Is This The Truth About Kundalini?

[Vajrahridaya]

Because in the buddhist texts, even those that have experienced rigpa may not become liberated. They all say the best is to achieve Buddhahood while alive.

 

Will not become liberated in this life, but will within I think it's at most 3 lifetimes? If they've actually experienced Rigpa. Not all Dzogchenpas have experienced Rigpa. Really experiencing Rigpa includes a glimpse at omniscience, as in you see the 6 realms, 31 planes and all associated phenomena of the universe and all complexity makes sense in a simple timeless moment from the perspective of dependent origination/emptiness.

Edited December 6, 2010 by Vajrahridaya

[RongzomFan]

Is the path the following?

 

Preparation: Say once "I go for refuge to the Buddha, Dharma and Sangha. By the merit I primordially have by abiding in the natural state, may I attain perfect Buddhahood to benefit infinite sentient beings."

 

Step 1. Realize nature of mind using Dzogchen or Hinduism

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dzogchen

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaivism

 

Step 2. Raise kundalini

 

http://www.forums.astraldynamics.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=2602

 

Step 3. Practice thogal till rainbow body is obtained

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dzogchen#Rigpa_and_Rainbow_Body

Edited December 6, 2010 by alwayson

[Vajrahridaya]

Is the path the following?

 

Preparation: Say once "I go for refuge to the Buddha, Dharma and Sangha. By the merit I primordially have by abiding in the natural state, may I attain perfect Buddhahood to benefit infinite sentient beings."

 

Step 1. Realize nature of mind using Dzogchen or Hinduism

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dzogchen

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaivism

 

Step 2. Raise kundalini

 

http://www.forums.astraldynamics.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=2602

 

Step 3. Practice thogal till rainbow body is obtained

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dzogchen#Rigpa_and_Rainbow_Body

 

The two traditions don't have the same goal. You're comparing apples and oranges, both fruit, but with different seeds and different end results. Also, just because someone attains a Rainbow body or Body of light, doesn't mean they are a Buddha, unless they have the perspective. So, those that attain it in Dzogchen are considered Buddhas, because they have the perspective or "right view." Right View has to do with compassion and emptiness.

Edited December 6, 2010 by Vajrahridaya

[RongzomFan]

My understanding is that the speed of thogal is based on the configuration of the channels etc. in the body.

 

Raising kundalini once would allow one to complete the four visions before death.

 

P.S. If you obtain rainbow body you are a buddha. To say anything different is heretical and really invalidates anything you else have to say.

Edited December 6, 2010 by alwayson

[Vajrahridaya]

P.S. If you obtain rainbow body you are a buddha. To say anything different is heretical.

 

In Dzogchen, yes... because it's based upon Right View with the goal of endless awakened activity for the sake of endless sentient beings.

 

People attain the body of light in other traditions, but because it doesn't originate from the basis of "right view" it's actually a different attainment, even if it looks the same, i.e. disappearance of the body into light. Because in most traditions the person is just merging into a long lived formless god realm made of blissful consciousness without awareness of activity, as more of an escape from action. So it's not really the attainment of the 3 kayas (dharmakaya, sambhogakaya, nirmanakaya) as discussed in Buddhism.

Edited December 6, 2010 by Vajrahridaya

[Vajrahridaya]

My understanding is that the speed of thogal is based on the configuration of the channels etc. in the body.

 

Raising kundalini once would allow one to complete the four visions before death.

 

 

Kundalini awakening and Rigpa is different, coming from a different place, with a different aim. It's not different in the sense that it's just awareness, but how it's utilized is different in the tradition of Rigpa from kundalini.

 

Dzogchen already sees that it's just awareness and karma, thus we use the term Rigpa, which just basically means awakened awareness.

[RongzomFan]

In Dzogchen, yes... because it's based upon Right View with the goal of endless activity for the sake of endless sentient beings.

 

People attain the body of light in other traditions, but because it doesn't originate from the basis of "right view" it's actually a different attainment, even if it looks the same, i.e. disappearance of the body into light.

