The So-called "Tree of Life" has been debunked

[Marblehead]

 

Has anyone studied Debt for Nature Swaps?

 

I didn't recognize the term but yes, I have herd bits and pieces of this. The WWF is one of the organizations I contribute to.

 

I am also aware of the eco-parks that have been created in a number of countries. All good stuff.

[thelerner]

But, I don't exactly see why ID, Creationism, evolution & "God" have to be "mutually-exclusive?" Why not "Intelligent Evolution," for example?

 

Eventual mainstream awareness of alien intervention is going to completely redefine this whole outdated paradigm anyways...

 

Seems to me thats just postponing the problem. You end up with 'Turtles, all the way Down!', ie we came from aliens, where did they come from? Other aliens? Same problem different world. Thats not to knock aliens, just to say its the same problem.

 

Hmnn Intelligent Evolution..there is an intelligence to it, Those who reproduce Rule, as long as conditions stay the same them, but they never do. Variety and flexibility in the genetic code make for new successes.

 

We could be part of an alien experiment, but somehow, I don't think they're going to stand up and take credit for us. Seems to me if we're the end game or part of it, they've been incredibly wasteful.

 

my 2 cents

[Machin Shin]

I didn't recognize the term but yes, I have herd bits and pieces of this. The WWF is one of the organizations I contribute to.

 

I am also aware of the eco-parks that have been created in a number of countries. All good stuff.

 

The use of Debt for Nature swaps has me wondering about the true nature of international relations and future economic development. The process for establishing environmental controls with in a nation to preserve the quality of the environment seems too daunting to be a reality. Imagine a struggling family being told that it can't harvest timber from land that has been harvested for generations. Does this make sense to anyone?

 

Bolivia for example has participated in this policy with the U.S., or so my text says.

Edited May 12, 2011 by Machin Shin

[Marblehead]

The use of Debt for Nature swaps has me wondering about the true nature of international relations and future economic development. The process for establishing environmental controls with in a nation to preserve the quality of the environment seems to daunting to be a reality. Imagine a struggling family being told that it can't harvest timber from land that has been harvested for generations. Does this make sense to anyone?

 

Bolivia for example has participated in this policy with the U.S., or so my text says.

 

Yes, there will be a problem if the people are not given a reason to conserve. That would mean that the government being forgiven its debt would need to trickle that savings down to the people in those areas. A very difficult thing to do.

 

On the other hand, eco-parks and eco-tourism can actually bring money into the areas by the visitors who frequent these parks and preserves.

 

Instead of cutting down the trees the people can become tour guides and workers maintaining the areas.

[Machin Shin]

Absolutely I believe that there is a tree over there full of life. But do you know how much it costs to preserve it for future generations? Best to cut it down and use it for a throne or a nice solid desk in the office.

 

Estimating the cost of Protected Areas

 

NB_pa=GB_du/m+GB_du/nm+GB_iu+GB_oe-C_m-C_lo-C_d

 

NB_pa is the Net Benefit of the protected areas

GB_du/m is the Gross Benefits derived from direct use of marketed products

GB_du/nm is the Gross Benefits derived from direct use of non marketed products

GB_iu is the Gross Benefits derived from indirect use

GB_oe is the Gross Benefits derived from non use

C_m is the Cost of management operations

C_lo is the Cost of protection

C_d is the Cost to local people in terms of damage to crops and livestocks

(thanks goes to the University of Wales for providing the formula)

 

 

So if the Net Benefit of preserving the wilderness is more than the Net Benefit of planned expansion of an nation than by all means preserve life. If the numbers show that a profit can be made at cutting down the forest's and ripping up the mountain's and draining the oceans of Helium-3 (³He), then let's get progressive and supply the consumers with the fresh resources.

 

There is a formula for the theoretical population density of advanced civilizations in the universe. The hidden part of the equation is the probability of war destroying the entire civilization. It's a pessimistic formula that teaches that the more advanced the technology in conjunction with the age of the civilization the more likely it is that it will destroy itself before making contact with another civilization.

 

Appropriately it is called the Drake equation.

Edited May 12, 2011 by Machin Shin

[Marblehead]

Sad, I think that it is necessary to put the value of life into monetary equations.

 

But that is the reality of things. If preserving a thing has less value than destroying it then it will be destroyed.

 

At least the United States had the forethought to put many of the lands of the nation into the public's hands and created many parks and preserves. (Of course, that was after the Europeans shamed us for what we did to Niagra Falls.)

 

I sure hope no one cuts down the Tree of Life.

[Spectrum]

No one has cut down that majestic tree. I was just there last week and the lights are working just fine and the garland is a nice touch. It's not everyday u attract interdimensional attention. Timeless Lovers Create

 

Facebook: spectrum Midas vidavlan

[Marblehead]

No one has cut down that majestic tree. I was just there last week and the lights are working just fine and the garland is a nice touch. It's not everyday u attract interdimensional attention. Timeless Lovers Create

 

Facebook: spectrum Midas vidavlan

 

Thanks for the words. They caused a chuckle.

[Apech]

Sad, I think that it is necessary to put the value of life into monetary equations.

 

But that is the reality of things. If preserving a thing has less value than destroying it then it will be destroyed.

 

At least the United States had the forethought to put many of the lands of the nation into the public's hands and created many parks and preserves. (Of course, that was after the Europeans shamed us for what we did to Niagra Falls.)

