Taoist Problem Solving Methods

[humbleone]

[Medhavi]

I don't identify as Taoist per se and have little experience with the systems associated with them, which is one of my reasons for coming here. Therefore, I am not what you are directly looking for, but I have a thought that might help you, even if it may seem basic and often repeated:

 

When working on problems, I mainly use my intellect to analyse. It is both a tool towards finding a solution and also a hindrance for accomplishing it.

I am sure you are familiar with the idea of trying too hard to solve something and then missing the solution, which may be hidden in plain sight.

 

Therefore, there might be other parts of the human being that can, at least in an "ordinary" man, only surface when the "lower" intellect comes to a rest- in the dream state for example. It is also rather obvious that many flashes of insight happen in a state of reverie, as you describe- which is another way to integrate more of your being towards finding a solution for a problem you are working on by letting you drift into another state of consciousness, which makes daydreaming and creative visualisation possible, amongst other things.

 

With this thought, I think it is possible to say that solutions have a greater chance of being found once the tight grip of some part of yours- not just the intellect, mind you - loosens and opens up. Is is entirely possible that a part of "you" has the necessary piece of information that completes a puzzle you are working on- but you will not "access" it if you do not loosen up.

 

Now all of this is nearly a given for everyone who has ever taken a step back to acquire a greater view of the overall picture. But I think you are asking for specific approaches to gaining these insights more often?

 

If so, then I would have to say that there is probably no particular technique for making this more frequent as all correct meditation practises and energy developing practises open up the human being, making insights and breakthroughs more frequent.

It is part of the natural process and can only be "influenced" in so far as one is ready to engage actively in those practises which, in the end, form a more coherent being.

There might also be something to the idea that lifelong commitment to intellectual development and meditational practise develops your faculties for receiving such revelations as we can't receive what we don't have capacity for.

What these faculties may be, beyond the five senses, may be tied to the receptor and ligand binding affinity and how they can be evolved to greater functioning in some way. I don't have the exact picture but that might be a clue as you have said that you have an affinity for chemistry.

 

Therefore, it is necessary to increase

-capacity to receive information

-open up the body which is directly correlated to a more "functional" mind which, in turn, broadens your perception of what you assume to be the reality around you. It should be obvious how meditation and the various energy arts which- in the end- are indistinguishable from formal meditation, help with this.

 

As such, I think that is possible to reduce most approaches to these basic points that aim to improve the sensory acuity of the human being beyond the five senses to receive more information until an objective view of reality is possible- that is at least the ideal I assume.

 

EDIT:

I have tried all the logical, rational traditional methods

There might be a problem with this approach. I work as a linguist and researcher in mainly the yogic arts and I am aware of the problem of projecting a scientific mindset of categorisation and especially "extraction/isolation" on so-called "spiritual paths".

It is tempting to go look for a specific "method" to improve a certain part of yourself that you desire to improve. But I have come to the realisation that a great amount of self-knowledge and critical thinking would be needed to accomplish that. This is not likely to happen until great proficiency in any art is reached.

And the greatest problem is that few "methods" that you can find embedded into any religious tradition still carries the "why's and how's".

You are mainly taught to follow a certain training until you reach gnosis- mainly because conceptualisation only gets you so far- this is a reverse to common western thinking which now demands the why's and how's in ready-made conceptual form before you undertake any practise.

And as I have pointed out, the intellect is both a helper and hindrance- depending on how you use it and approach your overall being. How you go about this may trigger insights. But to "force" it with a "method" specifically designed to do that is projecting a very specific mindset on traditions which simply do not(and can not) work this way.

Not because of the tradition but because of the make up of the human being- at least as I understand it at the moment.

