How to recognize Chi

[Birch]

I am still no closer to knowing what you think (or what I experienced) but you got my attention

 

Hehehe. I guess :-)

 

Anyway, the classification of different types of energy is one I stumble over pretty consistently. I'm not saying what I think it is because I'd rather folks with more 'chi-spotting' expertise came up with their answer independent of mine. I'm figuring that if a few unrelated folks come up with something similar then there could be a good chance we're collectively 'onto something'

[dawei]

Hi dawei. Curious... If "intent should be understood more as visualization and imagination," then how would one explain the success of Michael Lomax's medical qigong teachings, that do not involve visualizations nor imagination?

 

BTW, Michael also has spoken about, and has utilized, needles of light.

I am not sure how he defines or teaches "intent". These two words better describe [for me] what intent is about, whether purging, tonifying, regulating, light, color, sound, needles, etc.

 

how do you have an intent of a "needle" and "light" without visualizing or imagining it (or maybe constructing it)?

 

If you can produce the idea of a "needle of light" without any mental/cognitive reference (visual or image) of what "needle" of light" means (ie: because you must a predefined notion and definition for "needle" and "light" to construct a "needle of light") that's very cool

 

Now maybe you mean like one wants to just go empty; that is their intent. I probably don't think of this as 'intent' for that particular activity. My practices are probably about 90% full of intent [in my definition]. So I should rephrase that this is my way of explain the kind of 'intent' I practice. I think what you would find, if you experimented, is that visualization and imagination can make intent very powerful. But I know it may not be what someone has as a goal of their practice.

 

There are some vibrational practices which require no intent and some which do. It is a mixed bag of tricks

 

There is probably shen level intent which can achieve no-intent but I am not there

 

Good question

[dawei]

Hehehe. I guess :-)

 

Anyway, the classification of different types of energy is one I stumble over pretty consistently. I'm not saying what I think it is because I'd rather folks with more 'chi-spotting' expertise came up with their answer independent of mine. I'm figuring that if a few unrelated folks come up with something similar then there could be a good chance we're collectively 'onto something'

thanks... but you could send me a PM of your guess

 

I don't doubt it is some form of energy; but the 24/7 thing for weeks on end; and then later it happened again. As much as I was happy to see it go away at the time, right now I want to figure out how to reproduce it, if possible.

[ChiDragon]

thanks... but you could send me a PM of your guess

 

I don't doubt it is some form of energy; but the 24/7 thing for weeks on end; and then later it happened again. As much as I was happy to see it go away at the time, right now I want to figure out how to reproduce it, if possible.

 

Most people thought the Chi Sensation was the feeling of Chi itself but it was not. Actually, during the practicing period of Chi Kung, the body was going thought a healing process. Chi will find all the weak spots and busy doing repairs to the damaged cells. During the healing process, one will get some funny feelings like tingling, electric shocks, numbness or itchy feelings. After the heeling was completed, those feeling are gone and cannot be reproduced again.

[dawei]

Most people thought the Chi Sensation was the feeling of Chi itself but it was not. Actually, during the practicing period of Chi Kung, the body was going thought a healing process. Chi will find all the weak spots and busy doing repairs to the damaged cells. During the healing process, one will get some funny feelings like tingling, electric shocks, numbness or itchy feelings. After the heeling was completed, those feeling are gone and cannot be reproduced again.

Your repeating yourself

 

And wrong again

 

I found out what it was... and feel so dumb for not having thought of it.

 

---

 

http://www.commonsensekundalini.com/science_spirituality/permanent_vs_temporary_kund.html

 

Permanent Kundalini is like an electrical current that never stops....

 

Those who experience Kundalini temporarily

A large part of this group awakens Kundalini accidentally. This is neither good nor bad; it is what it is. When it happens and the person knows nothing about Kundalini, there’s a temptation to fight it, to resist giving in to it, which is foolish because, once activated, Kundalini takes control.

