Wikileaks - Thoughts

[Sloppy Zhang]

I used to admin a server of around 500 so called "Anonymous" members. This really isn't so much "cyber warfare" as a number of targetted server raids that aren't hard at all to pull off.

 

The media's jargon is completely off base here =/ not every person on the underbelly of the internet is a hacker, much less a "hacktivist!"

 

The government's corruption is no new news; the documents Wikileaks has released are easily available online if you know where to look (zoklet? 4chan?). Unfortunately it's been a few years since I've been connected with that community and I'm a bit off base.

 

The charges against Julian Assange are false,

 

bright blessings,

 

Koma

 

The "media's jargon" as you put it is a very key strategy when it comes to "framing the terms" of any given situation.

 

Look at the "New York mosque" controversy- the place wasn't even a full fledged "mosque" to begin with, but the very fact that they used such a word suddenly stuck all kinds of images and associations in peoples' minds. And once you have defined something one way in large media, it's VERY hard to change it.

 

The first to define the terms wins when it comes to media. If you have framed someone as a "hacker", "terrorist", or something like that, then you already have a tremendous step up on the other side.

 

I mean, who is going to step forward and say, "I support a known terrorist", ESPECIALLY in this climate?

[idquest]

I read recently that all previous 'leaks' were agreed with the USA administration. That is the administration looked through the raw data and had the right to cross off too sensitive names or otherwise critical info. This is why Assange is threatening to publish the raw data if something happens to him: the data won't be censored by the administration.

[Ulises]

"Dear Friends

The massive campaign of intimidation against WikiLeaks is sending a chill through free press advocates everywhere.

 

Legal experts say WikiLeaks has likely broken no laws. Yet top US politicians have called it a terrorist group and commentators have urged assassination of its staff. The organization has come under massive government and corporate attack, but WikiLeaks is only publishing information provided by a whistleblower. And it has partnered with the world's leading newspapers (NYT, Guardian, Spiegel etc) to carefully vet the information it publishes.

 

The massive extra-judicial intimidation of WikiLeaks is an attack on democracy. We urgently need a public outcry for freedom of the press and expression. Sign the petition to stop the crackdown and forward this email to everyone -- let's get to 1 million voices and take out full page ads in US newspapers this week!

 

http://www.avaaz.org/en/wikileaks_petition/?vl

 

WikiLeaks isn't acting alone -- it's partnered with the top newspapers in the world (New York Times, The Guardian, Der Spiegel, etc) to carefully review 250,000 US diplomatic cables and remove any information that it is irresponsible to publish. Only 800 cables have been published so far. Past WikiLeaks publications have exposed government-backed torture, the murder of innocent civilians in Iraq and Afghanistan, and corporate corruption.

 

The US government is currently pursuing all legal avenues to stop WikiLeaks from publishing more cables, but the laws of democracies protect freedom of the press. The US and other governments may not like the laws that protect our freedom of expression, but that's exactly why it's so important that we have them, and why only a democratic process can change them.

 

Reasonable people can disagree on whether WikiLeaks and the leading newspapers it's partnered with are releasing more information than the public should see. Whether the releases undermine diplomatic confidentiality and whether that's a good thing. Whether WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange has the personal character of a hero or a villain. But none of this justifies a vicious campaign of intimidation to silence a legal media outlet by governments and corporations. Click below to join the call to stop the crackdown:

http://www.avaaz.org/en/wikileaks_petition/?vl

[ralis]

Espionage charges may be imminent. The Justice Dept. is making this up as they go along.

 

 

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x4652750#4652921

[Sloppy Zhang]

I've been talking this over with some people from the journalism school at my college. The thing that comes up a lot is the Pentagon Papers case.

 

There are some situations in which the government can intervene and stop documents from getting out- but they have to CLEARLY be putting peoples' lives in danger, and CLEARLY hurting our war efforts, and things of that sort. Which means that stuff like, "well it could harm people" isn't good enough- HOW does it harm people? HAS it harmed people? are clear cut questions which MUST be answered if they want to stop this.

 

Furthermore, in this situation, wikileaks can make the case that it is acting just like any other journalism source- it's just passing along the information. If anyone is to go down for espionage, it's the people who ORIGINALLY got the documents, and then gave them to wikileaks.

 

Unless Julian Assange, or some other person affiliated with wikileaks got the documents themselves, they can't be held accountable. It would have to be the people who got the documents first.

 

At least, that's the theorizing that's going on in the academic circles I'm in.

Edited December 10, 2010 by Sloppy Zhang

[rain]

-What if Wikileaks is a set up by both the chinese and american goverments to mold mass consumers into the opinion that the internet has to be regulated, based on fear of cyber terrorism

 

-What if Wikileaks ideals finally result in what they claim they are trying to prevent..namely censorship,...,

 

-For how long can they exist as a radically free idealistic organization without being misused as spindoctors?

 

Have any of you signed the petition?

[Sloppy Zhang]

-What if Wikileaks is a set up by both the chinese and american goverments to mold mass consumers into the opinion that the internet has to be regulated, based on fear of cyber terrorism

 

-What if Wikileaks ideals finally result in what they claim they are trying to prevent..namely censorship,...,

 

-For how long can they exist as a radically free idealistic organization without being misused as spindoctors?

