Yong Chun Gong Fu

[C T]

What are you most likely to need?

A good pair of tackies? (thats the wurrrd for running shoes here in Ireland)

( having a friendly doberman next to me would be handy, too...)

 

Good points again, btw.

Edited May 28, 2011 by CowTao

[Sloppy Zhang]

A good pair of tackies? (thats the wurrrd for running shoes here in Ireland)

( having a friendly doberman next to me would be handy, too...)

 

Good points again, btw.

 

Hohoho! I see what you did there!

 

 

I think I come off to be a bit more extreme than I really am sometimes. The thing is, I really, REALLY like martial arts, and take them seriously, on all levels- martial development, personal betterment, health betterment, etc. Unfortunately many arts, and even more teachers, just aren't qualified to meet the expectations and hopes that some people have for them.

 

I bought into a lot of the stuff many martial art teachers peddle- our training is better than the brawlers, keep your root and you won't get taken down, oh well our style is for real fighting and can't be bound by rules. Luckily, I got the snot beat out of me in a safe environment... again.... and again.... and again, until I realized that maybe it wasn't that I hadn't trained well enough- but I had trained too well! All the stuff I had committed myself to was really just bad habits!

 

Stuff like Aikido is great. Stuff like Tai Chi is great. Wing Chun, all the big names. But the best fighters in those arts have always been CONSTANT fighters. They fought anyone and everyone from every style. I'm sure they had to adapt to new situations. But through the years, people copy the forms thinking that if they make it look like what the master did, they'll become like the master.

 

But there are no shortcuts. That's what ALL the masters tell you. No secret other than practice. If you want to be a good martial artist, you actually have to refine your art through MARTIAL situations.

 

 

Bottom line: Flynn, if you aren't interested in really fighting all that much, if you don't want or need or care about martial combat, if you don't really foresee having to use or care about self defense, then do what makes you happy. Get some exercise. have fun.

 

If you do care or want to know about martial applications, self defense, and combat, then just be aware that some arts have a lot more gaps than others, and that the only way to really get good at fighting is to practice fighting in as real a situation as you can. A good start- mixed martial arts. You and your training partners can mix it up by practicing with multiple opponents, lopsided situations, varied locations, etc.

[Friend]

Edited November 16, 2011 by Friend

[Mal]

Else for fun either you choose just hitting and get hit and lots of fun with sandbag doing form. Or you have nice uniforms, well places with calligraphy graceful movement and working on joints with throws, locks and control.

Pretty much.

 

But you also mentioned the teacher qualities. As opposed to assessing the teachers "technical proficiency" (that can be very difficult to do without previous MA's experience) I'd go with-

 

1. Which teacher do you want to spend time with?

 

2. Look at the students in the class. Do you want to look, move, and act like them?

 

Basically will taking the class help become what you want to be? Will you look forward to spending time with the teacher, or just hate going to class and only do it because it's "the best art"? Regardless of the teachers level of skill, can he pass on that knowledge and improve his students skills?

[Edward M]

I'd say as far as combat skills are concerned, Yong Chun is more easy to apply and learn than aikido...

 

As far as spiritual side of things go, depending on the school/teacher itself, some yong chun schools have solid chi gong practices within the system. I've heard aikido can be good also in that respect, but no experience to speak of myself.

 

Check out my friend Mike's youtube channel and website out for more info .. he is based in wales though, but his site has good info on, and the video of him doing si lum tao shows what skill can be developed.

 

http://www.youtube.com/user/yongchunwales

 

http://web.me.com/kaniewski_wing_chun/Site_/Welcome.html

 

Peace and hope this helps

 

Ed

[Edward M]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XhmP0jEoUXY

Here is the si lum tao...