 

Kundalini can be triggered by Yoga, by meditation, by ingesting drugs, or just plain not-doing. It can occur while walking down the street, driving a tractor, chewing your food, or making love. Just about any banal activity or non-activity can set it off. When it does occur, don’t fight it. Why? Because you can’t. So submit and learn. Perhaps, it will go away; perhaps it won’t. If it does go away, it’s probably because you did something to release sublimated sexual energy or the energy shook loose on its own. If the energy does cease for some reason, the conduits — between the base of the spine and the brain — have not been permanently opened.

 

Just for the record... it was NOT brought on by drugs

 

I know someone who studied this in India and has traveled a few places around the world and she teaches this. I may talk to her.

Edited August 15, 2011 by dawei

[ChiDragon]

So this is what you think was happening to dawei? Hm. I have no idea. However, I do agree with you when you talk about the sensations of qi cleansing a part of the body. Every day, week, month that practice, a noticeable clarity of the qi flow...flowing better, smoother, without much sensation at times. Except when it hits these smaller and smaller blockages. It does feel electric when it is clearing old injuries and restrictions!

 

I'll retract my statement in his case. It was the poor judgment on my part based on my own definition of Chi Kung. His definition was different from mine. Fortunately, I am in resonance with you.....

[dawei]

I'll retract my statement in his case. It was the poor judgment on my part based on my own definition of Chi Kung. His definition was different from mine. Fortunately, I am in resonance with you.....

It has nothing to do with definitions. (You don't have to be troll-like all the time.)

 

Please share your wisdom concerning Kundalini... I would honestly like to hear of your experience and personal knowledge of it.

 

I had taken a partial session in it a few years ago but it had completely slipped my mind as to it's energy role within the body.

 

Did you know there are energy practices outside of Qiging?

[ChiDragon]

1. It has nothing to do with definitions. (You don't have to be troll-like all the time.)

 

2. Please share your wisdom concerning Kundalini... I would honestly like to hear of your experience and personal knowledge of it.

 

3. I had taken a partial session in it a few years ago but it had completely slipped my mind as to it's energy role within the body.

 

4. Did you know there are energy practices outside of Qiging?

 

1. If our definitions are not the same, then we are talking apples and oranges.

 

2. Kundalini, is an Indian Term in yoga...??? Sorry, I am not familiar with it. Besides, It's not my intent to go into too many practices to avoid conflicts and confusions.

 

3. Good for you, but I'm out of this one.

 

4. I don't even have a vague idea of what you are talking about. Now, that's really slipped my mind...

[dawei]

1. If our definitions are not the same, then we are talking apples and oranges.

 

2. Kundalini, is an Indian Term in yoga...??? Sorry, I am not familiar with it. Besides, It's not my intent to go into too many practices to avoid conflicts and confusions.

 

3. Good for you, but I'm out of this one.

 

4. I don't even have a vague idea of what you are talking about. Now, that's really slipped my mind...

You don't have a vague idea of any energy practices outside of Qigong? AH !!! now I can understand your inability to understand energy practices, including higher level Qigong. I am glad you have explain this.

 

There is Kundalini, Reiki, SRI, Body talk, and a host of others which I am not exposed to but accept within Daoist, Buddhist, Ayurvedic practices. It seems you do not accept such idea as valid energy along with qigong... too bad your understanding is so limited as there is a world of energy to be embraced.

 

You can sit under your lemon tree and do zazen. That is a good practice for a lifetime. I truly feel the purpose of this. But at some point you should wake up and realize there is a world of energy outside the lemon tree.

[dawei]

Chi Dragon. A few serious questions:

1. How many WESTERN links have you given on this TB website which would help westerners understand you various points? What links? I know you have said that it is too difficult to cite chinese links, so just cite western links... How many western links have you cited so far? Please tell me... I wait for your response.

2. Since the DDJ area is a "study", I wonder, how many times is your FIRST post a discussion item? Or do you only, as a first post, give your translation without comment? This seems to be self-promoting without any care of discussion.

3. How many threads do you start with a question to the forum but you have your own idea you want to lecture after a few have responded? You seem to like this manner of posting and lecture. What is it you want to convert us to?

