Is Pineal Gland Activation more important than Heart Mind Activation?

[Vajrahridaya]

So you think an enlightened person is a corpse?

 

Feelings are as natural as the weather and the seasons, the only problem and ego issue is when you cling to them and push them away

 

Right, it's about integration, not escapism.

[Jetsun]

Proper activation Heart is absolutely necessary I would say... Otherwise the Eye will see into depths that are not correctly grounded...

 

-Dia:]

 

You wouldn't be able to handle what you see in yourself without a developed open heart. That is one thing I have painfully learned from my life when I had an energetic opening when I was a teenager due to an enethogen experience and couldn't handle what I saw in myself as my heart wasn't open enough to embrace it. Any spiritual system worth anything is a journey to the heart, at least at the beginning, without that you will just contract when you try to shine light on the darkness inside of you so you will get nowhere.

[C T]

Are you kidding me? You can only experience the void with the higher mind, the higher consciousness. Only by destroying your ego then can you interact with the void and the heart is one of the biggest supporters of the ego.

 

The truly enlightened person has no feelings whatsoever, no positive nor negative feelings because everything is void, everything is emptiness.

I do not see where this 'destroying' aspect is helpful at all, unless you are talking about snuffing out the separation from dualistic clinging which leads to craving and aversion.

 

You keep asserting how crucial the experience of the Void is pertaining to enlightenment, but somehow refuse to issue a reference point, nor any kind of contextual examples. Its easy to tell someone who is unwell to go see a doctor, but sometimes, if that unwell person is lost, they need directions in how to reach the doctor's clinic, and getting there, simply receiving the doctor's prescription then will not be an adequate enough solution to recovery. Its easy to mistake the prescription for the cure itself, isn't it?

 

Most of what you described are end-states of having done all the necessary work, undergone all the training and fulfilled all the complementary practices. This is all well and good, but its jumping the gun a little bit, dont you think so?

 

Perhaps it will make for a more productive and interesting discussion if you can give explanations and directions as to what this Void is that you vehemently declare to be IT, and how does one begin to practice assembling the appropriate VEHICLE to make the journey with the least possible hiccups?

 

And btw, that last statement regarding feelings is not accurate at all. It is only because of feelings/emotions that one gets to work with and experience the Void, yes? Without such, is the experience even required, or can it be validated as such? What you have proposed does not make much sense.

 

Without feelings, the whole purpose of wisdom and compassion falls apart. Nothing will make any sense, and one will not have the capacity to make any connection with anything or anyone else. This is so, i dont know whats the right word to use, silly maybe?

Edited August 11, 2011 by CowTao

[C T]

You wouldn't be able to handle what you see in yourself without a developed open heart. That is one thing I have painfully learned from my life when I had an energetic opening when I was a teenager due to an enethogen experience and couldn't handle what I saw in myself as my heart wasn't open enough to embrace it. Any spiritual system worth anything is a journey to the heart, at least at the beginning, without that you will just contract when you try to shine light on the darkness inside of you so you will get nowhere.

This is good!

[Aetherous]

Quotes that I like from Taoist Yoga's first chapter...

 

My masters Liao Jan and Liao K'ung once said: 'When beginning to cultivate (essential) nature and (eternal) life, it is necessary to first develop nature.'

 

...

 

Question: I have read Taoist books which all urge the development of light in the original cavity or centre of spirit (tsu ch'iao, in the center of the brain between and behind the eyes) at the start of practice but I do not see why. All Taoist schools regard this as the aim of the cultivation of (essential) nature without giving details. Will you please tell me where true nature actually manifests?

 

Answer: (The tsu ch'iao cavity in) the centre of the brain branches out into two minor channels on its left and right; the left one stands for t'ai chi (supreme ultimate) and the right one for ch'ung ling (immaterial spirit); they are linked with the t'ien ku (heavenly valley) centre above them and the yung chuan (bubbling spring) centres in the soles of the feet after running through the heart in the chest.

 

The Tan Ching says: 'Nature is (in) the heart and manifests through the eyes; life is (in) the lower abdomen and manifests through the genital organ.'

 

(Essential) nature is spiritual vitality in the heart that manifests through the two channels from the centre of the brain. So when seeing is concentrated on the spot between the eyes, the light of (essential) nature manifests and will, after a long training, unite with (eternal) life to become one whole. This union is called seeing the void that is not empty and he who is not awakened to this union will achieve nothing in his practice.'

 

Question: When I was taught meditation I was urged to empty my heart (house of fire) of all thoughts, set my mind on cultivating (essential) nature and open my eyes to contemplate the void to accord with the correct way; will you please explain all this to me?

 

Answer: Seeing the void as not empty is right and seeing the void as empty is wrong, for failure to return to the (tsu ch'iao) centre (which is not empty) prevents the light of vitality from manifesting. Under the heart and above the genital organ is an empty space where spiritual vitality manifests to form a cavity. When spirit and vitality return to this cavity, spiritual vitality will soar up and form a circle (of light) which is not void. Voidness which does not radiate is relative, but voidness which radiates is absolute. Absolute voidness is not empty like relative voidness. Voidness that is not empty is spiritual light which is spirit-vitality that springs from the yellow-hall centre (huang ting or middle tan t'ien,in the solar plexus).