The more I observe this group, slowly, I've grown to admire them

[InfinityTruth]

Not because I like their hateful message (God no) or agree with it, but because they have the courage to keep going on while the world bombs them, and attacks them and criticizes them endlessly. Ultimately flipping the world the middle finger and continuing with their thing, despite a huge amount of pressure to stop. They really are good at not breaking mentally, and must really believe in what they preach. I notice they have the bible practically memorized.

What's the difference if they protest at a funeral? Is it really that disrespectful? If no one fed the troll the troll would starve.

Maybe I just like taking the opposite opinion of the majority. The more I listen to people attack this family the more it sickens me, and sounds more and more like a drone-like opinion that allows them to keep doing what they do. If there were no fight they couldn't have a mission.

They aren't bad people. They just have an out of balance belief system that makes them behave in less loving ways. Take away the beliefs and really it's the beliefs that person held that you hated. Not the person.

The ones who are the hardest to love need it the most. Edited July 13, 2011 by InfinityTruth

[Marblehead]

What's the difference if they protest at a funeral? Is it really that disrespectful?

 

Yes, it is disrespectful. A funeral is a private affair and no one invited them. I have no problem passing judgement on this action.

 

If they only acted in accordance with their Ten Commandments I doubt that there would be many who would speak out against them. By being out of accordance they reap what they sow.

 

Other than that I have no problem that they have the belief they have. I just will not allow them to tell me what I have to believe and this is one of the things they try to do.

[Aetherous]

What's the difference if they protest at a funeral? Is it really that disrespectful?

 

It really is. Especially when the protesting involves them saying the deceased are going to hell.

 

I have no respect for the group. None.

 

That's me putting it lightly.

[Mahberry]

Yea, it's powerful how a concept and an unwavering belief can give people such tenacity.

 

Someone smart please deconstruct their belief systems as to why they can take so much abuse and keep going. It'd make a very fascinating read.

[goldisheavy]

These people are slime. It's one thing to withstand the shit the world throws at you, and it's another thing to throw your personal shit at the world in a manner that is completely unethical and inconsiderate. These people don't just post on some forum. They physically disrupt people's lives in their face. They're one step short of violence. In fact, if these same people were Muslims, they'd be setting off bombs with that kind of attitude, I guarantee it. It's lucky these fundies happen to be Christian. They probably have what Christ said about loving thy enemy on the back of their minds to moderate them at least somewhat.

[Teddy]

I don't want to give these people free publicity. If you agree then don't add anything else to this topic.

[thelerner]

 

 

What's the difference if they protest at a funeral? Is it really that disrespectful? If no one fed the troll the troll would starve.

 

 

They aren't bad people. They just have an out of balance belief system that makes them behave in less loving ways. Take away the beliefs and really it's the beliefs that person held that you hated. Not the person.

 

The ones who are the hardest to love need it the most.

 

Yes its disrespectful and exceedingly cruel, verging on evil in my opinion. Imagine if your son, daughter or parent were killed and they came to the funeral with signs celebrating. I've looked at some Utubes of there services and IMO (not so humble) they seem to be bad people.

 

There are passive beliefs and active ones. Sometimes you don't like people for there actions; and actions to me speak louder then words. You could be a rascist, and if you don't make waves, shout it, or express it, I'm all for being civil, polite and finding middle grounds with you. But if a person or group is actively sowing hate, thats another level & I will not be polite or civil.

 

I really don't think they're asking people for love. I don't think they want it nor do I think giving it would change them a whit. I wouldn't waste my time on them, unless it was reverse psychology to piss them off. Give'em a great big hug cause that would give them the Willies. Again that would be Me being Cruel(& having fun), not out misplaced compassion.

 

my 2 cents

 

I am rarely mistaken for a saint (though it has happened..)

[doc benway]

... they have the courage to keep going on ...

 

What's the difference if they protest at a funeral? Is it really that disrespectful?

 

..... The more I listen to people attack this family the more it sickens me, and sounds more and more like a drone-like opinion that allows them to keep doing what they do. If there were no fight they couldn't have a mission.

 

They aren't bad people. They just have an out of balance belief system that makes them behave in less loving ways. Take away the beliefs and really it's the beliefs that person held that you hated. Not the person.

 

The ones who are the hardest to love need it the most.

They have the courage of the brain-washed fanatic who would "martyr" him/herself for their religious beliefs - I don't respect that type of courage. I respect the type of courage that can tolerate differences.

 

At a funeral, they are viciously attacking the bereaved family of strangers, when they are at their most vulnerable.

They are making very hurtful accusations simply for media attention. Not only is it disrespectful, it is reprehensible.

 

I don't understand why this family doesn't sicken you and yet their critics do. That might be worth thinking about.