 

The only pattern that I can see is that flashes of insight needed for a breakthrough come through such a myriad amount of ways that one of the only common things about them is the idea that a long period of contemplation and hard work is crowned by the final insight gained in a- at times- non-ordinary(read: non-beta waves) state of consciousness. If I wanted to find out how, for example, Einstein in your quote came to that stroke of insight and how to repeat it with a method predictably it would be a kind of interference with what I assume to be the natural learning process. And you would have to assume a complete knowledge of the exact structure of all the bodies of man and how they work together. I would especially have to know where that flash of insight came from and how it entered my mind- in other words, how visions, synchronous events and all sorts of electromagnetic anomalia happen or how dreams can- at times- hold a key towars understanding a certain problem. As far as I know, there is no precise knowledge of that in western science and you only find allusions to it in the fragmentary traditions of the world.

 

I see this discussion opening a can of worms as a wide array of concepts would have to be laid out to even correctly explain the dichotomies at work here, nevermind the problems you might encounter approaching eastern traditions with the motivation to make something predictably happen in a lab setting.

Edited February 4, 2011 by Medhavi

[humbleone]

Medhavi, thank you for your wonderful post.

 

"But I think you are asking for specific approaches to gaining these insights?"

 

Yes.

 

I feel I have put in the hard work, 20 years of endless research. I am looking for an alternative way to mine the data I have. I have tried all the logical, rational traditional methods. Thanks.

[TheSongsofDistantEarth]

Kary Mullis, who won the Nobel Prize for the discovery of the Polymerase Chain Reaction (PCR), basically credits use of psychedelics for his important discovery:

 

From Wikipedia:

 

Developed in 1983 by Kary Mullis, PCR is now a common and often indispensable technique used in medical and biological research labs for a variety of applications. These include DNA cloning for sequencing, DNA-based phylogeny, or functional analysis of genes; the diagnosis of hereditary diseases; the identification of genetic fingerprints (used in forensic sciences and paternity testing); and the detection and diagnosis of infectious diseases. In 1993, Mullis was awarded the Nobel Prize in Chemistry for his work on PCR.

 

Use of LSD

 

Mullis details his experiences synthesizing and testing various psychedelic amphetamines and a difficult trip on DET in his autobiography. In a Q&A interview published in the September, 1994, issue of California Monthly, Mullis said, "Back in the 1960s and early '70s I took plenty of LSD. A lot of people were doing that in Berkeley back then. And I found it to be a mind-opening experience. It was certainly much more important than any courses I ever took."[26] During a symposium held for centenarian Albert Hofmann, "Hofmann revealed that he was told by Nobel-prize-winning chemist Kary Mullis that LSD had helped him develop the polymerase chain reaction that helps amplify specific DNA sequences."[27] Replying to his own postulate during an interview for BBC's Psychedelic Science documentary, "What if I had not taken LSD ever; would I have still invented PCR?" He replied, "I don't know. I doubt it. I seriously doubt it."

Edited February 4, 2011 by TheSongsofDistantEarth

[Everything]

Some guy sits under an orrange tree with an orrange in his hands. He squeezes the orrange. He sees all the sweet orrange juice coming out. He experiences how this whole thing plays itself out. He admires the orrange for giving him food even when he is destructive to the orrange. He may not notice it, but he did experience it. This is now part of him.

Then he goes back to his kung fu practice. He gets angry when someone gets to hit him. The pain gets him angry and he remembers the orrange that he ate in the morning. He gets back on his feet, gets hit again and tries with all his might and power to be like the orrange. Channels his anger into bringing something good to this world, focusing on sweetness of the orrange while being hit. He stands up with the pain and keeps trying, untill he looses all his anger... He gets hit over and over again, but stands up as if he did not even get hit. His sparring partner admires this and stops. From there on he never got angry while practicing. That is what happens when you attend the present while eating the orrange, to experience it. You become more creative, you will be filled with the power of creation so that you may create love, even while getting hit in kung fu practice.

 

That is how the Tao has teachen me to solve problems. Trough attending the present, becoming sensitive to the infinite mysteries around us, experiencing and following the children to its mother.