 

Yes, I am concerned about all of these as well- especially about citing potential threats as reasons to increase security and take away freedoms.

 

"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both." - Paraphrased quote attributed to Benjamin Franklin.

 

Have any of you signed the petition?

 

Yes.

[Mal]

Have any of you signed the petition?

 

Yes, I agreed with how Avaaz worded it.

We call on you to stop the crackdown on WikiLeaks and its partners immediately. We urge you to respect democratic principles and laws of freedom of expression and freedom of the press. If WikiLeaks and the journalists it works with have violated any laws they should be pursued in the courts with due process. They should not be subjected to an extra-judicial campaign of intimidation.

 

And according to the update from Avaaz, they got almost 400,000 signatures in a day. Looking forward to seeing what sort of response the newspaper adds generate.

[rene]

During Times Of Universal Deceit,

Telling The Truth

Becomes A Revolutionary Act.

 

-George Orwell

[ralis]

It gets worse everyday! Homeland Security Committee approves internet kill switch.

 

 

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x9752990

[rene]

It gets worse everyday! Homeland Security Committee approves internet kill switch.

 

 

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x9752990

 

Oh jesus. Thanks for that link. Ya know, I can usually see all sides of things and this is no exception but what scares the shit out of me is that even with good intentions (and that's suspect on its own) they must have absolutely no clue as to what doing this will actually do - the far reaching affect that kind of disruption will have on a system that relies on communication to function.

 

Think your bank cards will still work at the stores?? Transaction data travels via internet.

Etc, etc. Exponential etc.

 

If it aint time to hunker, it's close.

[Sloppy Zhang]

It gets worse everyday! Homeland Security Committee approves internet kill switch.

 

 

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x9752990

 

........

 

Wow......

 

As The Hill explains, the bill, sponsored by Sens. Joe Lieberman, Susan Collins, and Tom Carper, would give the president "emergency authority to shut down private sector or government networks in the event of a cyber attack capable of causing massive damage or loss of life."

 

Kind of like how they are going after wikileaks because the actions that wikileaks has taken are capable of causing massive damage or loss of life.

 

Translation: they'll do it whenever they want and however they want for whatever reason they want.

 

but an amendment to the PCNAA, approved yesterday, mandates that the president "get Congressional approval after controlling a network for 120 days."

 

This kinda reminds me about the whole, declaration of war thing, and how troops can be deployed even without a declaration of war, but there must be continuous approval to keep troops in combat zones. But once troops are already there, it's not like people are going to pull support just because they don't agree with them being there, which leads me to believe that once the internet gets "shut down" (if when they do it), it'll take a lot of work to get it back up......

 

 

This is not cool

Edited December 12, 2010 by Sloppy Zhang

[NeiChuan]

........

 

Wow......

 

 

 

Kind of like how they are going after wikileaks because the actions that wikileaks has taken are capable of causing massive damage or loss of life.

 

Translation: they'll do it whenever they want and however they want for whatever reason they want.

 

 

 

 

This is not cool

 

 

Loss of life Pfft. They'll do anything to justify this kind of crapping on the principals that made this country.

 

I hate to be "that" guy, but if their was ever a time for a revolution.

 

Now all they're going to do is find a reason to use it, mention wikileaks on the side (example "much like wikileaks has done" As though it were a crime).

 

If I see Obama at a press conference trying to justify this kind of embarrassment, im not going to sit on my ass about it lol.

[ralis]

I have been listening to William Shirer's "Rise and Fall of The Third Reich. The similarities between that time and now are striking. Even Chomsky stated the similarities between the 30's and now.

 

Shirer was a first class journalist!

 

 

http://www.theaudiobookmart.com/search.php?searchBy=author&query=William%20Shirer⊂=⊂=ABM-GS-authors2-17318&gclid=CPWfxM2Y8qQCFQsGbAoduilKhw

[gendao]

[ralis]

Latest update. Assange's accusers, have an agenda! So what else is new!

 

 

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x4655898

[strawdog65]

While it is human nature to be curious and guess about what will

happen in the future... paranoia and fear mongering is useless.

 

The truth behind politics is that we will never know why decisions

are made and who is actually in control of world governments.

 

Money knows no political party.

The desire to create more wealth for the relative few,

will always dictate what the status quo is for the rest of us.

A world-wide economy demands this.

 

Anyone thinking they will make real changes in government is foolish.

It is wasted effort to deeply invest one's self into political opinions.

Without ever knowing all the facts about what is the true underlying

nature of the world political agenda, it's all pointless.

 

Better to focus on what's right in front of you.

Live a simple uncomplicated life.

 

Regardless of what you believe... all things come to pass.

Good and bad are irrelevant, and we as individuals can only

endeavor to live the lives we have, as fully as possible.

 

Peace!

[Sloppy Zhang]

While it is human nature to be curious and guess about what will

happen in the future... paranoia and fear mongering is useless.

 

The truth behind politics is that we will never know why decisions

are made and who is actually in control of world governments.

