Kali Yuga Posted July 25, 2011 I was wondering.. what do you bums think is the most Taoist way to handle things considering sexual attraction? Lately, it just seems that it seems to be a problem of mine lately.. I find myself needlessly obsessing over attractive women, and the passions that are stirred up are difficult to put down.. and no matter how much i try to "go with the flow", it seems that its my sexuality is what is always causing disturbingly passionate emotions, that somewhat affect my peace of mind, causing my mind to linger on the past, or obsess over controlling the future. My last relationship ended rather sourly. My main squeeze was a very attractive woman and it was very passionate, but it just didn't last because she just wasn't the kind of a woman that could work things long term with me. I know that she's bitter and hurt, and it just seems that its hard to leave any kind of relationship without pain in someone's heart. It's hard since I am that much of a horndog and thus get into all these relationships with sexy hot women with little long term potential, but it would be nice not to hurt people anymore and not have to fight with your significant other because of big differences in character. Lately changes within my life have allowed me to distance myself quite a way from civilization and practice my neidan full time, but every time I seem to go down from my mountain, I seem to encounter some attractive woman and with that it is hard, because then I will know that I want her. It just seems I am angsty over my own attraction towards women, as when I desire someone I wish I didn't, it feels like torture, because my rational mind has no choice in the matter and the emotions rule solely. and when I act upon those feelings there is always the chance of rejection, which then my mind seems to endlessly beat itself about over with. its uncontrollable. so in short, even seeing a beautiful woman is a sure shot to get my mind and emotions in a knot whether I want to or not, and unless I cut all my ties with the whole world, this seems something that I have to deal with. It sucks not having a say as to who you're attracted to or not, and sometimes extremely much so. Damn hormones. You just are, and there's nothing you can do about it. And if your heart yearns for someone against your better judgment, where is peace? I've read the TTC and found that Chapter 3 has some say on this : "Not seeing desirable things prevents confusion of the heart." I see the wisdom in this and have been trying to do this, avoiding these disturbing emotions of sexual desire by avoiding women, but its not as easy because there are always circumstances that shove one back into the world at the least expected times.. So.. How does one person come to terms with his overpowering sexuality? Is the sage's only way to do so is to remove one's self from the cause of all these things? Do all people wishing to achieve a high spiritual transformation always hide from the sexuality that will stir their heart? that would mean living in a cave on a mountain or a forest, and although there are merits to that, there must be more practical means to do things with. . ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sloppy Zhang Posted July 25, 2011 (edited) It's easy to be a sage up on the mountain (though being a sage is hard enough, so maybe that's not saying much). Rather than running from uncomfortable thoughts and emotions, I think we should embrace them. We should follow them, examine them. Find out where they come from. How do they effect us? How did we get there? Why do we think/feel what we do. Why do those thoughts/emotions bother us in such a way? I think a sage would be friends with everyone, on all walks of life, the sage will recognize "the way" in any shape and form, and would be able to recognize how someone is living their life based on their own "way". You would be surprised the lessons "non-cultivating" people can teach you. You would be surprised at the insights they can make, just from living life. In some instances, I think that can be even more pure than knowledge of "the way", because they are seeing it without knowing it, they aren't trying to interpret it through dogma. So I would try to see the value in both the sinner and the saint. I would use that emotion that you are feeling as a springboard to get to know someone REALLY well. Really know them. Let them really know you. And through that, learn to know yourself. And if it works out, great. If not, that happens. That too is a way to learn about them, to learn why they think that, etc etc. Edited July 25, 2011 by Sloppy Zhang Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RiverSnake Posted July 25, 2011 (edited) I am a college student and i walk around beautiful women all day. I love basking in the energy of women whom glow with that special feminine charm, its a beautiful feeling. -If you are a man then you will inevitably attract women to you. I do not think this is something that should be fought. Rather it is better to decipher what the best kind of relationship would be for you and ask the universe for it. Perhaps it would be better for you if you had a relationship centered around spiritual growth and find a nice little yogi chick...or perhaps you should find a nice looking prostitute whom can satisfy your desires every time you come down the mountain and leave without any emotional attachment? -Or perhaps it is best that you have no relationship with the opposite sex -Ask your own inner source what is best for you...if you are in alignment with your deepest wisdom then you will have no problem being with or without a women. -My 2 cents, Peace Edited July 25, 2011 by OldGreen 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Harmonious Emptiness Posted July 25, 2011 I agree with the "out of sight out of mind" trick. Not only does it keep you from relinquishing your spiritual state, but I find that my state actually feels stronger, almost boosted from turning away from potential strong desire. It's like that would-be desire is transformed and intensifies the pure spirit feeling. This I don't do all day every day, but at certain times, like especially in the morning when urban life hasn't swayed me yet. The Dhammapada is definitely good to read when you feel the cart is pulling the horse.. "Wise people, after they have listened to the laws, become serene, like a deep, smooth, and still lake." