New to taoism and wanting some enlightenment

[brawnypandora0]

1) How can inanimate objects have tao?

 

2) Since taoism does not have dogma, how should one live ethically? Or why should one live ethically at all?

 

3) Since the tao is everywhere, does that mean everyone in the world is a taoist? Even Muslim fundamentalists?

 

4) Are Buddhists and Taoists really "brothers in heaven?" I've been studying up on taoism for the past year, and I have a much better impression of it than Buddhism, which I feel is almost as dogmatic as Abrahamic religions.

 

5) If taoist ideas are really that influential in China, why has Chinese history been so bloody and tyrannical?

 

6) At the current rate, the planet will be uninhabitable within two centuries as man destroys this planet. Do you think Laozi would be concerned about this?

 

7) Is there really an afterlife? If so, is there a heaven and hell?

 

8) Some branches of taoism (in Taiwan) believe in ancestor and deity worship of thousands of spirits. Are they misinformed?

 

9) How often do you consult the I Ching? Is it really divinely inspired?

 

10) Is there any scientific basis to the practice of semen retention?

[Marblehead]

WoW! You didn't waste any time getting started.

 

Way too many questions in one post.

 

Take your time - you have the rest of your life to find your answers. Please, one question at a time.

[manitou]

Hi Brawny - I'd go along with Marbles on this one. Slow down a bit, or you'll miss it. In Taoism, it's called 'casting out so hard you scare the fish away.'

 

Just for starters, yes, everything is Tao. Your dog is a 4-legged. You are a 2-legged. Trees are 1-leggeds. We are all one. It all has consciousness, even rocks. Getting them to respond quickly might take a while, though.

 

The Sage in the Tao Te Ching is your model. A lot would be gained by reading not only one translation of the TTC, but maybe two or three. You will be able to triangulate a lot of your own questions.

 

It sounds to me like your time for pounding knowledge into your brain has pretty much run its course on all this. It may be time to switch over to the experiential side. That's the 'going in' process. My advice to someone who has all the intellectual knowledge he needs to understand all this, such as you, would be to assume you have every character defect you can think of; selfishness, arrogance, pride, jealousy, the list goes much further. Your mission at that point is to determine to what extent you possess them.

 

It can be done real simply by merely starting the introspection process by going over your day every night. Look back and see where you could have been less arrogant, less prideful, less jealous....that sort of thing. Once your psyche accepts the possibility that it may have a few malfunctions, the process will take on a life of its own and you'll find that Life will bring to you exactly what you need, over and over again, until the lesson is learned.

 

It's really a lifelong thing. Try relaxing by a stream or go lay face down on the grass. Give your psyche time to process the incredible amount of information you've learned. Give yourself a break for a while. That's when the understandings will start to clink into place. Right now, your chunks of understanding are hovering around you and haven't found their rightful position yet. Just LET it happen, don't try to MAKE it happen. You can't make it happen. That's the nature of the Tao. You've already invited her in. Let her do the rest.

[adept]

Personally I would go straight to Chuang Tzu.

Very much overlooked on these forums in favour of the TTC which is more conservative and closer to Confucianism in my opinion.

The Chuang Tzu is more laid back and natural in it's approach. Quintessential wu wei.

For an easier ride however 365 Tao is great for daily contemplations.

Edited March 26, 2011 by adept

[Aaron]

1) How can inanimate objects have tao?

 

I thought I might attempt to answer your questions... In order to answer this question one must first decide what Tao is. Since most people are reticent to talk about Tao or attempt to define it, we tend to use terms that prevent Tao from being hedged in. I made the mistake of comparing it to consciousness at one time, which wasn't well received. So in regards to Tao, just keep in mind that it translates roughly as Way, but way as in practice, like a Buddhist Way or Confucian Way. In that regards Inanimate objects have a way because they are part of the "practice" of the universe.

 

2) Since taoism does not have dogma, how should one live ethically? Or why should one live ethically at all?

 

There are several different thoughts about this. Some tend to believe that there is no need to behave ethically, that the chapters regarding ethics were added at a later time during the formulation of the Tao Teh Ching and hence, they don't necessarily apply to the actual message of the Tao Teh Ching. I tend to view this kind of thinking as an attempt to justify one's own actions.

 

In my own opinion, the need to live ethically is simply because by living ethically we can live harmoniously with those around us. The important thing to remember is that ethics are subjective. Remember the first line of Chapter 2 of the Tao Teh Ching tells us, "When all the world recognizes beauty as beauty, that in itself is ugliness." Just because someone tells you something is "ethical" doesn't necessarily mean it is so.

 

3) Since the tao is everywhere, does that mean everyone in the world is a taoist? Even Muslim fundamentalists?