 

 

People may obtain a body of light in other traditions and not be a buddha, but if they obtain it via thogal, they are a buddha.

[RongzomFan]

Kundalini awakening and Rigpa is different, coming from a different place, with a different aim. It's not different in the sense that it's just awareness, but how it's utilized is different in the tradition of Rigpa from kundalini.

 

Dzogchen already sees that it's just awareness and karma, thus we use the term Rigpa, which just basically means awakened awareness.

 

 

Namdrol told me, that if a practitioner obtained like sixth, seventh eithth bhumi because their channels were modified by tummo, when they become a Dzogchen practitioner, the visions would start from scratch but go fast.

Edited December 6, 2010 by alwayson

[Vajrahridaya]

I don't believe in shaktipat.

 

Where did this stuff come from?

 

I have never come across it in the texts I read.

 

It's in the Shakti/Shaivite texts going back more than 1,000 years. Look up Kshemaraja, Abhinavagupta, Utpaladeva, also Jnaneshwar talks about it a little bit as Diksha, so does Shankaracharya.

 

It's also in the Nath tradition, who are also Shaivite. The term Shaktipat is an old Sanskrit term meaning, "decent of grace."

 

Read, "Triadic Heart of Shiva" by Paul Muller Ortega, he'll quote from lots of old Hindu texts for you. The Triadic Heart of Siva: Kaula Tantricism of Abhinavagupta in the Non-Dual Shaivism of Kashmir (Suny Series, Shaiva Traditions of Kashmir)

 

It's also talked about in the Siddhar tradition of Tamil Nadu which is also old, though from a different language than Sanskrit... as you know.

Edited December 6, 2010 by Vajrahridaya

[Vajrahridaya]

People may obtain a body of light in other traditions and not be a buddha, but if they obtain it via thogal, they are a buddha.

 

Yes, of course.

[Vajrahridaya]

Namdrol told me, that if a practitioner obtained like sixth, seventh eithth bhumi because their channels were modified by tummo, when they become a Dzogchen practitioner, the visions would start from scratch but go fast.

 

Which is why a high being in any tradition can come to Dzogchen, get transmission, recieve the contemplation of Thogal and they would also attain Buddhahood in this very life as well as the Jalus if they don't make too many disciples.

 

Anyone who attains the Jalus generally doesn't have lots of disciples. Either that or all their disciples are very good disciples.

Edited December 6, 2010 by Vajrahridaya

[manitou]

If someone doesn't understand or denies the kundalini phenomenon it just means they aren't kundalini active. If they were kundalini active they would understand that there are not only electrical sensations, pulses, and tinglings that sit and try to untangle knots at the chakras (and other places which seem to make no sense at all), but more importantly there is the direct "seeing" that comes along with the K phenomenon. This goes to not only the development of a third eye (in which one ultimately becomes a seer) but also to the strange awareness that one's brain is somehow evolving into something different; that the thinking is expanded and the One-consciousness is the overriding thing. This awareness is there all the time and I've wondered if at some level there isn't an analogy or relationship between a K-active person's brain expanding and the universe expanding. After all, we're most likely the "creator"....

[Alfred E]

[Jetsun]

From my own experience what's more important is to look at what blocks the energy and stops it from discharging rather than any fireworks or great sensations. I don't know if what I experienced is Kundalini but after a frightening drug experience I had survival energies flowing in my body which I could feel trying to discharge, but the blocks in my system prevented it from flowing properly, so the real value in my opinion is that it highlights your blocks more intensely which you have to learn to let go of otherwise you live your life in an anxiety fuelled hell realm.

 

Is there a difference between Kundalini and trauma induced survival energies? I don't know if what I experienced was Kundalini but when I went to see a Cranio Sacral Therapist she sped up my nervous system for a while and all I could feel were violent rushes of energy which would make my body jerk, but infact made me feel like a complete psychological wreck rather than any sort of good spiritual state.

