Kill your self...importance :)

[InfinityTruth]

I was thinking about how there's always someone you see as below you and someone you see as above you.

 

I started feeling bad for the poor people I see as below me. Like wtf do I have to think like that, and what makes that so true?

 

Then I realized that it's easy to kill the image you hold of yourself. It isn't true one way or another anyway. You just have to think of yourself as low importance. Like you are complete shit. There's nothing special about you. That sounds absolutely horrible. lol.

 

The beauty about this though is that now you have nothing you have to defend or suffer from. Why suffer from an illusion anyway?

 

You are completely free to be yourself.

 

EDIT: Beware. This is not self pity, or beating the hell out of your self needlessly. It's just like humbling yourself when you feel too important.

Edited June 16, 2011 by InfinityTruth

[Jetsun]

I'm not sure it helps anyone to think of yourself as lower than anyone else, from what I can see most people who think like that end up embittered and downtrodden and those people are usually more potentially dangerous and destructive than the average guy. Each person has the potential for immense power and the mind of a Buddha, so maybe all this lowering yourself is just another trick of those who wish to control you and trick you into thinking you are a sheep when in reality you are more like a lion.

[宁]

Sheesh!! stop the killing already, enough blood has been spilled, first the Buddha, now self importance... i wonder who's next?? the Easter Bunny??

 

Point is, things need transformation, not destruction.

 

Ego (which is root of self importance) really dies in one of two instances: either when sanity or the body itself dissolves. Roumor has it it stays with the Buddha also..

[Marblehead]

Nope. We don't need to kill anything. Not even the ego. And I agree that we need not belittle ourself either. We are what we are - a manifestation of Tao, just as all other things are.

 

But yes, we should lessen our ego and our desires. This allows us to more easily find that elusive 'peace and contentment'.

[Everything]

Nope. We don't need to kill anything. Not even the ego. And I agree that we need not belittle ourself either. We are what we are - a manifestation of Tao, just as all other things are.

 

But yes, we should lessen our ego and our desires. This allows us to more easily find that elusive 'peace and contentment'.

I agree on this.

 

When memory defines who you are, you live an ilusion. Deal with the Past by attending the present. We're a new person every second, our memories do not contain the experience that can be drawn from infinitely. Analyze your past by seeking where it effects your present negatively or positively.

 

No matter how many bad side effects our memories or our past hast has got on us, it cannot easily be killed. You must come in turns with it(am i saying that correctly?). Simply lessen its grasp on us by not dwelling in the past, because in the end most of the past is an illusion.

 

Untill the day your memory is gone, you'll have to make huge efforts to live in the present only in order to live beyond your memories or thoughts of he future. You will find that most of your day goes wasted to dwelling. There has been discovered a new type of memory in science, one that goes beyond your regular memory, it is the memory that cannot be taken away or changed. A subconscous kind of memorythat is all over your brain. Like the memory of riding a bike, even amnesia patients have these memories, but they can't recall them neither necome aware of them. We call this wisdom.

 

Why not kill memory? It will eventually ebb away when your wisdom is mature enough. Eventually you wont need it to live anymore. But it will never be completely gone. I don't suggest you develop amnesia. You can live in the present. This way you natueally cannot dwell in the past or future and your memory or ego naturally has no power over you

Edited June 16, 2011 by Everything

[doc benway]

I was thinking about how there's always someone you see as below you and someone you see as above you.

 

I started feeling bad for the poor people I see as below me. Like wtf do I have to think like that, and what makes that so true?

 

Then I realized that it's easy to kill the image you hold of yourself. It isn't true one way or another anyway. You just have to think of yourself as low importance. Like you are complete shit. There's nothing special about you. That sounds absolutely horrible. lol.

 

The beauty about this though is that now you have nothing you have to defend or suffer from. Why suffer from an illusion anyway?

 

You are completely free to be yourself.

 

EDIT: Beware. This is not self pity, or beating the hell out of your self needlessly. It's just like humbling yourself when you feel too important.

I get what you are saying. Another way to look at it is that you (meaning the image created of yourself and how it relates to others) dies as you begin to wake up to the inherent inter-connectedness of everyone and everything. We are all different expressions or appendages of one living universe, better or worse is just a creation of our mind. Dao treats all things with equal lack of concern.