[devoid]

Hi Humbleone,

 

I would try to approach this through a couple of sessions of deep mediation / trance and looking up my akashic records for advice in doing so. After doing that a couple of times, I would sit down and try to conclude what my intuition and instincts are telling me (which is likely to be opposed to what the intellect is saying). I would then force myself to spend a bit of extra effort on pursuing some of these unlikely paths (paths that I would probably have discarded under "normal" conditions in spite of not being fully convinced why I should do so).

 

I don't know how far you are in your practices. If you're starting from scratch this is not something you accomplish in a fortnight.

 

Feel free to PM me if what I said speaks to you.

[Trunk]

I also read something, yrs ago, about Einstein or the likes sometimes getting breakthroughs via dreams. I have only sparse information re: dream work:

- that one ought to keep a dream journal by your bed, as we often forget dreams and writing helps open & stabilize the conscious <~> dream connection.

- that sometimes you can go to sleep with a question 'intending' to address it in dream.

 

My (very limited) experience is that dream work takes considerable time to develop.. but pretty much every tradition (whether mystical or psychotherapeutic) considers it important territory.

 

- Trunk

[humbleone]

 

I would try to approach this through a couple of sessions of deep mediation / trance and looking up my akashic records for advice in doing so.

 

Thank you all for your comments. I carefully read through them. LSD sounds groovy.

 

A little about my 'self exploration'. I have studied and exprimented quite a bit with Hypnosis, NLP and Dr. Eugene Gendlin's Focusing etc. I consider my ability to visualize as fairly good. I have developed some basic protocols to contact X and I don't know what this X is. Some call is subconscious, other super consciousness or as you say akahic records. But interestingly some information is being returned.

 

So I am at a point now where I get into a relaxed state and simply state my question. Even before I finish the question, imagery or a vision is launched. It usually lasts about 15 seconds to a minute and then dissipates.

I feel am in a enviornment that I don't fully understand, thus my interest in writing here and asking for clarification and more developed methods.

 

To give you an example. After getting into a relaxed state, I asked 'what is the best method for xyz to happen'? Immediatly before I could even finish, I see myself being parachuted down, I feel the strapes around my waist. I can feel the parachute above me. I can feel the warm summer air on my face. You know so I am fully into it. I look down I see Lions, they start to circle where I will land. I start to feel very helpless, there is not much I can do. Sure enough I land and I get jumped by these Lions who proceed to devour me. All of this unfolded with 30 seconds. and then all done. gone. stopped.

 

So very unsettling imagery. and I have no idea what it means. I tried to ask the same question again, this time I think my logical mind woke up and I thought of wearing armor, the movie iron man came to mind etc etc.

 

Out of dozens of these, there was only one time that I had great insight. It was about a personal issue.

 

So there you have it. I believe there must be people out there who are familiar with this terrain I am not familiar with. Thanks very much.

[devoid]

Hi humbleone,

 

The lion's are your fears of going deeper into it and your higher self trying to save you from yourself. Ask your higher self for assistance (even if you don't realize yet that you have one) and tell your higher self that you really want to get further and you need the assistance of your higher self.

 

Additionally (and I think this will be hard for you given that you are so purpose driven / hell bent on this) - let go of wanting to know the answer to XYZ! Tell yourself that in this and the next many sessions, you will in fact not be asking for any such answer - instead you will want to explore your environment some more - perhaps try to meet up with a dead relative that meant a lot to you. When dangers abound, imagine that you are protected from them, immune to them - realize what they are (your own thoughts!) and tame them - if you can't simply stop - give it a rest for a day, a week, a month - as long as may be required. As an example that might help you: When I just started I would sometimes encounter a lioness and once I overcame my fears and scratch her behind the ears she's really quite nice :-)

 

About visualization: it is a great tool to get into an altered state, but if you allow it to take overhand, fantasies will abound and it will be hard to tell fiction from answers. Thus, once you 'get in there' - try to scale back on the visualization and start listening / sensing.