 

I believe that they are bad people. They are attacking innocent family members who are trying to mourn their loved ones for no reason but a forum for their fundamentalist fanaticism.

 

They don't need love, they need reprogramming.

 

 

You should watch the youtube video in which one of the members rants for a while. This is Jonestown type stuff.

Where is all the Kool Aid when you need it?

[gendao]

Well, I can admire the integrity to stand for your principles against all popular peer pressure, groupthink & herd mentality.

 

But not "forcing" your beliefs upon others...especially in deeply personal events.

 

So, a mixed review from me, lol..

 

That said, who's to say Fred Phelps might not be some sort of Hegelian plant continually used in varying roles?

 

He apparently has been a lifelong self-conflicted activist of all sorts ranging from a pro-Black/woman civil rights attorney who was later disbarred for verbally-abusing a woman, a Saddam Hussein fanboi who later claimed he was in Hell, a longtime Democrat who recently turned against them as well, etc etc.

 

Obviously, the guy's very flip-floppy & a little nuts. The only question is if he is getting paid to act nuts, or is nuts all on his very own?

Edited July 13, 2011 by vortex

[Marblehead]

The only question is if he is getting paid to act nuts, or is nuts all on his very own?

 

Of course he is getting paid for it. Likely half of all the money donated to 'the cause' goes directly into his pockets.

 

No, he is not nuts. He is taking advantage of the weaknesses of the blind.

[gendao]

Of course he is getting paid for it. Likely half of all the money donated to 'the cause' goes directly into his pockets.

 

No, he is not nuts. He is taking advantage of the weaknesses of the blind.

Lol true...I wonder how many donations he really gets though?

 

But I think I figured out his MO.. He constantly craves controversy against the mainstream. During segregation, he fought for their civil rights (and women). When these were no longer hot topics...then he had to find something else. So, during the Bush years, he supported Saddam Hussein. Then as Democrats took power, he turned against them now. And as Gay Pride has gone mainstream, he is publically opposing that. So, that's his common denominator here. He doesn't truly care about any of these issues...only about opposing whatever the mainstream movement is at the time. That's the only psychological issue he really cares about.

Edited July 13, 2011 by vortex

[Marblehead]

Lol true...I wonder how many donations he really gets though?

 

But I think I figured out his MO.. He constantly craves controversy against the mainstream. During segregation, he fought for their civil rights (and women). When these were no longer hot topics...then he had to find something else. So, during the Bush years, he supported Saddam Hussein. Then as Democrats took power, he turned against them now. And as Gay Pride has gone mainstream, he is publically opposing that. So, that's his common denominator here. He doesn't truly care about any of these issues...only about opposing whatever the mainstream movement is at the time. That's the only psychological issue he really cares about.

 

I think you've got it. There will always be those opposed to something and most of them need a leader of some sort. He is providing the leadership. And you are right, doesn't matter the issue as long as he can gain followers to give him money.

[gendao]

^ Yes, and more specifically, he has a layered persecution complex.

 

He feels the need to "give voice" to those getting "persecuted" by a more powerful majority - and even get persecuted for that.

 

What this actually represents fractally is that he has inner "minority opinion" parts of himself without a voice that he persecutes. So, he desperately wants to give those parts enough voice to be heard (by himself) - and ultimately accepted.

 

But until he does the self-inquiry to resolve this within himself - he will merely keep repeating this same pattern outwardly, futilely jumping from issue to issue, out in the public eye...

 

 

 

Whew, this was a tougher one to crack due to the feedback loop. My brain hurts now, lol!

Edited July 14, 2011 by vortex

[Marblehead]

 

Whew, this was a tougher one to crack due to the feedback loop. My brain hurts now, lol!

 

Hehehe. I know what you mean. Going that deeply into another person's mind is quite a task.

 

There are people who get paid $80 and more an hour to do that. You get nothing. Hehehe.

 

Myself? I think it is just the money in the wallet. Oh well.

[Otis]

It is not a virtue to always think you're right. There's nothing admirable about that.

 

Hopefully, this group (and other fundamentalists) are a warning to the rest of us, not to be so entrenched in our beliefs, not to take ourselves so seriously, not to assume that people who think differently are necessarily wrong. Certainty is the vice of fascism and extremism.

[Sloppy Zhang]

You know you're in trouble when the KKK counter protests you!

[InfinityTruth]

It is not a virtue to always think you're right. There's nothing admirable about that.

 

Hopefully, this group (and other fundamentalists) are a warning to the rest of us, not to be so entrenched in our beliefs, not to take ourselves so seriously, not to assume that people who think differently are necessarily wrong. Certainty is the vice of fascism and extremism.

 

They're a good teaching of what NOT to be like. So uncompassionate. Even 'good' comes from what seems like the 'bad'. I still admire their ability to move forward despite everyone hating on them. I don't care what anyone says that is goddamn admirable, and most people wouldn't have a spine to do what they do. Even if it is for seemingly shitty causes, I admire it.

