Our cognitive dissonance

[Everything]

Hey, guys.

 

I have this recurring struggle with making decisions in my education. Everytime I attempt to make a decisions here I cannot make sense of it, get frustrated. Since whatever decision I make is against my own will. I'm gonna explain how and wish you to help solve all conginitive dissonance in general. I just mention my own experience to bring an truthful example to the table here.

 

Cognitive dissonance is an inner struggle of dualities. For example, a smoker might enjoy smoking but wishes to become more healthy. What is the cognitive dissonance? The desire to smoke and the desire to quite smoking. No matter what he does, inner peace will never be found in this area of his life. This is very counter intuitive, since most people struggle their entire life without even realizing this.

Cognitive dissonance is usually a lack of clear identity/boundarie/believes/values or any similarity between those.

 

With me, I wish to enjoy my life, and I wish to invest in my self. Enjoying my life, I simply go with the flow and never see the seriousness in anything. Investing in my life, I study and am seriously neglecting my self. I go from study to fun to study to fun and never being content in this area of my life. I've realized this before, but my way of dealing with it was "rather make a wrong decision and learn from it then no decision at all"

 

So making decisions really did help, but my frame of reference has changed from "make wrong decisions untill you find the right one" to "no matter what decision I make, they are all wrong in my eyes. Getting rid of the cognitive dissonance and I don't have to make a decision at all!" This is not ment as an excuse not to have to make a decision, but this struggle simply cannot be solved with impulsivity. I have to sit down patiently, think about my cognitive dissonance and dissolve it like salt in water.

 

When someone says "study" or "fun" I get frustrated and confused, so a little bit angry and other times a little bit anxiety. I might even get fearful. For example when I study, I want to run away from fun impulsively for it WILL ruin my studies, and vice versa. If I have fun, thinking one second about my study and fun is dead. The cognitive dissonance is subconsciously causing this frustration and confusion. The struggle between two opposite values. Currently I run away from fun and stick to my investments like superglue. As you might have guessed, fun is always around the corner and I cannot find the time to succeed in my studies as I constantly get overworked and become tired of motivation.

 

To make it more general and less about me specifically, a smoker might flee from conversations about health, or a quiter might wish to flee from other smokers, especially if they're offering them sigarettes. Or they might feel agitated when people talk about smoking or health, even if they don't show it. This frustration might come out in unexpected ways as in the form of negative energy insufficiently and unwisely spend. I see that with addicts all the time. After a while you can intuitively feel what subjects to avoid.

 

Some people might not avoid their cognitive dissonance and discuss these subjects with emotional attachments. Especially when it is constantly coming up for them, they snap and quite running away from it. These discussions are not wise or fun discussions and usually lead to nowhere. For example, I might get angry and direct it on someone who says "Comon lets have fun/you study too much!" and I respond with "Don't confuse your desires with mine. I don't want to have fun and I'm nothing like you. I am going to study." While 5 seconds later I feel frustrated by my own sentence. cognitive dissonance: "I DO want to have fun and study at the same time, but I can't!" I don't exactly think those words, but I feel the values and emotions behind this cognitive dissonance subconsciously, without realizing where the emotions are coming from. Its like you're trying to find a toilet in Africa and get smacked in the face for being too polite and doing it on the ground. You have no idea what the reason behind the pain is. Cognitive dissonance sux...

 

The problem here is obviously a lack of a clear boundary for a certain area in your life, like cigarettes, health, relationships, studies. For me, I have no clear boundary for my studies. I either study 100% and fail, or I let go of my studies and have fun 100%.

 

So my guess here is: hold both dualities in mind at the same time and find inner peace with them both. But I'm not sure how. Basicly, setting clear boundaries for my self and integrating them into my identity does help. For example, wake up early and study to a certain time so that I have the rest of the day for fun stuff. Sounds pretty stupid, but it does the job. When someone says you study too much, I say "I study from this time to this time." Or when someone says "you smoke to much" you can say "I'm going to smoke untill I have lung cancer" rather then "no I don't!!! You're stupid!" which stems from a lack of identity/boundaries/values. Basicly: know thyself.

