What is the Purpose of Pain?

[Otis]

Of all the functions of the body, none is more mysterious and provocative than pain.

 

We often treat pain as if it is an outside invader, like a virus, that needs to be killed. But clearly, pain is not something that exists out there in the world, but is right here in my body, in my head.

 

Pain must serve a function (or many of them), or it would not exist. Compared to a sense as powerful and useful as vision, pain seems like a mistake, like a neurological dysfunction. But is it?

 

Is it possible that egoic man just has the wrong relationship to pain? Do we resent it, when we really should be thankful for it?

 

How do you view pain? What is its function? How does it fit into your Taoist/Buddhist/whatever cosmology? Do you think animals have the same relationship to pain as man, and if not, why not?

 

How do you relate to pain? Is it part of your cultivation? Do you see it as an enemy, or an ally? Do you embrace it, or turn away from it? Do you use it for self-healing? How does that relationship change as you age?

 

C'mon, Bums! Share your pain!

[三江源]

I had a lot of pain recently. I was told "look on the bright side, you're burning through a lot of karma", which foxed me right proper, because uuhh, did I volunteer to burn karma so painfully..no, not consciously. Am I a better person from having that pain, and all the pain I've had.. yes. More compassionate, more fully human. It extended my territories. As the pain of childbirth does. How did I cope with it? I became very quiet indeed and shut down to be alone with the pain, to feel the suffering full on, just to watch it 'what are you going to do now, pain?!' It needed space, clearly. It claimed it. I also wondered what I had done to create a situation that caused pain, so it was an opportunity for self examination of an urgent nature. Would I choose that kind of opportunity, not consciously, no. Would I choose to extend my territory? yes. Pain, and laughter, and love... treat them all the same? Part of the journey. Love more, because you know pain. Laugh more, because you know pain. Cry less, because you know pain.

[doc benway]

Of all the functions of the body, none is more mysterious and provocative than pain.

 

We often treat pain as if it is an outside invader, like a virus, that needs to be killed. But clearly, pain is not something that exists out there in the world, but is right here in my body, in my head.

 

Pain must serve a function (or many of them), or it would not exist. Compared to a sense as powerful and useful as vision, pain seems like a mistake, like a neurological dysfunction. But is it?

 

Is it possible that egoic man just has the wrong relationship to pain? Do we resent it, when we really should be thankful for it?

 

How do you view pain? What is its function? How does it fit into your Taoist/Buddhist/whatever cosmology? Do you think animals have the same relationship to pain as man, and if not, why not?

 

How do you relate to pain? Is it part of your cultivation? Do you see it as an enemy, or an ally? Do you embrace it, or turn away from it? Do you use it for self-healing? How does that relationship change as you age?

 

C'mon, Bums! Share your pain!

Some thoughts -

 

Pain is a critically important experience. It's easy to address "physical" pain but the discussion doesn't stop there.

It is an indicator that something is threatened or at risk. It is a protective mechanism.

If a physical part is not healthy, it often needs some degree of protection or rest.

Pain reminds of us this. Pain helps to prevent us from damaging ourselves.

It helps us to investigate whether something is not healthy or well adjusted somewhere.

 

At another level, pain is an indicator that there is an opportunity to grow.

It can indicate a shortcoming or weakness that can serve as a focus for development or improvement.

Pain can be a stimulus to rest or a stimulus to act.

Pain can be embraced and appreciated for it's value or feared and avoided at all costs.

It only becomes suffering when we treat it from a perspective of fear and anxiety.

When we embrace it (to whatever degree we are capable) it can be a great teacher.

 

This is a problem I have with the current push in the medical profession for "pain management."

Pain should not be treated as an illness to be abolished. Most "pain management" I observe amounts to nothing more

than facilitated opiate dependence.

Pain is a natural and necessary experience (another is death) that only becomes toxic when it is expressed as a way of distracting us from psychological and emotional content that is more difficult to deal with.

 

I really liked a brief discussion presented by Anthony Demello on psychological pain in his audio set - Wake Up To Life. He was a Jesuit, psychotherapist, and a spiritual guide. He often found himself deeply torn between treating a person's psychological pain (fulfilling his role as psychotherapist) vs allowing the person to experience deeper and more profound levels of pain which could potentially lead to a spiritual awakening and understanding of the need for major life change.

