siddhis do you believe in them?

[mewtwo]

So i was wondering do you belive in siddhis like walking through walls or walking on water ect? The reason i ask this is because i was on a spiritual chat room and i asked about siddhis and a majority of the people in the room at the time said that walking thru walls was impocible and that they were parables. the only one they thought were possible were ones of the mind like reading other peoples mind and so on.

 

Thanks

[Sloppy Zhang]

Yes.

[TheJourney]

Who knows. I've never experienced either of those but i've encountered some strange shit.

[RiverSnake]

I try not to "believe" in anything. However, i am open to the possibility that such things do exist.

[fiveelementtao]

Would Pygmie tribespeople who have never seen a bodybuilder think that Lou Ferrigno has siddhis?

If so, would they still believe in siddhis once they learned that he got his physique from lifting weights for hours every day for many years?

 

At what point do siddhis stop being supernatural and just become lots of hard work?

[Sloppy Zhang]

Would Pygmie tribespeople who have never seen a bodybuilder think that Lou Ferrigno has siddhis?

If so, would they still believe in siddhis once they learned that he got his physique from lifting weights for hours every day for many years?

 

At what point do siddhis stop being supernatural and just become lots of hard work?

 

Probably when someone who knows them teaches people what they are, and they see that anyone can learn to do them.

 

But it's not like people with siddhis go around doing that.

 

Unless we got people levitating, walking through walls, and walking on water somewhere that I haven't seen, teaching other people to do them successfully

[TheSongsofDistantEarth]

I see preoccupation with and pursuit of siddhis as a mark of a beginner on the spiritual path. Or a sign of immaturity on the spiritual path.

Edited December 31, 2010 by TheSongsofDistantEarth

[fiveelementtao]

Probably when someone who knows them teaches people what they are, and they see that anyone can learn to do them.

 

But it's not like people with siddhis go around doing that.

 

Unless we got people levitating, walking through walls, and walking on water somewhere that I haven't seen, teaching other people to do them successfully

So are you saying that siddhis are only siddhis if YOU don't know how to do them? We do all kinds of things today that 100 years ago would be considered siddhis.

 

Even if these skills do exist like levitation etc.., what makes them siddhis instead of little known science tricks?

 

IMO as long as you believe in the concept of siddhis being supernatural because they are beyond your abilities, then no matter what siddhis you learn, you will want the ones you think you can't have.

 

In your case sloppy, you have asked about certain abilities that are available to you in many directions from numerous people, yet I have not seen you actually take the time to find them...

 

do you REALLY want to learn them?

[Sloppy Zhang]

In your case sloppy, you have asked about certain abilities that are available to you in many directions from numerous people, yet I have not seen you actually take the time to find them...

 

So just because YOU do not see someone do something, you assume they do not, are not, can not, have not, or will not do something?

 

[fiveelementtao]

So just because YOU do not see someone do something, you assume they do not, are not, can not, have not, or will not do something?

 

 

Not anymore... My apologies...

[Sloppy Zhang]

Not anymore... My apologies...

 

'Tis alright!

 

In fact, I'm glad to know that one such as yourself has been keeping their eye on me (or at least taking notice of my presence!)

[goldisheavy]

So i was wondering do you belive in siddhis like walking through walls or walking on water ect? The reason i ask this is because i was on a spiritual chat room and i asked about siddhis and a majority of the people in the room at the time said that walking thru walls was impocible and that they were parables. the only one they thought were possible were ones of the mind like reading other peoples mind and so on.

 

Thanks

 

I believe everything is possible, but not everything is equally probable. So, it's possible that a person can go through a wall, but it is also unlikely. So if I hear something like that, I'll not be very quick to believe it.

 

Further, I also believe that psychic powers have only a tenuous connection with wisdom. So if someone demonstrates a power or two or even 100 powers, that doesn't mean I'll become a follower of that person and/or listen to everything they have to say.

[thelerner]

I believe everything is possible, but not everything is equally probable. So, it's possible that a person can go through a wall, but it is also unlikely. So if I hear something like that, I'll not be very quick to believe it.

 

Further, I also believe that psychic powers have only a tenuous connection with wisdom. So if someone demonstrates a power or two or even 100 powers, that doesn't mean I'll become a follower of that person and/or listen to everything they have to say.

 

well put.

[hyok]

It's 70's metaphysical icon, Flash Siddhi.

[Starjumper]

The Dolly Lama used to tell some people that he saw a person walk through a solid masonry wall, however, upon getting the 'usual' gothic reaction he changed it to: "I thought I saw a person walk through a wall."

[NeiChuan]

If people on a chat room can change what you believe so easily, may aswell not look for them.

 

Just go have fun, if you're meant to learn these things you will.

 

Walking through walls is supposed to be very high up there anyway. Not like you'd find anything related to learning it on the internet.

[JohnC]

Yes.

 

Would Pygmie tribespeople who have never seen a bodybuilder think that Lou Ferrigno has siddhis?

If so, would they still believe in siddhis once they learned that he got his physique from lifting weights for hours every day for many years?

 

At what point do siddhis stop being supernatural and just become lots of hard work?

 

Interesting perspective.