 

Money knows no political party.

The desire to create more wealth for the relative few,

will always dictate what the status quo is for the rest of us.

A world-wide economy demands this.

 

Anyone thinking they will make real changes in government is foolish.

It is wasted effort to deeply invest one's self into political opinions.

Without ever knowing all the facts about what is the true underlying

nature of the world political agenda, it's all pointless.

 

Better to focus on what's right in front of you.

Live a simple uncomplicated life.

 

Regardless of what you believe... all things come to pass.

Good and bad are irrelevant, and we as individuals can only

endeavor to live the lives we have, as fully as possible.

 

Peace!

 

I feel like I've heard you say this before.... did you repost this, or paraphrase it from someone else?

 

I don't know what country you're from, but I'm from America, and in America, the general idea is that it's the people that are the last check of the government. And for the people to be informed, they need to have access to information. Now I understand that certain information pertaining to national security or ongoing military affairs should be kept within a few people.... but seriously, to use that as a blanket excuse for hiding documents which reveal underhanded (or potentially illegal!) activities, is WRONG.

 

Saying "well we'll never know for sure, let's just keep our heads down" is exactly the kind of behavior which will allow people to continue making decisions that help themselves and lead to harm for others.

 

I'm not going to speak for other countries, but as far as being American, I think it's the duty of Americans to ask questions of their government, to not be afraid of asking questions of their government, and if a situation arises in which the leadership is not willing to answer the questions in an intelligent manner, then that government needs a change.

 

Investigation and accountability is not idle curiosity, nor does it lead to fear mongering. It should be a conscious activity that is undertaken with delicacy and intelligence, and an accurate appraisal should be made about the dangers revealed during such investigation. But sometimes the world is a scary place. Sometimes when you investigate, you find nasty stuff. It is not fear mongering to seek to discover the truth.

Edited December 13, 2010 by Sloppy Zhang

[strawdog65]

I feel like I've heard you say this before.... did you repost this, or paraphrase it from someone else?

 

I don't know what country you're from, but I'm from America, and in America, the general idea is that it's the people that are the last check of the government. And for the people to be informed, they need to have access to information. Now I understand that certain information pertaining to national security or ongoing military affairs should be kept within a few people.... but seriously, to use that as a blanket excuse for hiding documents which reveal underhanded (or potentially illegal!) activities, is WRONG.

 

Saying "well we'll never know for sure, let's just keep our heads down" is exactly the kind of behavior which will allow people to continue making decisions that help themselves and lead to harm for others.

 

I'm not going to speak for other countries, but as far as being American, I think it's the duty of Americans to ask questions of their government, to not be afraid of asking questions of their government, and if a situation arises in which the leadership is not willing to answer the questions in an intelligent manner, then that government needs a change.

 

Investigation and accountability is not idle curiosity, nor does it lead to fear mongering. It should be a conscious activity that is undertaken with delicacy and intelligence, and an accurate appraisal should be made about the dangers revealed during such investigation. But sometimes the world is a scary place. Sometimes when you investigate, you find nasty stuff. It is not fear mongering to seek to discover the truth.

 

 

Hi Sloppy !

 

Hey, yes I moved this from the politics post to here because I thought it was relevant

to the stuff being discussed. Yes, these are my own thoughts, and statements.

And I too, was born and raised right here in the USA.

 

I tire of the fear mongering that goes on. It's all over the media. It's here within this site.

It's within the pysche of the human mind, and it is wasteful and useless to living a life that is

calm and without contention. These things (which we can never really change) mean very little

to the average person. Their lives go on and will continue to do so, regardless of what paranoid

story is next to arrive.

 

Fear is a means to control the masses of our world, by showing fear we lose our capacity to deal

with challenges in a rational manner. Once we have reached that point, minds are no longer open,

and communication is at an end.

Fear and the actions predicated by fear are the enemy of mankind, and the world, and all life on it.

 

I used to worry about the scary things of this world, after all, there are so many especially if you watch TV.

War, human degradation, and all manner of suffering. I used to give in to those feelings that I am being lied

to by my government, and all world leaders. I used to feel angry for the things I judged to be wrong with this

world. I used to waste much of my time and energy reading and learning of all the scary stuff that has been

determined to be going on by those in the know.

 

I used to be a very unhappy, untrusting, unsure, unbalanced, irrational and usually misunderstanding person.

All because of my refusal to see what was this world. It is more than our minds can ever fully comprehend,

it is the great mystery that the Tao speaks of.

 

Our existence in this world is definitely unsure, and yes there are many things that are scary,

and there will always be another new conspiracy theory to tell us what's going on.

 

The point is .... so what?

Is this what your life is about?

Is the fear of feeling helpless the motivating factor in your actions?

If the world is falling apart and we are all going to die a horrible death, what does any of it matter?

 

It is an illusion to think that countries are entirely separate entities. They are not.

What happens in this world goes beyond any lines drawn on a map.

We all live on one world.

The control of nations is a worldwide endeavor by the unimaginably rich of our world.

Money controls governments and countries.

Governments are for the sole purpose to give the illusion of separateness a fleshed out reality.

