Temporary vs. Permanent Kundalini

[april]

JJ Semple distinguishes between Temporary and Permanent Kundalini. While his discourse may be subjective, and to some degree anecdotal, it is the result of talking to many Kundalini practitioners and comparing their experiences with his.

 

Wonder how others feel about his findings? Any empirical narratives to add?

[de_paradise]

Its an interesting question. I dont think its method, though method may have an effect in increasing the probablility of nailing the right head, so to speak, depending upon the method. Its likely something like "potential" which is a product of higher level or subtle biology, that was perhaps informed by the entire soul history as it passed from body to body, maybe not necesarily only human. So we are talking about a potential or coding that took quite a while to create to have certain characteristics if enlivened, and even to shape the biology of the flesh and blood body as it grew while the kundalini potential was mainly dormant.

[Birch]

"may be subjective, and to some degree anecdotal"

 

As is life in general. Whatevs.

 

Now look, you were spending quite a few posts on here on behalf of JJ, explaining "The Kundalini" as this and as that. All well, and good and fine because IMO (and small awful experience) much of such things which could resemble "The Kundalini" need a placeholder somewhere to explain to people undergoing such things or even semblances of such things that they are a) not going insane (although the nuance is not so easy to grasp IMO/IME) and there is indeed a context for their experience, and it is shared. I say shared in a very specific sense that I will not need to argue later if you're "getting" where I'm going with this :-)

 

 

My most terrible suggestion of this thread is to get JJ to forget about his own Kundalini experience and get interested in everyone else's.

[manitou]

I just read Semple's article - I didn't know there was a temporary kundalini.....

In my personal experience, I became K-active after an auto accident - I watched the truck about to hit us in the rear view mirror, and a voice in my head said "I wonder why I'm manifesting this?" as I watched the truck get closer and closer. It was just an odd thought to have just prior to being crunched. The electrical strangeness started a couple days later - coincidentally, I had bent over to pick up something on the floor and experienced an odd 'unsnapping' of three points in my lower back, down by the coccyx, around the same time.

 

It's definitely had something to do with the opening of the third eye. It definitely has something to do with the chakras being cleared out; I notice that the kundalini energy will sometimes sit at the point of one of my chakras for days at a time; I assume it's because there are life issues I may be facing that affect that particular chakra. At first it was very annoying having the kundalini energy at all, but now after about 6 years I just don't pay any attention to it most of the time. Sometimes it will be sitting in the back of my head and it burns so hot it's incredible, sometimes in just one little hot pinpoint, sometimes as more of a flood of warmth. Sometimes you can 'feel' it pushing through the heart chakra.

 

The real purpose for this thing has had me at a loss since it began. I did read Gopi Krishna's book at the time(which I wouldn't recommend to anyone who is newly blessed/cursed with kundalini energy, as it will scare the bejesus out of you; his case is really extreme!) I just look at it now as something I have to live with, much like my constantly ringing ears. (Actually, that may be related too)

[pilot]

His narrative highlights the practical significance of one important element, among many others, running through the classics of Secret of the Golden Flower (Wilhelm), Eva Wong's translations, and Tsung Hwa Jou. His experience has been inspirational and insightful.

[markern]

I just read Semple's article - I didn't know there was a temporary kundalini.....

In my personal experience, I became K-active after an auto accident - I watched the truck about to hit us in the rear view mirror, and a voice in my head said "I wonder why I'm manifesting this?" as I watched the truck get closer and closer. It was just an odd thought to have just prior to being crunched. The electrical strangeness started a couple days later - coincidentally, I had bent over to pick up something on the floor and experienced an odd 'unsnapping' of three points in my lower back, down by the coccyx, around the same time.

 

It's definitely had something to do with the opening of the third eye. It definitely has something to do with the chakras being cleared out; I notice that the kundalini energy will sometimes sit at the point of one of my chakras for days at a time; I assume it's because there are life issues I may be facing that affect that particular chakra. At first it was very annoying having the kundalini energy at all, but now after about 6 years I just don't pay any attention to it most of the time. Sometimes it will be sitting in the back of my head and it burns so hot it's incredible, sometimes in just one little hot pinpoint, sometimes as more of a flood of warmth. Sometimes you can 'feel' it pushing through the heart chakra.