4. How many western qigong books do you have in possession?

5. How many Qigong conferences have you attended in the US?

6. What Qigong activities have you participated in the US?

7. Have you every attempted to engage in anything in the US regarding Qigong in the last 30 years ? I am seriously wanting to know how you have come to understand the western concept outside of purely internet trolling.

 

Can you seriously answer these or side-step and troll more? Waiting on baited breath... you seem to like to lecture everyone about breath... without realizing that everyone accept this.... and so much more... It is the MORE aspect !

Edited August 16, 2011 by dawei

[Stigweard]

A friend of mine once said that talking about your Qi is like talking about your willie (erm cept for the lasses I guess ).

 

Perhaps he is right??

 

[zerostao]

A friend of mine once said that talking about your Qi is like talking about your willie (erm cept for the lasses I guess ).

 

Perhaps he is right??

 

willie or wont he ? idk

do we feel qi directly or indirectly?

is qi visable to the trained eye?

is the magnetic pulse sensations qi?

 

"BTW, Michael also has spoken about, and has utilized, needles of light."

R_V, does Michael teach this use of light needles?

Edited August 16, 2011 by zerostao

[ChiDragon]

Chi Dragon. A few serious questions:

1. How many WESTERN links have you given on this TB website which would help westerners understand you various points? What links? I know you have said that it is too difficult to cite chinese links, so just cite western links... How many western links have you cited so far? Please tell me... I wait for your response.

2. Since the DDJ area is a "study", I wonder, how many times is your FIRST post a discussion item? Or do you only, as a first post, give your translation without comment? This seems to be self-promoting without any care of discussion.

3. How many threads do you start with a question to the forum but you have your own idea you want to lecture after a few have responded? You seem to like this manner of posting and lecture. What is it you want to convert us to?

4. How many western qigong books do you have in possession?

5. How many Qigong conferences have you attended in the US?

6. What Qigong activities have you participated in the US?

7. Have you every attempted to engage in anything in the US regarding Qigong in the last 30 years ? I am seriously wanting to know how you have come to understand the western concept outside of purely internet trolling.

 

Can you seriously answer these or side-step and troll more? Waiting on baited breath... you seem to like to lecture everyone about breath... without realizing that everyone accept this.... and so much more... It is the MORE aspect !

 

Question 4 seems to be my main interest right now.

 

This is a very good book:

A Complete Guide to Chi-Gung

Written by: Daniel Reid

ISBN 1-57062-337-6

ISBN 1-57062-543-3(pbk)

Published by: 2000 Shambhala Publication, Inc. Printed in USA

Website for the book: Chi-Gung

 

This book was written by a British. His Taiwanese wife helped to translate all the Chinese technical terms into English. He used some western terms in parallel with the explanation of Chu Kung. Since it was a book written with a mixture of cultural ideas, it was very interesting and easy to comprehend. I thought some of you might be interested in reading it.

 

I saw his book in a Chinese book store and had a few glance at it. Guess what? He was talking about the same thing what I had in mind.

Edited August 16, 2011 by ChiDragon

[ChiDragon]

However, I do agree with you when you talk about the sensations of qi cleansing a part of the body. Every day, week, month that practice, a noticeable clarity of the qi flow...flowing better, smoother, without much sensation at times. Except when it hits these smaller and smaller blockages. It does feel electric when it is clearing old injuries and restrictions!

 

This the kind of experience that all Chi Kung practitioner should have, at some point in time, if they did it properly. You must have done something right. May I hear your personal experience about this e.g. like the sequence during your Chi Kung practice. What style is optional; I'm mainly interest in the procedural practicing experience in you own words. Thank you very much.

[johndoe2012]

Edited December 11, 2011 by chris d

[ChiDragon]

Is this saying a lot....???

Edited August 16, 2011 by ChiDragon

[ChiDragon]

Chi Dragon. A few serious questions:

1. How many WESTERN links have you given on this TB website which would help westerners understand you various points? What links? I know you have said that it is too difficult to cite chinese links, so just cite western links... How many western links have you cited so far? Please tell me... I wait for your response.

2. Since the DDJ area is a "study", I wonder, how many times is your FIRST post a discussion item? Or do you only, as a first post, give your translation without comment? This seems to be self-promoting without any care of discussion.