[Ulises]

The experience of so-called "Kundalini" is found virtually in all the wisdom traditions...including the roots of the western tradition:

"Syrinx was the name either for a musical instrument or for the part of an instrument that makes a piping, whistling sound — the sound called syrigmos. For Greeks, this sound of piping and whistling was also the sound of the hissing made by snakes. Ancient Greek accounts of ‘incubation’ repeatedly mention certain signs that mark the point of entry into another world: into another state of awareness that’s neither waking nor sleep. One of the signs is that you become aware of a rapid spinning movement. Another is that you hear the powerful vibration produced by a piping, whistling, hissing sound. It is also the sound produced by the solar basque, during the process of creation of the universe. In India exactly the same signs are described as the prelude to entering samadhi, the state beyond sleep and waking. And they’re directly related to the process known as the awakening of kundalini — of the ‘serpent power’ that’s the basic energy in all creation but that’s almost completely asleep in human beings. When it starts waking up it makes a hissing sound. In general, the sound of a syrinx was a call for silence. This is something that makes sense even on a very obvious level when you consider how hissing or whistling at people is still a way of silencing them (shhhhhhhhhhh…..). To ancient mystics and magicians the journey into a greater reality was a journey made through silence, in silence and into silence. The noise of a syrinx is the ultimate password. It’s the sound of silence."

 

REVIEW In the Dark Places of Wisdom by Peter Kingsley

Edited December 6, 2010 by Ulises

[Vajrahridaya]

If someone doesn't understand or denies the kundalini phenomenon it just means they aren't kundalini active. If they were kundalini active they would understand that there are not only electrical sensations, pulses, and tinglings that sit and try to untangle knots at the chakras (and other places which seem to make no sense at all), but more importantly there is the direct "seeing" that comes along with the K phenomenon. This goes to not only the development of a third eye (in which one ultimately becomes a seer) but also to the strange awareness that one's brain is somehow evolving into something different; that the thinking is expanded and the One-consciousness is the overriding thing. This awareness is there all the time and I've wondered if at some level there isn't an analogy or relationship between a K-active person's brain expanding and the universe expanding. After all, we're most likely the "creator"....

 

We're the creator, that's right, inter-dependently. So there isn't a "one" consciousness behind it. The thing is, is that I am so called "kundalini" active with all the classical experiences, and I used to have the same interpretation of it as you did... conditioned by theistic concepts with experiential interpretation revolving around theistic premise. When I started to have the 3rd eye experiences revolving around the contemplation of dependent origination/emptiness with the insights revealing perception past the theistic dimension of experience... There was no reconciliation between the two. I started to truly understand what the Buddha taught, and how entirely different of a realization it is from the level of "oneness" that reabsorbs and expresses Samsara, recycling all of us sentient beings, from the lower realms to the higher realms.

 

The experience of oneness is the experience of one's awareness expanding, but identifying that "WOW" and very powerful experience with a higher Self, or grand Self of all is just another revelation of the personal clinging to an identity, or Self of all. This is a deeply rooted tendency that is the root of our revolving between lower and higher realms since time without beginning.

 

Manitou,

 

What you're experiencing now is just the upswing, from Nihilism to Eternalism.

 

Because you haven't really studied the Buddhas teachings directly and at length as he is the single biggest teacher of a particular spiritual tradition known to man as he actually taught the tradition associated with him and it wasn't a later development by other more ignorant beings like Christianity for instance. You might not understand the subtlety of his intention or realization? But he went through all those experiences that you are talking about and that level of absorption in meditation and interpretation that reifies these experiences as proof of an ultimate "consciousness." He then stepped back and realized it was an incomplete view by questioning deeper and discarded the Vedic and Theistic interpretation of it all which he grew up with, as lacking in direct insight into what is really going on and went deeper! When he talks about the 8 jhanas including the 4 formless jhanas or meditative Samadhi's of "infinite space", "infinite consciousness", "infinite nothingness", "neither perception nor non-perception." These are deeply refined states of consciousness that most people never, become conscious of as a personal potential. When people do have a glimpse of one of these states of consciousness, they have a tendency to make one or another of them the ultimate "source of being", then tell everyone and create a tradition around it. I.E. Jesus, A.A., Islam... and other such versions of Monotheism. Generally the God that they saw is just one of the long lived God's or Goddess's that were first born at the big bang, who mistakenly thought that everything that came after one or the other depending on the dimension of that God, was actually coming from "His" or "Her" own being. So these God's teach different versions of theism saying that it all comes from "The Almighy One" who wills it all!!