 

The real purpose for this thing has had me at a loss since it began. I did read Gopi Krishna's book at the time(which I wouldn't recommend to anyone who is newly blessed/cursed with kundalini energy, as it will scare the bejesus out of you; his case is really extreme!) I just look at it now as something I have to live with, much like my constantly ringing ears. (Actually, that may be related too)

 

Hi Manitou! Do you practice a system of qigong/meditation/yoga? Kundalini should over time get integrated in a manner where it does not bother you just enhance your life (although make it a bit strange perhaps) and a good system of qigong/meditation/yoga should help achieve that goal.

 

Have you read Path notes by Glenn morris by the way? It has an interesting account of his kundalini awakening.

[april]

Its an interesting question. I don't think its method, though method may have an effect in increasing the probability of nailing the right head, so to speak, depending upon the method. Its likely something like "potential" which is a product of higher level or subtle biology, that was perhaps informed by the entire soul history as it passed from body to body, maybe not necessarily only human. So we are talking about a potential or coding that took quite a while to create to have certain characteristics if enlivened, and even to shape the biology of the flesh and blood body as it grew while the kundalini potential was mainly dormant.

 

Love this insight. It's a set of conclusions I'm coming to after many years of living with, exploring and researching K. Thanks ~ JJ Semple

[april]

"may be subjective, and to some degree anecdotal"

 

As is life in general. Whatevs.

 

Now look, you were spending quite a few posts on here on behalf of JJ, explaining "The Kundalini" as this and as that. All well, and good and fine because IMO (and small awful experience) much of such things which could resemble "The Kundalini" need a placeholder somewhere to explain to people undergoing such things or even semblances of such things that they are a) not going insane (although the nuance is not so easy to grasp IMO/IME) and there is indeed a context for their experience, and it is shared. I say shared in a very specific sense that I will not need to argue later if you're "getting" where I'm going with this :-)

 

 

My most terrible suggestion of this thread is to get JJ to forget about his own Kundalini experience and get interested in everyone else's.

 

My interest is in finding some way of documenting the K experience. Gopi Krishna tried to get it going in the 70s and 80s. Unfortunately, for a number of reasons, it's been woefully neglected. What I've found to be a useful blueprint for future K investigation is to compare the ways interest in Near Death Experience (NDE) and Kundalini are explored. It provides insight into where Kundalini study might lead in the future.

 

As for interest "in everyone else's," it would be nice if everyone had the same experience, but they haven't. Therefore, I have to relate every experience I hear about to the one I've lived. Only in that way, do I have an inkling of what went on. I use my experience as a baseline; others probably feel the same about theirs. We won't understand this phenomenon by discouraging comment, only by getting more individuals to describe their experiences in a clear, concise manner.

[april]

[Birch]

My interest is in finding some way of documenting the K experience. Gopi Krishna tried to get it going in the 70s and 80s. Unfortunately, for a number of reasons, it's been woefully neglected. What I've found to be a useful blueprint for future K investigation is to compare the ways interest in Near Death Experience (NDE) and Kundalini are explored. It provides insight into where Kundalini study might lead in the future.

 

As for interest "in everyone else's," it would be nice if everyone had the same experience, but they haven't. Therefore, I have to relate every experience I hear about to the one I've lived. Only in that way, do I have an inkling of what went on. I use my experience as a baseline; others probably feel the same about theirs. We won't understand this phenomenon by discouraging comment, only by getting more individuals to describe their experiences in a clear, concise manner.

 

Ok. To what end are you documenting people's experiences? I'd say there's quite a lot of that on here, even if people don't refer to it as "kundalini". Best thing is it's shared freely (as it should be IMO) I wasn't aware I was disparaging. Apologies.

 

Being concise about "kundalini" is like being concise about life.

[3bob]

Think of three octaves; when K results in permanetly moving the state of a human being up a whole octave (so to speak) then that person has effectively become somewhat like a heavenly deva although with a physical body.

 

Om

[Creation]

Hi April and JJ.

 

I would add a third category, people for whom it is not "on" all the time, but who can use a technique to raise it at will, like Michael Winn's experience here:

http://www.healingtaobritain.com/p67magazinequestforspiritualorgasm.htm

under the heading "Personal Account: Kundalini Rising in the West"

 

And perhaps also this account:

http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/15808-kundalini-juices/

 

In addition to the permanent/impermanent issue, I am also interested in the different qualities of the kundalini rising experience itself. For some it is very explicitly connected to sexual arousal and orgasm, like in this account:

http://xsplat.wordpress.com/2006/10/28/apana-the-downward-flow-and-kundalini/#comment-3

For some it feels like a burning hot fire. For others (like JJ and Seth Ananda) it is felt as a fluid moving up the spine. But JJ said the fluid was like an egg cracked at the base of his spine, and Seth said it was like his tailbone was drinking his ejaculate. This is slightly different, and is probably related to the fact that one was explicitly connected to sex and the other was not, and one was henceforth "on" all the time and the other was not.