3. How many threads do you start with a question to the forum but you have your own idea you want to lecture after a few have responded? You seem to like this manner of posting and lecture. What is it you want to convert us to?

4. How many western qigong books do you have in possession?

5. How many Qigong conferences have you attended in the US?

6. What Qigong activities have you participated in the US?

7. Have you every attempted to engage in anything in the US regarding Qigong in the last 30 years ? I am seriously wanting to know how you have come to understand the western concept outside of purely internet trolling.

 

Can you seriously answer these or side-step and troll more? Waiting on baited breath... you seem to like to lecture everyone about breath... without realizing that everyone accept this.... and so much more... It is the MORE aspect !

 

1. If I find any that really makes sense, I'll cite them.

2. You make your own judgment.

3. I am still waiting for your lectures with consistency.

4. One good one is enough(see post above).

5. If they are any different, than I'll go. If they are repeating the same thing as you are, then I don't need to go and hear from you.

6. I practiced a lot in the US.

7. If I understood the same way as they did, then I probably wouldn't be trolling on the internet.

[on the path]

Here is my few thoughts on the matter!

 

One first has to know what Qi is to even begin to recognize what/ how it manifests itself in the body.

 

So what is it?

 

If one can't actually know EXACTLY what it is, then one is just guessing.

 

I don't think it is necessary to consult manuals/ teachers to realize it, a lot of them don't really know themselves, they just want your money or for you to look up to them.

 

I think it has something to do with breath, but then again nothing at all!!

I think it has something to do with food and water, but then again nothing at all!!

I think it has something to do with the universe, the earth and evolution, but then that's my own opinion.

 

So what is it? Once we have established a definite answer to this then we can go on to some realization of how this definition manifests itself in the body.

 

Without this I think it is like the blind leading the blind in a very dark place.

[ChiDragon]

Here is my few thoughts on the matter!

 

One first has to know what Qi is to even begin to recognize what/ how it manifests itself in the body.

 

So what is it?

 

If one can't actually know EXACTLY what it is, then one is just guessing.

 

I don't think it is necessary to consult manuals/ teachers to realize it, a lot of them don't really know themselves, they just want your money or for you to look up to them.

 

I think it has something to do with breath, but then again nothing at all!!

I think it has something to do with food and water, but then again nothing at all!!

I think it has something to do with the universe, the earth and evolution, but then that's my own opinion.

 

So what is it? Once we have established a definite answer to this then we can go on to some realization of how this definition manifests itself in the body.

 

Without this I think it is like the blind leading the blind in a very dark place.

 

Thank you. Communication is very important to use common sense. I have established a definition for Chi in the last few years. I had been trying to let people know if we are talking about the energy flowing in the body. We cannot go by any myth from the past fanatically. We must go with something that is explainable and comprehensible. If we look closely to modern science e.g. physiology. It talks about how the human body energy, the biological energy(ATP), was required oxygen and glucose to be generated.

 

If we stick to the definition of Chi Kung which involves with breathing and we know it builds up body energy. It says loud and clear that breathing has something to do with oxygen and the energy Chi is implicating ATP. If we open our minds and think about it, we should related that the breathing and Chi are analogous to oxygen and ATP. Period.

[on the path]

Thank you. Communication is very important to use common sense. I have established a definition for Chi in the last few years. I had been trying to let people know if we are talking about the energy flowing in the body. We cannot go by any myth from the past fanatically. We must go with something that is explainable and comprehensible. If we look closely to modern science e.g. physiology. It talks about how the human body energy, the biological energy(ATP), was required oxygen and glucose to be generated.

 

If we stick to the definition of Chi Kung which involves with breathing and we know it builds up body energy. It says loud and clear that breathing has something to do with oxygen and the energy Chi is implicating ATP. If we open our minds and think about it, we should related that the breathing and Chi are analogous to oxygen and ATP. Period.

 

Hi Chidragon

 

I don't think this is a proper definition. Because just one point, although I do believe some qi comes from the air that we breath, certainly not all of it. Some may come from the food/water that we eat/drink but not all of it.