 

Perhaps you can take these examples and analyze patterns in your memories for any cognitive dissonance experiences. Any ideas on how to solve these to make a step towards inner peace is very appreciated, along with all other comments about this subject.

 

Thanks in advance.

Edited May 29, 2011 by Everything

[doc benway]

I think that all decisions in life have many facets. Some positive and some negative.

Sometimes the decision is very easy and sometimes hard.

This is yin and yang, the negative within the positive and the positive within the negative.

It is unavoidable.

 

One approach is to become familiar with your core values - what are the most important things to you, deep down; how do you want to be remembered when you are gone; what would you like your children to say about you to their friends? Many ways to look at it but the important thing is to identify those values and bring them into your consciousness.

 

When a decision is difficult, it can help to consider whether your choices will be in accordance with these values or go against these values. If the are consistent, then you are in accordance with your nature - Wu Wei. If inconsistent, you will be divided and conflicted. You will rarely be completely undivided but the knowledge and feeling that you are living a life of personal integrity is valuable. This approach has been very helpful to me in dealing with difficult issues over the past few years.

[Everything]

If the are consistent, then you are in accordance with your nature - Wu Wei. If inconsistent, you will be divided and conflicted. You will rarely be completely undivided but the knowledge and feeling that you are living a life of personal integrity is valuable. This approach has been very helpful to me in dealing with difficult issues over the past few years.

 

Wow that sounds really nice.

Can you take the patterns you notice in your own solving of difficult struggles and give an example of you go about solving a specific issue that is difficult?

 

Like for example the inner struggle of wanting to be a vegetarian but enjoying meat alot. as a vegetarian you crave for meat and as you eat meat you become nausious.

 

Also, do you personally think it is possible to change your inner nature? Change inner core values/boundaries/ideas/believe/identity. For example, if you think spiders are dangerous, deep down inside, you may feel divided and torn appart if you force yourself to take one into your hand. But I've turned this fear around into fascination towards these little creatures and can now take one into my hands without any fear and even find them cute, especially if they run when they sense your finger nearby.

Edited May 29, 2011 by Everything

[doc benway]

Wow that sounds really nice.

Can you take the patterns you notice in your own solving of difficult struggles and give an example of you go about solving a specific issue that is difficult?

 

Like for example the inner struggle of wanting to be a vegetarian but enjoying meat alot. as a vegetarian you crave for meat and as you eat meat you become nausious.

 

Also, do you personally think it is possible to change your inner nature? Change inner core values/boundaries/ideas/believe/identity. For example, if you think spiders are dangerous, deep down inside, you may feel divided and torn appart if you force yourself to take one into your hand. But I've turned this fear around into fascination towards these little creatures and can now take one into my hands without any fear and even find them cute, especially if they run when they sense your finger nearby.

I'll start with the second question first - I think that our inner nature does change, life is change. I don't think that "I" can force a change. But I do think that as we gain life experience and become increasingly aware of our behavior and our relationships with others, that we can certainly identify things which are more important to us and emphasize those values in our choices. And what is important to us changes with different phases in our lives. So this is an ongoing, dynamic process.

 

So for example, I may be the kind of father who feels it is important to have the last word and guide or even control the behavior of one of my children. Perhaps this was the only role model I ever knew. And this leads to conflict. Maybe the child is rebellious or defiant. And the conflict escalates to the point of violence (not necessarily physical, but emotional, psychological, verbal). And one day I have an insight into the fact that the child is distant and bitter and won't confide in me. And I see how it is connected to my behavior and stubborn attachment to be in control. Then I can make a choice - be more tolerant, accept certain behavior that might have previously been unacceptable. Allow the child to make certain choices and experience the consequences, good or bad. And still be there to pick them up and hug them when they are hurt. I make a choice to be loving and supportive rather than authoritarian. And this is because I see that the future of our relationship depends on developing confidence and trust rather than discipline. So both of our lives are enriched but I'm still a bit uneasy to watch the child make occasional "wrong" choices or "mistakes" that I may have helped them to avoid. We are rarely completely undivided. The irony and beauty is that the child will soon become much more open to my guidance because that is THEIR choice.