 

The Buddha talks about this in his deeply extensive and exhaustive teaching. He actually confronts one of the most powerful God's, Lord Brahma, known by most all beings in the higher heavens as the "creator" or "soul" of the universe, which over many eons they fight over who actually is the "creator." Yes, even the God's fight over this, even though they preach oneness. Anyway, the Buddha said to him, "Then you're going to take responsibility for all the suffering of the universe?" Which is pretty much what theists do, is offer everything back to this, "one". In this offering you rise! You will experience the high heavens for eons! But once that karma exhausts... who knows where you'll go? The only way to find out is by delving more deeply into this experience of oneness.

 

Kundalini is really just inter-personal awareness's and inter-personal karmic alignments being illuminated. There really is no kundalini as an intelligent and independent force behind it all, this is just another notion arising dependent upon self clinging, but on an ultimate level. It's reflective of the extreme of Eternalism. It's an attachment, and one that ultimately leads to unsatisfactoriness, even after the hell realms are emptied and the middle realms are emptied, and then the heaven realms of the long lived Gods' are emptied.

 

These teachings come from the long lived Gods'. These realms Buddha talked about going to and having access to during his trip through the different meditative states. These realms I've verified for myself through going through these different meditative states as well.

 

The Buddha did teach something different, it's a paradigm shift in perception and interpretation of the nature of perception on a deeply intuitive level that does reflect third eye activity.

 

The seeming will of the Energy you are experiencing is a complex assortment of your own karmas and also the will of the God's within your karmic lineage all working together. It's really not a one individual will. It is positive, but it's just the other extreme from the hell of Nihilism, thus not the path of the middle way.

 

We do not merge with a formless level of being, we cut through even "oneness" and empty that level of clinging as well in order to truly liberate from the unconscious recycling program that is the universe, not to transcend it per say, but to truly see right through it, even while being a part of it.

 

I wish you well!

[Vajrahridaya]

From my own experience what's more important is to look at what blocks the energy and stops it from discharging rather than any fireworks or great sensations. I don't know if what I experienced is Kundalini but after a frightening drug experience I had survival energies flowing in my body which I could feel trying to discharge, but the blocks in my system prevented it from flowing properly, so the real value in my opinion is that it highlights your blocks more intensely which you have to learn to let go of otherwise you live your life in an anxiety fuelled hell realm.

 

Yes heightened awareness and a deeper experience of ones own karma. This happens when awareness is jarred open by some catalyzing experience, and sometimes it is a drug that does this, or a near death experience, or contact with a highly developed being, saint, wise sage... etc. The ensuing avalanche which you are talking about below is generally considered, "kundalini" that primal feeling, that primal force and intensity! It's really just awareness and karma.

 

Is there a difference between Kundalini and trauma induced survival energies? I don't know if what I experienced was Kundalini but when I went to see a Cranio Sacral Therapist she sped up my nervous system for a while and all I could feel were violent rushes of energy which would make my body jerk, but infact made me feel like a complete psychological wreck rather than any sort of good spiritual state.

 

Yes, this is exactly what is considered "awakening of the kundalini" and the "wreck" you are experiencing is just the onslaught of unconscious patterns coming to your conscious state of being to a degree that is shocking your state of mind and thus nervous system. This can be helped through proper guidance. I would recommend a Vajrayana Master, or Dzogchen Master, who can prescribe yogic techniques in order to help ground your experience of this new level of awareness without reifying and deifying a mystical "agent" behind it all. Where do you live? Not all that carry the name of Rinpoche are worthy of the name.