 

In what way are these experiences the same phenomenon? In what ways are the different phenomena? How are the underlying energetic dynamics, mechanisms, and results the same and different in these different experiences?

Edited November 2, 2010 by Creation

[april]

[april]

Hi April and JJ.

 

In what way are these experiences the same phenomenon? In what ways are the different phenomena? How are the underlying energetic dynamics, mechanisms, and results the same and different in these different experiences?

 

I would say they are the same experience, filtered through educational and cultural biases. Most of the differences seem to be the individual author's choice of words. Put the two together in the same room, ask them to hash out the differences and I bet they'd come pretty close. That is, if they could set aside their terminology differences, which, as I stated in my previous post, holds us all prisoners.

[Birch]

[ShaktiMama]

I would add for myself and Santi it is ON 24/7 and has been like that for years. I am speaking out of my own experiences and I don't think that is rare in our circles of influences. I am in regular contact and in friendship with people who are on 24/7. It might have been rare at one time but Santi and I are doing our best to make that not so.

 

In the 90s there was research and an instrument invented by Bob Dratch that could measure kundalini waves in the spine. He spoke about how he thought they were more of a microwave frequency. There is also research out there (escapes my mind) the kundalini as a wave length is longer and as a sound frequency is almost unhearable and more felt. Microwave is of a lower frequency than infra red I think.

 

Dr. Glenn Morris and I used to play with a tuning fork which was said to be attuned to the energy waves of shaktipat. It had very long tines (foot and a half?)and was more felt than heard. I would activate the tines and place it against Glenn's skull. He would report seeing a very deep violet almost black color from the vibration on his skull.

 

After my k was awakening I used to love to put my hands on a plasma globe tesla coil. The light frequency would excite my kundalini and send me into bliss. I also found that standing close in front of a satellite dish would also excite my kundalini and put me into bliss. (This is really a stupid thing to do to stand in front of dish. Don't do it.)

 

These things, now that my K is mature, don't really affect me like they used too. So I would say that sensitivity to light wave frequency could be a good measure. Glenn and I used to talk about the different ways. One of the most basic was just to look at the aura and into the body and check out the degree of awakening.

 

Nice essay on kundalini and proof by Yogi Tom.

http://www.kundalini-gateway.org/essays/e_science.html

 

You might also review the polls we did over the years on kundalites and their experiences.

http://www.kundalini-gateway.org/polls/index.html

 

 

Susan

 

Excerpts from the Avatamsaka Sutra;

 

Of all things seen in the world

Only mind is the host;

By grasping forms according to interpretation

It becomes deluded, not true to reality.

 

All is clearly seen once the great mind is developed.

That mind is far-reaching, as vast as the cosmos;

Without reliance, unchanging, like space---

It clearly comprehends the realm of truth, apart from discriminatory thought.

[april]

After my k was awakening I used to love to put my hands on a plasma globe tesla coil. The light frequency would excite my kundalini and send me into bliss. I also found that standing close in front of a satellite dish would also excite my kundalini and put me into bliss. (This is really a stupid thing to do to stand in front of dish. Don't do it.)

 

These things, now that my K is mature, don't really affect me like they used too. So I would say that sensitivity to light wave frequency could be a good measure. Glenn and I used to talk about the different ways. One of the most basic was just to look at the aura and into the body and check out the degree of awakening.

 

We seem to be working toward the same end. My recent blog post echoes your experience. Will check your links out...

 

Thanks

[Kali Yuga]

posted by Creation

 

For some it feels like a burning hot fire. For others (like JJ and Seth Ananda) it is felt as a fluid moving up the spine. But JJ said the fluid was like an egg cracked at the base of his spine, and Seth said it was like his tailbone was drinking his ejaculate. This is slightly different, and is probably related to the fact that one was explicitly connected to sex and the other was not, and one was henceforth "on" all the time and the other was not.

end.