It is comical when people talk of having to do something to make changes within their government,

as if they really have any control whatsoever.

 

Stop talking. What is there to be done ?

Do you really think you as one person have a complete

and full understanding of what the truth of this world is?

Do you think anyone does?

What is to be gained by creating discontent, with no clarity of

how to change what you actually have no understanding of?

 

This is the opposite of wisdom... to act without fully comprehending what the

situation you are within, is.

Know, comprehend, see with clarity the systems with a system that is our world.

 

The only thing you can control is your own actions, and even that only with discipline and practice.

The most important endeavor you will ever take is that of seeing the importance of stopping the

wasting of vital energy in useless behavior, and refocusing that energy to live your life as fully,

as consciously, as Tao like as possible, right Now.

 

To look at the world and say things need to change to what you believe they should be, this is not Tao.

To force what is to become anything else, this is not Tao.

To waste your vital energies in acts of needless contention, this is not Tao.

To live a life of judgmental non-awareness, this is not Tao.

 

To look at the world and see the cyclic nature in all things, and to accept that this is Tao.

To see what is and accept what is, and use to the benefit of all, this is Tao.

To use our vital energies in pursuits that compliment the flow of nature, this is Tao.

To live a life as impartial and full of awareness as possible, this is Tao.

 

We are the merest of specks... In an unknowable managerie of existence.

 

Peace!

[rene]

No.

[Sloppy Zhang]

Hi Sloppy !

 

Hey, yes I moved this from the politics post to here because I thought it was relevant

to the stuff being discussed. Yes, these are my own thoughts, and statements.

And I too, was born and raised right here in the USA.

 

I tire of the fear mongering that goes on. It's all over the media. It's here within this site.

It's within the pysche of the human mind, and it is wasteful and useless to living a life that is

calm and without contention. These things (which we can never really change) mean very little

to the average person. Their lives go on and will continue to do so, regardless of what paranoid

story is next to arrive.

 

Fear is a means to control the masses of our world, by showing fear we lose our capacity to deal

with challenges in a rational manner. Once we have reached that point, minds are no longer open,

and communication is at an end.

Fear and the actions predicated by fear are the enemy of mankind, and the world, and all life on it.

 

I used to worry about the scary things of this world, after all, there are so many especially if you watch TV.

War, human degradation, and all manner of suffering. I used to give in to those feelings that I am being lied

to by my government, and all world leaders. I used to feel angry for the things I judged to be wrong with this

world. I used to waste much of my time and energy reading and learning of all the scary stuff that has been

determined to be going on by those in the know.

 

I used to be a very unhappy, untrusting, unsure, unbalanced, irrational and usually misunderstanding person.

All because of my refusal to see what was this world. It is more than our minds can ever fully comprehend,

it is the great mystery that the Tao speaks of.

 

Our existence in this world is definitely unsure, and yes there are many things that are scary,

and there will always be another new conspiracy theory to tell us what's going on.

 

The point is .... so what?

Is this what your life is about?

Is the fear of feeling helpless the motivating factor in your actions?

If the world is falling apart and we are all going to die a horrible death, what does any of it matter?

 

It is an illusion to think that countries are entirely separate entities. They are not.

What happens in this world goes beyond any lines drawn on a map.

We all live on one world.

The control of nations is a worldwide endeavor by the unimaginably rich of our world.

Money controls governments and countries.

Governments are for the sole purpose to give the illusion of separateness a fleshed out reality.

It is comical when people talk of having to do something to make changes within their government,

as if they really have any control whatsoever.

 

Stop talking. What is there to be done ?

Do you really think you as one person have a complete

and full understanding of what the truth of this world is?

Do you think anyone does?

What is to be gained by creating discontent, with no clarity of

how to change what you actually have no understanding of?

 

This is the opposite of wisdom... to act without fully comprehending what the

situation you are within, is.

Know, comprehend, see with clarity the systems with a system that is our world.

 

The only thing you can control is your own actions, and even that only with discipline and practice.

The most important endeavor you will ever take is that of seeing the importance of stopping the

wasting of vital energy in useless behavior, and refocusing that energy to live your life as fully,

as consciously, as Tao like as possible, right Now.

 

To look at the world and say things need to change to what you believe they should be, this is not Tao.

To force what is to become anything else, this is not Tao.

To waste your vital energies in acts of needless contention, this is not Tao.

To live a life of judgmental non-awareness, this is not Tao.

 

To look at the world and see the cyclic nature in all things, and to accept that this is Tao.

To see what is and accept what is, and use to the benefit of all, this is Tao.

To use our vital energies in pursuits that compliment the flow of nature, this is Tao.

To live a life as impartial and full of awareness as possible, this is Tao.

 

We are the merest of specks... In an unknowable managerie of existence.

 

Peace!

 

I spoke in another thread about being able to know yourself fully, and being able to make honest appraisals. For instance, you could go from being a boastful jerk, to thinking, "boasting gets you nowhere, see how I do not boast, you all boast so much, but I do not, I am more humble than all of you!" that is the same boasting, but in a much more dangerous forum, because it is self deception.

