duality, buddhism and TCM 'craziness'

[Non]

I know.. you're trying to help. I just had a difficult realization today in class.

 

The prof says.. in China there is the "tradition" of men having more than 1 wife. I felt bad about this... so I asked.. what if there are more men than women? He said there will be war, and he thinks this may happen with China. Now.. I also wanted to ask.. doesn't this leave to many men being alone if men have more than one wife? He did not answer because he probably did not hear me. I did not want to make it seem a big deal but it was a big deal to me. Though a woman told me that in Tibet if men did not become monks women marry them, but many men share the same woman so it's the reverse.

 

I don't get this.. this is very offensive or hurtful to me. Why the inequality? Men are left out because. IN each case a man cannot have one woman for himself, or the woman can have many. IN tthe case of the "Chinese tradition" many men are left alone, even if they're good men. Simply for tradition. More men are born than woman worldwide anyway, but they kill themselves or die off to equal it out. He says nature intended women make it much easier to find a mate, and many, while for men it's much harder. IN the case of the Tibetan 'tradition' a man cannot have his own woman to himself, but a woman can have many men.

 

But over all the women still ends up on top. NOw who is to blame? Is it nature? Or is it REALLY women? Or rather the nature of the feminine? We all co-create this "reality". This Duality right? So in a sense do womoen contribute to this reality, or are they really just "forced to submit to the will of nature?" Surely women have it easier than men in all cases. They have the internal power which men do not have. How the HELL can masculine and yang energies not have the foundation of an Internal power such as yin?

 

I asked... for there to be Good, or for Good to exist, doesn't there need to be evil? If evil did not exist, what then? He says "we would not exist". So I say "how is there a choice then to be good or evil? if there's not enough evil to support the existence of good then how is there a choice if a person has to submit to the "dual nature" and become evil just to support the existence of good?"

 

He says... you'll understand in the future once you get more into TCM.

 

This sort of thing really changed me perspective.. and it really messed with me. I took a break and walked outside, cried in the restroom. I asked myself.. is this the reason why I'm so alone? BEcause I'm meant to be as a monk, or celibate just to the support the worldwide traditions of greedy men and women, and of their evil natures? He says..that mankind has an evil nature.

 

 

uhh.. yeah!? is it mankind or Nature?

 

Why does it have to be so dual? Do the CHinese and taoists Support rather than try to transcend the Dual Nature of reality which CAUSES suffering?

 

I started to think of the many theories of TCM. Most of them are very good and sound, logical and intuitive. There are some things I don't agree with though.. where TCM theory seems to support the suffering, or the dualistic nature. For example: he says animal products are most of the time more powerful than any plant for curing certain diseases and 9 times out of 10 they really are the more powerful of the TCM medicines. Now, ok, I'm vegan. I eat only from plant food sources. So what then? Because I don't want to support the suffering of animals. Ok.. maybe if the animal dies of natural causes, but if not? Does it support the "belief" in this dual reality, in which Evil exists to support Good? Where animals, humans, etc. must feed off other living organims' overt sufferings for their own selfish benefit?

 

Is there a Universal Good?

 

 

OK..so he says... "I like Christianity, it's just so natural. It's based on the beleif in Love." I asked about buddhism, and he said "Buddhism gives people hope.". UNder my breath I said "yea for the involuntary celibate males". It would seem the ones who are involuntarily celibate are celibate just to support the existence of an unequal tradition. Of one extreme to support another extreme, just like "evil" supporting "good"... and then "good" supporting "evil".

 

 

So even if Buddhism has it's uses... hoepfully it can help me "GTFO" of this Insane reality of which Only suffering exists.

 

Because this sort of thing forces many men to be alone and neglected. Is the Yin nature to blame? or the fact that many people seem to support such a dualistic view of reality?

 

Does TCM wish to support the dualistic reality, including all the suffering or seek to transcend by integrating it?

 

He says.. "you have the choice of being good or evil". but again I asked the question do you really have a choice then if evil supports good and vice versa? You can live either as a monk in a temple or be a TCM doctor or?

 

And is buddhism just as insane also as the rest because they inherently believe in a dual world that has to be transcended?