 

Great topic for discussion - so much more could be written about this but enough for now...

[fizix]

"Pain is the one teacher no man will ignore." -Jorus C'Baoth, insane Jedi Master

 

Anyone want to speculate on pain in relation to karma? I heard that any pain experienced during full lotus is karma (from current and past lives) being burned.

[三江源]

Fiveelementao mentioned here the other day, the Shiva path, the path of transformation/purification through destruction. I think pain can be part of that path.

[Everything]

Of all the functions of the body, none is more mysterious and provocative than pain.

How can you say it is mysterious?

 

Punch your self very softly under the eyes on the cheek bones. There... You felt pain, and you can draw infinitely from this experience. There is alot of mystery in pain, yes. But really, out of all the things you could pick, you chose pain to be the most mysterious function of the body?

 

Well, guess its for our survival and a fun fact is that pain is equal to everyone. But the focus on it can be reduced and the sensitivity of pain can be reduced trough practice. But focus is a larger factor, or bigger role in "less sensitive" people. If you can focus well, you can concentrate your focus on what matters, and not the pain. This is important in sports.

 

Only excessive pain can be mysterious or found useless, for it is the thing designed to save us which eventually ends up killing us, causing too much stress. Is that what you mean? That paradoxical nature of such an event.

Edited April 19, 2011 by Everything

[GreytoWhite]

It is a tool like anything else in the body or mind. Pain brought me to my path and it is my sensory guide for much of what I do. I find it especially useful for weather work.

[Marblehead]

Well, Steve has already said what I would have said plus a lot more. Hehehe.

[Aaron]

I used to know a doctor that was a pain management specialist that refused to prescribe opiates. I'm not sure what alternatives he used, but he was really anti-opiates or anything else that held a high risk for addiction. Believe it or not, he had quite a healthy practice. Despite what the medical community is led to believe, a large number of people are not interested in taking opiates and such and would much rather manage their pain in ways that do not have the potential risk of addiction and abuse.

 

In regards to pain, I think that's been addressed quite well. For those who have suffered an injury or procedure that requires pain management, if you feel uncomfortable taking opiates or are unsure of what you are taking, ask your doctor. Don't be afraid to research the drugs you take on your own as well. Oftentimes doctors are reticent to explain all the side effects associated with certain prescription drugs.

 

Lastly, the abuse of prescription narcotics is a billion dollar industry, so there's no wonder that most of the measures taken to curtail it seem to only do minimal good. Spend a billion dollars to stop illegal drug cartels, but spend a million or so to try and prevent the abuse of illegal drugs that are earning billions for our own companies. Do I really need to say more? I guess I'm feeling political today.

 

Aaron

[Otis]

There is alot of mystery in pain, yes. But really, out of all the things you could pick, you chose pain to be the most mysterious function of the body?

Yes, I think pain is among the most mysterious functions, not only in how it works, but why it's there at all.

 

Precisely because pain seems so obvious. We all know that "pain is something to be avoided". But I think that "obvious knowledge" is exactly backwards. The very urgency of pain suggests that our body is trying to direct our attention toward the pain, not away from it. It is (perhaps) only our limited perspective that insists on distracting ourselves, on numbing the sensation.

 

Just about every other function in the human body is seen as default useful, and the problems only begin when they get out of whack. But pain is (usually) seen as default wrong. What other sense do we try to escape from? That's a big puzzle, right there, and solving it, I think, can be the source of a great deal of liberation.

[Marblehead]

Do I really need to say more? I guess I'm feeling political today.

 

Aaron

 

Hehehe. Or at least expressing your concern.

[thelerner]

 

 

Is it possible that egoic man just has the wrong relationship to pain? Do we resent it, when we really should be thankful for it?

 

Good stuff, also what Steve wrote about allowing for pain. Pain can lead to growth (and to knowledge, even if the knowing is STOP doing that). Same with boredom, shielding ourselves & kids from boredom we hide from understanding ourselves, wasting time on the trivial, because it entertains and distracts us.

[Otis]

I think that Genesis has some insight into pain:

 

After Eve ate of the fruit of duality (i.e. knowledge of good and evil), then she was afflicted with "pain in child birth". It was dualism that led to her shame of nakedness, and to the suffering of pain.