 

I agree that one cannot let their energy be dispersed just because there is a lot of crap in the world. But sweeping it all under the rug, and then sitting upon that rug so you can meditate and say, "see how I am calm and do not cave into fear mongering" is not what I would call progress or proper action- it is just another form of self deception and willful ignorance and apathy. And that causes nothing but problems, and you have given your tacit support for the despicable acts other propagate.

 

The only true peace and stillness comes from when you have resolved all of the shit, and that is a long, long way away.

 

To look at the length and difficulty of the path and say, "well I can't do anything about it on a global/universal scale, but if I just think of myself, how easily I can still my mind and my actions!" that, I do not think is (as) proper.

Edited December 13, 2010 by Sloppy Zhang

[strawdog65]

I spoke in another thread about being able to know yourself fully, and being able to make honest appraisals. For instance, you could go from being a boastful jerk, to thinking, "boasting gets you nowhere, see how I do not boast, you all boast so much, but I do not, I am more humble than all of you!" that is the same boasting, but in a much more dangerous forum, because it is self deception.

 

I agree that one cannot let their energy be dispersed just because there is a lot of crap in the world. But sweeping it all under the rug, and then sitting upon that rug so you can meditate and say, "see how I am calm and do not cave into fear mongering" is not what I would call progress or proper action- it is just another form of self deception and willful ignorance and apathy. And that causes nothing but problems, and you have given your tacit support for the despicable acts other propagate.

 

The only true peace and stillness comes from when you have resolved all of the shit, and that is a long, long way away.

 

To look at the length and difficulty of the path and say, "well I can't do anything about it on a global/universal scale, but if I just think of myself, how easily I can still my mind and my actions!" that, I do not think is (as) proper.

 

 

Hi Sloppy/ and everyone else!

 

I appreciate your candor in speaking your mind, it helps me to learn about other viewpoints that I

myself have not been exposed to. Because I don't have any interest in convincing you or anyone else of

anything contrary to their own experience, I accept what you and others have said to be the truth as

determined by you and for you. Discussion without contention. Disagreement without animosity.

Both are possible when accepting that any perception is based on the individual first, and that the

truth# is relative ... to who you are, and the experiences you have had.

 

(# This does not refer to proven mathematical truths or any other statistical,

empirical, or scientific extrapolation backed up by verifiable evidence. I am applying this to the human

perception of events and experiences, and how this determines that individuals version of the truth.)

 

With that said, the following is an explanation of my own perception of what is true to me based on my own life

experiences. No agreement is called for or even necessary. To fully understand, one would need the same frame of

reference of experiences. Because some of us may share similar life experiences, it is through this commonality that we can talk and understand some but not all shared experiences. The following commentary is not directed at anyone person in particular, but is a summation of my own ideas in regards to what I believe are misconceptions.

 

Self deception.

What is it?

Deluding oneself from something judged to be obvious? Wearing rose colored glasses and seeing a

distorted view of the world that is not real? Lying to oneself in a destructive manner, creating discord and harm?

 

Since "reality" is self-determinate, then can one on the outside say that someone else is being self-deceptive?

Or is it merely their judgment becoming an extension of their own reality, therefore making understanding of

someone else's view not possible? Of course anyone can call anyone else self-deceptive, but saying it doesn't make it true.

The world is what we determine it to be based on how we think.

I see that my speaking from my own experience is seen as boasting.

I guess everyone posting on TTB is guilty of that as well!

Speaking from one's life experiences could, I guess, be seen this way,

but the intent was not to boast. I do apologize if that is what your perception was.

 

lets say that all thats being said about this world and country, and government is correct. (And it really is, to you.)

How do you suggest that we proceed in making this country a better place? What in your opinion should we be doing?

I am honestly and sincerely interested, and ask that you please elucidate on what needs to be done and how this might be accomplished. If you have awareness of what needs to be done, please share this information,

so we may participate if we so wish to. Logically, if we know what to do, and a course of action is clear and rational,

then it's just a matter of walking the walk and stopping all the talk. I do have some caveats though......

 

The using of force to push people into action is a tactic of a mind controlled by fear.

So I would not participate in anything like that.

It's easy to believe all we are told. It requires no thought.

With thought there is a questioning of why, what we perceive to be, is.

The point Is when the outside influences of the world create a life filled with fear, and winnowed perception,

then life itself closes in on us. Things start to become all gloom and doom. Negativity is an all consuming fire.

Being cynical, pessimistic, and constantly looking for what's wrong leads to a pretty unhappy and dismal life.

It is the easier path, to give in to all of the imposed judgment and meted out portions of personal fear.

But it can reduce people to acting without compassion or understanding, thinking only of themselves in the end.

Not a pretty picture, negativity can do all this and more if you allow it.

 

The challenge is seeing the imperfections of this world as part of it's actual completeness.

It is possible to look at the world, look at governments, look at the people you see everyday, and be positive

and make a difference in a way that is neither combative or contentious. Become more appreciate in your

everyday existence. Become more aware of the people and the stories of their lives. Show more empathy to

those you meet. Be slow to anger, but quick to smile with forgiveness. Make it a practice to feel compassion

for someone or something everyday.

