Your guys thoughts on Ron Paul?

[Dagon]

I think that he makes a lot of good points.

[walkerinthewoods]

I have liked Ron Paul for awhile now. I agree with most of what he says. Freedom is a good thing.

[RiverSnake]

Well at-least he's got a pair and puts his own beliefs out there.

 

-Interesting ideas

[NeiChuan]

It's funny the people want a real politician for the people to run, and he's one of a handful that are helping us. He seems to want too extreme of change for people.

 

But, this isn't a time to be picky.

[sean]

i generally like his stance on war and drugs and he seems sincere and principled.

 

but i don't like his views on corporate deregulation, abortion, healthcare, state's rights, evolution (lol). total deal breakers.

 

sean

[Dagon]

You must also realize that all of his propositions wouldn't make it to law.

 

I do see how it is a bit extreme in some instances.

 

I would vote for freedom at any cost.

 

His freedom is actually profitable to the USA as opposed the the budget cuts from the Republicans and Democrats that would put us in to a debt of either 19 or 20 trillion dollars over 8 years.

Edited April 27, 2011 by Dagon

[RiverSnake]

Interesting Video. Go to 1:00

 

-Been getting back into politics lately. Probably gonna read the books of all the candidates.

 

Edited April 27, 2011 by Tao Apprentice

[Dagon]

Do you think that when he says the things like eliminating the Department of Education, Department of Energy, etc . . He is referring to relinquishing the governments control over these things, so that the free enterprise can pick it up in the more efficient manner?

 

I feel that if buisnesses were less concerned about thier profit margins and focused more on making a sustainable company, with quality and lasting products, we would be better off in general.

 

There are lots of not-for profit and for profit company's that would be more than happy to fill these voids and they would have to compete with eachother so that the consumers gets a good deal. Especially with the internet and our access to competitors of any given products.

 

Also he proposes to keep the Social Security for the elders who have a vested interest in it, and make a transition away from it, not completely cutting it off.

[RiverSnake]

Do you think that when he says the things like eliminating the Department of Education, Department of Energy, etc . . He is referring to relinquishing the governments control over these things, so that the free enterprise can pick it up in the more efficient manner?

 

I feel that if buisnesses were less concerned about thier profit margins and focused more on making a sustainable company, with quality and lasting products, we would be better off in general.

 

There are lots of not-for profit and for profit company's that would be more than happy to fill these voids and they would have to compete with eachother so that the consumers gets a good deal. Especially with the internet and our access to competitors of any given products.

 

Also he proposes to keep the Social Security for the elders who have a vested interest in it, and make a transition away from it, not completely cutting it off.

 

When you try to make over-arching Educational Policy (this extends to many policies) for an entire country things naturally get messy.

 

-I think it is better let each state cator to themselves and sort out what works for them best: this is my interpretation what he is saying .

 

-In my opinion there is no law flexible enough to fit the bill for an entire countries educational policy. If you let people figure stuff out at the local level then you avoid a massive headache.

 

-I should add i am no "expert" on these matters and cannot pull out an encyclopedia of sources, i simply have my opinions and philosophies.

[Outis]

Dagon: By eliminating things such as the Department of Education, he doesn't want it to be left to private enterprise. He follows a strict constitutionalist view that powers not granted to the federal government explicitly should be left up to the states. Such as a Nevada Department of Education having supreme powers over the public schooling in Nevada. The original view of the United States was not with an overbearing federal government like it is now, but a loose confederation of independent regions.

 

Unfortunately, a lot of hardcore right-wing racists subscribe to the states rights ideology in an attempt to reinstate segregation, which gives the benign states rights groups and their members (such as Ron Paul) a lot of bad press when they have valid points.

 

I'll probably be voting for Jello Biafra if he decides to run (Green Party) because my personal beliefs fall more in line with their views than any others, especially modern Republicans and Democrats. I view an absolutely free market as benefiting the rich, not the common people due to the protections granted to corporations and the tendency for monopolies to form. Also, I view the Earth as our mother and we should give her and her inhabitants the utmost respect. You can extrapolate from there where I'm going if you like, but I'd prefer not to turn this into a heated political debate in a sanctuary such as this (or at least I perceive this to be a sanctuary).