 

You might want to start a practice of Tai Chi and if there is a good Taoist Master around, that could be good too, if he/she is a Master that is.

 

But, Yoga or some sort of Chi practice under the guidance of an adept would be most advisable!

Edited December 6, 2010 by Vajrahridaya

[Ulises]

We're the creator, that's right, inter-dependently. So there isn't a "one" consciousness behind it. The thing is, is that I am so called "kundalini" active with all the classical experiences, and I used to have the same interpretation of it as you did... conditioned by theistic concepts with experiential interpretation revolving around theistic premise. When I started to have the 3rd eye experiences revolving around the contemplation of dependent origination/emptiness with the insights revealing perception past the theistic dimension of experience... There was no reconciliation between the two. I started to truly understand what the Buddha taught, and how entirely different of a realization it is from the level of "oneness" that reabsorbs and expresses Samsara, recycling all of us sentient beings, from the lower realms to the higher realms.

 

The experience of oneness is the experience of one's awareness expanding, but identifying that "WOW" and very powerful experience with a higher Self, or grand Self of all is just another revelation of the personal clinging to an identity, or Self of all. This is a deeply rooted tendency that is the root of our revolving between lower and higher realms since time without beginning.

 

Manitou,

 

What you're experiencing now is just the upswing, from Nihilism to Eternalism.

 

Because you haven't really studied the Buddhas teachings directly and at length as he is the single biggest teacher of a particular spiritual tradition known to man as he actually taught the tradition associated with him and it wasn't a later development by other more ignorant beings like Christianity for instance. You might not understand the subtlety of his intention or realization? But he went through all those experiences that you are talking about and that level of absorption in meditation and interpretation that reifies these experiences as proof of an ultimate "consciousness." He then stepped back and realized it was an incomplete view by questioning deeper and discarded the Vedic and Theistic interpretation of it all which he grew up with, as lacking in direct insight into what is really going on and went deeper! When he talks about the 8 jhanas including the 4 formless jhanas or meditative Samadhi's of "infinite space", "infinite consciousness", "infinite nothingness", "neither perception nor non-perception." These are deeply refined states of consciousness that most people never, become conscious of as a personal potential. When people do have a glimpse of one of these states of consciousness, they have a tendency to make one or another of them the ultimate "source of being", then tell everyone and create a tradition around it. I.E. Jesus, A.A., Islam... and other such versions of Monotheism. Generally the God that they saw is just one of the long lived God's or Goddess's that were first born at the big bang, who mistakenly thought that everything that came after one or the other depending on the dimension of that God, was actually coming from "His" or "Her" own being. So these God's teach different versions of theism saying that it all comes from "The Almighy One" who wills it all!!

 

The Buddha talks about this in his deeply extensive and exhaustive teaching. He actually confronts one of the most powerful God's, Lord Brahma, known by most all beings in the higher heavens as the "creator" or "soul" of the universe, which over many eons they fight over who actually is the "creator." Yes, even the God's fight over this, even though they preach oneness. Anyway, the Buddha said to him, "Then you're going to take responsibility for all the suffering of the universe?" Which is pretty much what theists do, is offer everything back to this, "one". In this offering you rise! You will experience the high heavens for eons! But once that karma exhausts... who knows where you'll go? The only way to find out is by delving more deeply into this experience of oneness.

 

Kundalini is really just inter-personal awareness's and inter-personal karmic alignments being illuminated. There really is no kundalini as an intelligent and independent force behind it all, this is just another notion arising dependent upon self clinging, but on an ultimate level. It's reflective of the extreme of Eternalism. It's an attachment, and one that ultimately leads to unsatisfactoriness, even after the hell realms are emptied and the middle realms are emptied, and then the heaven realms of the long lived Gods' are emptied.

 

These teachings come from the long lived Gods'. These realms Buddha talked about going to and having access to during his trip through the different meditative states. These realms I've verified for myself through going through these different meditative states as well.

