Relationships and Children will only curb your spiritual cultivation

[Non]

Why is it that for everything people talk about the answer is always "look within"?

 

I mean.. honestly, I think it's a START but why is it EVERYTHING?

 

If all that is without is also within, and all that is external is ALSO YOU then why the sole emphasis on the within? WHy isn't there a blending?

 

What you're asking for is pretty much for people to become Superhuman or Gods, to transcend their animal natures so that they are able to live without fulfilling their needs. Much like a breatharian can live without food and water(?) and live on qi.

 

But without the prerequisite of having attained the siddhi the person cannot do that obviously.. and that takes a process.

 

OK everything is withni. JUST AS MUCH as everything is also without because there is within "outside" also. There is Without "inside" also.

[Sloppy Zhang]

Why is it that for everything people talk about the answer is always "look within"?

 

I mean.. honestly, I think it's a START but why is it EVERYTHING?

 

If all that is without is also within, and all that is external is ALSO YOU then why the sole emphasis on the within? WHy isn't there a blending?

 

What you're asking for is pretty much for people to become Superhuman or Gods, to transcend their animal natures so that they are able to live without fulfilling their needs. Much like a breatharian can live without food and water(?) and live on qi.

 

But without the prerequisite of having attained the siddhi the person cannot do that obviously.. and that takes a process.

 

OK everything is withni. JUST AS MUCH as everything is also without because there is within "outside" also. There is Without "inside" also.

 

Well perhaps it's not so good to get caught up with the semantics

 

If the outside is also within, then looking inside will tell you what's outside.

 

Conversely, looking outside can lead you to what is inside, since the inside is reflected on the outside.

 

So you can go:

 

Inside: I am inherently distrustful of people, where is this on the outside?

Outside: I don't have any friends

 

Or

 

Outside: I don't have any friends- why?

Inside: I am inherently distrustful of people

 

Of course, to do this you MUST be able to examine and appraise yourself AND your external environment honestly.

 

As for this:

 

What you're asking for is pretty much for people to become Superhuman or Gods, to transcend their animal natures so that they are able to live without fulfilling their needs. Much like a breatharian can live without food and water(?) and live on qi.

 

That and what you are doing all depends or your framework or what you are trying to do. For me, it's healthier and more effective in the long run to work WITH things, rather than against them. Acceptance does not automatically lead to allowance.

 

So it's not that you sit there desperately wanting to fuck something, but then tucking it in because you have to try, or are still in the midst of trying, to transcend. It's more like you don't even think of it as a big deal, and you move on with your life.

Edited May 6, 2011 by Sloppy Zhang

[exorcist_1699]

Only after having all our jing changed into qi, does it not come up frequently to affect our cultivation. Jing's appearance are complicated , you think we are a reasonable person,and reason is in charge of everything ? Absolutely not ; even if we take charge in daytime, it appear always in our sleeping to undermine our enterprise .many different forms it appears...even our mind is always used as a means to achieve its goal ...

 

It is not strange when we consider jing/sex is the root of our existence, so it will find various ways to let its job done by making use of as much pretense as it can

 

Only high level of Shen can tame it..

Edited May 6, 2011 by exorcist_1699

[King Kabalabhati]

I am a (single) father of three and ready to admit that family life seriously curbs my practice, making serious Qigong progress next to impossible. Another thing is I'm not sure if I would be practicing at all without this situation since I was really desperately searching for a means to survive and live happy in a challenging reality, surrounded by these... people who want my time, my money, my energy, everything.. And still get mad at me all the time and even call me stupid and lazy though I'm the only one providing for them

 

Family life makes cultivating stressful.. I can never be certain if I can get time for my session or finish it when I get it. Right now my boy has a cough and he's very easily alert in the eary morning so if I try to sneak downstairs he will come running after me. Oh well, today I have a 2-hour train trip I will surely put to use.

 

OK I'm speaking from a single father's point of view. Had I a woman who was into the traditional roles, who would like to cook and clean and look after the kids, then I guess this wouldn't be such a hard path.

 

Depite the obvious limitations and bummers I'm often feeling grateful for the special kind of beauty that this life has shown me. Maybe I can take this experience to my supposed next life (which begins in the next 10 years as the kids grow, haha) and then go for the serious cultivator's path. I sure hope I don't need another family guy experience to move forward

Edited May 6, 2011 by King Kabalabhati

[Encephalon]

I am a (single) father of three and ready to admit that family life seriously curbs my practice, making serious Qigong progress next to impossible. Another thing is I'm not sure if I would be practicing at all without this situation since I was really desperately searching for a means to survive and live happy in a challenging reality, surrounded by these... people who want my time, my money, my energy, everything.. And still get mad at me all the time and even call me stupid and lazy though I'm the only one providing for them

 

Family life makes cultivating stressful.. I can never be certain if I can get time for my session or finish it when I get it. Right now my boy has a cough and he's very easily alert in the eary morning so if I try to sneak downstairs he will come running after me. Oh well, today I have a 2-hour train trip I will surely put to use.