 

 

Sheesh!! stop the killing already, enough blood has been spilled, first the Buddha, now self importance... i wonder who's next?? the Easter Bunny??

 

Point is, things need transformation, not destruction.

 

Ego (which is root of self importance) really dies in one of two instances: either when sanity or the body itself dissolves. Roumor has it it stays with the Buddha also..

New Flash:

THERE IS NO EASTER BUNNY!

[de_paradise]

I was thinking about how there's always someone you see as below you and someone you see as above you.

 

I started feeling bad for the poor people I see as below me. Like wtf do I have to think like that, and what makes that so true?

 

Then I realized that it's easy to kill the image you hold of yourself. It isn't true one way or another anyway. You just have to think of yourself as low importance. Like you are complete shit. There's nothing special about you. That sounds absolutely horrible. lol.

 

The beauty about this though is that now you have nothing you have to defend or suffer from. Why suffer from an illusion anyway?

 

You are completely free to be yourself.

 

EDIT: Beware. This is not self pity, or beating the hell out of your self needlessly. It's just like humbling yourself when you feel too important.

 

This method works, I've used similar. Its straight out of Buddhism to apply the opposite feeling to neutralize a kind of unconscious ego habit. I think this type of method is useful in a society where we are all raised to chase importance, make a mark, be one up, be someone above one's peers. So, walking down the street making judgements and criticisms of others, because it validates the way we are, and how they are not. This is a very pernicious habit and can be neutralized when you catch yourself doing this. Its pretty subtle sometimes, glances, assumptions underneath gestures. When you apply the antidote wisely, you can feel a shift in your energy, like going WITH the river and not against it.

Edited June 16, 2011 by de_paradise

[Otis]

I was thinking about how there's always someone you see as below you and someone you see as above you.

 

I started feeling bad for the poor people I see as below me. Like wtf do I have to think like that, and what makes that so true?

 

Then I realized that it's easy to kill the image you hold of yourself. It isn't true one way or another anyway. You just have to think of yourself as low importance. Like you are complete shit. There's nothing special about you. That sounds absolutely horrible. lol.

 

The beauty about this though is that now you have nothing you have to defend or suffer from. Why suffer from an illusion anyway?

 

You are completely free to be yourself.

This is a beautiful realization, InfinityTruth.

 

This is how it occurred to me:

 

The belief in human hierarchy is just a myth, nothing more. When I look closely at it, I realize there is no substantial reason to believe that any other person is worth more or less than I am. There is no objective yardstick. It is just my bias that keeps the myth alive.

 

Whenever I see anyone else as lower than me, then I automatically buy into that myth of hierarchy. Without the myth, then there is no one lower.

 

And as soon as I buy into the myth of hierarchy, then I also make myself lower than others. Because, in every single possible trait or measurement, I can always find someone else, who does it better.

 

So as long as I put myself above, then I also put myself below. The only way to get out of hierarchy, is to let go of the need to be above, to stop getting my rewards by being superior. And that means, too, of course, to learn to stop being afraid of being seen as lower.

 

I completely agree with your statement "kill the self-image". After all, there's no real violence there, because it's not a living thing, just an image. Self-image is just an addictive story, that warps everything that comes in, or goes out.

[stan herman]

This is a beautiful realization, InfinityTruth.

 

This is how it occurred to me:

 

The belief in human hierarchy is just a myth, nothing more. When I look closely at it, I realize there is no substantial reason to believe that any other person is worth more or less than I am. There is no objective yardstick. It is just my bias that keeps the myth alive.

 

Whenever I see anyone else as lower than me, then I automatically buy into that myth of hierarchy. Without the myth, then there is no one lower.

 

And as soon as I buy into the myth of hierarchy, then I also make myself lower than others. Because, in every single possible trait or measurement, I can always find someone else, who does it better.

 

So as long as I put myself above, then I also put myself below. The only way to get out of hierarchy, is to let go of the need to be above, to stop getting my rewards by being superior. And that means, too, of course, to learn to stop being afraid of being seen as lower.

 

I completely agree with your statement "kill the self-image". After all, there's no real violence there, because it's not a living thing, just an image. Self-image is just an addictive story, that warps everything that comes in, or goes out.