 

That the spiritual path has so few that get anywhere on it, and that these things are quite normal, just due to hard work.

 

John

[KoolAid900]

I think that it is certainly possible. The main thing that prevents everybody from being able to perform siddhis is our deeply ingrained perception/belief in the solidity of percevied reality. If one completely realizes emptiness than there is no difference between appearance and sold reality. One of my teachers Bardor Tulku Rinpoche told stories about mahasiddhas one time. He said that for a mahasiddha they do not see any difference between appearance and so-called reality and have to work very hard not to accidently perform miracles like hanging their clothes on a ray of sunshine when they are tidying up around the house.

 

I got the impression that Bardor was talking directly from personal experience, and am actually fairly certain for myself that he is a mahasiddha. I heard a story that when he was helping build the monastery, KTD in new York, that he walked off the end of a scaffold and continued to walk in the air until he looked down and realized what he was doing. I don't know anything for the validity of this story, but it's fun. I've heard another story from someone that I trust very deeply that on the way to the monastery she drove by Bardor Rinpoche who was walking up the mountain and when she got there he was already there.

 

One time during a practice session with Bardor Rinpoche I noticed that I everytime I looked in his direction he was looking at me. As his gaze was quite penetrating this was unsettling for me and eventually I got paranoid and stopped looking around, LOL. My girlfriend was also there and she said she was watching him doing this to everybody in the room during the practice... that he would already be looking at people before they looked at him. I don't know if they got paranoid like I did, lol.

[fiveelementtao]

Interesting perspective.

 

That the spiritual path has so few that get anywhere on it, and that these things are quite normal, just due to hard work.

 

John

I myself am too lazy for siddhis

 

The unspoken assumption I hear when I read from those who believe that these abilities are being hidden from them is that these abilities are as easily learned as tying your shoelaces. Five minutes and presto! you're John Chang!

 

IME, siddhis do exist but they do not bring fulfillment or enlightenment any more than huge muscles from bodybuilding. I sought after them and had some minor experiences but then I realized that siddhis had no practical use in my day to day life or in my relationships. Nor did they bring the fulfillment I expected. From those whom I have met whom I believe do have siddhis, some of them are very immature, unhappy and bitter. Their powers have isolated them from others. They are very lonely and egomaniacal. But, the other aspect is that they worked really, really hard... sometimes 8 hours a day for years to get their abilities. In the end, it is not so different from training to become Mr. Universe. You need some genetic predisposition, and lots and lots of hard work.

 

What's more is that some of those I mentioned have personal lives that are an absolute train wreck and they seem to have overlooked the natural siddhi abilities that all people have but remain largely unrealized.

 

For those truly interested in siddhis that we all have, I recommend a book called "The Intention Experiment" by Lynne McTaggert. It gives credible scientific evidence to the idea that we are able to create reality with our mind...

 

But it shows that we can destroy with our minds just as easily... So, in the end, seeking happiness and enlightenment still is the highest siddhi...

[suninmyeyes]

So i was wondering do you belive in siddhis like walking through walls or walking on water ect? The reason i ask this is because i was on a spiritual chat room and i asked about siddhis and a majority of the people in the room at the time said that walking thru walls was impocible and that they were parables. the only one they thought were possible were ones of the mind like reading other peoples mind and so on.

 

Thanks

I think everything we think of is possible(as physical manifestation is concieved in the mind),becouse every thought is like a seed .It only depends if the seed will be watered or left to dry out.

It all about reppaterning and rewiring and reprogramming belief system.Reinventing your being,or like adding a new program.

Is it possible for everyone ?I would say yes ,but no.

 

Everything has its place.But siddhis is not my personal preferance.I just want to relax these days.Take Take things

easy and enjoy whatever I am doing.

[RiverSnake]

I myself am too lazy for siddhis

 

The unspoken assumption I hear when I read from those who believe that these abilities are being hidden from them is that these abilities are as easily learned as tying your shoelaces. Five minutes and presto! you're John Chang!

 

IME, siddhis do exist but they do not bring fulfillment or enlightenment any more than huge muscles from bodybuilding. I sought after them and had some minor experiences but then I realized that siddhis had no practical use in my day to day life or in my relationships. Nor did they bring the fulfillment I expected. From those whom I have met whom I believe do have siddhis, some of them are very immature, unhappy and bitter. Their powers have isolated them from others. They are very lonely and egomaniacal. But, the other aspect is that they worked really, really hard... sometimes 8 hours a day for years to get their abilities. In the end, it is not so different from training to become Mr. Universe. You need some genetic predisposition, and lots and lots of hard work.

 

What's more is that some of those I mentioned have personal lives that are an absolute train wreck and they seem to have overlooked the natural siddhi abilities that all people have but remain largely unrealized.

 

For those truly interested in siddhis that we all have, I recommend a book called "The Intention Experiment" by Lynne McTaggert. It gives credible scientific evidence to the idea that we are able to create reality with our mind...

 

But it shows that we can destroy with our minds just as easily... So, in the end, seeking happiness and enlightenment still is the highest siddhi...

 

I was under the assumption that siddhis were a sign of ones progression along the path but not the end goal.