 

NB I know you said it for fun, but I suggest avoiding LSD or any type of drug (including legal ones) for clarity.

[Kris]

Medhavi, thank you for your wonderful post.

 

"But I think you are asking for specific approaches to gaining these insights?"

 

Yes.

 

I feel I have put in the hard work, 20 years of endless research. I am looking for an alternative way to mine the data I have. I have tried all the logical, rational traditional methods. Thanks.

 

Dreaming practices are one way to go. The modern equivalent (for your use) would be something like Win Wengers Image Streaming.

 

- Kris

[humbleone]

The lion's are your fears of going deeper into it and your higher self trying to save you from yourself. Ask your higher self for assistance (even if you don't realize yet that you have one) and tell your higher self that you really want to get further and you need the assistance of your higher self.

 

 

Hi Devoid, a great reply. Thanks very much. I will heed your advice.

 

One more item if you have a few minutes that is driving me nuts for the past two weeks. I asked a similar question and the vision unfolded as follows: I see myself below water holding on to a large snake or python in the middle, it is about 15 feet long. which is moving very fast through the Ocean. I sense that this python has very sharp teeth and that if I don't hold correctly or do something wrong it is liable to turn around and bite me. There is a tremendous sense of speed, of great force moving through the ocean. What would be your interpretation?

 

Where can I turn to, to find meaning of these riddles. are there any books etc you could recommend?

 

Thanks very much.

[Everything]

Hi Devoid, a great reply. Thanks very much. I will heed your advice.

 

One more item if you have a few minutes that is driving me nuts for the past two weeks. I asked a similar question and the vision unfolded as follows: I see myself below water holding on to a large snake or python in the middle, it is about 15 feet long. which is moving very fast through the Ocean. I sense that this python has very sharp teeth and that if I don't hold correctly or do something wrong it is liable to turn around and bite me. There is a tremendous sense of speed, of great force moving through the ocean. What would be your interpretation?

 

Where can I turn to, to find meaning of these riddles. are there any books etc you could recommend?

 

Thanks very much.

Well, this means you think that this creature is powerful and might be dangerous to you. Plus you had a fear of death ofcourse. Try lucidipedia.com

Try and believe that you are more powerful then the creature, that you have rocket boots and that you can swing this snaky beast into the air. If you can do that, you pretty much solved the psychological challenge that this fear is bringing to you.

[Edward M]

Hey HumbleOne,

 

For what it's worth my understanding of these things is it is about thinking of and concentrating on nothing else but the subject and then when that is exhausted just have faith and leave it to your unconcious mind to send the answer to your conscious awareness.

 

It only works if you forget and don't try to force an answer/insight.... it has to be natural.

 

You could pray or state your intention before hand to charge up the process if you want..but have faith, take it easy and remember if you are meant to have a breakthrough then you will, if not then don't worry it is not in your destiny, or your karma isn't ripe yet

 

peace

Ed

[devoid]

Hi Devoid, a great reply. Thanks very much. I will heed your advice.

 

One more item if you have a few minutes that is driving me nuts for the past two weeks. I asked a similar question and the vision unfolded as follows: I see myself below water holding on to a large snake or python in the middle, it is about 15 feet long. which is moving very fast through the Ocean. I sense that this python has very sharp teeth and that if I don't hold correctly or do something wrong it is liable to turn around and bite me. There is a tremendous sense of speed, of great force moving through the ocean. What would be your interpretation?

 

Where can I turn to, to find meaning of these riddles. are there any books etc you could recommend?

 

Thanks very much.

 

Hi Humbleone,

 

I am afraid you can only really turn to yourself for the proper interpretation of your own visions - what you see gives you clues, but after all, they come to you from your own mind... Many people report associating feelings of traveling at high speed with switching into different frequencies / dimensions - let's just call it other mental states. If the snake seems too dangerous try to replace it with something else - Einstein's lightening speed train, for example

(Don't despair if this doesn't work straight away)

 

Remember to ground yourself properly and maintain the taoist safety postures (straight spine, chin slightly in, abdominal breathing and no limb fully stretched).