 

What I find most useful is a SENSE OF HUMOR--applied to yourself and your doings. I don't find it very useful to deny hierarchies--they exist and in day-to-day life they're important. There are also differences in 'intelligence' and 'competence' among people--no sense in denying that either. Somebody said (may have been Lincoln) that We are all ignorant--only on different subjects. Seems to me that's true about competencies as well.

 

Getting rid of my ego is hard, hard, hard, to do. Learning to notice what it does without chastising it is easier, and then eventually watching it do its number and smiling at it tolerantly I find works nicely in softening and relaxing it so it's easier for me to let go of its habits--at least those that don't serve me well. BUT, let me be clear there are some pieces of my ego I dearly love, and I'm damned if I have any intention of giving those up until it's time for my transfer out

[gendao]

The belief in human hierarchy is just a myth, nothing more. When I look closely at it, I realize there is no substantial reason to believe that any other person is worth more or less than I am. There is no objective yardstick. It is just my bias that keeps the myth alive.

Hierarchies reveal one's own prejudices.

 

Someone who uses materialism as their primary metric for self-worth will see poor hood rats and monks as lower than themselves. They simply cannot fathom the possiblity that anyone else would willingly choose to pursue other less-lucrative routes in life as more personally rewarding.

 

Whereas, a hood rat using swagger and manhood as his metric might actually view those same rich yuppies as inferior squares, instead.

 

This is why it is flawed to try to artificially equalize everyone per any single metric (like socioeconomic, etc) as a political agenda. Because the fact is, different people prioritize different metrics differently and make different choices accordingly in their lives. And who are others to look down upon them for that?

 

Maybe a street busker with 5 kids might be happier than an accountant driving an SUV. Who's to say??

[Marblehead]

BUT, let me be clear there are some pieces of my ego I dearly love, and I'm damned if I have any intention of giving those up until it's time for my transfer out

 

Amen! to that!

[Dainin]

 

New Flash:

THERE IS NO EASTER BUNNY!

 

 

Damn it Steve, could you at least put in a spoiler alert if you're going to post things like this!

[Aaron]

I was thinking about how there's always someone you see as below you and someone you see as above you.

 

I started feeling bad for the poor people I see as below me. Like wtf do I have to think like that, and what makes that so true?

 

Then I realized that it's easy to kill the image you hold of yourself. It isn't true one way or another anyway. You just have to think of yourself as low importance. Like you are complete shit. There's nothing special about you. That sounds absolutely horrible. lol.

 

The beauty about this though is that now you have nothing you have to defend or suffer from. Why suffer from an illusion anyway?

 

You are completely free to be yourself.

 

EDIT: Beware. This is not self pity, or beating the hell out of your self needlessly. It's just like humbling yourself when you feel too important.

 

 

I think that you were half way there, but you went over the line... the line of course is that you see yourself as no better, nor worse, than anyone else. I think it's from this knowledge that true compassion can arise.

 

Aaron

Edited June 17, 2011 by Twinner

[manitou]

Funny - don Juan Mateus repeated told Carlos Castaneda over and over during the series of books to get rid of his self importance to get to the place of the shaman.

[Birch]

I get what you are saying. Another way to look at it is that you (meaning the image created of yourself and how it relates to others) dies as you begin to wake up to the inherent inter-connectedness of everyone and everything. We are all different expressions or appendages of one living universe, better or worse is just a creation of our mind. Dao treats all things with equal lack of concern.

 

 

 

New Flash:

THERE IS NO EASTER BUNNY!

 

 

What's this then?

 

Added link http://curiousnewyork.blogspot.com/2011_04_01_archive.html interesting!

Edited June 17, 2011 by -K-

[Otis]

What I find most useful is a SENSE OF HUMOR--applied to yourself and your doings. I don't find it very useful to deny hierarchies--they exist and in day-to-day life they're important. There are also differences in 'intelligence' and 'competence' among people--no sense in denying that either. Somebody said (may have been Lincoln) that We are all ignorant--only on different subjects. Seems to me that's true about competencies as well.

Exactly (on the "we are all ignorant"). That's why I'm not too keen on judging intelligence in others. There are areas in which I think of myself as smart, but there are other areas in which I'm downright stupid. Can Bill Gates change his radiator? Can Stephen Hawking get a woman's heart to melt? Can Jackie Chan do stand-up? I think it's easy for us to favor our own kind of intelligence, whereas there seem to be an infinite variety of forms of intelligence. So I'd rather just not get involved in the calculation.

