On Warriorship

[neimad]

Isn't being a warrior about defending boundaries (at various levels) and also living by some value system designed to protect something greater than themselves?

 

definately.

in the definition of the term that i am using a warrior is defending (searching really) freedom. the value system is generally opposite to that which is commonly held by humatons trapped within the matrix.

i would say in this case... a warrior is trying to protect and create something greater than themselves.

 

Values stop them throwing their weight around and abusing their power (hopefully). Is there a qualitative difference between a warrior, a soldier and a mercenary? Can someone be more than one of these at the same time?

 

hmmmm. i would say the moment a warrior begins to abuse their power is the moment they cease to be a warrior and fall back into the matrix.

 

a warrior carves his own path to the source, gives help to those who need it and takes help when he needs it (a warrior has no pride, so a warrior has no problem with receiving help).

a soldier blindly follows orders coming from up the ranks. a soldier is not free to question his role.

a mercenary is basically a whoremonger (like that one!?). that is whoring their services out for money and are still deeply rooted in the matrix because they are acting on greed.

 

to me a warrior is the only one of these three that follows the path with a heart.

 

'Life, you loose. The only thing that counts is how you conduct yourself while you're being destroyed'.

very warrior speak.

 

[sean]

Just some thoughts your post called up.

Todd, I really enjoyed your post. It put into words exactly what comes to my mind when I read quotes like Horsley's. I imagine this style is targeting, or at least attracting a primarily adolescent, or return-to-adolescent market. Not necessarily bad, just not my cup of tea these days.

 

Shit happens. War included. Yet I fail to see how building an identity around resistance cultivates a nondual awakening. We are not in feudal Japan. This isn't Star Wars or The Matrix. People that I meet that are obsessed with war, villains, "the system", "the matrix", conspiracies of grandeur, vanquishing foes ... they either a) live with their parents, are geeks, c) get so wrapped up in this mindset they took it too far and end up attracting really really strange crap into their lives or d) all of the above.

 

Sean

[neimad]

<------ d) all of the above.

 

[neimad]

Shit happens. War included. Yet I fail to see how building an identity around resistance cultivates a nondual awakening.

 

i fail to see how you can equate cultivating an attitude of fearlessness relates to building an identity of resistance.

 

are you saying, then, that we should forget about being fearless? how does this lead to non-duality as fear is obviously living in duality?

 

it's not about being afraid of the matrix, it's about recognising that we are a slave to it (susbtitute 'matrix' with 'samsara' and you have a buddhist point of view right there) and that we want to be free of it. it's not about war, it's about recognising that we were always at war (duality) and we are heading to end the war (non-duality).

 

i personally think it's awesome to have something available to aware adolescents (even if they are geeks and live with their parents) that can help explain why everything in their lives feels so wrong and stupid. that can give them tools to build upon that awareness and go somewhere with it..... a purpose for existing. otherwise the all too easy allure of drugs, alcohol, television, sex and other indulgence is ready and waiting to snap them up.

 

because paths like buddhism and other more eastern ones are not always very attractive to youths, cos they aren't 'cool' (and the healing tao is a load of crap - very 'matrix') it's so useful to have something explained in 'cyber' terms, that is using 21st century lingo to explain a very ancient line of thought (around since man has been around, i assume... or since humanity got themselves trapped in the matrix anyway).

 

i've been having a lot of discussion with my mother lately about my understanding of the warriors path and her understanding of the buddhist one. we have been coming to a lot of agreement.... more so than ever before (especially as the controlling influence of my father is temporarily absent and my mum has more freedom to think for herself).

she just went to see a high lama called lama zopa over the weekend and what he talked about, from her understanding, has been relating with what i have been coming to understand also.

 

you see a true buddhist is a warrior. a true taoist would also be a warrior. a true yogi would be a warrior.

fearlessness is just one of the many things necessary to cultivate on the journey to liberation.

 

for if you don't know what you are afraid of, how can you ever conquer that fear?

if you don't know who or what your opponent is, how can you ever use that energy to spur you onwards?

 

 

 

so then, sean, if you fail to see how an attitude of fearlessness is useful.... please explain then how you think an individual can go from a state of duality (samsara, matrix, machine, system) to that of non-duality (freedom, liberation, enlightenment)?

what is useful? (and in terms of my cyber-punk, geeky, 21st century thoughts).

 

Edited June 16, 2006 by neimad

[sean]

Neimad, I can't wait to hang out with you dude. We are going to have such a blast have crazy debates into the dawn hours.

 

I agree that it's great to have materials that inspire people at all different levels, geeks (which would include myself ), adolescents, wierdos, etc. There are probably infinite entry points onto the path and we could probably debate our whole lives over what kinds of subtle or not so subtle misunderstandings and imbalances the various entry points can leads to, etc. Really, every entry point probably has it's own dark night of the soul and on another level I think if you get down to it we really don't get to pick our entry point as much as it picks us anyway.

 

The aspect of the warrior mindset I was kind of teasing in my post is not about the simple recognition that we are in prison, a matrix, samsara, ignorance, what have you ... it's in the obsession with this to the point that it becomes "your thing". You know how people have "their thing". Like there are people who are vegetarians and then there are people who being a vegetarian is "their thing". They have all the gear, hats, t-shirts, lot's of IE bookmarks. They talk about the suffering of animals completely out of context in mixed company. Oh God, and if you are on their friends mailing list watch out. That sort of stuff. Kind of annoying. Also kind of funny. And we probably need more people with convictions like this. It's a kind of yang energy. Wanting to shake up the world, change the world, save the world in some really drastic way. You can also go back and replace "world" with "self" and I think that might even be truer. How often is this wanting to fight / change / transcend the world/matrix/prison/illusion just a projection of things the person wants to change in themself?