Ed

[jak3b]

These posts always turn into pissing contests about styles,schools,MMA,Bruce Lee yada yada.If you want to fight theres plenty of people you can find who will be glad to take you up on that.99.9% of so called martial arts is utter bullshit.Its a fantasy."On the street","in the ring",going to the ground".Come on,are you kidding?.How many people on a Toaist forum do you think actually have been in a real life or death fight?.I worked with people who really had to.They all have post traumatic stress dis-order,shattered nervous systems,sleeping dis orders,They cant function anymore,alcaholism,drug addiction,massive health issues.That is what happens when you experience combat and survive.I havent been in a fight in 35 years,since high school.I live in major cities all my life.Ive been robbed once,I gave them the money.Im going to risk my life for a few bucks?.I dont think so.If you want to be a professional MMA guy or a boxer.Go for it.Some people really enjoy it. I know a guy here who was a ranked heavy weight.He is brain damaged.Its a hell of a way to make a living.I studied at a school for a couple of years that was heavily into sparring and full contact fighting.I liked to intensity of the work outs.I was in my early 20's.I also played music.After a couple broken fingers it started to effect my abilty to play my bass.I quit.I thought long and hard about what I was doing.I got into it for 2 reasons.I was attracted to the "exoticness" of it but really,deep down,I felt small and weak,insecure in this big bad world.Facing my fears saved me alot of money and gave me back lots of time to pursue much more rewarding things like qigong,meditation,and what we are doing on this rock flying through space.

[Seth Ananda]

I have to throw my two cents in as well.

I unfortunately am a master of nothing as i changed styles too often... I started with Judo at about 8 and did it for 4 years. But I really wanted to hit people so went to ZendoKai for 2 years before being told about Bob Jones secret Ninja school [kakusuryu].

lol At 12 this sounded so mysterious and exciting I nearly burst a vessel.
It was really an early freestyle Karate/mma with weapons, bone breaks, grappling, blind folded full contact sparring, and at least 40 mins of full contact sparring per class. I did this for the next 4 years and yes I got mean.

when I left my home town at 17 and came to the city I fell in with some rather rough dudes who just loved wing chun and escrima. They loved to get into fights, did bouncing and security work in the hope of more action but usually just picked them them selves. Eye pokes and throat strickes were the name of the game for them.
In my various conversations they would claim that wing chun was a supreme opener for a fight that would almost always guarantee them getting the first hit in. The first hit for them was always a jab/poke/gouge to the eye or the throat. then no more wing chun. The second they had the person off center from an eye poke, they would wind up a big swing or two till the guy was down [he was often already going down]

My thoughts are:
1. these guys were vicious and loved to fight. I think Wing Chun is well suited to that kind of person.
2. Brock lesner is a lousy comparison till there is a wingchunner of same size weight and meanness.
3. All styles can be nasty and employ eyegouging, but WT will usually win at a speed contest, and thus get the eyegouge in first.
4. I have been on the recieving end of an eye jab, and it took me 10 mins before I could open either eye even slightly. They truly f#@k you up.
5. This make ring sports an unsuitable judge of Wing chun.
6. I also tend to believe that If you do not really want to hurt your opponent, Wing chun is a more unsuitable self defence system.

When you stand there trying to chainpunch/control their elbows and cross their arms while they furiously swing heavy blows trying to take your head off, you are going to loose if you are not willing to maim them in the first second.

I went to an mma gym for 6 months and it was great. I found myself that they found me hard to deal with. One I am very hard to get on the ground [probably from judo] and two, I have developed some decent strength with my center line punches. I probably have good timing as well, as I seem to know when to step in or back off. But even more was the small bits of combative Taiji training [which is now my main focus] that inform my striking. The more fatigued I get [my heart/cardio health needs lots of work] the stronger my punches become as I am forced to rely on proper weight transference. George Kostovalis [who has trained some top fighters] was Intrigued by some of the tricks I had up my sleeve, which sometimes decked his good students.

Its a pity really, as I enjoy fighting but am probably getting too old and unhealthy for it. Taiji just doesn't cut it exercise wise.

