Paradise lost

[hagar]

With the tragedy in my own country and city in the forefront of my mind, I have comed to see, almost physically, how harmony and trust is lost in a society.

 

I heard the blast from the bomb, and my office is just a block away. People from my home town were killed.

 

Not wanting to create a thread about politics on TTB, the recent events in Oslo has made me realize something chilling, yet also spiritually startling. The man who killed 93 souls, most of them young teenagers as they were begging for their lives actually lived about half a mile from my home. I share his first name, and he could likely have gone to the same kindergarten as my son goes to now. This could have been any of us, and it was one of us.

And this society gave birth to his ideas. What startled me was the realization that he grew up loved, that he is not evil, and that he acted out of fear of the unknown. He wanted to destroy what he feard and what had wronged him. The space that is his centre is the space in me. I cannot hate him, only grieve.

 

What has become evident is that Norway has lost the only thing of value as a country, its shared trust. My son will grow up in a society whith fear, distrust and guardedness. How very different was my own childhood. A childhood where we as kids walked freely around without chaperones, where the police did not wear arms, where I could run into the prime minister at the supermarket, and where the maximum sentence for any crime was 21 years. This will now change.

 

But what has now happened is the sign of the decay of harmony, of the loss of Te, of virtue. I see what Lao Tzu meant in chapter 38 of the TTC:

 

When a truly kind man does something, he leaves nothing undone.

When a just man does something, he leaves a great deal to be done.

When a disciplinarian does something and no one responds,

He rolls up his sleeves in an attempt to enforce order

 

Therefore when Tao is lost, there is goodness.

When goodness is lost, there is kindness.

When kindness is lost, there is justice.

When justice is lost, there is ritual.

Now ritual is the husk of faith and loyalty, the beginning of confusion.

Knowledge of the future is only a flowery trapping of the Tao.

It is the beginning of folly.

 

In an almost self-righteous way I have talked about the uniqeness of my little nation. Maybe the illusion of this harmony was what is now gone, yet where is the difference between the perception of this harmony and the existence of it in society?

 

I feel we move into an age where all structures and shared truths will unravel, and everything will change. In most this will start in subtle ways. But look around. The earth is cracking, spieces dissapearing, the ecosystem is loosing its balance, social and political structures are unraveling, and its only the beginning. Things will fall apart. All things percieved as safe will change into security. What loss, how sad. Yet maybe inevitable.

 

The only thing one can do is to remain in our true nature, as anything else falls away ultimately. Even here in little Norway.

 

A friend of mine who is an upper class engineer walks around with a tshirt with the text "Unite Pangea". Pangea is the primal continent, before the continental plates drifted apart. He wears it unaware of the unconsious message he transmits, and shares with many. The yearning to return to the original unity and harmony.

The german social critic Walter Benjamin, resting heavily on the Kabbalah, defined the modern age as that of shock and shattering, pointing to the inborn nature of modernity to destroy itself. It is in these times that that the kabbalistic notion of mending what is shattered comes into play. This work of mending is also a work of waking up from history, from the past, to the present. This may be our wake up call.

 

Please excuse my rant, as I never thought this would affect me to the degree it does. I am totally floored.

 

h

[Gerard]

[Marblehead]

Hi Hagar,

 

My heart goes out to those effected by what happened there.

 

The human animal is what it is. And as we can think, we can think of many ways to be inhumane.

 

We cannot go back. We can only go forward.

[hagar]

Thanks G

 

On a positive note, people here talk about meeting hatered with love.

 

h

Edited July 25, 2011 by hagar

[Mal]

_/\_

[suninmyeyes]

Hi Hagar,

 

My heart goes out to those effected by what happened there.

 

The human animal is what it is. And as we can think, we can think of many ways to be inhumane.

 

We cannot go back. We can only go forward.

+1

Just what I wanted to say

[Vajrahridaya]

[Moonbar]

So sorry to hear Hagar, my thoughts are with you brother

[hagar]

So sorry to hear Hagar, my thoughts are with you brother

 

Thank you all for your kind words.

I did actually wish to invite a degree of reflection/dicussion as to the broader implications of this, as Norway by no means are anything special in this regard. Especially the fact that the west seem to be in a downward spiral of distrust and fear mongering, as a sign of the "Te" or inherent natural virtue in Daoist sense seems in decline. There seem to be an increasing almost energetic imbalance to the inflamed rethorics and fingerpointing, always away from one self.

 

What do you think?

 

h

[zerostao]

i agree with you about Te.

i look at it as our actions to stay in harmony with Tao.

for so many there is alot of confusion about Te.

you see it clearly.

when virtue is lost and we fall out of harmony with Tao

then disaster is sure to follow.

my thoughts are with you.

stay strong brother.

[thelerner]

For a dark moment eyes and attention are focused on single sad demented human being. The real Norway emerges quickly in the those who help others, sacrifice, show compassion and charity to others.

 

My thoughts and prayers

 

Michael

[lifeforce]

My thoughts are with all the families affected by this horrible tragedy.

Norway as a nation will pull through this eventually. Wonderful country, wonderful people.

[gendao]

This doesn't surprise me, from the standpoint of male psychology.