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sloppy Zhang Posted July 25, 2011 I agree with the "out of sight out of mind" trick. Not only does it keep you from relinquishing your spiritual state, but I find that my state actually feels stronger, almost boosted from turning away from potential strong desire. It's like that would-be desire is transformed and intensifies the pure spirit feeling. This I don't do all day every day, but at certain times, like especially in the morning when urban life hasn't swayed me yet. The Dhammapada is definitely good to read when you feel the cart is pulling the horse.. "Wise people, after they have listened to the laws, become serene, like a deep, smooth, and still lake." The only issue I have with this is a matter of "genuine"-ness. Are you a truly serene person if you are never around anything that bothers you? I can be relaxed on a quiet mountain all alone. Can I be relaxed in a crowded subway station? Can I be relaxed in an airport terminal, where my flight arrived late, and I have to run to get my connecting flight? If you can only be relaxed and serene when things are going for you, are you really relaxed and serene? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tragblack Posted July 25, 2011 what do you bums think is the most Taoist way to handle things considering sexual attraction? I don't know about the "most Taoist way," but my way is to just go with the flow and try not to hurt myself or anyone else. I find myself needlessly obsessing over attractive women, and the passions that are stirred up are difficult to put down.. and no matter how much i try to "go with the flow", it seems that its my sexuality is what is always causing disturbingly passionate emotions, that somewhat affect my peace of mind, causing my mind to linger on the past, or obsess over controlling the future. Perhaps let it be, then let it go? How does one person come to terms with his overpowering sexuality? Masturbate? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sloppy Zhang Posted July 25, 2011 (edited) Masturbate? Win. Not if you want to conserve your jing, though Edited July 25, 2011 by Sloppy Zhang Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Birch Posted July 25, 2011 Be very very honest with the people you meet. And bear in mind that our current setup isn't easy for both sexes. It's not always hearts that break IMO/IME. Or, go find some attractive older women who won't be quite as hurt. But, bear in mind you might be yourself. Mr Slopp, The jing reductionism is wearing. Anyway, young guy, not too much of a worry. Old guy, ought to watch out. I figure if your head's about to blow off, letting yourself off the hook is a good idea. See the perils of retention without additional considerations on Trunk's site. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sloppy Zhang Posted July 25, 2011 Mr Slopp, The jing reductionism is wearing. Anyway, young guy, not too much of a worry. Old guy, ought to watch out. I figure if your head's about to blow off, letting yourself off the hook is a good idea. See the perils of retention without additional considerations on Trunk's site. I know. Damn, forgot the extra Never been a fan of jing reductionism. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Harmonious Emptiness Posted July 25, 2011 The only issue I have with this is a matter of "genuine"-ness. Are you a truly serene person if you are never around anything that bothers you? I can be relaxed on a quiet mountain all alone. Can I be relaxed in a crowded subway station? Can I be relaxed in an airport terminal, where my flight arrived late, and I have to run to get my connecting flight? If you can only be relaxed and serene when things are going for you, are you really relaxed and serene? That's the point Sloppy. It's in subways, crowded streets, malls, where this needs to be practiced. No bombshells are walking into my room unannounced. As for being late, with some practice it's not too difficult to be the "still center in the middle of the wheel" at least when necessary. Sometimes a situation doesn't call for serenity, but making that choice is what counts. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Otis Posted July 25, 2011 I was wondering.. what do you bums think is the most Taoist way to handle things considering sexual attraction? Lately, it just seems that it seems to be a problem of mine lately.. I find myself needlessly obsessing over attractive women, and the passions that are stirred up are difficult to put down.. and no matter how much i try to "go with the flow", it seems that its my sexuality is what is always causing disturbingly passionate emotions, that somewhat affect my peace of mind, causing my mind to linger on the past, or obsess over controlling the future. Good questions, Kali Yuga. I've just gone through a crush, myself, recently, and it wasn't very pleasant. All these old teenage mental habits came back, spinning stories about her, trying to analyze small details of her behavior, etc. I was plunged into an earlier version of myself, one with a lot more chatter, and a lot less peace. On top of that, my desire made me behave strangely, take things too seriously, etc., and she didn't respond to me the way my crush would have liked. Given all that, I still don't recommend avoiding the women who bring up that desire and all its connected habits. IME, practice is the only way to make peace with all parts of life. Avoidance just postpones resolution. Also, with avoidance, when you do have to face your desire, the stakes seem bigger, the anxiety is greater, etc. So, I think more (calm, conscious) exposure to attractive women is the answer, not less. I'm also a believer in incremental change, and so maybe there's a way to get more connected to women in general, not focusing on desire. Practice being friendly and connecting to women you don't desire, without ulterior motive, and let that become the norm. And progress from there. When a woman comes along who really shakes you up, you'll at least have the practice of calm and joyful connection to rely on, to help balance all the adrenaline and grasping, that gets triggered. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Birch Posted July 26, 2011 "Avoidance just postpones resolution" And IME resolution is where it's going anyway. So I guess you can go the incremental route or the massively life-changing due to extreme event route, or anywhere inbetween :-) Or go give up and live in a cave Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