And Finally in defense of Aikido. The one man I have met that utterly bewilders me is an Aikido master.
I personnely despised every Aikido school I had ever seen. They looked beautiful, flowing and graceful. Thats fine for an Art, but not a Martial art. They lie to them selves with Training with no resistance. They cooperate with the moves being done to them, and have usless excuses why it should be like that. Usless lame and stupid.

Then I met Sensei Malcolm McRae. First class, he says so you like MA? I say yes. He says ok, attack me any way you want as hard as you can. So I did. we spent the entire class with my trying every dirty trick I know. I got angrier and more frustrated, I wanted to KO him, break his knee, kick his nuts, what ever. I was never even close for a milli second to success. As soon as I moved he owned me. Humiliation. Eventually he started laughing and asked me if I could see how pointless strength and speed was yet.

I would still be with that man, but Aikido is not good for my knees. His class trains every move with full resistance. He told us that AiKiDo means 'Way of harmonizing Ki'. There must be 'strength' and resistance present for Ki to harmonize with. This is the mistake of nearly All other Aikido schools. He said that every other class he had seen around the world lacks realistic training, thus they have no Ki. If they do not fully resist you, how can you learn to use Ki against it. So in other words, It looks and talks like AiKiDo, but It just isnt. Its just people acting out the moves, empty of the essence.

His school is slowly gaining popularity. One of the Gracie trained BJJ teachers has become his student. Bob Jones, Cebrano and a bunch of old Karate hard men [many who were heavy weight champions] boxers and Muay Thai practitioners have all become his students. He had to fight a number of them and he Flogged them. Bob Jones pulled some strings to get Him on the cover of Blitz magazine [Vol 21 No 2]

I still to this day have never seen Ki displays anything like his. [not stupid like golden bamboo] but astonishing.

But as Despite His school being iMO a totally valid MA, It still takes a long time to learn.

Anyway I think I am done.
Kung Pow!

Edited September 20, 2014 by Seth Ananda

[Sloppy Zhang]

GREAT post Seth

 

A couple of points I'd like to zoom in on....

 

My thoughts are:

1. these guys were vicious and loved to fight. I think Wing Chun is well suited to that kind of person.

 

Training in real fights is much better than many schools that market themselves as "traditional" but have no real combat training.

 

2. Brock lesner is a lousy comparison till there is a wingchunner of same size weight and meanness.

 

Thaw WOULD be true, IF martial arts marketed themselves as having weight classes and equivalent levels of aggression. But many martial arts, especially Wing Chun, market themselves as being able to train people to defeat people, even opponents who are stronger and faster.

 

And that sounds great, "Wing Chun was developed by a woman!" and everything, until you realize that a lady might not run into Joe Bob on the street, Mr. Average in everything. She just might run into a criminal Brock Lesnar, or a criminal version of your already borderline buddies.

 

And for the people who seriously think they're going to eye gouge, then hit in the throat, then the groin, then the knees, successfully WITHOUT being at least 3/4 as big, strong, and tough as somebody else and at with at least as much fight experience, they are putting themselves at risk.

 

I went to an mma gym for 6 months and it was great. I found myself that they found me hard to deal with. One I am very hard to get on the ground [probably from judo] and two, I have developed some decent strength with my center line punches.

 

Not to mention some extensive cross training and actual fighting experience.

 

And Finally in defense of Aikido. The one man I have met that utterly bewilders me is an Aikido master.

I personnely despised every Aikido school I had ever seen. They looked beautiful, flowing and graceful. Thats fine for an Art, but not a Martial art. They lie to them selves with Training with no resistance. They cooperate with the moves being done to them, and have usless excuses why it should be like that. Usless lame and stupid.