 

Not to get off topic or threadjack, Dagon is one of my favorite short stories.

Edited April 27, 2011 by Outis

[wayki]

controlled opposition....be very wary.

[joeblast]

Do you think that when he says the things like eliminating the Department of Education, Department of Energy, etc . . He is referring to relinquishing the governments control over these things, so that the free enterprise can pick it up in the more efficient manner?

 

I feel that if buisnesses were less concerned about thier profit margins and focused more on making a sustainable company, with quality and lasting products, we would be better off in general.

 

This past year, Americans spent more on regulatory compliance costs than what our deficit is.

 

If you need any frame of reference for how much extra we pay in "hidden taxes."

 

On top of, taxes.

 

A business MUST be highly concerned with their bottom line, and also their long term strategy for their bottom line...if they wish to remain in business!

 

Overregulation only helps big businesses stay entrenched by mandating all this additional red tape, significantly increasing the startup costs for a business...in effect, keeping competition away. Smart regulations necessary but they should be as minimalist as possible.

[walkerinthewoods]

The Federal Department of Education is a complete waste of money. It is a fairly new program, 1980's I think off the top of my head. The States did just fine without it and education has not improved any since the Federal department was formed. Some could argue it has gotten worse.

 

Personally I think that the whole education system in the US is out dated. I think a lot of money could be saved and education improved if they got innovative with the technology we have and possible improvements in the future. With what we have now with all the educational tv programs and available access to the internet and libraries, why do kids need to go to a school building most days of the week all day long? I know that I personally, along with my kids, have learned a lot of useful things just with these resources.

 

As for corporate regulation, is what we have right now so good? The laws are written with corporate influence to stack things in their favor so it becomes legally difficult on the competition. Where has all the small businesses gone? In most places in the US big corporations are the only option.

[Enishi]

I'm not sure if I'd label myself as a libertarian anymore (at least not in the lewrockwell, mises vein) but I do consider freewill to be of paramount importance. Further in the past I drifted away from liberalism when I realized many liberals are just as moralistic and controlling as conservatives, if not more so.

 

I think the area where some libertarians lose support is in their seeming support of big business. Greater freedom would also include communal land ownership and worker owned businesses, which would go a long way towards fixing the imbalances in the world.

Edited April 27, 2011 by Enishi

[RiverSnake]

 

 

Personally I think that the whole education system in the US is out dated. I think a lot of money could be saved and education improved if they got innovative with the technology we have and possible improvements in the future. With what we have now with all the educational tv programs and available access to the internet and libraries, why do kids need to go to a school building most days of the week all day long? I know that I personally, along with my kids, have learned a lot of useful things just with these resources.

 

 

I don't think haveing technology is what makes a educational system good. Having inspiring teachers who are enthusiastic about what their teaching makes a world of a difference.

[Stevekare]

Do you think that when he says the things like eliminating the Department of Education, Department of Energy, etc . . He is referring to relinquishing the governments control over these things, so that the free enterprise can pick it up in the more efficient manner?

 

I feel that if buisnesses were less concerned about thier profit margins and focused more on making a sustainable company, with quality and lasting products, we would be better off in general.

 

There are lots of not-for profit and for profit company's that would be more than happy to fill these voids and they would have to compete with eachother so that the consumers gets a good deal. Especially with the internet and our access to competitors of any given products.

 

Also he proposes to keep the Social Security for the elders who have a vested interest in it, and make a transition away from it, not completely cutting it off.

[joeblast]

I'm not sure if I'd label myself as a libertarian anymore (at least not in the lewrockwell, mises vein) but I do consider freewill to be of paramount importance. Further in the past I drifted away from liberalism when I realized many liberals are just as moralistic and controlling as conservatives, if not more so.

 

I think the area where some libertarians lose support is in their seeming support of big business. Greater freedom would also include communal land ownership and worker owned businesses, which would go a long way towards fixing the imbalances in the world.

Flatten everything immediately, and how long do you think it would be before there was again "inequality?"