 

So I started with focusing on the importance of discipline and the responsibility of guiding the child to the right decisions. And I recognized that a close relationship depending on tempering that with kindness, support, and encouragement. By identifying the values that were more important to me (having a loving and supportive relationship with my child) and changing my behavior accordingly, I was able to enrich both of our lives.

 

I think flexibility is important also. So I can choose to be a vegetarian because I am honoring the value of life and not harming animals, fish, and foul. And there comes a time when I really crave meat and no substitute is adequate. So I eat the meat. I make a choice. I'm going against that value but for a good reason - my body is telling me that I need the meat. And then I can resume honoring my choice to being vegetarian when I'm ready. I don't think this has to be all or none. It just has to be a conscious process. We need to be aware.

[Everything]

I'll start with the...

 

...We need to be aware.

Yeah, I totally agree with this. It is also a great example of boundaries.

 

I see people stick together in relationships all the time, codependantly, and it only turns into violence. Especially between two partners who are overly jealous. Where as an independant relationship becomes dead after a while and drained of passion and love. Your balance of both (inter-dependant relationship) is a constant movement towards the perfect balance in the relationship where you take the best of two sides.

 

A baby is born in your boundary, at 12 years old they gradually take steps out, at 18 or higher they have their own bubble or boundary, and the interaction between the boundaries should be mature if the example of the parents are one of mature boundaries. Accepting the individual life of your own child is usually a first step, the next is to love the child yet say no to unaccaptable behaviour and keep a knob on the door incase the child changes behaviour so that you may give love without being drained of love out of frustration first.

 

I see this cognitive dissonance in parents alot. They don't want to hurt the "feelings" of the child, but they don't want their child to continue bad behaviour aswell. It is a huge struggle for them as they often say no to the point that the child cries and then suddenly say yes to unaccaptable behaviour. A lack of clear boundaries will result in more unaccaptable behaviour and codependent relationship. With partners, these kind of relationship have alot of "lies" or "fake boundaries" that they put out there to rationalize their messed up codependant relationship in order to prevent the passion from extinguishing. As you said, sometimes you must let the other be on their own. Take care of yourself so that you have more to give your child when the child really needs it. So that you can be generous continuesly and become impartial with your sharing of happiness. I always say, if you're not happy with the child, don't expect the child to become happy.

[Everything]

oops, double post

Edited May 29, 2011 by Everything

[doc benway]

I always say, if you're not happy with the child, don't expect the child to become happy.

I really like that. It's quite profound in its implications and nuance.

[Marblehead]

A few years ago I did a short search of this concept. I did the search to find out how it applies to the learning process. Turns out that cognitive dessonance oftentime prevents use from learning new concepts and especially when the new information is in conflict with what we already believe is the truth. The dsssonance hyrts and causes confusion so we throw the new information out and regain our peace of mind.

[Otis]

I think this all relates closely to the "Be as One Being" thread. We have cognitive dissonance, because our various forms of consciousness are each aligned in different directions. One part is seeking to define, another part to escape definition. One part is seeking to belong; another to differentiate itself.

 

I don't think that any of the various elements of my self are inherently wrong or right. Instead, they are there to balance each other out. Just as the body is composed of hundreds of muscles that are designed to easily and instantly balance each other out, so too IMO the various functions of the self are evolved to act as one unit.

 

Boundaries are a good stop-gap method, of satisfying the various parts of my brain, without necessarily upsetting the other parts. However, eventually, I think that to find freedom and balance, I need to stop being the manager of the other parts of my brain, and instead let them be on their own. Let them contest and pull with each other, without me deciding which is more virtuous. Allow the various parts to come into balance with each other, precisely by me, the ego, loosening my grip on choices.

[Marblehead]

We have cognitive dissonance, because our various forms of consciousness are each aligned in different directions. One part is seeking to define, another part to escape definition. One part is seeking to belong; another to differentiate itself.

 

Yes, I did notice when you spoke to this concept earlier. I said nothing because I didn't have anything to say. Still don't. Hehehe.

 

This is along with the concept of the "good wolf/bad wolf" except we feed the one we want to win.

 

I have a problem speaking to a concept where we break it down into its components because when we break something down we lose its total essence.

 

Maybe if you keep speaking to this concept something will form in my mind that I can speak to.

