Disinformation campaign

[Marblehead]

Okay. I'm glad Vmarco came back. I doubt that we will interact that often as our interests are significantly different.

 

But I still consider myself a conservative and actually take pride in that. Hehehe. Just bugging you.

 

So Vmarco has his understandings and opinions just like the rest of us do. Don't agree with him? That's okay. Don't want to see his ramlings? Hit the ignore button.

 

But I am sure that Vmarco understands that there will be people watching him. Hehehe. That's just the way life is. The tigers are watching, Vmarco, and ready to pounce.

 

You can praise your belif system but as soon as you compare it to another and suggest that yours is better than what you are comparing it to you should expect some very negative feedback.

 

Anyhow, welcome back.

[konchog uma]

how do posts about meditation techniques and philosophical viewpoints struggle to get 2 pages but this thread has 16?

[Marblehead]

how do posts about meditation techniques and philosophical viewpoints struggle to get 2 pages but this thread has 16?

 

Hehehe.

 

Because once we have agreed with another there is nothing left to be said but disagreements can be carried on forever. Don't have to look very far to verify that.

[konchog uma]

Hehehe.

 

Because once we have agreed with another there is nothing left to be said but disagreements can be carried on forever. Don't have to look very far to verify that.

 

i agree.

 

HEY youre right!

[Aetherous]

if I shone some light on Christianity (a subject which I'm internationally known to be proficent on)

 

That is a very hilarious and false statement Mr. Vmarco.

[Aaron]

Having received an e-mail a few days ago asking if I would return to TTB,...I responded:

"I had a most excellent time on TTB,...both the inquisitiveness and the combativeness has been very helpful for my writing. Sure, there's a possibility of returning,....was especially interested in the 'What is Light' thread."

 

Obviously, there are many, including moderators, who allowed themselves to get quite "charged" over my posts. And equally as obvious, there is a double standard,...for example I was called:

 

Sissy, troll, frenzied, pompous, great God complex, attacker, monotonous, hateful, sissified boy, jingles, dramatic reactionary, whacked out!, one eyed girl who should pluck out her remaining eye, and even "a repetitive placard of outdated and/or irrelevant postulations", etc.,etc., and not so much as a warning to those who stalked, trolled, and attacked my posts. But no big deal, that's the nature of today's society.

 

In response to Sunya's statement, "Why don't you rely on your own experience instead of vague scientific theories which are purely conjecture. You rely too much on abstractions..." and a broader dialogues,...I responded, "Ah,...you're a conservative.

http://www.thirdworl...econstruct.html

A link based on "88 different psychological studies conducted between 1958 and 2002 that involved 22,818 people from 12 different countries"

 

And for that I was suspended. Anyone who followed my posts from the beginning of any thread I engaged in, can easily see that my responses were follow-ups, and not launched attacks. Sunya was personally asked to cease stalking and attacking my posts on 12 Aug #239 in the oxymoron thread,....the above comment about Conservatives (obviously to the disdain of Conservatives) was two days later on 14 Aug.

 

I feel I kept the rule. Of course, if I shone some light on Christianity (a subject which I'm internationally known to be proficent on), or attempt to explain the Freethought Buddhist practice of the Short Path, I'm ganged on, disrespected and stomped upon as an attacker of someones beliefs. Well, believe it or not,...people are not their beliefs,...although they think that they are. Conservatism is not a belief,...it's an inability to think in an abstract, open-minded, unrigid way, according to many in the Mental Health field. Conservatism has been shown to be detectable in children that are 3 - 4 years old.

 

I don't attack people,...I critique their beliefs. I did not attack Sunya because of his conservatism. In empathy, I did however mentioned that he shouldn't be ashamed of it.

 

The rule I was given was "Treat other members with respect. No personal attacks"

 

There was even a post that I was in receipt of the TTB rules:

http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/19943-disinformation-campaign/ Post #12

"Tao bums is a moderated, privately owned, web site; all who agree with our guiding principals are welcome to join our discussions: Treat other members with respect. No personal attacks."

 

Yet, even before that post, I requested that XxxXxx and Sunya cease stalking and attacking my posts,...for example:

http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/19563-oxymorons-that-hinder-awakening/page__hl__oxymoron__st__240

 

Personally, I've gained much insight being an active member here. I've posted to the unremitting trolls stalking me that I would gladly limit the threads I engage in,...and have no intention of threatening their expert positions on the forum. They instead grouped up, and continued.