 

The world changes because we change.

And with our own small changes, we culmatively create the world that will be in the future.

Are you helping to create a world you want to live in, by your everyday actions?

If not isn't it time to do something differently?

Gandhi said, "Be the change you wish to see in the world".

Don't wait for permission to enact this principle. We create the change by the people we are, our actions,

our thoughts, our influence on all of the people we meet, these are the elements of real meaningful change.

If compassion and understanding are needed in the world, you are the first step in the manifestation of this

new reality. It always starts with you.

 

Fear mongering and the institution of united paranoia.

These are my suggestions to break the cycle of paranoia.

Turn of the TV whenever possible. Stop watching news programs! If you do, take what is said as just what it is,

"their story". Try taking 2 weeks off from watching any news program or any internet news.

See what a difference it makes to live your life without all the judgment being spoon fed to you thru the

TV or internet. Remember that the news is never impartial, you will always be presented with the side that

is motivated by what they have to gain, whether that be power of fortune. Fear is used constantly within news

stories. Fear is the most useful tool in evoking a response and destroying a rational ability to think.

 

When you have all the available information and knowledge about a given situation,

and are able to see a course of action that allows for an outcome that is beneficial to all parties involved,

and causes no intentional harm, then this is rational, and (I Believe) wise decision making.

This ability is precluded if you are ruled by fear. When fear is your master there is no thought made that is

not clouded by its shadow. Stop the fear. Only speak of what you know to be true. Stop making judgments of

things you have the minimal amount of comprehension of, better to say you don't know or understand.

 

 

Self identification with country/government.

 

It is of course acceptable behavior to identify our selves with our country.

But is it Acknowledgment of Tao?

Countries are just lines drawn on a map by man. Natural/unnatural borders of many countries consist of

mountain ranges and manmade artifices such as walls. But as far as countries existing truly separate, this is a

false reality. There is only 1 earth, and we are all inhabitants here, together. The only thing that really separates

the people of this world are the distinctions we create with our judgments.

 

When someone says I'm American... what does it really mean?

Other than identifying your place of birth on this world, what does it say?

The only real use of such statements of other than factual reference, is one of pridefulness.

I am an american as well, but I do not succumb to thinking of myself or the country I was

born into as better, just because I'm here, and consider my countries rules to be better than yours.

All people's of this world can point to examples of patriotism, of honor, of peacefulness, and great intellect

within their own cultures history. The country we live in has NO ownership of being better somehow, we by

example, are no better than any other country, and so too the people living in that country.

We live as a people who believe they possess, real, actual freedom, and that no other people of the world

experience freedom such as us. What we "americans" really have is the illusion of being free in a society that is

structured for slavery of the mind. We move about freely everyday, and can not see the shackles that bind

us, because they are not evident on our bodies, they exist within our minds.

We are confined by the limitations of our thoughts.

We are controlled by the approval of ignorance within our society.

 

There will always be governments to control world populations. This is inevitable. There will always be

those wishing to create chaos for their own benefit. It is up to us as individuals to change.

Change your focus, from one of watching the world outside your widow with paranoid

apprehension, to one of accomplishing what is necessary to live a fuller, more content life.

 

 

Focus on what you do know.

Know yourself... know your life...

know that its up to you to make the best of your life right now in this moment.

 

Is filling this moment with fear for what's unknown or even unknowable, the best use of your existence?

If you say yes, then I'm glad you are happy. But look deep to fully understand your motivation for your

acts/thoughts, if they are based on fear then most likely they are irrational as well. Only when we see clearly

why it is for the way we act and think does the opportunity to change present itself. Only then will you know

the possibilities, that you can choose to live a life not motivated by fear, but a life motivated by everyday

compassion, awareness, and reverence for the life you live.

Fear is a tremendous weight, it is a burden you can choose not to carry. Just put it down, and walk away.

 

You may ask, what kind of life is that?

I can only speak from my own experience( more boasting...sorry )

Life's focus for me has changed from being about all the business of the world to being about

what's right here, right before me. To me, that is my family, my friends, and the people I work with.

Taking everyday just as it comes. Taking that days moments one by one and living within them fully-

feeling all that is happening within them fully. Experiencing those moments like they are their own complete

lifetimes, each one as full of mystery and pleasure as the next. The time spent with my loved ones is fresh

and new with this perspective, there is no hurrying or thinking about something else, there is only what's

happening right then at that moment, and it is the most important thing in the world.

Even at work or around complete strangers, all are opportunities to practice living fully,

to show compassion, to give of yourself without expectation.

 

Focus on the NOW and see how your life changes. It did for me.

Edited December 13, 2010 by strawdog65

[Sloppy Zhang]

Self deception.

What is it?

Deluding oneself from something judged to be obvious? Wearing rose colored glasses and seeing a

distorted view of the world that is not real? Lying to oneself in a destructive manner, creating discord and harm?

 

Not necessarily- you could be deceiving yourself and life could turn out better.