[Otis]

Yes, I did notice when you spoke to this concept earlier. I said nothing because I didn't have anything to say. Still don't. Hehehe.

 

This is along with the concept of the "good wolf/bad wolf" except we feed the one we want to win.

 

I have a problem speaking to a concept where we break it down into its components because when we break something down we lose its total essence.

 

Maybe if you keep speaking to this concept something will form in my mind that I can speak to.

OK. This is my own experience of my consciousness: that I am composed of several sub-personalities. One is fearful, one analytical, one sentimental, etc. (these are over-generalizations, but roughly accurate). I spend some time in one mode, but then, at some point, without my input, some mechanism shifts me from one consciousness to another. It's like turning a corner. Sudden peace, sudden anxiety, whatever, it happens suddenly.

 

If I'm mad (for example), and I wait, then eventually, I just shift. If I start to meditate on what made me angry, I may find myself back in the angry realm, but usually it's easier to get back out again, because the dominance has already moved on to a calmer "personality".

 

There's even a small amnesia that happens at the point of gear-shifting. I think that's part of why, during a make-up session, the lovers seem to forget what they were fighting about, just minutes before. "Let's never fight again" they say, because they are in a different consciousness. Next time that they fight, of course, all those awful things the other one said, come flooding back, because they are back in that pathway of the brain. (In psychology, this is known as state-dependent memory).

 

Shifting gears has historically been a troublesome place for me. My brain was not necessarily in the mode that the situation would require, and thus my responses arose from the wrong function. For example: I might be editing video at work, with my earphones on, and my attention fully in the project that I was working on, when someone would come up to me and tap on my shoulder. My response used to be irrational anger, because I was in project-focus consciousness, not social-focus consciousness. The experience felt like an intrusion, like being surprised with cold water, and I would be brittle in my reaction.

 

I have trained myself away from much of that brittleness, by learning to trust flow. In the past, I would contract and be mad at myself for not being in the right mode, but as I've learned to accept it, it also has been kinder to me. The less I demand that I be in the right mode at the right time, the easier it is shift.

 

Learning to trust my inner workings has been key, letting them be the boss, instead of me (my ego) trying to rule the organism. If I'm not feeling adventurous on my motorcycle, then I drive it like a car. If I am feeling it, then I go nuts, because I trust it. If I'm feeling loquacious at a party, I play, but I don't try to force it, when feeling subdued. Etc.

 

Cut to: the science. My neuropsych prof dad's research suggests that there are at least 5 separate pathways in the brain (pathway = a flow of neurochemical and electrical information across various physical structures), that act as sub-personalities. Each pathway is responsible for major attributes of our personalities, and they seem to take turns dominating. An MRI scan will show one pathway at a time, lighting up, in correlation to these observable personality modes. He says there are also theories with 7 or more dominant pathways. (I won't try to go too deep into his model, because I would need him to confirm the details).

 

Ironically, this model suggests something to me, very different than the "two wolves" conclusion. Yes, the "two wolves" story is true: feed the anger, and it will become dominant.

 

However, to find real peace inside me, I don't think that it is "my" (i.e. my ego's) job to decide what is good or bad for the various functions of my brain. My ego just doesn't have the tools; it would be like the petals telling the stamen what is right for it. So instead, I say: let the stamen be a stamen. Let anger be anger. Let all the various parts of me be as they are. Don't feed or fight any of it, but allow every part of me to be "right" (or at least, just fine). It's all there for a reason; no part is an alien invader; so I will not pick and choose. Instead, I trust that through the development of every part of me, that a greater, more unified whole will emerge. So far, I have many experiences of (what seems like) that "unified whole emerging", but they are all temporary. My accepting and growing processes still have a long ways to go.

 

Please let me know if I'm making this clearer.

Edited May 30, 2011 by Otis

[Nanashi]

Excellent post, Otis. I could relate with much of what you said.

 

Your conclusion reminds me of a zen story:

 

A Roshi was asked by his student, "If you're so enlightened, why do you get angry at us students sometimes?"

 

The Roshi replied "Anger and joy are like the seasons; let them arise and pass naturally."

[Marblehead]

Excellent post, Otis. I could relate with much of what you said.