 

OK I'm speaking from a single father's point of view. Had I a woman who was into the traditional roles, who would like to cook and clean and look after the kids, then I guess this wouldn't be such a hard path.

 

Depite the obvious limitations and bummers I'm often feeling grateful for the special kind of beauty that this life has shown me. Maybe I can take this experience to my supposed next life (which begins in the next 10 years as the kids grow, haha) and then go for the serious cultivator's path. I sure hope I don't need another family guy experience to move forward

 

Thank you for raising some important points. I think it sheds some light on the futility of consumer culture with it's suburbia, auto-dependency, wage slavery, time annhilation and the individualism run amok that has eclipsed the sense of community that once accomodated quality time (I'm going back many decades here).

 

We're on our way out, in the midst of moving to an ecovillage, one of the few modern lifestyles that comes close to the sustainable villages of ancient times. We are under no delusions that we won't have our hands full, but it's quality time with likeminded souls and I'll still be able to squeeze in three hours of cultivation time in lieu of commuting, shopping, tv, not to mention the time availed by shared duties -meal prep, laundry, gardening, hunting, ranching and the like.

 

I'll only have one kid though!

[Thunder_Gooch]

+1

 

A particular member has been spending so much time and energy posting in this forum about his frustrations with women and sex..

 

One wonders how much progress he can attain in his cultivation if he can channel the time and energy wasted on women and sex to spiritual practices or even other self-improvement practices..

 

Why do everybody thinks you need a family or a spouse in order to achieve enlightenment or even to lead a perfectly normal healthy life?

 

Truth is, relationships and families are meant to drag you down.. they will always hinder you on the path to true enlightenment..

 

you need money to survive.. no doubt about that .. but you do not need a family or a spouse to survive..

 

99% of the world's population today focus all their lives and energies on looking for a spouse to raise a family because they are trying to fill the hole in themselves with marriage and family..

 

this phenomenon exists in all cultures and all countries since the origins of mankind..

 

if one can only explore the emptiness or void inside them instead of trying to unsuccessfully fill the void, then one will have taken the next big step on the Path..

[bodyoflight]

nice... wish there were more men out there who had this mature view of practice.

 

we can use our circumstances to transcend and transform our practice. or we can blame women and children for our own failings.

 

"The woman! She made me eat of the Apple." Adam complaing to God that the woman was responsible for his screw up. lol

 

the priesthood, Daoist, buddhist, Christian, whatevah, have been blaming the woman for their failures since the priest hood was invented. Oh, and women are energy vampires too I have heard tell in the whispering of temple courtyards. I heard that from the High Lama who has 30 nuns to practice sexual tantra. Sex and women are best left to the really spiritual people to handle.

 

 

Maybe the way to higher practice is to love your woman and child so much it transforms your heart and life.

 

i am not blaming women..

 

cultivation is meant for both men and women so why would I put down women?.. which part of my posts show me putting down women?

 

in the cases of female practitioners, then it is even more important not to waste any time and energies in a man and just focus the time and energies on yourself..

 

marriage and relationships and children are the problems.. not the man or woman themselves

[bodyoflight]

bodyoflight wrote:

 

 

 

This is true.

 

Recieving love from other people can be really enjoyable...more than most things in life. But it doesn't permanently fill the hole. Keeping this in perspective is wise. Being a loving person to others can be highly rewarding, and can help to fill the hole in a more lasting way.

 

If we want a spouse in life, might as well do it and learn from the experience.

 

Side note: I personally think it's healthier to be around people than to be alone.

 

I don't think you have the courage to be alone..

[bodyoflight]

I'm talking After enlightenment... even so, how can one say you cannot have sex, or be in a relationship and not attain enlightenment?

 

Why so black and white?

 

after enlightenment you can do anything you want..

 

but have you crushed your human ego yet?

 

I think not

[bodyoflight]

Well perhaps it's not so good to get caught up with the semantics

 

If the outside is also within, then looking inside will tell you what's outside.

 

Conversely, looking outside can lead you to what is inside, since the inside is reflected on the outside.