 

Anyway, I recognize that we all go through a lot of phases here and this is totally the place for that. Christ, how many phases I've gone through just since TTB started. Some phases are expressed louder than others and so might get some extra eye rolls ... Like Todd relayed, I think some (many?) of us (myself included) have gone through this "warrior" process of waking up to the intensity of the struggle we are up against. Your perspective is 100% true from your perspective. This is a war. We are in prison. And probably 99% of the world is asleep and doesn't give a shit and won't ever awaken in this lifetime. But I feel I've grown through this perspective into something (arguably) more mature. I see subtleties to this particular "warrior" fixation that, while you are saying "oh yeah, well I will leave that behind later", it doesn't usually work like that. I am not enlightened, so take this for what it's worth, but IMO it's not like you can just whip up this big new warrior identity and slash and burn your way to the very brink of the void and then go "shit, that was fucking cool as fuck! Ok, now I will take off this fake but highly useful warrior costume and jump into the void as the nothingness that I truly am". Maybe that works for some people (in movies and pop spirituality books written by people also not enlightened), but I think these days awakening is more organic than that. Fixations and wierd identity compulsions come and go. Some are strong and sweep us off our feet and have us ranting that we have found the latest greatest temporary identity that can take us to the edge of the abyss, but IMO it's all baloney. We are all just really ordinary people, suffering some moments, happy others, it all comes and goes and we have absolutely no fucking control of anything whatsoever. Enlightenment is an accident. The best we can do is engage in practices that make us accident prone. I think it's good to stay in touch with our fragile, ordinariness. But feel free to take this as a description of my own temporary identity I have built. We are all building selves. It's what humans do best. Always building selves.

 

Just two more cents for the TTB sangha coffer.

 

Sean

[neimad]

The best we can do is engage in practices that make us accident prone.

 

i think this is the coolest thing that i have read of your written words.

 

 

hey i totally agree with you. and the obsession thing.... totally a trap.

 

been there, done that, so over it (or am i? now i am obsessed with being a warrior haha).

 

i totally agree about that whole external projection for changes that we really want to make internally too. been there also... wanted to change the whole world, blah blah blah until i finally realised it's me that i want to change (and thats what changes the world anyway).

 

also agree with how we create personalities... but if we are aware thats what we are doing, that is we are consciously creating personas for a set use then how powerful can it be?

 

for me, my experiences on the weekend and reading jake's book was an incredible shake-up. has opened my eyes and brought new clarity to everything i was already doing and has caused me to engage in them with more determination than ever.... i really feel like i'm on the verge of something, and now i am spending all my time engaging in those accident inducing practices..... i mean the more time we spend making room for the accident to happen, the more likely it is to happen.

(i'm getting a visual here of the simpsons when homer realises if he injures himself he'll get compensation and so he rushes off to a construction site without a hardhat on waiting for something to fall on his head).

 

 

i think we have both identified that we learn most from debates and discussions (i see this now as being constant reminders, because the moment we let our distraction slip we fall back asleep and into the matrix) so yeah.... likely we will talk into the wee hours of the morning and undoubtadely it will be very productive too.

 

however we are both pretty stubborn too so i can imagine raised voices occurring.....

[rex]

a mercenary is basically a whoremonger (like that one!?).

Closely related to this is wargasm. The connection with sex and power with these is no accident.

 

I think someone can be a warrior and a soldier at the same time - there's loads of accounts of soldiers who've questioned dodgey commands or done the right thing. But then again there's of accounts of what occupying armies have done throughout history. Whoremonger and wargasm are very apt.

 

,

We are all just really ordinary people, suffering some moments, happy others, it all comes and goes and we have absolutely no fucking control of anything whatsoever. Enlightenment is an accident. The best we can do is engage in practices that make us accident prone. I think it's good to stay in touch with our fragile, ordinariness.

It's good to be aware of our fragility. It helps develop awareness of others and compassion by relating to qualities held in common. From a Buddhist pov enlightenment is not an accident. It's all mapped out in the Lam-Rim, stages on the path to enlightenment. In our present condition having no control over anything is a result of our karmic vision and being in our dimension. At least we can try to have control over our reactions. There's one teaching that tries to get people from being overly dominated by hope and fear - one of the methods is to ask troublesome spirits to give you hassle!

Edited June 16, 2006 by rex

[freeform]

So I've been thinking about warriors a lot... have had a dream about it... and good old uncle Bob Wilson popped into my dream with some Tarot cards... they weren't the normal tarot cards, but ones that made sense

 

8-Circuit Model of Consciousness

 

Having woken up, I thought to myself immediately - a Warrior (in the way that neimad describes it) is the transformed manifestation of the Second Circuit - the 'Anal Emotional-Territorial Circuit'... something that is part of our inherent psychological map. A non-transformed - Anal Territorial Warrior, shits on people (marks territory - whether mental, emotional, spiritual, sexual etc) and is a natural politician... when you transform the Circuit you get Leary's 6th circuit - 'The Metaprogramming Circuit' as Bob calls it... working on this circuit involves the ability to behave in total freedom... that is, the ability to 'metaprogram' your own persona... your own behaviour patterns etc. (like hacking into the matrix for all us nerds! )

 

So it seems that Neimad's path is taking him in that direction... I'm all for it! One must not forget that there are all the other Circuits to transform if you're looking for the level of 'enlightenment' that Taoists call Imortality. The Wiseman is an archetype of the next circuit (3rd and 6th), The Lover is a manifestation of the 4th (and 8th)... IMO Transforming them in sequence is the way to go... Because each transformed circuit releases energy to move onto the next one... makes me think of the spiral shape