 

Your conclusion reminds me of a zen story:

 

A Roshi was asked by his student, "If you're so enlightened, why do you get angry at us students sometimes?"

 

The Roshi replied "Anger and joy are like the seasons; let them arise and pass naturally."

 

Excellent!

[Marblehead]

 

Please let me know if I'm making this clearer.

 

Hi Otis,

 

I hear you saying something very similar to what Pema Chodron whote in her "When Things Fall Apart".

 

She wrote that we should not try to ignore or fight our negative experiences but rather acknowledge them, talk with them for a little while if your in the mood for that and then let them go. No holding on! And yes, some other mood will notmally enter our mind if we make room for it.

 

I really don't see what you are talking about as different 'selfs' but rather just moods as a result of something that happened.

 

This is one of the reasons I enjoy so many different styles of music. I have music for all of my different moods. My music can take me our of any negative mood that happens to come my way.

[stan herman]

I think this all relates closely to the "Be as One Being" thread. We have cognitive dissonance, because our various forms of consciousness are each aligned in different directions. One part is seeking to define, another part to escape definition. One part is seeking to belong; another to differentiate itself.

 

I don't think that any of the various elements of my self are inherently wrong or right. Instead, they are there to balance each other out. Just as the body is composed of hundreds of muscles that are designed to easily and instantly balance each other out, so too IMO the various functions of the self are evolved to act as one unit.

 

Boundaries are a good stop-gap method, of satisfying the various parts of my brain, without necessarily upsetting the other parts. However, eventually, I think that to find freedom and balance, I need to stop being the manager of the other parts of my brain, and instead let them be on their own. Let them contest and pull with each other, without me deciding which is more virtuous. Allow the various parts to come into balance with each other, precisely by me, the ego, loosening my grip on choices.

 

I appreciated your description Otis. I too have experienced similar abrupt and strong changes in overall outlook, sometimes even when nothing substantive has changed in my 'situation'. Allowing the variations to play themselves out, rather than cutting off the ones I don't approve has worked well for me over time. The more familiar I become with the habitual patterns ( in their emotional, mental and physical manifestations) the less they control me.

[Otis]

I really don't see what you are talking about as different 'selfs' but rather just moods as a result of something that happened.

Ah, we all know what a "mood" is, but really, what is it? Maybe a different mood really is a different sub-self.

 

Do you ever find yourself about to grab that midnight snack, and one part of you says: "nah, I shouldn't" and another part of you says: "c'mon, I want it!"? That's another example of having multiple selves, active at the same time. They perceive the world differently, and they choose differently. IME, those different parts even use language differently. One part swears more, another part speaks in full sentences, etc.

 

In the case of the inner judge, who is scolding whom? It is one inner self, upbraiding another.

 

As I approach a stunt, I hear two parts of my brain arguing with each other, one encouraging me forward, one trying to talk me out of it. Isn't multiple sub-selves what we talk about, with the devil and angel on our shoulders?

 

When I tell myself to count to ten to clear my anger, who is telling whom? How is it, that there is a calm "me" and an upset "me" at the same time?

 

All the time, I hear a conversation in my brain, one voice asserting one thing, and another one contradicting it. Most of my decision-making process happens between (seemingly) multiple parties.

 

I don't think that this schism is how we're supposed to live, but it certainly is how I experience my own brain.

[Otis]

I appreciated your description Otis. I too have experienced similar abrupt and strong changes in overall outlook, sometimes even when nothing substantive has changed in my 'situation'. Allowing the variations to play themselves out, rather than cutting off the ones I don't approve has worked well for me over time. The more familiar I become with the habitual patterns ( in their emotional, mental and physical manifestations) the less they control me.

Likewise. And I find that the less I try to control the various parts of me, the more they tend to balance themselves, and so do not need my fixing.

[Marblehead]

Do you ever find yourself about to grab that midnight snack, and one part of you says: "nah, I shouldn't" and another part of you says: "c'mon, I want it!"?

 

Yeah, that used to happen back when I used to think. I don't think anymore and the problem is gone.

 

I don't think that this schism is how we're supposed to live, but it certainly is how I experience my own brain.

 

Hey, it is how you are experiencing your experiences at this point in your life. It's not either right or wrong, it just is.