 

So you can go:

 

Inside: I am inherently distrustful of people, where is this on the outside?

Outside: I don't have any friends

 

Or

 

Outside: I don't have any friends- why?

Inside: I am inherently distrustful of people

 

Of course, to do this you MUST be able to examine and appraise yourself AND your external environment honestly.

 

As for this:

 

 

 

That and what you are doing all depends or your framework or what you are trying to do. For me, it's healthier and more effective in the long run to work WITH things, rather than against them. Acceptance does not automatically lead to allowance.

 

So it's not that you sit there desperately wanting to fuck something, but then tucking it in because you have to try, or are still in the midst of trying, to transcend. It's more like you don't even think of it as a big deal, and you move on with your life.

 

do you think that you need friends in order to reach enlightenment?

 

*shakes head*

 

if the world is full of animals, why bother living with such animals? or even enlightening them?

 

it will be a waste of your time and energies..

 

if you give in to the spiritual forces that control your thoughts of lust, then you will be a true weakling indeed..

Edited May 6, 2011 by bodyoflight

[bodyoflight]

I am a (single) father of three and ready to admit that family life seriously curbs my practice, making serious Qigong progress next to impossible. Another thing is I'm not sure if I would be practicing at all without this situation since I was really desperately searching for a means to survive and live happy in a challenging reality, surrounded by these... people who want my time, my money, my energy, everything.. And still get mad at me all the time and even call me stupid and lazy though I'm the only one providing for them

 

Family life makes cultivating stressful.. I can never be certain if I can get time for my session or finish it when I get it. Right now my boy has a cough and he's very easily alert in the eary morning so if I try to sneak downstairs he will come running after me. Oh well, today I have a 2-hour train trip I will surely put to use.

 

OK I'm speaking from a single father's point of view. Had I a woman who was into the traditional roles, who would like to cook and clean and look after the kids, then I guess this wouldn't be such a hard path.

 

Depite the obvious limitations and bummers I'm often feeling grateful for the special kind of beauty that this life has shown me. Maybe I can take this experience to my supposed next life (which begins in the next 10 years as the kids grow, haha) and then go for the serious cultivator's path. I sure hope I don't need another family guy experience to move forward

 

I am glad you have realized the limitations placed on yourself by your spouse and kids..

 

I am sincerely sorry that you have to go through such hardships..

 

99% of the world's populations do not have the capacities to realize such limitations unless they have been married themselves..

[King Kabalabhati]

I am glad you have realized the limitations placed on yourself by your spouse and kids..

 

I am sincerely sorry that you have to go through such hardships..

 

99% of the world's populations do not have the capacities to realize such limitations unless they have been married themselves..

 

Yeah.. At the same time I'm very aware that things could be MUCH harder. At least I have SOME time for myself. And my day to day living is usually quite happy with challenges I can handle. It would only take a handicap or another kind of serious health issue to make this a VERY tough situation. And today I get to see my girlfriend who is very good to me.. So yeah I'm blessed.

 

I no longer need to comfort myself with thinking like "but family life IS cultivation of sorts" etc. because it is just what it is.

[ShaktiMama]

i am not blaming women..

 

cultivation is meant for both men and women so why would I put down women?.. which part of my posts show me putting down women?

 

in the cases of female practitioners, then it is even more important not to waste any time and energies in a man and just focus the time and energies on yourself..

 

marriage and relationships and children are the problems.. not the man or woman themselves

 

Just my own opinion:

spoken like an unenlightened man.... i find offensive what you write as I have noticed other female members of this group do too...you have not a clue that you are being offensive. Doesn't seem you have the self awareness to notice that women are finding how you talk about women offensive.

 

 

 

your view, imo, is self limiting.

 

women, sex, family can bring you into the realm of enlightenment very very quickly or one can become bitter and resentful and prolong the journey...

 

that which one finds stressful and limiting can become a tool of inner cultivation. Now that takes discipline and commitment.

 

asceticism/ austerities is just one practice to the end of the journey....it is not the only practice.

 

self denial as spiritual journey places the blame/responsibility on the adherent's failure to reach spiritual achievement on externals (my wife, my kids, my job, sexing, etc. etc. ect.) and not what is held in the heart of contemplation. This is a strong "ego" based practice.

 

In other words, what the ascetic says is, the quality of my enlightenment is dependent on how much control my environment/attachments have on me. If I cant control or make peace with my environment and its inhabitants I will never make high spiritual attainment. I.E. I can't be spiritual because my environment/family/relationships get in the way. oh poor me....i am so weak....