 

Is this how the Existential world has to be? Full of suffering just to support Life itself. Full of Death just to support Life?

 

Why can't we just not exist, and be in a state of purity then forever?

Edited February 19, 2011 by Non

[Non]

I forgot to say.... the prof. I am talking about supports the Chinese tradition of marrying more than one woman. Duhh... of course he does. Anyways he says it's healthy. The men live longer that way.

 

Uh.... ok.

 

He also says one must be a balance of good and bad/evil. If you're too good you're weak.

 

Now obviously.. I understand his point but speaking in such DUALISTIC TERMS can keep people entrapped in dualism. I believe in Universal "Good", which is beyond these terms. It's understandable more to say that you can be good as long as you don't do that which is necessary to ward off 'evils' but to be Bad/Evil is something else...

[henro]

Is your professor Chinese ? And if so, when was the last time he was there ? How old ?

 

It hasn't been a "tradition" since the communists took over. And before that, it was mostly the extremely wealthy that had multiple wives. In some cultures women take more than one husband, in others it's the reverse. One of my tai ji teacher's brothers had 5 or 6 wives, and my kung fu teacher talks about one of the wealthier people he knew growing up in China having 12 wives.

 

No reason to get upset, there are customs all over the world that would make many of us depressed, and disgusted. Not much we can do about that. Approach them with compassion, and try to understand to the best of your ability. Then let it go. . .

[henro]

I forgot to say.... the prof. I am talking about supports the Chinese tradition of marrying more than one woman. Duhh... of course he does. Anyways he says it's healthy. The men live longer that way.

 

Uh.... ok.

 

He also says one must be a balance of good and bad/evil. If you're too good you're weak.

 

Now obviously.. I understand his point but speaking in such DUALISTIC TERMS can keep people entrapped in dualism. I believe in Universal "Good", which is beyond these terms. It's understandable more to say that you can be good as long as you don't do that which is necessary to ward off 'evils' but to be Bad/Evil is something else...

 

 

Ask him how a man can retain essence if he's servicing multiple wives ?

[The Way Is Virtue]

Hi Non. Keep in mind that your TCM professor is relating his own biases and opinions and interpretations in much of what he says. TCM doesn't support or not support duality or anything along those lines, but it must work within the confines and laws and ways of this dualistic world, just as everything else in this world does. That is all. TCM is a way of helping people with their health. Focus on that. Why are you trying to read more into it than that, I wonder?

 

Maybe it would be helpful for you to focus more on just the methods and theory of TCM that you are being taught, and try not to let others opinions or your own opinions and ideas get in the way of that too much. Each teacher adds their own slant to what they are teaching. Understand that different teachers may express things somewhat differently. Learn what is useful and important to using and implementing TCM, but understand that one never stops learning and you will no doubt have other teachers throughout the years who will help you expand on your knowledge. You certainly don't have to accept everything any given teacher is saying, but it is always good to keep an open mind and listen as sometimes our own personal views and opinions may be limiting us from further or deeper understanding.

 

I don't know your exact situation, but you seem to be more than a little wound up and stressed out right now, so maybe try to get away from it all for periods of time where you can and just get out in nature or whatever and relax and enjoy. Long walks in nature are always good. At any rate, do something that will help you to relax. Try not to take things so seriously as well. Interacting with others in social activities is a good way to release stress as well...

Edited February 20, 2011 by The Way Is Virtue

[gendao]

Lol, first off, I'm finding your Chinese prof increasingly questionable...

 

First, he promotes Falun Gong as the "highest Buddhist qigong."

 

And now, he's giving you some very distorted and outdated societal views. Multiple wives have always been extremely rare in China - more the exception than the traditional norm. The vast majority of married couples in China - are just that - couples. You might as well say that having tons of groupies are a "tradition" here in the US (even though it only applies to a miniscule handful of rock & jock stars).

