reliance on the sexual energy in spiritual cultivation

[Non]

is there a way to bypass the need to always retain semen to be able to spiritually progress or even physically progress?

 

I feel like all my abilities are shot if I ever lose it.. except for example it was "lost" with a woman that could just probably make up for the loss.

 

But what'ws the evolutionary purpose of needing to relying on the witheld sexual energy to provide motivation towards progress in the physical or spiritual?

 

What's the evolutionary foundation for this?

 

Were men denied passage of semen (or sex) in the ancient days by the women unless they did something pleasing or fulfilled the woman's desire first? Is this the reason we have come to rely on the semen (or sexual energy) to provide the drive to succeed?

 

Were the men denied creativity or rights unless they had fulfilled a slavemenship duty and then coupled it with a split in sexuality to mate?

 

I mean.. to constantly have a burning sensation reminding us "do your work".

 

Do we require the burning sensation of repressed sexuality to drive us toward seeking in life?

Edited May 31, 2011 by Non

[Sloppy Zhang]

is there a way to bypass the need to always retain semen to be able to spiritually progress or even physically progress?

 

Yes. It's called don't give your energy into that paradigm.

 

I've never been a big fan of the theory that sexual energy is the foundation for everything. That sex is at the root of all the energy.

 

I do believe sex is powerful, and that sexual energy can be manipulated and is very strong. But I believe it is only one kind of energy. I do not believe it is the only kind, nor do I believe it is the strongest.

 

I suggest you examine some of Seth Ananda's posts on body armoring for some perspectives on cultures that have a different view of sex, one that doesn't make sex draining if you have it.

 

Many of your ideas are socially constructed, and not inherently universally applicable.

 

Were men denied passage of semen (or sex) in the ancient days by the women unless they did something pleasing or fulfilled the woman's desire first?

 

Well in the "ancient days", men kind of did this thing where they took what they wanted, woman's pleasure be damned. If a guy or a country had a woman you wanted, you killed the guy or invaded the country and took the woman. Or you at least tried in the process. Or you got nothing.

 

The issues we have now in our society are rather unique. We have "civilized" rules- I can't just kick down my neighbor's door, cut him down, rape his girlfriend, and then invoke the "might is right" clause in court. Women are people too. As such, you gotta play this game where you are attractive to a woman where she consents to you. And women have to play this game where they attract the attention of the guy they want, because many women still see it as a world where the guy has to make the move. Some women have gotten the brilliant idea that, whoa, they don't have to wait for the guy to make the first move! But culturally, I think that while people realize that's an opportunity, they don't really go through with it.

 

But then you could go even more ancient, and look at the matriarchal societies, before the invasion of all the paternalistic ideas and whatnot. And I have no idea how those worked, but somehow I get the feeling that women weren't invading countries because they're supply of men was declining I also don't think that they were telling their men to force their sex energy upwards, but I'm not an ancient, matriarchal historian. Taomeow seems to know a bit about cultures prior to the invasion of patriarchal cultures and religion, so maybe she can shed some light on that.

 

 

 

Bottom line: You have to realize that pretty much everything you are asking and have asked are about rules that are entirely constructed in society by people, intentionally or not. Despite being pitched as such, none of them are universal truths. If you choose to live life by those rules, that's on you. If you feel you MUST retain and sublimate your pent up sexual frustrations towards art or whatever, be my guest. Just realize that, even now, other cultures do not necessarily abide by that.

Edited June 1, 2011 by Sloppy Zhang

[deci belle]

"Grafting" (sexual) vitality for refining energy through concentration exercises was developed through magic practices in parts of Asia and other parts of the subcontinent, then developed in the southern sect of Complete Reality taoism for the purpose of aiding elderly practitioners. Energy still has to be refined into spirit and steps beyond by clarification of mind in order to interrupt conditioned consciousness.

 

You have no need for this type of practice at your age. Forget it. Just get on with the real deal and refine mind. Sounds fun though, don't it!!! haha!

[Birch]

"Grafting" (sexual) vitality for refining energy through concentration exercises was developed through magic practices in parts of Asia and other parts of the subcontinent, then developed in the southern sect of Complete Reality taoism for the purpose of aiding elderly practitioners. Energy still has to be refined into spirit and steps beyond by clarification of mind in order to interrupt conditioned consciousness.