 

Once we decide that pain is something that we don't want, then we suffer. As consequence, we find addictions to cover it up. We bury ourselves in distractions like delusion, drugs, food, sex, adrenaline, and self-identity, all to distract from, and cover up pain. The reasons why these things are addicting is because the pain doesn't go away; it is only temporarily ameliorated by the activities which stimulate dopamine, serotonin, etc., which fade over time. So the activity must be kept up, or the pain returns.

 

If we can accept pain, embrace it as a sense that is every bit as important and healthy as vision or hearing, then we don't need to cover it up with neurochemicals.

Edited April 19, 2011 by Otis

[Seth Ananda]

Well, Steve has already said what I would have said plus a lot more. Hehehe.

I Second that

[Ya Mu]

Pain. Is.

 

I intensely disagree, for the most part, to the "pain management" with drugs mentality. IMO drugs work very well for acute pain situations, not chronic or long-term pain situations. However, in terminal situations I agree with their use. Also I highly question all that seems to be assigned to pain in many of the terms expressed here. Next I'm sure someone will be assigning "chakras" to the interpretation of and purpose of pain.

 

Yes pain can be a great teacher. But it also can be a great detriment to true spirituality.

All the causes? Trauma is the main cause. Pain is there to call attention to the trauma. It is not there so someone can "work through" the pain but because nerves are sending a signal that something is wrong.

 

What can be done? Well, all of you here who have been practicing qigong could be applying your qi development to helping others with pain. Medical qigong is the most profound method of eliminating pain (NOT pain management)that exists.

[King Kabalabhati]

Pain. Is.

 

I intensely disagree, for the most part, to the "pain management" with drugs mentality. IMO drugs work very well for acute pain situations, not chronic or long-term pain situations. However, in terminal situations I agree with their use. Also I highly question all that seems to be assigned to pain in many of the terms expressed here. Next I'm sure someone will be assigning "chakras" to the interpretation of and purpose of pain.

 

Yes pain can be a great teacher. But it also can be a great detriment to true spirituality.

All the causes? Trauma is the main cause. Pain is there to call attention to the trauma. It is not there so someone can "work through" the pain but because nerves are sending a signal that something is wrong.

 

 

I was going to say something similar. Pain IMO was not "given to man" as a means of enlightenment, although some may find it useful for that purpose. Some will simply be stressed out, depressed, debilitated by chronic pain. It is surprisingly often not cured by western medicine, only medicated for life just to be tolerable.

[King Kabalabhati]

Thelerner said: "Same with boredom, shielding ourselves & kids from boredom we hide from understanding ourselves, wasting time on the trivial, because it entertains and distracts us."

 

This I've been pondering.. Now I'm not sure whether I should think of boredom as some kind of pain from lack of inspiration. And whether I should really be inspired all the time or just accept boredom when it comes and also realise that there's not necessarily anything wrong with doing something just for the sake of avoiding being bored, hmmmm...

 

It could be a question of tolerance, I mean my children clearly experience boredom as something a bit painful while I can easily take it to some degree or be entertained by things much less entertaining, if you know what I mean.

 

Wait, did I type all this because I'm bored with housecleaning and want to avoid it? YES I'm outta here

[King Kabalabhati]

-

Edited April 20, 2011 by King Kabalabhati

[Jetsun]

I was going to say something similar. Pain IMO was not "given to man" as a means of enlightenment, although some may find it useful for that purpose. Some will simply be stressed out, depressed, debilitated by chronic pain. It is surprisingly often not cured by western medicine, only medicated for life just to be tolerable.

 

I agree the pain for some physical ailments only help you so far in alerting you to something which needs treatment or attention, but for many other ailments the origins of the pain can be psychological or spiritual even though it's showing up as a physical symptom so the pain serves to tell the psyche that this is an issue you can no longer keep ignoring or repressing and it is time to finally face upto what is at it's source. So on the basic level pain is an indicator that something needs your attention.

[三江源]

Anyone have any actual experience to share about pain and their actual response to it?

[Ya Mu]

I agree the pain for some physical ailments only help you so far in alerting you to something which needs treatment or attention, but for many other ailments the origins of the pain can be psychological or spiritual even though it's showing up as a physical symptom so the pain serves to tell the psyche that this is an issue you can no longer keep ignoring or repressing and it is time to finally face upto what is at it's source. So on the basic level pain is an indicator that something needs your attention.