[InfinityTruth]

What's this then?

 

Added link http://curiousnewyork.blogspot.com/2011_04_01_archive.html interesting!

 

That's a girl bunny, the easter bunny is a boy

[stan herman]

Funny - don Juan Mateus repeated told Carlos Castaneda over and over during the series of books to get rid of his self importance to get to the place of the shaman.

 

Yes indeed, and it's important to notice the context in which he kept saying it. If I remember correctly, it was NOT to comfort Carlos and reassure him that he was as good as other people. Quite the contrary, it was to tell him to quit feeling sorry for himself and blaming others for his difficulties. Don Juan and his old buddy (can't recall his name) used a lot of humor to make their points.

[Non]

Well killing your self-importance...

 

it's about in what context you take it.

 

Obviously the better way to Rid of your self importance is through selflessness. nothing more nothing less (what else is there anyway?)

 

but to add the context of "murder" and "suicide" and other "negative connotations" is unnecessary and in fact may hinder progress. Trying to force it in such a way is also risky.

 

It's better to just practice selfless-cultivation methods rather than to try and "break" yourself. Breaking yourself has the attachment of negative emotions,a nd is still ego centered. It might be one way.

 

Like meditating on a mantra until the point of exhaustion that your mind quiets.. instead though you attach negative emotions which can also cause traumas on the way and other nuisances.

 

I dislike when poeple try to "force" you into selflessness by trying to break you.... and for what? domination?

 

Some people just don't have it in them to deal with that, or they don't have the temperament for that way.

Edited June 21, 2011 by Non

[Otis]

Well killing your self-importance...

 

it's about in what context you take it.

 

Obviously the better way to Rid of your self importance is through selflessness. nothing more nothing less (what else is there anyway?)

 

but to add the context of "murder" and "suicide" and other "negative connotations" is unnecessary and in fact may hinder progress. Trying to force it in such a way is also risky.

 

It's better to just practice selfless-cultivation methods rather than to try and "break" yourself. Breaking yourself has the attachment of negative emotions,a nd is still ego centered. It might be one way.

 

Like meditating on a mantra until the point of exhaustion that your mind quiets.. instead though you attach negative emotions which can also cause traumas on the way and other nuisances.

 

I dislike when poeple try to "force" you into selflessness by trying to break you.... and for what? domination?

 

Some people just don't have it in them to deal with that, or they don't have the temperament for that way.

I agree that verbs like "kill", when applied to the ego, imply a form of violence that seems counter-productive. After all, since I am my ego, how in the world am "I" supposed to kill that ego (short of actual suicide)? When it comes to self, I'd rather forget and surrender.

 

Nor would I want someone else forcing my system to break, nor would I want to force someone else.

 

That said, I do think a certain amount of ruthlessness towards my self, is worthwhile. When it comes to something like my self-importance (which is just a foundation of my ego, but not the "I" itself), then there's no need to be nice to it, because my self-importance does not feel. It's just a bunch of stories, that cover up pain. It's only the source of the pain that I need to be kind to.

 

Of course, I don't see a use in berating myself, whenever I catch myself being self-important; that's just creating more internal schism between me and me. I have to be willing to forgive myself, whenever I fall back into the old habits. (Forgiving myself is just the same as not giving in to the habit/temptation to be angry at myself). Chasing myself is just a fool's delusion; who's chasing whom?

 

But I do feel called to hold on to none of the self-importance, eschewing all self-stories, positive or negative. Self-importance has been somewhat useful on my path, helping me get started in my practice by magnifying my achievements. But it's time is done. My path calls me to move forward, without fear, but with no bravado either. To be a student of life, not a master, as much as possible, from here on out.

Edited June 21, 2011 by Otis

[InfinityTruth]

I agree that verbs like "kill", when applied to the ego, imply a form of violence that seems counter-productive.

 

**sighs** Did no one understand my joke in this thread title? And why do people keep taking me literally. ffs, I said "Kill yourself...importance." The ellipses is there to change the meaning of the whole title. I could have just said, "Kill your self importance," but that wouldn't have been a joke and not nearly as interesting a thread title.

 

You're completely missing the point of this thread if you're worried about metaphorical violence toward the ego, lol.

 

Not to pick on this quote, I've just seen a couple people complain about that.