 

Workers can own businesses, if a bunch of workers decided to band together and start their own company...but if I owned a business and the workers I employed tried to ostensibly take it over and start calling the shots on an endeavor I created and initiated, procured funds for, invested massive amounts of my time to make it successful - I'd fire every last one of them, IMMEDIATELY. (Yes, I'm aware that would necessarily hurt my business, but surgery is never a pleasant ordeal.) I'm fully of the opinion that if you have good help, pay it well and it will serve you extremely well. If you have help that is not carrying its weight, it must be culled, and often.

 

Giving "workers" who have little clue of how to run a business a large say in the operations is shooting yourself in the foot, you only wind up with a few individuals who take charge for the rest and it winds up being their twist to your vision you have to deal with. If there are areas of expertise such as from an engineer, he should be listened to, where his area of expertise is concerned. Like my buddy's dad said (who was a longtime union member) - Unions generally do an okay job of representing their worker's interests - until, of course, they become more interested in their own interests. And most often those interests are not on the bottom line...if left unchecked, the union virtually destroys the company, a la GM et al. In other words, a parasite, much like groups like the SEIU are today. (I recall my grandfather receiving letters from his union reps practically with veiled threats instructing him how to vote... )

 

So unfortunately this communal Utopia idea is a complete fallacy except in its smallest iterations where every single member has made the choice as his own personal one - its pretty easy to prove 100 times over that generally speaking, that which is owned by the most people has the littlest care ascribed to it, especially if it is the case where they havent specifically opted into the paradigm.

[zerostao]

what i want to know is > is ron paul a taoist ?

bizneswise my utopia would be heavily weighted on the lassez faire side.

the demands of the consumer balances out the greed of the suppliers.

competition levels the field.

politically( i am anarchist by nature) i could care less who is in power.

i do accept that government is a neccessary evil/tryanny but i choose not to play their game. i heard once on the history channel the only politician in the 20th century that ever actually did what he promised during his campaign was hitler.

oops that is another current thread.

[tumoessence]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwIZ4syCFLc

 

I like it Ron Paul and Ralph Nader.

[Mattimo]

controlled opposition....be very wary.

 

Oh realllyyyy.

[johndoe2012]

Edited December 11, 2011 by chris d

[Otis]

I think that Libertarianism can help frame solutions in society. I think that's also true for capitalism, socialism, etc. No system is all right, nor all wrong. Each has its own strengths and its own weaknesses, and the most successful governments seem to blend all of the above.

 

I don't think that a Libertarian society would be a very pleasant one to live in, especially if you were old, sick, disabled, a woman or a minority (the old frontier wild West is an illustration of life under Libertarianism; not kind to the powerless). But Libertarianism frames some issues very well, just as the other -isms help illustrate truths that Libertarianism IMO totally misses.

[Dagon]

The thing that does it for me is the fact that the BIG BUSINESS now seems to be synonomous with politics.

 

The oil spills for instance, and the continuance of the drilling. These businesses have more say in who is elected than anyone.

 

Everyone of the presidential elects last term was found to recieve money for campaigning from oil companies.

 

Big companies are allowed to pollute our earth as long as they pay money for it.

 

These things need to stop, I feel the only way to remove the corruption entangled within the weave of government is by reducing it down to size and making it transparent.

 

Sure, it won't be easy, but it is up to us. Otherwise we are simply allowing it if we are not resisting or trying to change it.

 

Has our reliance on oil really changed much in the last few years?

 

So many companies have been bailed out and propped up by the government. Why? Why are billions of dollars printed out each year, reducing the value of each dollar that you worked so hard for? Dollars are simply paper and ink and are useless without something to back it.

 

We give the Federal Reserve the right to print out as much money as it deems, effectively stealing money from the rest of the populace. This direction does not lead anywhere good IMO.

 

Something big has to change if we are to conserve the earth and set a efficient foundation for the children who will inherit the earth in the future.

 

Anyone else that we elect is going to result in more debt being accumulated (imo) until we are eventually bankrupt.

 

[Dagon]

The sound is a bit off on this one.

 

 

Here is a better one, but it is long.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Xt5US8FUpw

Edited April 27, 2011 by Dagon

[Dagon]

2011 CPAC speech if anyone is interested to find out more!

 

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBEywuyfGPQ&feature=related