Yes origin can be from any trauma whether it is physical, mental, or spiritual. However, from 30 plus years of running a pain clinic I find that most do have a physical trauma. Many times it is something that happened in childhood/teen years and the person forgot about it. Of course the person may have been told by their physician that nothing could be found, then the person went for counseling or even psychiatric treatment because if it can't be found it must be in their head, right? Far too many, actually has this happened to. When all along it was physical. Most often if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it is a duck. What we need is for real palpation skills to be re-introduced into the western medicine model and medical qigong practitioners to be integrated into the world medicine model.

[C T]

Patience is one of the great antidotes to living with pain. When i fail to see pain as something that will pass, as with all states, then i am usually more anxious and intolerant to it.

 

Sometimes pain in itself is not the issue - suffering arises out of the need to wish for the pain to dissipate quickly. This could stem from being conditioned by getting into the habit of avoiding matters, or having formed the habit of seeking quick fixes. When pain presents itself, one of the more normal reactions would be, "Oh, i need to do something about this - its driving me... (fill in your own words to finish the sentence?). Sometimes its really not a necessity to 'do' anything about it. Implicit to 'doing', one then falls into the trap of avoidance, stemming from fear perhaps, and also grasping at what one perceives to be the state of 'ah! now i am pain free!'. Its hard to remove oneself from the cycle of cause and effect if this sort of habit is not altered or rectified.

 

A couple of weeks ago, around the time when Japan was hit by that tragic tsunami, i was doing tonglen, and began to experience a massive toothache. It really bothered me cos i am not very used to pain of that degree. Immediate reaction was to go for pain relievers, but then, i said no, i will use the pain fruitfully - how insignificant this pain is compared to the pain of those who are stricken over in Japan, i kept asking myself over and over. I was trying to find some meaning for it, so that at least my pain could turn into some sort of blessing. I woke up with the pain, went to work with it, and went to bed at night while it kept pounding me. For days, my day was bookended by this bloody toothache. A few days ago, it started dissipating, and now, its gone. Am i glad? Not really. Am i not glad? Not really. It is what it is, and when one realizes that self is impermanent, i suppose life is simply what it is - a journey that is intrinsically whole - it cannot be otherwise unless we learn what are all parts of this wholeness, and pain is not outside of it, by any definition.

[Everything]

Yes, I think pain is among the most mysterious functions, not only in how it works, but why it's there at all.

 

Precisely because pain seems so obvious. We all know that "pain is something to be avoided". But I think that "obvious knowledge" is exactly backwards. The very urgency of pain suggests that our body is trying to direct our attention toward the pain, not away from it. It is (perhaps) only our limited perspective that insists on distracting ourselves, on numbing the sensation.

 

Just about every other function in the human body is seen as default useful, and the problems only begin when they get out of whack. But pain is (usually) seen as default wrong. What other sense do we try to escape from? That's a big puzzle, right there, and solving it, I think, can be the source of a great deal of liberation.

Maybe the thought of us being an animal may lessen the mystery in the idea of pain. What seperates us from animals is our ability to contemplate our own lifes, including the pain, and choose where to focus our concentrations or even change our reality by seeking new believes. But we're still evolved not for our day and age. This world we live in now has emerged way to fast for us to evolve quickly, so we slowly addept our artificial environment to us. There is no mystery in our pain, the mystery indeed lies in our ignorance to accept our own nature and the nature that is all around us, the nature that are our ancestors.

 

If you talk about the pain that is out of place in our world, it is usually the emotional pain. It is mostly caused by immaturity. A baby can be very intelligent, but may quickly get frustrated because his emotions stand in the way. The emotions are a mystery to him, and they run to parents for comfort and guidance, etc. When a baby feels pain, he is helpless, he does not understand it and just wants it to go away. A baby can not focus like a cat and have a high tolerance to pain, because babies get easily distracted. But when you look from their perspective, they do need a parent and can't survive without them. Babies even die if not given love but taken care of well.

What about a mature man or women? They can too get distracted by pain, even feel attracted to it, or wander in the past, present, or that which cannot be controlled to suffer pain that useless and mysterious and makes you wonder why it even exists. The reason that this kind of meaningless pain exists, is because it has been essential to our survival for milions of years. It is not so mysterious when you suddenly live in a natural environment, is it? This world can be destroyed today and everyone would continue the way of living, as long as our nature remains. But we can also addapt to new environments, and cope with it. We're all essentially the same humans.