 

You have no need for this type of practice at your age. Forget it. Just get on with the real deal and refine mind. Sounds fun though, don't it!!! haha!

 

Fun for who?

 

So why do so many people seem to be getting taught the turbo-charged stuff if it's not useful at their age? Is this a symptom of our own "sexed-up" culture (which I happen to find repressive for some reason but I digress), something else?

[Sloppy Zhang]

Fun for who?

 

So why do so many people seem to be getting taught the turbo-charged stuff if it's not useful at their age? Is this a symptom of our own "sexed-up" culture (which I happen to find repressive for some reason but I digress), something else?

 

From what I've seen, some people just want to get super energized super quickly....

 

And at the same time, be able to masturbate or have sex as much as they want but still be considered "spiritual".

 

 

And as to your digression, I find the culture to be a tad bit hypocritical. Things are hyper-sexualized, but it's only okay if it's in the form of a movie, tv, or music video. If you actually act out something like that, hoo boy, what a no-no. If you do, you keep it behind very, VERY closed doors. You know, because an upstanding politician or businessman can't have sex with his wife. Of course he does, or else where do the kids come from? But everyone is sure that it's only on birthdays and Christmas, and only for approximately 6-8 minutes, and only in the missionary position, of course. Any other position is for hookers and porn stars.

 

Edited June 2, 2011 by Sloppy Zhang

[mjjbecker]

This sort of thing was mentioned in some threads a while back (The 'Tantric Mongoose' stuff).

 

http://www.sashacobra.com/Sasha_Cobra/About_The_Work.html

 

Just occurred to me it might be useful for 'Non', given the issues he has raised.

[henro]

is there a way to bypass the need to always retain semen to be able to spiritually progress or even physically progress?

 

I feel like all my abilities are shot if I ever lose it.. except for example it was "lost" with a woman that could just probably make up for the loss.

 

 

At your age you don't need to worry about. Any energy you expend through orgasm will be replaced very quickly. Check out Dan Reid's "The Tao of Health, Sex, and Longevity".

 

From what I've seen here and on other forums so many people want to jump into the sexual stuff before they've sorted out the basics. Get into a regular practice with a good, qualified teacher - get your emotional, spiritual, and physical life regulated then move on to the more advanced stuff. And seriously, how many posts do we need to see with people injuring themselves after learning these practices from a book. This is one of the reasons they were secret for so long.

 

A very wise teacher in China told me not everyone is meant to be a monk, or celibate. You have to find the practice that makes sense for you, your constitution, and your lifestyle.

Edited June 8, 2011 by robmix

[ChiDragon]

At your age you don't need to worry about. Any energy you expend through orgasm will be replaced very quickly. Check out Dan Reid's "The Tao of Health, Sex, and Longevity".

 

From what I've seen here and on other forums so many people want to jump into the sexual stuff before they've sorted out the basics. Get into a regular practice with a good, qualified teacher - get your emotional, spiritual, and physical life regulated then move on to the more advanced stuff. And seriously, how many posts do we need to see with people injuring themselves after learning these practices from a book. This is one of the reasons they were secret for so long.

 

A very wise teacher in China told me not everyone is meant to be a monk, or celibate. You have to find the practice that makes sense for you, your constitution, and your lifestyle.

 

Non...

I am totally agree with robmix.

 

"And seriously, how many posts do we need to see with people injuring themselves after learning these practices from a book. This is one of the reasons they were secret for so long."

 

What you are doing is jumping the gun. What you are now is just an ordinary person without and practice of Chi Kung. Do you know that you must practice many years of Chi Kung to build up your libido and perform sex without hurting yourself...??? Reading something from a book and start practicing some unknown method which you are not ready for and unfamiliar with is very dangerous to your health.

Edited June 8, 2011 by ChiDragon

[2souls]

is there a way to bypass the need to always retain semen to be able to spiritually progress or even physically progress?

 

I feel like all my abilities are shot if I ever lose it.. except for example it was "lost" with a woman that could just probably make up for the loss.

 

But what'ws the evolutionary purpose of needing to relying on the witheld sexual energy to provide motivation towards progress in the physical or spiritual?