 

The Buddha did teach something different, it's a paradigm shift in perception and interpretation of the nature of perception on a deeply intuitive level that does reflect third eye activity.

 

The seeming will of the Energy you are experiencing is a complex assortment of your own karmas and also the will of the God's within your karmic lineage all working together. It's really not a one individual will. It is positive, but it's just the other extreme from the hell of Nihilism, thus not the path of the middle way.

 

We do not merge with a formless level of being, we cut through even "oneness" and empty that level of clinging as well in order to truly liberate from the unconscious recycling program that is the universe, not to transcend it per say, but to truly see right through it, even while being a part of it.

 

I wish you well!

 

 

here, interesting views about the Buddhist path...

http://www.quantumyoga.org/Revolt%20Spirit%20vs%20Matter%20Life%20Divine.htm

[adept]

We do not merge with a formless level of being, we cut through even "oneness" and empty that level of clinging as well in order to truly liberate from the unconscious recycling program that is the universe, not to transcend it per say, but to truly see right through it, even while being a part of it.

 

This is your personal view of course.

What is there to be liberated from ?

What if some of us don't want to be 'liberated' ?

We might just want to try to enjoy life as best we can without the mental trips to other realms and such like.

Your constant Buddhist propaganda seems to be infesting, once again, on threads that are not about your chosen path.

[Jetsun]

Yes, this is exactly what is considered "awakening of the kundalini" and the "wreck" you are experiencing is just the onslaught of unconscious patterns coming to your conscious state of being to a degree that is shocking your state of mind and thus nervous system. This can be helped through proper guidance. I would recommend a Vajrayana Master, or Dzogchen Master, who can prescribe yogic techniques in order to help ground your experience of this new level of awareness without reifying and deifying a mystical "agent" behind it all. Where do you live? Not all that carry the name of Rinpoche are worthy of the name.

 

You might want to start a practice of Tai Chi and if there is a good Taoist Master around, that could be good too, if he/she is a Master that is.

 

But, Yoga or some sort of Chi practice under the guidance of an adept would be most advisable!

 

I live in the south of the UK. I tried Yoga but to be honest Yoga feels too aggressive and ungrounding. I have tried some Chi practises but even the ones which move the energy downward grounding don't appear to be helping all that much, they seem to heighten the energies but I don't seem to get any resolution from the resistance, although I haven't done Tai Chi. It sounds a bit sort of glamorous to call it Kundalini, I went to see a clinical psychologist who said it was an anxiety disorder with derealization. I did experience an onslaught on unconscious material which kicked it all off but unfortunately I didn't know anything about letting go or meditative approaches at that time so I resisted it out of fear unfortunately.

[Vajrahridaya]

here, interesting views about the Buddhist path...

http://www.quantumyoga.org/Revolt%20Spirit%20vs%20Matter%20Life%20Divine.htm

 

That's a complete misrepresentation of the Buddhas teaching. It's propaganda Ulises and not a knowledgeable source for understanding the Buddhas teaching.

 

This entire expose is really just exposing a complete misunderstanding of the Buddhas teachings as well as the fear of it.

 

The Buddhas teaching is incredibly positive and life affirming. You should study the teachings directly. As well as those of the Mahayana, Vajrayana and Dzogchen traditions as well.

 

We do not revolt against matter or wish to transcend anything other than our own ignorance concerning the matter of everything as well as our incessant clinging to a static self or Self of all.

 

Nirvana is not a negative state of being. Nirvana is liberation while living, a "blowing out" of ones ignorance concerning the nature of the universe and the self.

 

Shree Aurobindo is not a good source of Buddhist teaching.

 

He say's, The Buddha "made a mistake, calling away the dynamic side of the liberation."

 

But the teaching of Dependent origination/emptiness is all about dynamism, and constant awareness of change on all levels.

 

Shree Aurobindo reveals how deep the clinging to a static concept of an ultimate reality goes. Shree Aurobindo is a victim of his own mis-interpretation of the Buddhas teaching and is in fact the one who is having a hard time understanding dynamism.