 

I can understand taking a spiritual break but if it is taking a lifetime to achieve...get a new teacher or get a new path.

 

"spiritual" teachers sell enlightenment but tell you it might take 30 years for you to achieve it. so over the years, little by little, teachers sell the promise of enlightenment.

 

It is Enlightenment on the installment plan. It is also called "following the rice bowl."

 

I have no problems with people charging for their time as teachers. But just because someone claims to be spiritual doesnt mean they are qualified to teach. Claiming you have the only answer and you are charging people for the answer...not good in my eyes. But that is my personal opinion.

[Non]

after enlightenment you can do anything you want..

 

but have you crushed your human ego yet?

 

I think not

 

 

well... for the human ego evrything pretty much sucks, i mean it houses cravings and attachments and sex is definitely the biggest attachment but anything else could be. sex tho can be the worst drug. but yea like one of the guys said.. it probably would not affect you as much if you had transformed jing to qi. or at least could abolish craving..

[Non]

isnt having a family theway of karma yoga?

[ShaktiMama]

well... for the human ego evrything pretty much sucks, i mean it houses cravings and attachments and sex is definitely the biggest attachment but anything else could be. sex tho can be the worst drug. but yea like one of the guys said.. it probably would not affect you as much if you had transformed jing to qi. or at least could abolish craving..

 

seeing the "ego" in others is very easy. Seeing the "ego" in ourselves not so easy. Just continue in your practice and eventually the "ego" drops away and ceases to be an obsession.

[bodyoflight]

Just my own opinion:

spoken like an unenlightened man.... i find offensive what you write as I have noticed other female members of this group do too...you have not a clue that you are being offensive. Doesn't seem you have the self awareness to notice that women are finding how you talk about women offensive.

 

 

 

your view, imo, is self limiting.

 

women, sex, family can bring you into the realm of enlightenment very very quickly or one can become bitter and resentful and prolong the journey...

 

that which one finds stressful and limiting can become a tool of inner cultivation. Now that takes discipline and commitment.

 

asceticism/ austerities is just one practice to the end of the journey....it is not the only practice.

 

self denial as spiritual journey places the blame/responsibility on the adherent's failure to reach spiritual achievement on externals (my wife, my kids, my job, sexing, etc. etc. ect.) and not what is held in the heart of contemplation. This is a strong "ego" based practice.

 

In other words, what the ascetic says is, the quality of my enlightenment is dependent on how much control my environment/attachments have on me. If I cant control or make peace with my environment and its inhabitants I will never make high spiritual attainment. I.E. I can't be spiritual because my environment/family/relationships get in the way. oh poor me....i am so weak....

 

I can understand taking a spiritual break but if it is taking a lifetime to achieve...get a new teacher or get a new path.

 

"spiritual" teachers sell enlightenment but tell you it might take 30 years for you to achieve it. so over the years, little by little, teachers sell the promise of enlightenment.

 

It is Enlightenment on the installment plan. It is also called "following the rice bowl."

 

I have no problems with people charging for their time as teachers. But just because someone claims to be spiritual doesnt mean they are qualified to teach. Claiming you have the only answer and you are charging people for the answer...not good in my eyes. But that is my personal opinion.

 

i am charging people because they wanna ask me about the real deal..

 

if people think that i do not have the answers, then please do not ask me..

 

if i am a woman, i would say the same stuff.. but i would replace the term "woman" in all my posts with the term "man"..

 

if you can't see the universality of my words, then you do not see deep enough..

[bodyoflight]

i am going to give a real easy and realistic summary to all my posts..

 

if lord buddha or jesus reincarnated on earth in this lifetime as a female, i would definitely think about marrying him/her..

 

but if not, what can i gain spiritually wise by marrying a woman (or a man if i am a female) who is ill-tempered, lustful, materialistic, greedy, arrogant plus all other defects found in humans..

 

i say this because i am ill-tempered, lustful, greedy and arrogant myself.. and almost everybody in the world is like me..

 

if two such characters get together, disaster will befall the marriage..

 

so unless i find a woman who is much higher than in me in every manner, who can tolerate all my faults while having no faults of her own..

 

then i will take the easy way out and spend time changing my own faults and defects on my own ...

 

clear cold logic..

Edited May 6, 2011 by bodyoflight

[hagar]

A particular member has been spending so much time and energy posting in this forum about his frustrations with women and sex..

 

One wonders how much progress he can attain in his cultivation if he can channel the time and energy wasted on women and sex to spiritual practices or even other self-improvement practices..

 

Why do everybody thinks you need a family or a spouse in order to achieve enlightenment or even to lead a perfectly normal healthy life?