 

What's the evolutionary foundation for this?

 

Were men denied passage of semen (or sex) in the ancient days by the women unless they did something pleasing or fulfilled the woman's desire first? Is this the reason we have come to rely on the semen (or sexual energy) to provide the drive to succeed?

 

Were the men denied creativity or rights unless they had fulfilled a slavemenship duty and then coupled it with a split in sexuality to mate?

 

I mean.. to constantly have a burning sensation reminding us "do your work".

 

Do we require the burning sensation of repressed sexuality to drive us toward seeking in life?

 

Well its a good question, I wanted you to know that almost all schools of tao call for a measure of semen retention.. NOT absolute rejection of ejaculation or orgasm. Just a mere preservation of some to restore strength and vitality. After that few weeks of shoring up... then set a schedule according to your health and age. However if you are still in your twenties? then don't worry for a decade or so. Then you will see the reason for all this.

 

What you can learn is to draw in the sperm energy when its not needed.. say in the a.m before work and allow it to flourish at night with a femme. All day, women can sense you are a bit more "aware of them" than most men, but that is a healthy recognition of our dedication to ourself and loved ones.

 

The question of a woman is yes!! its not only our pyschological health/need to please them, its also a part of our spiritual path as men.

When we learn to withhold ejaculation we give the woman enough time to orgasm and therefore feel more connected to us, we also absorb her essence or fluid through our paper thin skin on our penis which is very healing once we become aware of it. When a woman is regularly sexually fullfilled they have a bit of an evolutionary response to return to us...almost a surrender to their own desire.. and therefore complete the cycle of yin and yang being in balance.

 

PSA>>> I know this is a very simplified version intended to give the basics to him..intended for the 99% of men who at some point(mid 30's) struggle with a real place in a real woman's life.. obviously not for those who seek a monastic lifestyle in seclusion of a cave in tibet..

[C T]

is there a way to bypass the need to always retain semen to be able to spiritually progress or even physically progress?

 

 

Do we require the burning sensation of repressed sexuality to drive us toward seeking in life?

Hi Non,

 

The idea is not to bypass or repress needs, but to use them to your advantage, as bases which could lead to transforming the negative aspects of whatever arises within the realm of the senses into their positive equivalent. Buddhist tantra is very effective in this regard. But you are free to decide which road you want to take, but i would suggest that you do not go it alone.

 

To begin mastery, its best you come to a decision on which path you want to use in order to gain full understanding of how needs can be used as means to propel you forward or upward in matters of the spirit.

 

Some paths are more detailed than others, in that they provide actual maps which are systematically laid out, so that you do not have to rely on figuring things out on your own. If you are serious about spiritual development that is guided and backed up by a proven lineage of masters, which means that whatever doubts you have will be addressed not by the subjective interpretations of individuals who claim to be teachers, but by a provision of actual principles and data that will show you that if you do this, you will get that, and when you do that, you will get to that, and so on. Further to this, you will understand why certain practices can only be done after doing a lot of preliminary preparations, and you will be given guidance accordingly. The room for error is made smaller so your chances of getting somewhere become enhanced.

 

Just as an example, in Vajrayana tantric schools, if you are given a practice that includes channelling your sexual energy, first you will be given a teaching that will outline the practice step by step so that you will get a conceptual understanding of what this practice is for, how it works, and what are the pitfalls to avoid. You might be asked to stabilize this conceptually for a period, during which time you can attend certain guided sessions relating to the practice, where you can clarify doubts, exchange notes with other practitioners, hear about experiences of those who have actually begun practice proper... and then when most, if not all doubts have all been addressed, you will have arrived then at the point where you are mentally convinced that whatever follows on after the conceptual phase, in the actual path of the practical applicative tools given to you, that these will yield the necessary results.

 

This will result in a quicker and surer realization, rather that the common thing happening nowadays where participants attend a 3 day course, given materials, dance around a bit, raise a bit of energy, get a few demos, and bam! they call you a member of their school. Then, armed with these puny tools and with a hug and a pat on the back, you are 'formally' requested to hold your head up high, that you have 'graduated', which implies then that you are expected to put what you have 'mastered' in the 3 days to design the rest of your life henceforth. Naturally, these words have been dramatized a bit, but basically, i hope you get the idea of what is being said here.