 

Another great cause for feeling that pain is mysterious is PTSD, or something similar, like a small trauma or several trauma's. For example, the pain of sadness which is equal maybe even more then physical pain. But it has not purpose, because the environment where the trauma was developed and was essential for survival is no longer there, most of the time. This is how veterans survive in war, then suicide when they come back home. Today, our environment is so weird. Some people feel pain when talking to other people, shy away from it, being scared of social anxiety. In the past, doing the wrong thing socially could mean certain death.

 

So many forms of pain and I have no idea which one you are talking about. You don't really think that physical pain is mysterious do you? I cannot see how someone does not see the purpose of physical pain.

[cheya]

 

 

Anyone have any actual experience to share about pain and their actual response to it?

Hey Cat,
I've been hesitating to throw this in here, because it seems trivial compared to all the pain in the world, but since you asked...

Deep pressure anywhere on my leg muscles has always been very painful. A couple years ago my rolfer was roto-rooting my legs, and it was incredibly painful, when suddenly it changed. The sensation was that he was just pushing a wave of deep thick energy up my leg. It didn't hurt at all. It was just very interesting. I'd been doing a lot of chi gung, and I had somehow shifted into an energy state instead of my usual consciousness. In that state, the work was not at all painful. The same thing happened at our next session. Somehow I shifted into that other state, and the deep leg work was just energy being moved. No pain. I thought I was done with bodywork pain, but the following session, I couldn't find that doorway, and the work was again painful.

Recently, it happened again, but this time, before the painful work, I was "in my chi mind" from meridian work that had put me in a strong chi state. Then the therapist moved to the back of a sore shoulder, and the pain brought me momentarily out of that chi state. But then I went back into the chi state, and the shoulder relaxed into the work amidst great waves of chi.

Anybody else have their pain shift into energy waves or surges? Tips or techniques for entering that state? Any relation to right/left brain function?

 

[三江源]

Hey Cat,

I've been hesitating to throw this in here, because it seems trivial compared to all the pain in the world, but since you asked...

 

Deep pressure anywhere on my leg muscles has always been very painful. A couple years ago my rolfer was roto-rooting my legs, and it was incredibly painful, when suddenly it changed. The sensation was that he was just pushing a wave of deep thick energy up my leg. It didn't hurt at all. It was just very interesting. I'd been doing a lot of chi gung, and I had somehow shifted into an energy state instead of my usual consciousness. In that state, the work was not at all painful. The same thing happened at our next session. Somehow I shifted into that other state, and the deep leg work was just energy being moved. No pain. I thought I was done with bodywork pain, but the following session, I couldn't find that doorway, and the work was again painful.

 

Recently, it happened again, but this time, before the painful work, I was "in my chi mind" from meridian work that had put me in a strong chi state. Then the therapist moved to the back of a sore shoulder, and the pain brought me momentarily out of that chi state. But then I went back into the chi state, and the shoulder relaxed into the work amidst great waves of chi.

 

Anybody else have their pain shift into energy waves or surges? Tips or techniques for entering that state? Any relation to right/left brain function?

 

Adeha

 

Brilliant! Thanks so much for sharing something real. I know what you mean about the doorway: once you move through it, resistance is dissolved and what was 'pain' is now something else: a phenomenon. The stuck energy shifts instead of is resisted. I think EFT works really well to open that doorway, to lower the resistance which sets up the kind of road block that we experience as pain. Idk if you know EFT.. the first thing it removes is our disaproval of self / withdrawal of self acceptance: so often when have pain or symptom we are annoyed with ourselves for 'falling from grace'.. and the negativity immediately makes the situation escalate.

 

About 'chi state' .. my first training was one in which 'enter qigong state' was an always and every time instruction, so that it became an instant thing one could do. It might help if one uses qigong standing stance, for as long as it takes, ie train to use that to signal to the body that it's full flow open time. At some point it's possible to do it mentally, the pathways become well worn.

 

One of the useful things I learned about pain is that it is never steady. It moves in waves. There will always be dips in the wave. Even when the pain is beyond what you think you can endure, it will ebb. You will get a chance to regroup, some. This is the way it moves.