 

Truth is, relationships and families are meant to drag you down.. they will always hinder you on the path to true enlightenment..

 

you need money to survive.. no doubt about that .. but you do not need a family or a spouse to survive..

 

99% of the world's population today focus all their lives and energies on looking for a spouse to raise a family because they are trying to fill the hole in themselves with marriage and family..

 

this phenomenon exists in all cultures and all countries since the origins of mankind..

 

if one can only explore the emptiness or void inside them instead of trying to unsuccessfully fill the void, then one will have taken the next big step on the Path..

 

Like most things that matter in life, the experience of parenthood, childbirth, love, relationships, pretty much all that matter when you lie on your deathbed, is all a great mystery. Its neither a hindrance nor a great inducer. But its a gift, and before you have a deep relationship, or hear the first cry of our son or daughter, discussion only leads us astray.

 

Good relationships, bad relationships, sleeping children, crying children, all reveal the great mystery of how we are entagled, immersed and part of this one reality. Feeling the pain, blessings and obstacles that this life gives us, we are given this wonderful opportunity to let go of what is not real, and see that we must face our own nature in total aloneness.

 

h

Edited May 6, 2011 by hagar

[bodyoflight]

Like most things that matter in life, the experience of parenthood, childbirth, love, relationships, pretty much all that matter when you lie on your deathbed, is all a great mystery. Its neither a hindrance nor a great inducer. But its a gift, and before you have a deep relationship, or hear the first cry of our son or daughter, discussion only leads us astray.

 

Good relationships, bad relationships, sleeping children, crying children, all reveal the great mystery of how we are entagled, immersed and part of this one reality. Feeling the pain, blessings and obstacles that this life gives us, we are given this wonderful opportunity to let go of what is not real, and see that we must face our own nature in total aloneness.

 

h

 

if you can achieve siddhis, you will understand and experience how all this great mystery is without even sacrificing an iota of your time and energy to your kids and spouse..

 

there are .. slow roads and fast highways..

 

i will choose the fast highway.. even if i do crash and burn, i will still choose the fast highway..

 

not even crashing and burning can stop me now on the fast track..

[King Kabalabhati]

if you can achieve siddhis, you will understand and experience how all this great mystery is without even sacrificing an iota of your time and energy to your kids and spouse..

 

there are .. slow roads and fast highways..

 

i will choose the fast highway.. even if i do crash and burn, i will still choose the fast highway..

 

not even crashing and burning can stop me now on the fast track..

 

Yes, it's all about me, me, me, isn't it?

 

Sorry couldn't resist.. By all means just crash and burn on the fast lane and see where it takes you. I don't mean to criticize your path, I just don't fully understand your attitude when communicating on a forum such a s TB's.

[bodyoflight]

Yes, it's all about me, me, me, isn't it?

 

Sorry couldn't resist.. By all means just crash and burn on the fast lane and see where it takes you. I don't mean to criticize your path, I just don't fully understand your attitude when communicating on a forum such a s TB's.

 

it is all about me and the creator..

 

the rest of humanity does not factor into the equation..

[ShaktiMama]

i am charging people because they wanna ask me about the real deal..

 

if people think that i do not have the answers, then please do not ask me..

 

if i am a woman, i would say the same stuff.. but i would replace the term "woman" in all my posts with the term "man"..

 

if you can't see the universality of my words, then you do not see deep enough..

 

I teach a lot for free. Like in a thursday night study group I lead and on Monday I lead a healing class and do free energy work.

 

I tell people if they want to insult me and have me insult them back, then they have to pay for a session with me.

 

For you I make special deal...$200 US.

 

Sweetness and light and love is free. Wake up calls are gonna cost big time.

[adept]

it is all about me and the creator..

 

Who is this creator that you speak of ?

Who created the creator ?

[LaoTzu21]

The concepts of relationships are invented by higher beings standing below the Creator who oversee the progress of human beings on behalf of the Creator.

 

The lessons learnt from relationships will be hard ones.

 

It will be easier to look at how other people's relationships fail and draw lessons from their experiences.

 

One will always fail to grasp the full meaning of life's lessons unless one can analyze things from a third-person perspective and it is hard to remain in a third-person perspective if one is personally involved in a relationship.

 

So go the easy way.

 

Let other people suffer and learn from their own experiences.

 

While wisely spending your own limited time and energies on your own enlightenment.

 

Search? I have already searched on the outside long enough..

 

Time to go on the inwards search... the REAL inwards search..

 

dont even pretend you know. give it a rest go about your business and admire others.