Edited December 6, 2010 by Vajrahridaya

[Vajrahridaya]

I live in the south of the UK. I tried Yoga but to be honest Yoga feels too aggressive and ungrounding. I have tried some Chi practises but even the ones which move the energy downward grounding don't appear to be helping all that much, they seem to heighten the energies but I don't seem to get any resolution from the resistance, although I haven't done Tai Chi.

 

Buddhist yoga is not the same as the Hindu yoga you are probably referring to.

 

Here... Yantra Yoga (Yoga of Movement)

 

Also this one... Yantra Yoga

 

They say it's from Tibet, but it's actually from North India, then preserved in Tibet.

 

This form is much more gentle and more focused on integration in the middle, or the heart. After the Rinpoche talks, there is a show of some of the movements.

 

This form is a much more dynamic form of yoga than hatha with a deeper awareness of the breath in conjunction with the movements.

 

 

It sounds a bit sort of glamorous to call it Kundalini, I went to see a clinical psychologist who said it was an anxiety disorder with derealization. I did experience an onslaught on unconscious material which kicked it all off but unfortunately I didn't know anything about letting go or meditative approaches at that time so I resisted it out of fear unfortunately.

 

It's fine. It has helped propel you towards a sense of seeking answers about things. It has probably brought up questioning you never thought you knew you had.

Edited December 6, 2010 by Vajrahridaya

[Vajrahridaya]

This is your personal view of course.

 

Well, it's Buddhism really. Just my wording.

 

What is there to be liberated from ?

 

Ignorance, suffering, that is all really. The Buddha said, "All I teach is the pacification of suffering."

What if some of us don't want to be 'liberated' ?

 

Well, if you want bondage? Then definitely ignore me.

 

We might just want to try to enjoy life as best we can without the mental trips to other realms and such like.

 

You don't have to get into the idea of other realms. That just naturally occurs as your meditation progresses.

 

It's really about understanding the causes of why you suffer while on Earth, right now, in the body. The teaching is also about understanding the swings of pleasure and pain. How you might not be suffering during a time of pleasure, but what about when this pleasure ends. His teaching should deepen a persons awareness of change. If for you that does not include the change of before life and after life on a personal level, including multiple dimensions of experiencing your self? That is fine, the practices are really just about grounding your self awareness. For me that also means grounding my awareness of the cosmos and my experiences of other realms of self experience which the Buddha addresses very well.

 

Your constant Buddhist propaganda seems to be infesting, once again, on threads that are not about your chosen path.

 

This thread is about Kundalini and it's experience. I have a different view of what Kundalini is than what is being shared here. But it's still about the same phenomena. If you don't like what I have to say, you don't have to read it. You are not the only one here, and there are people who do like what they read from me. It is a perspective that is a radical departure from the norm, so it might be challenging. But none the less, it's valid.

Edited December 6, 2010 by Vajrahridaya

[Birch]

Heh, Vaj, for once you're saying some things I agree with. Woo Hoo!

 

However, at this here reality level, our friend Jetsun seems to be having some trouble with grounding his (or her) energy. And for that, I think there's a lot to be said for healthy exercise, good food (including "enough" protein), sleep, staying off the benders and self-educating about mental health. This also includes IMO looking into the history of the "discipline," it's professionals and results BTW, but I digress

 

I reckon that once K has been given a (paradoxically) rational context and a playing field in which one can accept it, even make "friends" with it then fear can drop away and proper investigation can begin. BUT if you jump right into things with an offering of an explanation, however good and truthful and helpful it seems to you, but is somewhat distant from the person experiencing it, I wonder if you don't deny that person the fruits of their own insights. You know, the raft and all that?

 

Still, if it helps, it helps.

[3bob]

Any tricked-out and tripped-out harpings made about any form of spiritual vehicle being the ultimate is BS.

 

It's that simple. (in my experience)

 

Om