 

-However, you implied hear that it is perhaps a detour or a side path that is not related to spiritual progression towards immortality/enlightenment/rainbow body...etc

 

-Is this an incorrect assumption?

[fiveelementtao]

I was under the assumption that siddhis were a sign of ones progression along the path but not the end goal.

 

-However, you implied hear that it is perhaps a detour or a side path that is not related to spiritual progression towards immortality/enlightenment/rainbow body...etc

 

-Is this an incorrect assumption?

 

I am making a distinction between energetic accomplishments and spiritual accomplishments. Rainbow body, IMO does not necessarily mean enlightenment. It means energetic accomplishment. IMO, it is possible to become an immortal or even a god and still be trapped in the illusion of self...

 

IMO and IME, Siddhis are, at best, nothing more than an entertaining distraction. At worst, they can actually retard one's spiritual evolution. Unfortunately many believe that siddhis are a sign of spiritual achievement. I disagree. Siddhis can be used as a means to strengthen one's spiritual practice because they show the person that there is more to reality than meets the eye. But, they can also give one ego delusions and even further separate them from spiritual truth. IMO, the highest form of enlightenment is compassion. No one needs siddhis to practice compassion... Just my opinion...

Edited January 1, 2011 by fiveelementtao

[RiverSnake]

I am making a distinction between energetic accomplishments and spiritual accomplishments. Rainbow body, IMO does not necessarily mean enlightenment. It means energetic accomplishment. IMO, it is possible to become an immortal or even a god and still be trapped in the illusion of self...

 

IMO and IME, Siddhis are, at best, nothing more than an entertaining distraction. At worst, they can actually retard one's spiritual evolution. Unfortunately many believe that siddhis are a sign of spiritual achievement. I disagree. Siddhis can be used as a means to strengthen one's spiritual practice because they show the person that there is more to reality than meets the eye. But, they can also give one ego delusions and even further separate them from spiritual truth. IMO, the highest form of enlightenment is compassion. No one needs siddhis to practice compassion... Just my opinion...

 

Indeed, i feel that your words have weight.

 

-IME and from reading and listening to others i have found that often the path of healing and spiritual growth is one of suffering because we must drop a lot of garbage that we have become attached to.

 

-It has also been my experience that although the individual has to muster enough courage and intentionally release there blockages, energetic work can often help strengthen the awareness to the point where it becomes easier to recognize and heal the wounds of the self.

 

-So my question would be to what degree do you feel that that energetic practices and and spiritual growth are separated from one another? Can one achieve his ultimate goal simply with intensive self reflection? Or is the ego the ultimate divider between energetics and spirituality?

 

-A Note: I know this is a technical question that might not have perfect answer. I simply would like to hear your opinion.

[fiveelementtao]

Indeed, i feel that your words have weight.

 

-IME and from reading and listening to others i have found that often the path of healing and spiritual growth is one of suffering because we must drop a lot of garbage that we have become attached to.

 

-It has also been my experience that although the individual has to muster enough courage and intentionally release there blockages, energetic work can often help strengthen the awareness to the point where it becomes easier to recognize and heal the wounds of the self.

 

-So my question would be to what degree do you feel that that energetic practices and and spiritual growth are separated from one another? Can one achieve his ultimate goal simply with intensive self reflection? Or is the ego the ultimate divider between energetics and spirituality?

 

-A Note: I know this is a technical question that might not have perfect answer. I simply would like to hear your opinion.

 

Good question. I do not necessarily think that energetic accomplishments are separated from spiritual accomplishment per se. Everything is spiritual. Everything is made of energy and spirit. It is we who make the distinction between physical and spiritual. But reality itself does not make this distinction. I believe the mindset that wants to view energy work as being something separate from physical reality will also want to make them more 'spiritual.' The tendency to overspiritualize energetic accomplishments IMO comes from a dualistic mindset. As with the witch hunters of 300 years ago who felt that anything supernatural was evil. Nowadays, people have swung in the opposite direction and feel that anything supernatural is spiritual. So, energy accomplishments are just like anything else. Neither good or bad.

One reason I am attracted to pre-christian european practices is because 2,000 years ago in europe there was no distinction between the physical and spiritual realms and consequently, there was no abitrary attachment of judgement such as "spiritual' and "non-spiritual." Everything just WAS. Supernatural abilities were viewed just like anything else, it could be good or evil or neutral. Wizards could be good or evil just like everyone else. Nowadays, however, if someone shows supernatural abilities, our first inclination is to believe they are enlightened. This knee-jerk reaction makes them more seductive. The idea that we NEED something outside of us to transport us to enlightenment comes from a place of insecurity. IMO, all destructive actions stem first from a place of insecurity, a place which says, "I am not enough as I am. I need something outside of me to save me. I need siddhis."

 

I don't know if I answered your question. But as always, it is only my opinion for today. Tomorrow I may feel differently.

 

I myself still practice alot of energy work and I get alot of health benefits from it, both physically and emotionally. But energy and accomplishments in and of themselves are neutral but my REACTIONS to them determine how I use these abilities.

So, for me, the only real litmus test is if I can be helpful to both myself and others.

[ben]