 

In relation to sexual energy cultivation in Buddhist tantra, on the conceptual level, it is said that there are 2 major paths of training. This is just a tiny elaboration to support what has been mentioned at the top para.

 

These two major paths belong to the outer tantras made up of Mahayoga and Anuyoga.

 

Specifically the 2 major paths mentioned here belong to Anuyoga. Path (1) is the path of skillful means, a training which aims to help the student generate and stabilize innate wisdom, the changeless great bliss, as its known in this tradition. One can do this by means either of the upper entrances, where one works on the 4 or 6 chakras of the body, which brings you to the fruit gradually, or by means of working with the lower entrance, which is union with consort (sexual practice, but not necessarily involving a partner), which brings fruition of innate wisdom instantly.

 

The second path (2) is known as the path of liberation. Again, there are two aspects here. Meditation on the meaning, which requires contemplation on suchness, the ultimate nature that is free of any mental fabrications, and also free of mental conceptualizations. (formless)

 

The other aspect of the training is called meditation on the signs or characteristics (forms). Here the student generate visualizations and one-pointed focus on the various deities and mandalas, while also working the pranic channels with mantra recitations. Upon stabilizing this, the mere utterance or recollection of the deity, or of chanting the mantras, one sees the world and its beings as the mandala of the various buddhas. From here, the student can relate whatever happens in the 'outside' world to the perfected settings of the 'inner' world of the mandala, and this is where all the transformation occur, within the pure environment of the mandala.

 

From the outer tantras one progresses on to the inner tantra, which is called Atiyoga, or Heart Essence Yoga. Here again there is a gradation process from basic practices (outer development) leading up to advanced practices (inner development).

 

The above is only a very brief outline which i have included just to give you a taste of what true cultivation involves as far as genuine traditional Buddhist yogic paths go. Its approach is never haphazard at all, and at the early stages, because it requires a lot of time to ground the practice, not many are dedicated enough, nor have the karmic connection, so to speak, to carry the practice thru to the completion stages. Pity, because the rewards, i am told, are immense.

 

Hope this helps a bit. Best to you.

Edited June 8, 2011 by CowTao

[2souls]

Fun for who?

 

So why do so many people seem to be getting taught the turbo-charged stuff if it's not useful at their age? Is this a symptom of our own "sexed-up" culture (which I happen to find repressive for some reason but I digress), something else?

 

 

Yeah, using sex to sell everthing is repressive and depressing. The "turbo stuff" is a quick way to become aware of energy. Most men expel their simpliest source every day or so when young and don't feel the draining effect till their mid-late thirties, Thats when it helps us become stronger, happier, more sensual and confident, if more men in their 40's and 50's did this they could save alot without a need for viagra. The clearing out of old emotional crap is an effect of lots of qi also, that means an emotionally balanced man. With control of sexual energy men appreciate a beautiful woman but are not overwhelmed by her. Its not the same for females, I think God likes you folks a little more, dammit, Ha.

Edited June 8, 2011 by 2souls

[Harmonious Emptiness]

Yeah, using sex to sell everthing is repressive and depressing. The "turbo stuff" is a quick way to become aware of energy. Most men expel their simpliest source every day or so when young and don't feel the draining effect till their mid-late thirties, Thats when it helps us become stronger, happier, more sensual and confident, if more men in their 40's and 50's did this they could save alot without a need for viagra. The clearing out of old emotional crap is an effect of lots of qi also, that means an emotionally balanced man. With control of sexual energy men appreciate a beautiful woman but are not overwhelmed by her. Its not the same for females, I think God likes you folks a little more, dammit, Ha.

 

ha, yes (to the top portion). There was an article in a free daily Montreal newspaper (24 hour) they hand out in front of the subways every morning in Montreal, about 3 weeks ago: the title (in french) was "Did you say injaculation?" It was basically saying men can have multiple orgasms according to this Taoist system which leads to longer life. It referenced Mantak Chia and some other Tantric book.

 

I had mixed opinions about it, since they would have to sell the idea to the masses and the advertisers with SEX, but it still brought the idea out there, so maybe some people will get turned on to a more spiritual consciousness.

 

On the other hand, well, I'm sure I don't need to preach to the choir on that side..