 

Then I met Sensei Malcolm McRae. First class, he says so you like MA? I say yes. He says ok, attack me any way you want as hard as you can. So I did. we spent the entire class with my trying every dirty trick I know. I got angrier and angrier, I wanted to KO him, break his knee, kick his nuts, what ever. I was never even close for a milli second to success. As soon as I moved he owned me. Humiliation. Eventually he started laughing and asked me if I could see how pointless strength and speed was yet.

 

I would still be with that man, but Aikido is not good for my knees. His class trains every move with full resistance. He told us that AiKiDo means 'Way of harmonizing Ki'. There must be 'strength' and resistance present for Ki to harmonize with. This is the mistake of nearly All other Aikido schools. He said that every other class he had seen around the world lacks realistic training, thus they have no Ki. If they do not fully resist you, how can you learn to use Ki against it. So in other words, It looks and talks like AiKiDo, but It just isnt. Its just people acting out the moves, empty of the essence.

 

His school is slowly gaining popularity. One of the Gracie trained BJJ teachers has become his student. Bob Jones, Cebrano and a bunch of old Karate hard men [many who were heavy weight champions] boxers and Muay Thai practitioners have all become his students. He had to fight a number of them and he Flogged them. One managed to crack his rib once and that was the only guy to even be able to touch him. He slammed that guy down on the mat so hard it took him a few hours to get up. Bob Jones pulled some strings to get Him on the cover of Blitz magazine [Vol 21 No 2]

 

Sounds like a boss

 

But as Despite His school being iMO a totally valid MA, It still takes a long time to learn.

 

Sounds like it!

 

And thanks again for relaying your experiences!

[Sloppy Zhang]

I worked with people who really had to.They all have post traumatic stress dis-order,shattered nervous systems,sleeping dis orders,They cant function anymore,alcaholism,drug addiction,massive health issues.That is what happens when you experience combat and survive.

 

Excellent post, especially this point.

[C T]

 

Kung Pow!

Would that be chicken or the house special, sir? :lol:

 

 

(Great share btw... thanks bro!)

[Seth Ananda]

Lol thanks guys.

 

Here is The Aikido teacher blitz article:

 

http://kifusionaikido.com/?page_id=54

 

I really hope he can clean up the appallingly Infective Aikido world.

 

Malcolm's teacher David Brown is also a very Interesting man. He really wanted to know if aikido could be realistically used in fights. He did no cross training in his life, but went and challenged all kinds of [good] martial artists and fighters around melbourne. Boxers, Thai Boxers, wrestlers, kungfuers... If they beat him, and at the start they did, he would spend time contemplating it, then challenge them again, and so on till he finally could beat them with out them being able to lay a Hand on him.

 

I Have a lot of respect for that man. He got Injured badly several times in that period. He did not suddenly add elements off bjj or something to his aikido to win. When he fights it looks like and is Aikido. He just learned [the hard way] how to use it against different styles.

 

 

And sloppy, good points but I would not be too quick to be too sure about the size difference in wing chun. My dodgy friends were almost desperate to prove themselves against much larger opponents. I have to say some of the things I saw made me feel ashamed to be associated with them. Picking on unagressive hulks just for a 'size badge' of honor, but they were not all big softies. They key to them was to piss of someone so much that the person would make the first move. at least with the wingchun opening, if your opponent strikes first, that gives you quite an advantage.

 

I certainly found this in the MMA class. I would always wait for them to move first, and when they did, i would bypass somehow, tap them hard on the fore head, above the eyes just to make sure I could have really taken out an eye. I reckon it worked 29 out of 30 times. As far as I am concerned, in that moment the fight [if real] was over.

 

When my daughter turns 5 next year, she'll go to wing chun classes, which I think is particularly good for women, and later learn Taiji and more sanshou style fighting.