I believe that a great deal comes from the universe etc. which charges the air, food etc that we take in, but this is certainly not the whole story, so we have to define what we feel is the essence of qi. If you see what I mean. Once we have an all encompassing definition, then we can take that and see the effects it has on the body.

[oat1239]

I have established a definition for Chi in the last few years. I had been trying to let people know if we are talking about the energy flowing in the body. We cannot go by any myth from the past fanatically. We must go with something that is explainable and comprehensible. If we look closely to modern science e.g. physiology. It talks about how the human body energy, the biological energy(ATP), was required oxygen and glucose to be generated.

 

Hello ChiDragon. I have experienced qi flowing into or out of points on my body such as the laogong points on my hands. I have also experienced the very strong sensation of qi being transmitted from the hamd of a qigong healer who was standing a couple feet away from me and emitting qi from his hand to my body without touching me. It produced a very strong sensation with immediate effects on my body. It feels like some kind of strong field but clearly it is not an electromagnetic field or magnetic field or it would be relatively easy to get a reading of the field with an appropriate electronic meter. Also, I have stood in both electromagnetic and magnetic fields of varying strengths and not felt any noticeable effects on my body. There is most definitely something else going on with qi emission.

 

So, if qi is really just a way of describing physical properties or biological energy, what do you suppose causes the strong field like and other sensations when qi is being emitted from a distance? Just so you know, when I was in university I took part in a study by the psychology department on hypnosis and suggestibility levels, and I tested as being of very low suggestibily. I was pretty much completely unresponsive to all suggestion techniques used in the test. So, based on that, I think that this is also not just a case of suggestibility causing me to imagine sensations. Something is really going on that produces a strong field like sensation when qi is being emitted from a distance. Also, I started to feel almost immediate relief in pain once the qigong healer began emitting qi towards the area where I had pain. How would you account for this based on your understanding and definition of what qi is?

Edited August 18, 2011 by oat1239

[ChiDragon]

oat1239...

As I had mentioned this here once before in the forum, I am not at the level of understanding how Chi was emitted from on human body. This was never my argument. My argument was an scientific and comprehensible explanation to show how was the energy generated within the human body.

 

If I am going to explain the scenario in you case, based with my present knowledge, the Chi emitted from the human body has to be related to the ATP because that was the only known source of energy within the human body. My educational guess would be that the Chi Kung master has the ability to activate all the mitochondria in the body to generated a maximum of ATP possible to release all at once.

[ChiDragon]

Hi Chidragon

 

I don't think this is a proper definition. Because just one point, although I do believe some qi comes from the air that we breath, certainly not all of it. Some may come from the food/water that we eat/drink but not all of it.

I believe that a great deal comes from the universe etc. which charges the air, food etc that we take in, but this is certainly not the whole story, so we have to define what we feel is the essence of qi. If you see what I mean. Once we have an all encompassing definition, then we can take that and see the effects it has on the body.

 

Yes, I had limited myself to the definition of Chi within Chi Kung. If we are talking about ATP, yes, the food and breathing comes into the picture. This would be food and breathing is analogous to glucose and oxygen.

 

 

I believe that a great deal comes from the universe etc.

Isn't the air and food are a great deal comes from the universe which turns into energy with the human body.

[zerostao]

ChiDragon, can you provide a link to your ATP thread?

also on a side note imo/ime one does not need to be a qigong master to emit qi. evryone has ability to do it. some will emit much stronger and smoother qi than others. i think maybe becoz i live so close to nature maybe why i experience this quicker than it seems others do? idk, but it is not a master level accomplishment

just to emit and absorb qi.

[ChiDragon]

ChiDragon, can you provide a link to your ATP thread?

also on a side note imo/ime one does not need to be a qigong master to emit qi. evryone has ability to do it. some will emit much stronger and smoother qi than others. i think maybe becoz i live so close to nature maybe why i experience this quicker than it seems others do? idk, but it is not a master level accomplishment

just to emit and absorb qi.

 

zerostao...

 

1. We were talking about emitting Chi 5 to 10 feet away which an ordinary person cannot do.

 

2. You can do a google search on ATP.