 

I find this very interesting. In my own recent experience after repeated hours of solid meditation on my dantien, I awakened a sensation akin to "fire" down there. I started out small and tingling and then with each breath coupled with focus this would get "stoked" and burn harder and harder. It suddenly flipped from my dantien to my tailbone, and I could not return the heat back to the dantien, nor could I get the heat to go up the spine. It went to almost unbelievable proportions of heat that was distracting from time to time, the heat was incredible yet, it wasn't exactly heat per say. I found that it was linked to every breath that I took for when I inhaled it would kindle by itself and upon exhale it would burn harder. After cultivating this heat for awhile I found that the heat remained there regardless of whether I meditated or not or the time of day. This is all very recent and started last week.

 

come to mention now that I feel it there is that unsettling feeling of something being split or inserted there at the tailbone. the heat is a bit pleasurable when it isn't crazy hot, but the tailbone feeling is not so much pleasurable.

 

thread is right here

 

JohnC says that his kundalini felt like a sexual turn-on going up his spine. Scotty said that a book he read said that this heat would flip to the tailbone to awaken kundalini. I am not sure if mine could be identified as kundalini. I'm curious to all the kundalini talk especially because I've read Glen Morris's book Pathnotes. He claims in his KAP newsletter that kundalini is the driving force behind all human genius and superhuman feat. I don't know about that, but if you're talking about something burning crazy hot at the tail bone, then yeah I have that one.

Edited November 6, 2010 by Kali Yuga

[ShaktiMama]

the day kundalini switched from temporary to permanent was like this:

 

I was sitting on my bed in meditation and I felt a strong wind moving through my room. My body began shaking and I felt rather than heard something like thunder. Then my tailbone began to ACHE and vibrate.

I felt a presence in the air which I knew was intelligent and alive. I later learned that was the presence of what I came to know as Shiva.

 

Incredible heat started at pin point in the space of my tail bone and heated up my lower body. My body began rocking back and forth and a sinusoidal wave of pressure began oscillating in my pelvis and started moving up my back and in my spine like heated thick honey.

 

The heat spread through my whole body and radiated out into my room causing the window to sweat and fog over inside on a cold October morning.

 

Waves of intense orgasmic pleasure began to rock my body as my pelvis undulated in harmony with the snake like movements up my spine. I began to moan inwardly as my hands were drawn into mudras.

 

And that's how it began.

 

19 years later it is all very yin, the universe beats with the creation power of Shiva and Shakti constantly making love, and I am happy and at peace.

 

 

namaste,

Susan

 

 

posted by Creation

 

For some it feels like a burning hot fire. For others (like JJ and Seth Ananda) it is felt as a fluid moving up the spine. But JJ said the fluid was like an egg cracked at the base of his spine, and Seth said it was like his tailbone was drinking his ejaculate. This is http://www.thetaobums.com/public/style_emoticons/default/wub.gifslightly different, and is probably related to the fact that one was explicitly connected to sex and the other was not, and one was henceforth "on" all the time and the other was not.

end.

 

I find this very interesting. In my own recent experience after repeated hours of solid meditation on my dantien, I awakened a sensation akin to "fire" down there. I started out small and tingling and then with each breath coupled with focus this would get "stoked" and burn harder and harder. It suddenly flipped from my dantien to my tailbone, and I could not return the heat back to the dantien, nor could I get the heat to go up the spine. It went to almost unbelievable proportions of heat that was distracting from time to time, the heat was incredible yet, it wasn't exactly heat per say. I found that it was linked to every breath that I took for when I inhaled it would kindle by itself and upon exhale it would burn harder. After cultivating this heat for awhile I found that the heat remained there regardless of whether I meditated or not or the time of day. This is all very recent and started last week.

 

come to mention now that I feel it there is that unsettling feeling of something being split or inserted there at the tailbone. the heat is a bit pleasurable when it isn't crazy hot, but the tailbone feeling is not so much pleasurable.

 

thread is right here

 

JohnC says that his kundalini felt like a sexual turn-on going up his spine. Scotty said that a book he read said that this heat would flip to the tailbone to awaken kundalini. I am not sure if mine could be identified as kundalini. I'm curious to all the kundalini talk especially because I've read Glen Morris's book Pathnotes. He claims in his KAP newsletter that kundalini is the driving force behind all human genius and superhuman feat. I don't know about that, but if you're talking about something burning crazy hot at the tail bone, then yeah I have that one.