 

"I'm not a mean person", "people love me", "my spouse is not cheating on me", "I love my job", can be lies that you tell yourself to get you to enjoy a life that, deep down, you do not enjoy, or things you do not agree with. It is still deception, because it does not line up with the physical reality that most of the rest of us interact with. But it helps you get through the day (and sometimes, helps you get through life).

 

Since "reality" is self-determinate, then can one on the outside say that someone else is being self-deceptive?

Or is it merely their judgment becoming an extension of their own reality, therefore making understanding of

someone else's view not possible? Of course anyone can call anyone else self-deceptive, but saying it doesn't make it true.

The world is what we determine it to be based on how we think.

I see that my speaking from my own experience is seen as boasting.

I guess everyone posting on TTB is guilty of that as well!

Speaking from one's life experiences could, I guess, be seen this way,

but the intent was not to boast. I do apologize if that is what your perception was.

 

I don't know that I can fully agree with the notion that we make our own reality. We may make our own CONCEPT of reality, and then, through various types of cognitive bias, accept or ignore different types of data which either support or deny the things we have already determined to be true.

 

Again, you can tell yourself that your spouse still loves you and would never cheat on you, and you might cite as evidence of this all the time he/she was nice to you, said they loved you, did nice things for you, but reject absences that could not be accounted for, phone calls to numbers you don't recognize, and purchases that you had no clue of.

 

lets say that all thats being said about this world and country, and government is correct. (And it really is, to you.)

How do you suggest that we proceed in making this country a better place? What in your opinion should we be doing?

I am honestly and sincerely interested, and ask that you please elucidate on what needs to be done and how this might

be accomplished. If you have awareness of what needs to be done, please share this information,

so we may participate if we so wish to. Logically, if we know what to do, and a course of action is clear and rational,

then it's just a matter of walking the walk and stopping all the talk.

 

Full scale investigation on everyone and everything. Total transparency. Of course, to a certain extent, as long as there are ongoing operations, not everything can be fully revealed publicly, because some people have raised valid concerns that certain released info could put lives in jeopardy. However, if it is discovered that military operations, known or covert, have transpired in an illegal fashion, if other types of illegal action have been taken, then the people who authorized it need to be found and brought to justice in accordance with the law.

 

I do have some caveats though......

 

The using of force to push people into action is a tactic of a mind controlled by fear.

So I would not participate in anything like that.

 

I don't know what you mean by "force". Are you suggesting that some might be suggesting that we "force" people to investigate? That we "scare" them into thinking that the government is scary and is doing illegal things to get them to act? Or that we "force" the perpetrators to go to prison for their crimes?

 

Because work WILL be involved. A change will have to happen. And there will always be those that resist change, there will always be those who will want to cling to their perfect la-la land of "as long as I didn't see it, I don't have to think about it!"

 

It's easy to believe all we are told. It requires no thought.

With thought there is a questioning of why, what we perceive to be, is.

The point Is when the outside influences of the world create a life filled with fear, and winnowed perception,

then life itself closes in on us. Things start to become all gloom and doom. Negativity is an all consuming fire.

Being cynical, pessimistic, and constantly looking for what's wrong leads to a pretty unhappy and dismal life.

It is the easier path, to give in to all of the imposed judgment and meted out portions of personal fear.

But it can reduce people to acting without compassion or understanding, thinking only of themselves in the end.

Not a pretty picture, negativity can do all this and more if you allow it.

 

You can face and deal with negativity without being a negative person. Drawing an example from spiritual cultivation, a cultivator can come across some very negative things, within themselves or in others.

 

But just because you realize that deep down inside you are a greedy, jealous person, that those around you are twisted and sick, and that life itself is an endless spiral of debauchery, ignorance, and hate, doesn't mean you should stop cultivating just because everything you see is "doom and gloom"!

 

What you should do is work through it and reach a point where all of that is resolved. That involves some work. Some people see this work as "force", kind of like how some people look at a Chen style tai chi form, which has fast movements and some fa jin, and say that it's not tai chi because it doesn't look slow and gentle!

 

The challenge is seeing the imperfections of this world as part of it's actual completeness.

 

I agree, but that does not mean we should excuse criminal behavior, behavior that purposefully damages (and loses) lives, simply because "imperfection is part of living in the world".

 

It is possible to look at the world, look at governments, look at the people you see everyday, and be positive

and make a difference in a way that is neither combative or contentious. Become more appreciate in your

everyday existence. Become more aware of the people and the stories of their lives. Show more empathy to

those you meet. Be slow to anger, but quick to smile with forgiveness. Make it a practice to feel compassion

for someone or something everyday.

 

You can feel compassion towards and forgive those who have done wrongs, but that does not mean you excuse them for those wrongs and let them off the hook.

 

The world changes because we change.

 

There's a keyword here, and I put it in bold. The world changes because WE change. Not just you. Not just me. But EVERYONE.

 

If I am the only nice person on the world, and everyone else is mean, and I am always nice, and everyone else is always mean, am I changing the world? No, I'm just the only nice guy.

 

But if one mean person changes to a nice person, and another mean person changes to a nice person, THEN the world changes.

 

And with our own small changes, we culmatively create the world that will be in the future.

Are you helping to create a world you want to live in, by your everyday actions?