[TheSongsofDistantEarth]

Hmmm. You said you were into Gendlin's Focusing? Have you encountered this one? It seems to be perfect for what you're describing.

 

Let Your Body Interpret Your Dreams

Also, working with a Jungian psychologist may be another way of interpreting your dreams.

 

Here is another book I personally can highly recommend to you, by a noted Jungian:Inner Work

You probably don't need anything else if you really take in these books.

Edited February 4, 2011 by TheSongsofDistantEarth

[gendao]

I feel I have put in the hard work, 20 years of endless research. I am looking for an alternative way to mine the data I have. I have tried all the logical, rational traditional methods. Thanks.

Intuition is foresight, logic is hindsight.

 

Logic helps you to analyze what you first see with intuition.

 

Einstein himself did not use logic for inspiration to make discoveries. He also used intuition, which he allegedly tapped into with this method:

Al claimed that your best thinking is done right after you fall asleep. He used to go to sleep thinking about a problem while holding a rock on the edge of the bed. As soon as he fell asleep his grip on the rock would relax & the rock would fall to the floor & wake him up. He would then write down any ideas he had as quickly as possible.

That's a crude method, but there are many others as well...

[NeiChuan]

I remember hearing Einstein, when he'd think of a mathematical problem in his head. He'd sit wherever and just empty his mind except for that problem, and the answer would just come to him.

 

He was supernatural in the sense of how well he knew mathematics/laws.

 

The same way a troop who has seen alot or battle knows whenever someone in the same room has a gun.

 

They get so good at what they know it's passed the physical realm.

 

Lot more common then some think.

[ben]

[ben]

[zerostao]

Lucid dreaming. Try "Exploring the World of Lucid Dreaming' by Stephen LaBerge Ph.D. - you need will a lot of discipline.

Or there are faster methods to elicit the ability to work with dream time; explore shamanic traditions. I have used dreams to manifest design ideas. chow

welcome back ben. i have been missing shaman discussions. would you agree that some rare people are born with the natural ability to work within dreamtime without doing the work to get to that level becoz they began at a higher level?

[ben]

[manitou]

Kary Mullis, who won the Nobel Prize for the discovery of the Polymerase Chain Reaction (PCR), basically credits use of psychedelics for his important discovery:

 

 

I would go along with Songs on this one. I think this is the time for LSD or ayahuasca; at the very least, some cannabis. If you're not familiar with the mind-expanding qualities of these drugs, then you're missing something. My guess is that your data would fall together during one of these forays.

[Birch]

"He was supernatural in the sense of how well he knew mathematics/laws."

 

This to me points to the idea of priming your intuition and the idea of 1000 hours to reach "expertise".

 

However, what happens if all your priming has been based on an erroneous model you learned?

 

I mean, I'm sure you'll get great insights into that model through intuitive practices but what if you need to recognize your model (might be) fatally flawed in the first place? Where do you go to get that insight? What if there's a lot (including your reputation and potentially by extension, yourself) riding on your continued use of that model?

[TheSongsofDistantEarth]

I would go along with Songs on this one. I think this is the time for LSD or ayahuasca; at the very least, some cannabis. If you're not familiar with the mind-expanding qualities of these drugs, then you're missing something. My guess is that your data would fall together during one of these forays.

 

If you've never actually tried psychedelics, they have the potential to shift your perceptions and reality. Regarding Steve Jobs, the co-founder of Apple computers, " Jobs experimented with psychedelics, calling his LSD experiences "one of the two or three most important things [he had] done in [his] life".[38] He has stated that people around him who did not share his countercultural roots could not fully relate to his thinking.[38]" -from Wikipedia.

[The Observer]