 

Most men "don't sweat the small stuff" and let a lot of things slide on a daily basis. However, if they feel disrespected over and over on the same sore issues for a lonngggg period of time, they may eventually snap.

In a relationship conflict, crying is often a woman's response to feeling unloved, and anger is often a man's response to feeling disrespected.

In this case, beta males all over the world are reaching tipping points in the amount of unabated disrespect they feel they can take from the Bully Cuckolder State.

 

From the Unab0mber to postal workers to Columbine kids to Cho Seung-Hui to George Sodini to Joe Stack to Thomas Ball to Non, etc etc...we are seeing the growing tip of a beta angst iceberg here all with similar gripes here.

 

(Note: I am not justifying anything here...just saying how they are all connected from a psychological standpoint. And that should be examined if we want to take corrective action for the future, not just swept under the rug.)

[doc benway]

With the tragedy in my own country and city in the forefront of my mind, I have comed to see, almost physically, how harmony and trust is lost in a society.

 

I heard the blast from the bomb, and my office is just a block away. People from my home town were killed.

 

Please accept my sincere condolences hagar.

This is the first I've heard of your tragedy.

Some friends of mine just moved to Oslo a few weeks ago, I need to check on them.

 

After 9/11 here in the USA, I became somewhat engrossed in news.

I then started following news organizations around the world because what I was reading here in the states felt biased.

After doing this for a while, I saw how each saw what was happening through their own bias and used it to further their agenda.

I completely gave up following news a few years ago now.

 

I have no idea how or why things like this happen.

I've come to release that I can't affect meaningful change in society through politics or social action.

The only thing I can affect is myself.

So rather than get wrapped up in news and politics, I've taken a path of personal cultivation.

Only through looking deeply into myself and finding the way to love and compassion inside, can I ever hope to bring any sense of healing to those around me and to my community and beyond.

 

When things like this happen, I'm reminded of Zhuang Zi's parable of The Empty Boat...

It doesn't really help but it is interesting to see how when tragedy occurs as a consequence of natural disaster it somehow feels different than when it is at the hand of a human being. Somehow we distance ourselves from nature and yet we are nothing more (or less) than a manifestation of Dao in our actions. Dao is beyond my understanding as is this insanity.

 

Again - I'm deeply disturbed that you and so many others are suffering as a result of this tragedy and my heart goes out to you in a spirit of support and friendship.

[Mal]

I did actually wish to invite a degree of reflection/dicussion as to the broader implications of this, as Norway by no means are anything special in this regard. Especially the fact that the west seem to be in a downward spiral of distrust and fear mongering, as a sign of the "Te" or inherent natural virtue in Daoist sense seems in decline. There seem to be an increasing almost energetic imbalance to the inflamed rethorics and fingerpointing, always away from one self.

 

What do you think?

 

I'm afraid Breivik's actions will realize his dream. More Fear, more distrust, more people afraid of "others".

"there was no other way. He had tried all possible alternatives.He felt that his actions were gruesome, but necessary," from nobody would take any notice of me, to worldwide news

 

Martin Bryant allegedly told a next door neighbour "I'll do something that will make everyone remember me." (Hopefully non Australians have already forgotten him ) But with a news media that just thrives on bad news and disaster, the "recognition" these people get is disgusting.

 

What can a single person do? Solitary, isolated, and afraid. Except hide?

 

But together... we can love,

together... we can shine.

Just as darkness is banished by light,

hate is transformed through love.

 

[hagar]

This doesn't surprise me, from the standpoint of male psychology.

 

Most men "don't sweat the small stuff" and let a lot of things slide on a daily basis. However, if they feel disrespected over and over on the same sore issues for a lonngggg period of time, they may eventually snap.In this case, beta males all over the world are reaching tipping points in the amount of unabated disrespect they feel they can take from the Bully Cuckolder State.

 

From the Unab0mber to postal workers to Columbine kids to Cho Seung-Hui to George Sodini to Joe Stack to Thomas Ball to Non, etc etc...we are seeing the growing tip of a beta angst iceberg here all with similar gripes here.

 

(Note: I am not justifying anything here...just saying how they are all connected from a psychological standpoint. And that should be examined if we want to take corrective action for the future, not just swept under the rug.)

 

Thank you all for your replies once more.

After the ceremony at the City hall where 200 000 + people attended, and with ceremonies around Norway in every town and city, I feel this will deflect some of the negativity and hatred, as everyone at these rallies showed an eagerness to embody trust, love and solidarity.

 

Yet I do concur with Vortex concerning some of the motives behind these acts of extreme violence. This anger is fuelled by a form of neglect that abounds in certain circles here in Norway. We don't acknowledge the unwanted emotions, and the people that does not meet our standards and conventions. It is to a degree an exlusive society in this way. Lack of success, lack of conformity to social codes creates many dropouts and loners. Anger will emerge in one way or another.

 

h

[hagar]

Please accept my sincere condolences hagar.

This is the first I've heard of your tragedy.

Some friends of mine just moved to Oslo a few weeks ago, I need to check on them.

 

After 9/11 here in the USA, I became somewhat engrossed in news.