If not isn't it time to do something differently?

Gandhi said, "Be the change you wish to see in the world".

Don't wait for permission to enact this principle. We create the change by the people we are, our actions,

our thoughts, our influence on all of the people we meet, these are the elements of real meaningful change.

If compassion and understanding are needed in the world, you are the first step in the manifestation of this

new reality. It always starts with you.

 

The question is not if it will start, but if it will continue.

 

Though you may be the change you wish to see in the world, that does not mean others will change along with you.

 

(had to break it up, it was too long!)

Edited December 13, 2010 by Sloppy Zhang

[Sloppy Zhang]

Fear mongering and the institution of united paranoia.

These are my suggestions to break the cycle of paranoia.

Turn of the TV whenever possible. Stop watching news programs! If you do, take what is said as just what it is,

"their story". Try taking 2 weeks off from watching any news program or any internet news.

See what a difference it makes to live your life without all the judgment being spoon fed to you thru the

TV or internet. Remember that the news is never impartial, you will always be presented with the side that

is motivated by what they have to gain, whether that be power of fortune. Fear is used constantly within news

stories. Fear is the most useful tool in evoking a response and destroying a rational ability to think.

 

All this does it make you ignorant of what is going on around you. Unless you work personally with many key members in Washington D.C. and you have friends who you talk to frequently and tell you about what's going on in the Pentagon, and you have friends who are members of the armed forces stationed all over the world.....

 

Turning off the T.V. doesn't change anything except allow you to be willfully ignorant of what's going on.

 

When you have all the available information and knowledge about a given situation,

and are able to see a course of action that allows for an outcome that is beneficial to all parties involved,

and causes no intentional harm, then this is rational, and (I Believe) wise decision making.

 

Well what happens when a criminal doesn't want to go to jail? What happens when someone who stole a bunch of money doesn't want to give it back? What do you propose we do then?

 

This ability is precluded if you are ruled by fear. When fear is your master there is no thought made that is

not clouded by its shadow. Stop the fear. Only speak of what you know to be true. Stop making judgments of

things you have the minimal amount of comprehension of, better to say you don't know or understand.

 

You are never going to be able to learn all the facts about anything if you turn off the tv and live in willful ignorance of what's going on, just because you think the news is scary and makes people afraid.

 

(I am going to make another post for the second half, as this is getting long!).

[Sloppy Zhang]

When someone says I'm American... what does it really mean?

Other than identifying your place of birth on this world, what does it say?

The only real use of such statements of other than factual reference, is one of pridefulness.

I am an american as well, but I do not succumb to thinking of myself or the country I was

born into as better, just because I'm here, and consider my countries rules to be better than yours.

 

Neither do I. It is a reflection of certain values which we have founded the country upon, and which we find to be right.

 

Just as you believe that people should not be controlled by fear or forced to do anything, well, so too did the founding fathers when they said that a government should not subject its people to doing things that they do not want to do, which is why they created a representative government!

 

If there are actions being taken which are NOT the will of the people, and if in fact there are actions being taken which are not in the best interest of those people, then the people doing such acts in government are NOT acting in accordance with the job they have been granted by the PEOPLE, and they should be removed and, if it is revealed something unlawful was done, they should be brought to trial.

 

If you believe that a certain group of people, because they are born into a certain family or have certain amounts of money, should be subjected to different laws or can act in their own interest even at the expense of others, well, that's not American. And if those people did the same things in that country, then they would not be doing anything unAmerican, and they would be breaking no laws, and there would be no reason for their people to bring to any sort of law.

 

(now whether you think it's okay to go into that place and "set things right", well that's just a whole other topic entirely )

 

All people's of this world can point to examples of patriotism, of honor, of peacefulness, and great intellect

within their own cultures history. The country we live in has NO ownership of being better somehow, we by

example, are no better than any other country, and so to the people living in that country.

 

No one is saying anything about "better". I am referring to certain parts of America which are written in law and which every American is held accountable to. If there are people in America who are breaking those laws, they should be brought to trail. That's how America works. If you don't like that, you either work to change the law, or go somewhere else. If you don't like how America is run, try to change it, then leave. If you think there is something "better" or "worse", then do something about, or go somewhere else. That's just how it works. That's how America was founded.

 

It's not a measure of value, it's just how the system works. I'm not saying it's "right" or "wrong" or "better", I'm just saying that's how the process works.

 

We live as a people who believe they possess, real, actual freedom, and that no other people of the world

experience freedom such as us. What we "americans" really have is the illusion of being free in a society that is

structured for slavery of the mind. We move about freely everyday, and can not see the shackles that bind

us, because they are not evident on our bodies, they exist within our minds.

We are confined by the limitations of our thoughts.

We are controlled by the approval of ignorance within our society.

 

I do not disagree with this.

 

There will always be governments to control world populations. This is inevitable.

 

I refer you to your own words above about the "structured slavery of the mind"

 

Furthermore, even though you may say "this is just how the system works", that does not excuse harmful behavior.

 

There will always be

those wishing to create chaos for their own benefit.

 

As above, so here

 

It is up to us as individuals to change.

 

Again, the keyword.