Boys Beware

Edited May 31, 2011 by Seth Ananda

[Sloppy Zhang]

Malcolm's teacher David Brown is also a very Interesting man. He really wanted to know if aikido could be realistically used in fights. He did no cross training in his life, but went and challenged all kinds of [good] martial artists and fighters around melbourne. Boxers, Thai Boxers, wrestlers, kungfuers... If they beat him, and at the start they did, he would spend time contemplating it, then challenge them again, and so on till he finally could beat them with out them being able to lay a Hand on him.

 

I Have a lot of respect for that man. He got Injured badly several times in that period. He did not suddenly add elements off bjj or something to his aikido to win. When he fights it looks like and is Aikido. He just learned [the hard way] how to use it against different styles.

 

See if more people did that, then we wouldn't have so many problems with teachers stringing people along.

 

And sloppy, good points but I would not be too quick to be too sure about the size difference in wing chun. My dodgy friends were almost desperate to prove themselves against much larger opponents. I have to say some of the things I saw made me feel ashamed to be associated with them. Picking on unagressive hulks just for a 'size badge' of honor, but they were not all big softies. They key to them was to piss of someone so much that the person would make the first move. at least with the wingchun opening, if your opponent strikes first, that gives you quite an advantage.

 

As a big person myself, I've been a target all my life for people looking for that "size badge of honor", I'm familiar with the tricks

 

It's also I'm familiar with the ways that fights can be successfully avoided or diffused without actually fighting- which I think is a crucial step to self defense, but should be balanced with actual fighting training. Don't rely too much on fighting- or you'll get into fights that could have been avoided. And don't rely too much on your diplomacy, or else you won't survive fights that you couldn't avoid.

 

 

Thanks for linking to the article, and I hope your daughter enjoys the martial arts

 

And don't worry too much if she starts and stops for a while. I did that a bit as a kid, my parents thought I had quit martial arts, but really I was just pondering and internalizing stuff. I knew I wanted something as a kid, but I didn't quite know what it was. But once I knew that martial arts could take me where it really was, I totally threw myself into it.

Edited May 30, 2011 by Sloppy Zhang

[C T]

Pssst... guys, pass the word around - there is massive potential for anyone interested to teach authentic Wing Chun here in Ireland. Population 4.45million... number of Wing Chun academies = 2!!! One in the North of the Republic, and one in the South. So if any of your mates are looking to expand into 'fertile' territory, especially now that the visa laws have been relaxed, they ought to seriously consider setting up shop here. Premises are currently quite cheap to rent, and if anyone wants to come and have an initial look around, PM me for a chat anytime.

 

 

(apologies for veering off topic )

[henro]

Excellent post, especially this point.

 

Well, to a point.

 

I don't think the members here are talking about combat, they're talking about being able to defend themselves. Sure, good martial arts training should teach you how to avoid confrontations if at all possible, but if you're going to train in an art you want to know, and feel that you can handle a self defense situation. I have, unfortunately, been in two altercations in my adult life. One after someone threatened my client's life. It ended on the ground because I took it there, no striking, forearm on the throat until the authorities could take the guy away. The second was in China recently when a drunkard attacked my wife and I simply because I was the only white guy on the street. Again, no striking, only containment until he could be taken away. I credit my training for me being able to control the situation while maintaining complete calm. I've been training in tai chi, and hung gar for about 10 years, and recently started ba gua, and xing yi. I had a little exposure to wing chun as I trained at a JKD studio briefly before I started Hung gar. Hung gar can be devastating, so to me it's nice to have softer responses a la tai chi, and ba gau, and know the hung gar is there if the altercation gets more serious. Actually in China I used some xing yi moves that I had learned only a couple weeks before without even thinking about it. That was pretty cool to me. Walking those damn lines for hours actually works !!!!

 

So I do think these conversations are valid, especially if people can speak from experience.

Edited May 30, 2011 by robmix

[Sloppy Zhang]

So I do think these conversations are valid, especially if people can speak from experience.

 

I also think the conversations are valid.

 

I thought it was a good point, that people who are involved in combat can be really messed up. Even criminal street thugs usually come from broken homes, a history of violence, emotional and social problems, etc.