[Jetsun]

In the fourth way they say that there is a part of you which wants to wake up and get enlightened and there is a part of you which is outright opposed to it, so the main struggle is to get this opposing part of you onside and headed in the same direction, the question becomes how to do this. Many people try to force this part of you along through willpower, which is infact a form of violence towards that part so it just grows in opposition and you get nowhere, so then the other option is to bargain and sooth that part of you to show it compassion so in the very least it wont interfere with your efforts. But the reality of it is that most people never even become aware of that opposing part or what it is, they never gain enough awareness to understand why it is sabotaging their efforts towards enlightenment and undermining their meditation and cultivation, so they never even get in a position to attempt to get the opposing part onside headed in the direction of enlightenment then wonder why they fail to get anywhere.

[三江源]

In the fourth way they say that there is a part of you which wants to wake up and get enlightened and there is a part of you which is outright opposed to it, so the main struggle is to get this opposing part of you onside and headed in the same direction, the question becomes how to do this. Many people try to force this part of you along through willpower, which is infact a form of violence towards that part so it just grows in opposition and you get nowhere, so then the other option is to bargain and sooth that part of you to show it compassion so in the very least it wont interfere with your efforts. But the reality of it is that most people never even become aware of that opposing part or what it is, they never gain enough awareness to understand why it is sabotaging their efforts towards enlightenment and undermining their meditation and cultivation, so they never even get in a position to attempt to get the opposing part onside headed in the direction of enlightenment then wonder why they fail to get anywhere.

 

Yes. This is one of those elephant in the living room things.. we are all tiptoeing around the elephant, and we cant even see it, but it is taking up most of our space.

[Otis]

In the fourth way they say that there is a part of you which wants to wake up and get enlightened and there is a part of you which is outright opposed to it, so the main struggle is to get this opposing part of you onside and headed in the same direction, the question becomes how to do this. Many people try to force this part of you along through willpower, which is infact a form of violence towards that part so it just grows in opposition and you get nowhere, so then the other option is to bargain and sooth that part of you to show it compassion so in the very least it wont interfere with your efforts. But the reality of it is that most people never even become aware of that opposing part or what it is, they never gain enough awareness to understand why it is sabotaging their efforts towards enlightenment and undermining their meditation and cultivation, so they never even get in a position to attempt to get the opposing part onside headed in the direction of enlightenment then wonder why they fail to get anywhere.

Great!

 

It's not surprising that there is a part, which resists this change. The self gets its security from its certainty, so to surrender certainty is to lose (the sense of) security.

 

For example, here on a discussion board, in which many people will agree that the ego needs to be dissolved, how many people will actually acknowledge that "I am the ego"?

 

I don't see it very often, but no surprise, because who wants to dissolve themselves? We'd rather see the ego as this pesky thing to get rid of, and then "I" will be happy and complete. But I am the ego. I am the pesky thing. When I go, something else may be happy and complete, but it will not be me. I will just return to being a cog in the machine, a function of awareness.

 

Of course there's great resistance to surrendering all knowledge, all beliefs, all pretense to being "right". Because they are addictions at the very core of the self. How do I "know" anything? By referencing this ground of unquestionable "of course" that began at infancy. But all "of course" is just delusion, which means there is nothing left to hold on to. If we take away "what I know", then it seems to endanger "who I am".

 

Thankfully, "who I am" is an illusion, and so there is no danger. But the certainty must go, or I will always be addicted to being this "self".

Edited May 31, 2011 by Otis

[stan herman]

Great!

 

It's not surprising that there is a part, which resists this change. The self gets its security from its certainty, so to surrender certainty is to lose (the sense of) security.

 

For example, here on a discussion board, in which many people will agree that the ego needs to be dissolved, how many people will actually acknowledge that "I am the ego"?

 

I don't see it very often, but no surprise, because who wants to dissolve themselves? We'd rather see the ego as this pesky thing to get rid of, and then "I" will be happy and complete. But I am the ego. I am the pesky thing. When I go, something else may be happy and complete, but it will not be me. I will just return to being a cog in the machine, a function of awareness.