 

I also see a ton of humanity in them when they actually show their interests outside of 'christianity'. Morethan in the average person. Even though they always deny it afterwards. These people just have hateful beliefs. Beliefs, thoughts and so on are not the person.

 

If people are so insecure that they need this group's lovely perspective to tell them their relatives are in heaven, then they NEED to believe their relatives are in hell.

 

These people are already 'mentally' in hell. Why would you listen to them when they say your relative is in hell? I bet they would say that 99% of people are going to hell. I'm not worried about their opinion. If my mom died tomorrow, and I got a call from fred phelps saying that my mom was in hell, I would probably laugh at them.

[InfinityTruth]

You know you're in trouble when the KKK counter protests you!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. That's not that surprising to me though. Rednecks are really patriotic. What would be astonishing is if they showed up to a black funeral to defend a black dead guy. Show me that and I'll be amazed.

[Otis]

I still admire their ability to move forward despite everyone hating on them. I don't care what anyone says that is goddamn admirable, and most people wouldn't have a spine to do what they do. Even if it is for seemingly shitty causes, I admire it.

Of course, you could also be talking about terrorists, members of the Nazi Party, etc. I guess thinking one is superior to everyone else gives one bravery.

 

I'm much more impressed by someone whose bravery is fueled by love and/or the desire for peace, than by someone who is fueled by hate and bigotry.

 

For example, this link is to a video about my aunt and my late uncle, both peace activists. Uncle Art stepped in front of an Israeli tank, which was trying to destroy a Palestinian fruit market. Aunt Peggy has spent about half of the last several years in Iraq (including during the initial bombing), helped uncover Abu Ghraib, and was actually kidnapped for a couple days. She was released precisely because of the photo she had of Uncle Art, in front of the tank, which helped her kidnappers realize that although she was Christian, she was also a friend to Muslims. The video is all about that story.

 

Art, who was, of course, accused of being anti-semitic, actually went to synagogue every Saturday, as well as mosque every Friday and church, every Sunday. They were not against people, at all, just against the violence that institutions and beliefs bring about. These are people I admire.

Edited July 14, 2011 by Otis

[zerostao]

I'm much more impressed by someone whose bravery is fueled by love and/or the desire for peace, than by someone who is fueled by hate and bigotry.

 

i used to say that my hero was the one who without hope of heaven or fear of hell

still made the right(compassionate) choices.

the true path of the warrior is always peace.

[InfinityTruth]

 

Art, who was, of course, accused of being anti-semitic, actually went to synagogue every Saturday, as well as mosque every Friday and church, every Sunday. They were not against people, at all, just against the violence that institutions and beliefs bring about. These are people I admire.

 

I agree. Did he die from getting run over by a tank?

[Otis]

I agree. Did he die from getting run over by a tank?

No. I'm sure that's how he would have liked to have gone, but he died in a fire, back at home on his farm.

[billb]

They're a good teaching of what NOT to be like. So uncompassionate. Even 'good' comes from what seems like the 'bad'. I still admire their ability to move forward despite everyone hating on them. I don't care what anyone says that is goddamn admirable, and most people wouldn't have a spine to do what they do. Even if it is for seemingly shitty causes, I admire it.

 

I also see a ton of humanity in them when they actually show their interests outside of 'christianity'. Morethan in the average person. Even though they always deny it afterwards. These people just have hateful beliefs. Beliefs, thoughts and so on are not the person.

 

If people are so insecure that they need this group's lovely perspective to tell them their relatives are in heaven, then they NEED to believe their relatives are in hell.

 

These people are already 'mentally' in hell. Why would you listen to them when they say your relative is in hell? I bet they would say that 99% of people are going to hell. I'm not worried about their opinion. If my mom died tomorrow, and I got a call from fred phelps saying that my mom was in hell, I would probably laugh at them.

 

What you do not seem to realize is what you are admiring in them is really not hard for them at all and is in fact what fuels them. They absolutely crave this hatred and attention. That is why they go to funerals because the fuel they crave and need will be guaranteed. It is like a drug for them, can you not see this?

[InfinityTruth]

What you do not seem to realize is what you are admiring in them is really not hard for them at all and is in fact what fuels them. They absolutely crave this hatred and attention. That is why they go to funerals because the fuel they crave and need will be guaranteed. It is like a drug for them, can you not see this?

I see it now when it's put that way. Why would you give that to them though if that's what they want?

[thelerner]

I see it now when it's put that way. Why would you give that to them though if that's what they want?

 

I think most of us don't give them anything. Not even a thought, they're generally ignored. If they were in our face we'd (I'd) probably do something negative. I think only one person on the bums really cares anything about them.

Edited July 15, 2011 by thelerner