 

I sure hope no one cuts down the Tree of Life.

 

What exactly did you do to the Niagara Falls??? Have you turned them off???

 

Yours European and worried,

 

Apech

[Machin Shin]

Any comment on the drake equation? There is a reason I payed attention in class on that day so long ago. It's real lofty stuff...even involves Carl Sagan...

 

BTW I called in to D.C. and the WWF to follow up on the Debt for Nature swaps. College research and hunting for a J.O.B....

[Marblehead]

What exactly did you do to the Niagara Falls??? Have you turned them off???

 

Yours European and worried,

 

Apech

 

We commercialized the entire area totally destroying the pristine nature of it. Both we and the Canadians did this.

 

I can understand the need for power generation from the falls but at least some of the naturalness could have been set aside.

[Marblehead]

Any comment on the drake equation? There is a reason I payed attention in class on that day so long ago. It's real lofty stuff...even involves Carl Sagan...

 

I have heard many references to it but had not looked at it myself. But I do agree that the potential for life on other planets could be very large. Surely there are solar systems in our galaxy as well as others that have planets of the right size and in the right distance to allow for life.

 

But to the best of my knowledge so far none have been detected (planets or life).

 

BTW I called in to D.C. and the WWF to follow up on the Debt for Nature swaps. College research and hunting for a J.O.B....

 

That's great! I wish you the best with that. I think it would be really a great way to spend part of your life - going to different countries and trying to help the people improve their standard of living.

[ralis]

Where is our resident debunker Immortal4Life?

[ralis]

The right wing keeps pushing with their anti-science and anti-intellectual agenda.

 

http://losalamitos.patch.com/articles/global-warming

http://www.thomhartmann.com/blog/2011/05/koch-brothers-have-plan-recruiting-students-tea-party

Edited May 13, 2011 by ralis

[Marblehead]

Where is our resident debunker Immortal4Life?

 

Shhhh!

[Marblehead]

The right wing keeps pushing with their anti-science and anti-intellectual agenda.

 

http://losalamitos.patch.com/articles/global-warming

http://www.thomhartmann.com/blog/2011/05/koch-brothers-have-plan-recruiting-students-tea-party

 

Some people just refuse to accept the information that is available to them because it conflicts with what they 'believe'.

 

Beliefs have no problen denying the truth.

[ralis]

Shhhh!

 

I guess he is moving on to another thread which he just started. Seems he has difficulty with serious debate.

[Encephalon]

I guess he is moving on to another thread which he just started. Seems he has difficulty with serious debate.

 

We're not bringing "him" up anymore. Didn't you get the memo?

[Marblehead]

We're not bringing "him" up anymore. Didn't you get the memo?

 

Who? What? What are you talking about? (Don't tell me!)

[gendao]

Seems to me thats just postponing the problem. You end up with 'Turtles, all the way Down!', ie we came from aliens, where did they come from? Other aliens? Same problem different world. Thats not to knock aliens, just to say its the same problem.

True, it wouldn't answer the overall question - but would effectively resolve the most heated portion concerning the oddly-accelerated development of humans.

 

 

Now, for an entirely unrelated question and pointless exercise in logic:

 

Is the evolution of the automobile proof for or against their "intelligent design?"

Were these progressive improvements due to a series of random defects along the assembly line that proved advantageous...or deliberate design?

 

We have a very reliable fossil record here that clearly shows chronological advancement. So, what does that actually prove?

[NeiChuan]

I wonder if eastern philosophers or mystics troll christian forums.

 

Mainly just republican/tea party forums, when im really really bored. haha.

[Marblehead]

What you presented above proves tha the brain of man has evolved. Man changed the design to make the vehicles more attractive and well as improving its utility.

 

And yes, along the way they became safer to operate.

 

No, the automobile cannot evolve on it's own. It is not a living thing. So, yes, I suppose that one could consider the evolution of the automobile a process of intelligent design.

 

But don't put that feather in your hat yet. Hehehe. Consider that changes were made because there were flaws in the original design. That would make the designer fallible. You really don't want that do you?

 

Nature has produced some really strange life forms that didn't last very long. Nature isn't perfect (as seen through the eyes of man). But you know what? I doubt that nature cares about our opinions.

[Marblehead]

Mainly just republican/tea party forums, when im really really bored. haha.

 

Hehehe. Maybe I should start doing that. The RNC just called me about an hour ago trying to get some of my money. (No, I don't give money to politicians. They already take too much in the form of taxes.)

[gendao]

"The source field is the source of life, it is not random Darwinian mutation. Charles Darwin's father was a 33rd degree Mason...

 

Darwinian evolution very conveniently removed the idea of a higher power. 'Oh, it can all be explained by random, it's just bunch of things knockin' together, there's nothing divine in the universe at all, you're just gonna die and that's it, you don't exist anymore.' Well, I don't believe that." - David Wilcock (

) Edited September 17, 2011 by vortex

[Birch]

I figure the automobiles as an exercise in multifaceted futility and cheating:-)

Alright, these things got a little more streamlined from production to highway but they're still IMO basically fossil-fuel-guzzling appendages. And as such, they're designed exactly the way they ought to be. Not that I'm knocking the skillz of the designers neither. But if they were solar-powered or water-powered, would they look the same and have the same "efficiency" (hahahaha- seems that catalytic converters are quite recent up North)?

 

Read elsewhere: "People aren't designed"