I then started following news organizations around the world because what I was reading here in the states felt biased.

After doing this for a while, I saw how each saw what was happening through their own bias and used it to further their agenda.

I completely gave up following news a few years ago now.

 

I have no idea how or why things like this happen.

I've come to release that I can't affect meaningful change in society through politics or social action.

The only thing I can affect is myself.

So rather than get wrapped up in news and politics, I've taken a path of personal cultivation.

Only through looking deeply into myself and finding the way to love and compassion inside, can I ever hope to bring any sense of healing to those around me and to my community and beyond.

 

When things like this happen, I'm reminded of Zhuang Zi's parable of The Empty Boat...

It doesn't really help but it is interesting to see how when tragedy occurs as a consequence of natural disaster it somehow feels different than when it is at the hand of a human being. Somehow we distance ourselves from nature and yet we are nothing more (or less) than a manifestation of Dao in our actions. Dao is beyond my understanding as is this insanity.

 

Again - I'm deeply disturbed that you and so many others are suffering as a result of this tragedy and my heart goes out to you in a spirit of support and friendship.

 

Thank you for your kind words and concern.

 

The empty boat parable is something I also thought about. =)

Papaji said that if you go by the river of the Ganga, the Ganga will take everything away from you. Only when you realize the river is you own consiousness is there nothing to fear.

I feel this is the essence of a realization that changes my outlook now. And realizing that one is only able to change oneself through realizing that the only thing one can do is to give everything up completely, no change will come.

 

As to TV and the coverage, they are throwing themselves into this and devour whatever baits the killer has thrown to them.

 

h

[hagar]

I'm afraid Breivik's actions will realize his dream. More Fear, more distrust, more people afraid of "others".

"there was no other way. He had tried all possible alternatives.He felt that his actions were gruesome, but necessary," from nobody would take any notice of me, to worldwide news

 

Martin Bryant allegedly told a next door neighbour "I'll do something that will make everyone remember me." (Hopefully non Australians have already forgotten him ) But with a news media that just thrives on bad news and disaster, the "recognition" these people get is disgusting.

 

What can a single person do? Solitary, isolated, and afraid. Except hide?

 

But together... we can love,

together... we can shine.

Just as darkness is banished by light,

hate is transformed through love.

 

 

Mal, I think you are right.

This is something that will linger for the forseeable future here, and we will unfortunately have a chain reaction of events like this now, both here and abroad.

 

The simple misapprehention of equating identity with the origins of culture creates support for the fear of islam. Intelligent people think that change equals annihilation. So much fear around.

It really is a crisis of identity on a massive scale. Thus fundamentalism in any form.

 

But only through breaking down the walls between us and others do this not change into the society of control and fear so many really want unconsciously. They want some father figure-state entity to come and control them, and lure awareness away from this silent, lurking freedom that hurts so much for many.

 

h

[doc benway]

Peace and healing to you, your nation, and those affected by this tragedy. _/\_

 

 

Yes. But only if individuals allow it. Every moment is the ideal moment to cultivate. We can choose to make an extra effort into opening our hearts. Today.

 

This is the only way to move forward - for each of us as individuals to open ourselves to everything in and around us.

Through a sincere opening and acceptance we can touch one another and feel and understand our common bond.

There is no hope of this happening through politics, social action, religious leadership, or any other organized format.

It must start with me, inside, where I can find my connection to you and everything else.

[sifusufi]

I dedicate the Terje Rypdal compositions

 

The Last Hero & Laser to the people of Norway

 

Since they are not available in my country...

 

 

 

May your hearts find peace

[gendao]

US Neocons invaded Afghanistan and Iraq where they've killed a million Iraqis.. Not to mention were likely complicit in killing 3K on 9II at home..

So, why haven't they been tried?

 

Oh, they did it for a legit cause - those people were harboring WMDs (and being Muslim?)..

Oh, wait...

 

And now Obama's invaded Libya as well...

And he got the Nobel Peace Prize?

 

So, if we care so much about 1 man killing 93...I wonder why we care so much less when it's a whole nation killing a million?

Just some food for thought, folks..

 

I guess with the right mass media PR team, you can do anything!

Edited July 27, 2011 by vortex

[hagar]

US Neocons invaded Afghanistan and Iraq where they've killed a million Iraqis.. Not to mention were likely complicit in killing 3K on 9II at home..

So, why haven't they been tried?

 

Oh, they did it for a legit cause - those people were harboring WMDs (and being Muslim?)..

Oh, wait...

 

And now Obama's invaded Libya as well...

And he got the Nobel Peace Prize?

 

So, if we care so much about 1 man killing 93...I wonder why we care so much less when it's a whole nation killing a million?

Just some food for thought, folks..

 

I guess with the right mass media PR team, you can do anything!

 

 

I am actually surprised that the worlds media has shown such an immense interest of the Oslo incident, just as the rest of Norwegian media is. It's been the nr. 1 headline on CNN, Reuters, BBC and even Aljazeera for about 5 days now.

The only reason is we are wayting for payback for Bin Laden, and then it turned out that the enemy was from within. Thus the media interest.

 

Right now 1 million people are dying in Somalia.

 

h