 

Of course there's great resistance to surrendering all knowledge, all beliefs, all pretense to being "right". Because they are addictions at the very core of the self. How do I "know" anything? By referencing this ground of unquestionable "of course" that began at infancy. But all "of course" is just delusion, which means there is nothing left to hold on to. If we take away "what I know", then it seems to endanger "who I am".

 

Thankfully, "who I am" is an illusion, and so there is no danger. But the certainty must go, or I will always be addicted to being this "self".

 

As long as one is going to be hanging around this (apparent) world, seems to me, that I/ego is a pretty handy thing. The trick is to keep the I/ego and exercise it regularly and vigorously, while keeping in mind it's only a paper shell over an empty bucket

 

After your transfer comes through is plenty of time to join up with what replaces it.

Edited May 31, 2011 by stan herman

[Otis]

As long as one is going to be hanging around this (apparent) world, seems to me, that I/ego is a pretty handy thing. The trick is to keep the I/ego and exercise it regularly and vigorously, while keeping in mind it's only a paper shell over an empty bucket

 

After your transfer comes through is plenty of time to join up with what replaces it.

No doubt, I don't feel ready to live in the world without my beliefs and habits. The trick, for me, is to remind myself that they are not "what's real", but merely "what's worked thus far". To see them as a game, nothing more.

 

I do feel the need to slowly wean myself from beliefs. I have various practices in which I am able to temporarily get out of the way, but they are still just a portion of my life, not the entire flow. What those practice reveal, however, is that it is entirely possible to function beyond my previous experience, without the meddling of "I". It reveals also, that whatever it is that emerges when I'm out of the way, possesses insight, awareness, efficiency and clarity that I have never been privy to.

 

The major function that I see now for "me" is to remind my system: "Hey, the bill is due" or "I'm already full, and yet still eating" or "I've lost my awareness of the moment, while distracted by stray thoughts". Because I have acted as the "grown-up" for so long, I/my ego is still the part that has the most practical knowledge, and is the most used to being in charge. So rather than trying to kill myself off, I'm merely trying to downgrade my role: from tyrant to manager, and when possible, to student.

[stan herman]

No doubt, I don't feel ready to live in the world without my beliefs and habits. The trick, for me, is to remind myself that they are not "what's real", but merely "what's worked thus far". To see them as a game, nothing more.

 

I do feel the need to slowly wean myself from beliefs. I have various practices in which I am able to temporarily get out of the way, but they are still just a portion of my life, not the entire flow. What those practice reveal, however, is that it is entirely possible to function beyond my previous experience, without the meddling of "I". It reveals also, that whatever it is that emerges when I'm out of the way, possesses insight, awareness, efficiency and clarity that I have never been privy to.

 

The major function that I see now for "me" is to remind my system: "Hey, the bill is due" or "I'm already full, and yet still eating" or "I've lost my awareness of the moment, while distracted by stray thoughts". Because I have acted as the "grown-up" for so long, I/my ego is still the part that has the most practical knowledge, and is the most used to being in charge. So rather than trying to kill myself off, I'm merely trying to downgrade my role: from tyrant to manager, and when possible, to student.

 

Sounds to me you're doing good. Whenever you can, take it easy on yourself. When you can't manage that, just do what you have to and notice yourself doing it--don't analyze it. Something said to me a while back was, "everybody's got these karmic seeds to burn before they get free, so just go ahead and burn them, one by one, until you're done." Good luck.

[Birch]

In the fourth way they say that there is a part of you which wants to wake up and get enlightened and there is a part of you which is outright opposed to it, so the main struggle is to get this opposing part of you onside and headed in the same direction, the question becomes how to do this. Many people try to force this part of you along through willpower, which is infact a form of violence towards that part so it just grows in opposition and you get nowhere, so then the other option is to bargain and sooth that part of you to show it compassion so in the very least it wont interfere with your efforts. But the reality of it is that most people never even become aware of that opposing part or what it is, they never gain enough awareness to understand why it is sabotaging their efforts towards enlightenment and undermining their meditation and cultivation, so they never even get in a position to attempt to get the opposing part onside headed in the direction of enlightenment then wonder why they fail to get anywhere.

 

Yes, I agree! I don't want to get enlightened. I just want to enjoy things