 

These are the people you COULD run into, and I think it is important to realize this from a self defense point of view, but it's also a good point from the point of view as a "gut check"- I've seen a lot of guys who thought they were "bad", who walk around acting invincible because they know some skill or the other. Even on this forum there have been such people, whether they could actually back up what they said, who knows.

 

Television and movies have glamorized violence. What guy WOULDN'T want to be an action hero? But it's a shitty life and there are lots of nasty issues.

 

Just the hand full if fights I've been in have caused me FAR more grief than they were worth. Sure, lessons learned. But never something I'd want to live my life by.

 

So, I dunno, I just thought it was a good point that isn't often considered on the surface.

[Edward M]

sorry deleting this as don't want to cause possible offence to some members on here!

Ed

Edited May 30, 2011 by Edward M

[The Way Is Virtue]

Hello all,

 

After a fairly long hiatus from meditation and my studies of taoism, I've recently decided to resume a schedule of exercising and meditating daily. So far I've been at it for about three weeks, and things seem to be finding their way back into balance again. I'm very interested, however, in learning a martial art to help improve my physical, mental, and spiritual self.

 

I've been searching around a bit, and it seems that the only schools near me (I live in a fairly rural area) teach either Aikido or Wing Chun (I prefer the pinyin "yong chun," but that's just me being a snob) gong fu. I have taken a few courses in Aikido, and I really enjoyed its philosophy of nonviolence, but I have always been primarily interested in Chinese schools of gong fu. Have any of you practiced yong chun gong fu, particularly in the US? I'd love some advice about what I should do, and what other schools may be better if it is not ideal.

 

Thanks!

Flynn

 

Hi Flynn. IMO, if aikido and wing chun are the only options available to you in your area, then you could maybe go and meet the teachers at the two schools and see which of the teachers/schools seems to be taking an approach that is most in line with what you are looking for. I think you can learn valuable things from most any martial art, and what all you can get out of it depends to a large extent on the emphasis and understanding and approach of the teacher or teachers.

 

Is the particular school mainly focused on fighting and breaking heads or competitions or do they seem to have some understanding that martial arts is a way of training oneself at many different levels and fighting skill is only one aspect of it? If they seem to show some understanding of the latter and their approach seems to resonate with you then you can always give it a try for a while to see if you like it.

 

Why am I saying to check it out first? Well, as one example, one time I heard about a certain Chinese martial arts teacher in my area at the time who taught various martial arts including bagua zhang, and who some were recommending, so being interested in learning bagua zhang I signed up to learn bagua zhang. After attending classes there for a month or so it became obvious to me that the teacher was teaching bagua zhang basically as just another exteranl style 'form' and seemed to have little understanding of the internal aspects of the art. The teacher seemed to be quite accomplished at 'hard style' martial arts but I was mainly interested in learning bagua zhang as a system of internal cultivation so I moved on. It all depends on what a person is looking for and much also depends on the approach and understanding of the teachers. Some 'external' style teachers have at least some knowledge in internal cultivation as well, so it does depend a fair bit on the teacher and the tradition they are coming from, IMO.

[jak3b]