 

But, it essentially boils down to the fact that extremely alpha (high-testosterone, powerful, wealthy, etc) "yang" males are extremely desired by women. And as PUAs say, women would rather have 1% of a "yang" man than 100% of a "yin" man. Or how 20% of men get 80% of women. So, when demand outstrips supply like this - you will simply end up with multiple groupies, concubines, wives, baby mamas, gf's, fb's, etc etc. Whatever arrangement it comes in - the basic Darwinian phenomenom is still the same - a surplus of p*ssy for these select men. Meanwhile, all the remaining men will suffer a deficit of p*55y because it is essentially a finite pool.

 

And many men are actually already suffering from terminal singlehood in China already. They are known as "guang gun" (光棍) or "empty branches." China's ruling class probably actually likes this though - because it gives them a larger military/labor force while reducing population. These guys will make ideal potential cannon fodder or lifelong factory workers - as they have nothing else to live for and won't be breeding.. They are in essence, worker bee drones who will make life better for the rest of society, if not much for themselves.

 

 

 

So, it's all just a big Game Theory game. Hence, Buddhism says that life on Earth is suffering and Taoism ultimately views indulging in worldly pursuits as a waste of lifeforce from the real endgame of alchemical immortality. After all, you can't take all your toys and hoz with you - but you can take all your yang.

 

Of course, at the lower levels, Buddhism does advocate a Middle Way approach and Taoist practices can still enhance one's ordinary well-being & life. So, it's just really up to you how far you want to take them...and if you want to support or transcend the duality.

 

 

Again, great probing questions!

Edited February 20, 2011 by vortex

[Sloppy Zhang]

Non, you think too much. Seriously.

 

Look at your past posts, see the back and forth, the this and that, the what about this scenario, what about that scenario.

 

You ever find yourself drawn to one conclusion, then more thought leads to another conclusion, then thought leads you back to the first? Yeah, it's a very LITERAL sign that you are thinking in circles.

 

Get out more. Get some physical work done. Walk, jog, run, do some push ups, jumping jacks, squats, crunches, get some dumbells (10-20 lbs), workout with those. DO stuff. Stop thinking about it. DO it. You are thinking yourself into a hole, and the only way to get out of a hole is to actively climb out.

 

Changing up your lifestyle routine will give you a change in perspective. You'll be able to see stuff happening, rather than thinking in elaborate hypothetical situations.

 

I mean, I'd sit here and throw some more thoughts your way, and if it were anybody else I probably would, but you've been at this for a long time. It's obvious it's not working. So you gotta change it up.

Edited February 20, 2011 by Sloppy Zhang

[Non]

Lol, first off, I'm finding your Chinese prof increasingly questionable...

 

First, he promotes Falun Gong as the "highest Buddhist qigong."

 

 

 

no that's a different professor.

[henro]

no that's a different professor.

 

 

Can I ask what school are you at ?

[gendao]

Here's an amusing example of a current polygamous relationship with a fabulously wealthy, famous, dominant, "yang"-looking celeb:

Charlie Sheen's two girlfriends have today spoken about their new - and very unconventional - living arrangement.

 

Porn star Bree Olson - Rachel Oberlin - and former nanny Natalie Kenley have both moved into the Two And A Half Men star's LA mansion in a situation Sheen describes as a 'polygamy story'.

 

'We do whatever Charlie wants us to do,' Olson tells the New York Post. 'This is the type of lifestyle I’ve always wanted, and I’m thrilled with it.'

 

'All three of us are in a relationship, and if Charlie ever wants to go outside "the wedge" and act out on his sexual desires, that’s fine with Natty and me,' Olson, 22, continues.' We’re laid-back people.'

I guess in this case - 50% of a man with millions of dollars, "tiger's blood & Adonis DNA" is still faarr more than 100% of a regular Schmoe. So while the % is lower...the absolute value is still higher with him. And absolute value is what (many) women are really comparing men by.. So, this "unconventional" relationship is actually fairly logical according to simple Game Theory math. Edited March 2, 2011 by vortex

[markern]

Lol, first off, I'm finding your Chinese prof increasingly questionable...

 

First, he promotes Falun Gong as the "highest Buddhist qigong."

 

 

WHat??? I have a book with interviews with Buddhist masters where his holiness or venerable something A Tibetan guy I think) says that Falun Gong should be banned and talks about how abusive the mind control methods of Falun Gongs leader is and he calls it the highest BUDDHIST qigong