 

Again this depends on what you consider a Taoist to be. For most a Taoist refers to someone who practices Taoism, either as a religion or philosophy. The idea that everyone is a Taoist often stems from the idea that Tao is the natural course of things, but most people tend to agree that those who are practicing in accord with Taoist ideology and philosophy are Taoists.

 

4) Are Buddhists and Taoists really "brothers in heaven?" I've been studying up on taoism for the past year, and I have a much better impression of it than Buddhism, which I feel is almost as dogmatic as Abrahamic religions.

 

In order to understand this idea that Buddhists and Taoists are "brothers in heaven" one must also understand the complex relationship of Buddhism and Taoism. Most Chinese are not exclusively Taoist or Buddhist, but rather follow a myriad of different philosophies. Historically, as Buddhism developed in China, it was eventually modified in certain ways so it adapted to the Chinese cultural identity. When this occurred aspects of Taoism were adapted by Buddhists. Many years later, when Buddhism was the more prominent of the two religions, Taoists began to adapt Buddhist ideas in order to appeal to the court. This adaptation of various philosophies and traditions has made Taoism and Ch'an Buddhism more similar in many respects, than different, hence this idea that Buddhists and Taoists are really "brothers in heaven".

 

5) If taoist ideas are really that influential in China, why has Chinese history been so bloody and tyrannical?

 

You could ask the same question about Christianity. The fact is, just because someone might believe something is true, doesn't mean they necessarily practice what they preach. Chinese history isn't really any more violent that Western History, but if one ceases to see Chinese people as people and rather defines them according to their religion and philosophy, what happens is that we will expect them to behave as that religion dictates, when in fact rarely does any man or woman behave in accord with all of a religions teachings, rather we do those things we absolutely must and let the others slide.

 

6) At the current rate, the planet will be uninhabitable within two centuries as man destroys this planet. Do you think Laozi would be concerned about this?

 

Now keep in mind that Laozi was most likely a fictitious character, created by early Taoists to explain who authored the Tao Teh Ching. However, if one examines the man that people come to view Laozi as, then one can also see that he was essentially forced to write the Tao Teh Ching by the guard at the gate. Also the Tao Teh Ching advocates influencing others through ones actions, rather than one's words, so it would seem to me that, rather than preach about the need to conserve fossil fuel and change our destructive ways, that Laozi would most likely live a life that he thought would be an example for how others should live their lives. In this way, he would be showing the path of virtue.

 

7) Is there really an afterlife? If so, is there a heaven and hell?

 

If you want concrete proof of an afterlife, I think you'll be disappointed. I personally believe in reincarnation, but I don't believe in heaven or hell. I can't prove to you that any of this exists, but I can tell you that the formulation of ideas about an afterlife often have to do with one's fear of death. If you want evidence of any of this, then you will have to experience it on your own.

 

8) Some branches of taoism (in Taiwan) believe in ancestor and deity worship of thousands of spirits. Are they misinformed?

 

They are not misinformed, they are simply adapting cultural traditions to the religion of Taoism. As Westerners we often view Taoism as two distinct schools, a school of philosophy and a school of religion, in the eastern world this distinction isn't so visible. Many Chinese follow various traditional beliefs as well as Taoism and Buddhism. They will go to the Taoist temple on Tuesday and the Buddhist temple on Thursday. The temples have learned that in order to receive donations they need to cater to the people's needs, hence over time they've adapted their religious ceremonies to include the traditional cultural folk traditions of the local people. I mentioned this earlier in regards to the 'brothers in heaven' question and it applies here as well.

 

9) How often do you consult the I Ching? Is it really divinely inspired?

 

I have a copy of the I-Ching, but I have never consulted it. The I-Ching actually is not Taoist, but rather comes from a tradition that predates the Tao Teh Ching. The ideas involved in the I-Ching do not necessarily represent the ideas presented in the Tao Teh Ching, but rather, as I've stated twice before, became incorporated in to that belief system because it was a popular tradition of the Chinese people. As far as being divinely inspired, I can't tell you. I would assume a divinity would be the only one who could tell you for certain.

 

10) Is there any scientific basis to the practice of semen retention?

 

Most advanced practitioners of Qigong will tell you that semen retention is unnecessary. Even if it is practiced, it is one of last things one will learn in a Qigong system. Practicing this without sufficient knowledge and experience can be physically dangerous. As far as a scientific basis for the practice, no, I've never heard of one.

 

 

Well I hope that helps to answer your questions. I'm sure others will come along and offer their own answers. In the end I would recommend that you look into these topics for yourself and decide how you feel about them.

 

I hope life is treating you well.

 

Aaron