Didnt mean to denigrate anyones experience here.I just have had these conversations seems like millions of times.Mostly martial artist talk about fighting as it relates to there style or school vs another style or school.People I know from Hong Kong would tell me they would have to fight the students from the other schools sometimes.Even though it was informal,It wasnt really like a street fight in the Lower East Side.There was etiqette,rules.When Bruce Lee fought Wong Jack Man here in SF.There were witnesses,an area to fight in etc.Its a highly ritualised event,theres breathing room.Theres loads of cultural threads running through it all.I lived in China Town here in San Francisco for a few years.How the Chinese street kids fight is 20 to one.They NEVER fight one on one.to risky.When they get a little older,like 12 they use guns.Traditional Martial arts in Japan is totaly ritualised,very very formal,deep deep in the Japanese psyche.Morihei Ueshiba developed Aikido, as a spiritual path (Do- Tao).After it became Aikido from Aiki jutsu fighting was not the stress,It was blending,flowing yielding through which you have a direct experience of the Tao.The Chinese have a much more practical approach.My first teacher was Dr Leung Kay Chi in Boston.His school is called JIANN SHYONG He told me it means basicly good health but in an over all kind of holistic meaning.Self defence to him meant being healthy and balanced in mind body and spirit, your total being.When you have that your immune to the real dangers of life, your own mind.Your free from worry.You dont find your self in situations where you need to physicly defend your self.That has been my experience.I have seen some horrible shit people are capable of doing to each other.I liked to live in the seedier of life for many years.Being alert using common street sense,dont look lost and keep moving were much more valuable skills "on the street" then techiques or any moves I ever thought I learned.Its a how you carry your energy.I have traveled alot in Asia.Other expats would always be complaining about how they were always being rippid off,cheated.They dont have any trust they believe all the fear mongering the media constantly spews out and thats what they get.I choose to believe that most people are ok,They are just like me trying to live there life as best they can.And things go well.Its pretty simple.The most effective weapon is your mind and your common sense,Also the abilty to listen.

[Sloppy Zhang]

sorry deleting this as don't want to cause possible offence to some members on here!

Ed

 

You should say what you want, and not care who takes offense. If someone is bothered by it, that's their problem.

 

Just as long as you don't go insulting someone personally or making a racist comment, the mods won't get ya

 

People I know from Hong Kong would tell me they would have to fight the students from the other schools sometimes.Even though it was informal,It wasnt really like a street fight in the Lower East Side.There was etiqette,rules.

 

People like to think back to the good old days. But thanks to the internet, we can even get some footage from those good old days. And we find some silliness....

 

 

 

When Bruce Lee fought Wong Jack Man here in SF.There were witnesses,an area to fight in etc.Its a highly ritualised event,theres breathing room.Theres loads of cultural threads running through it all.

 

Really? Because that event has been a singular source of mud slinging to this very day!

 

My sister came by and told me that she had seen a demonstration from a new Kung Fu school. I asked her what style, and she was like "I don't remember, but he said his teacher was the only person to ever defeat Bruce Lee." Ooooooh boy, just from that I knew EXACTLY who she was talking about. And the Bruce Lee camp points to that as a success for Bruce Lee. And then the opposing camp says "nah, he could have killed Bruce Lee several times with his lethal techniques, but held back because he's a true master, that's why it looked like he might have lost, but really it was a win, but really everyone had to pull them apart, but really, it was a..."

 

If you're going to hold back, the only way you can legitimately claim that is if you dominate the fight otherwise, similar to the Tai Chi masters who would reportedly hardly hurt people, but fling them right off the Lei Tai. Otherwise it sounds like you're making excuses.

 

Point is- you can dress it up all you want, but most of this stuff is fodder for political pissing contests. But nooooo, it's all cultural, traditional, honor, blah blah blah. It's people pissing on each other and calling it rain.

 

Being alert using common street sense,dont look lost and keep moving were much more valuable skills "on the street" then techiques or any moves I ever thought I learned.Its a how you carry your energy.

 

That's true so long as you don't get into fights.

 

But you can't comment on what didn't happen. Just because one might get away by walking with a purpose, another might not because somebody decided one day that they wanted to join a gang, and had to get in by killing someone of your particular race. So you can't really determine across the board that street smarts is a better investment then physical, combative self defense measures.

 

I have traveled alot in Asia.Other expats would always be complaining about how they were always being rippid off,cheated.They dont have any trust they believe all the fear mongering the media constantly spews out and thats what they get.I choose to believe that most people are ok,They are just like me trying to live there life as best they can.And things go well.Its pretty simple.The most effective weapon is your mind and your common sense,Also the abilty to listen.

 

My experiences with foreign countries is that it helps a LOT to know the language and the culture. Even just a little bit. Be humble, try to learn. I see a lot of Americans go abroad and act like they own the place. They're just asking to be duped out of everything they've got. Know what to say, know what to wear, learn the customs and the manners and the gestures.

 

But that won't work against, say, an anti-foreigner extremist who's determined to take you down a couple of notches. So you gotta know the limits for each of your tools. The right tool for the right job.

Edited May 31, 2011 by Sloppy Zhang

[jak3b]

"That's true so long as you don't get into fights."

Getting into a fight is a choice.Why would you want to?

 

"But you can't comment on what didn't happen. Just because one might get away by walking with a purpose, another might not because somebody decided one day that they wanted to join a gang, and had to get in by killing someone of your particular race. So you can't really determine across the board that street smarts is a better investment then physical, combative self defense measures."

 

I dont know where you live but here we have lots of gangs and gang activity.Oakland has one of the highest murder rates in the US, Richmond and Vallejo are both running close behind.Its on the news all the time for the last 20 years.drive by's,Kids getting shot etc etc.Where did this happen,Right in the Gang bangers area.Ive worked in the projects in Hunters point repairing some retaining walls.The people that lived there told us it was not a good idea to work late.I got a couple "hey white boy" but never threatend or even made uncomfortable.99.9% of the people are basicly ok.I was there everyday for a couple months.That whole thing about killing some one of your race to get into a gang is an urban myth.Its the kind of crap they eat up in the 'burbs.The was a gang related shooting here about a year ago out side of a dance club.These clowns started popping off on each other.they didnt get close to hitting each other but a stray bullet killed a German woman.She was a block and half away.It was a total tragedy.What are the odds of that happening?.And how the hell do you train for that?.

[jak3b]

Oh and most likely political extremists,terrorists are not much interested in street fighting either.They are more interested in the big picture like total economic disruption.They like bombs,things like make a big splash.The most dangerous person in the world, bar none, is a 18-19 year old air head,driving an SUV and texting.Keep your heads up!.

[Sloppy Zhang]

"That's true so long as you don't get into fights."

Getting into a fight is a choice.Why would you want to?

 

I actually gave a couple of examples in which it is NOT a choice- namely things like racial violence, or cultural violence, where someone looks at you and decides you need to be hurt or be killed. And your best bet is to pray they don't just shoot you, but come at you in a manner in which you can defend yourself.

 

I got a couple "hey white boy" but never threatend or even made uncomfortable.99.9% of the people are basicly ok.I was there everyday for a couple months.

 

Well just 'cause it worked for you doesn't mean it is applicably broadly. Just be careful about making generalizations. I prefer to look at and account for all possibilities, even the improbable ones, rather than writing them off as unlikely only to have them come back and bite me later.

 

And how the hell do you train for that?.

 

You can't train for that. You can't train for standing in the hot dog line and somebody just deciding to stab you. You can't train for a drive by (well maybe how to dive for cover, if their first shot doesn't kill you). You can't train for stray bullets.

 

But that doesn't mean you can't train for people who want to kick the shit out of you. That doesn't mean you can't train for somebody who comes at you with a variety of blunt or edged weapons. Or ballistic weapons at close range.

 

Know your limitations, but don't let those limitations limit your training.

 

Oh and most likely political extremists,terrorists are not much interested in street fighting either.

 

You are referring to organized political groups. And sure, they are most likely not going to be interested. Well guess what? The power is most likely going to be on tonight. But I still have an emergency backup flashlight with backup batteries in my home. An angry, unorganized person who hates you can lash out violently at you just as easily (and, depending on your region) just as likely as the infrastructure of the power companies suddenly failing. But that doesn't mean you can't learn to defend yourself, and it doesn't mean you shouldn't get a backup flashlight just to prepare.