 

Again I ask,...if you cannot be respectful in responding to my posts, please don't respond. I'm aware you dispise me, and feel threatened by my membership. I understand that your seniority obviously has weight with the moderators, but just because you're privileged to get away with attacking others is no reason to do it.

 

I would like to engage in discussions on a limited number of threads,...IMO it would be unfair, disrespectful, and rude to post on those threads just to bash a poster. Not once, in 375 posts have I posted solely to bash a poster,....whereas nearly a third of all responses to my posts were ad hominem.

 

V

 

 

Hello VMarco,

 

I want to say that I am very happy to see you back. I believe that every moment has potential and that understanding that potential involves understanding that the past does not write the future, but rather our actions do. In many ways I fail at being the person I'd like to be, so sometimes I have to accept the person I am. I can be mean, spiteful, arrogant, and even thick headed, that's who I am, but I would like to be a compassionate person, who is able to allow people to be who they are, and still be who I am. I think you strive for the same thing, even if many people might not see it.

 

I do understand what you mean by compassion and I agree with 98% of what you say, so my view is why let the 2% prevent us from learning from each other. I'm sure you have much to share and I look forward to our future together on this forum.

 

I make this promise to you, that I hope I do not break, that I will respect your beliefs and understand that you have them for reasons, even if I don't understand those reasons. I will endeavor to listen to what you say and to try to understand not only what you're saying, but why you are saying it. In doing this I hope we can have compassionate discourse, that may be lively, but never resort to insults. So long as we respect the right of each other to say and believe what we believe, even if we don't necessarily agree with what we both believe, I do think this is possible. You don't have to do this and I wouldn't ask you to. If anything our discourse has brought about a melancholy state within me, because, as others have stated, much of what pricked my ego about you, were those parts of me I refused to admit existed. Each day we can become more than what we are and in becoming more, realize that there is nothing more to us than what exists already.

 

I would also like to define my idea of "with love", in that, as you stated elsewhere people often project love, not out of a sense of love, but rather out of a sense of rightness. Love is neither right nor wrong, good nor bad, but rather the binding force that exists within us all, the light of the soul perhaps? For me I try to love everyone because I understand that, regardless of what someone does, we are all equally deserving of compassion. (By the way Love is just a fancy way of saying compassion, perhaps my Western notions lead me to use that term instead of compassion.)

 

Anyways, welcome back.

 

Aaron

[Vmarco]

V: "if I shone some light on Christianity (a subject which I'm internationally known to be proficent on)"

 

That is a very hilarious and false statement Mr. Vmarco.

 

Yes, you already inferred that about posts #19 #23 #24

http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/19964-jesus-is-the-way/page__hl__notzri__st__16

 

The irony is that I'm unaware of anyone with Religious Studies credentials who would, or could, disagree with anything mentioned in those posts. Yes, I understand that you prefer to cling to your beliefs, and as such, the facts in those posts are upsetting.

 

Another facts is, contrary to Justinian or Theodosius times, smothering messengers is no longer to stop the message from the light of day.

 

Honesty is the only way to enlightenment.

 

V

[Vmarco]

 

I make this promise to you, that I hope I do not break, that I will respect your beliefs and understand that you have them for reasons, even if I don't understand those reasons. I will endeavor to listen to what you say and to try to understand not only what you're saying, but why you are saying it. In doing this I hope we can have compassionate discourse, that may be lively, but never resort to insults. So long as we respect the right of each other to say and believe what we believe, even if we don't necessarily agree with what we both believe, I do think this is possible. You don't have to do this and I wouldn't ask you to. If anything our discourse has brought about a melancholy state within me, because, as others have stated, much of what pricked my ego about you, were those parts of me I refused to admit existed. Each day we can become more than what we are and in becoming more, realize that there is nothing more to us than what exists already.

 

I would also like to define my idea of "with love", in that, as you stated elsewhere people often project love, not out of a sense of love, but rather out of a sense of rightness. Love is neither right nor wrong, good nor bad, but rather the binding force that exists within us all, the light of the soul perhaps? For me I try to love everyone because I understand that, regardless of what someone does, we are all equally deserving of compassion. (By the way Love is just a fancy way of saying compassion, perhaps my Western notions lead me to use that term instead of compassion.)

 

 

Aaron

 

I cannot reciprocate,...I will always respect you,...but I will never respect beliefs,...beliefs deny, suppress, disconnect, and disempower. Beliefs are never true,...if a belief was true, it would not be a belief. Maybe a belief could someday be recognized as a truth,...and on that day I would honor it as a truth. Perhaps we can have a honest discourse,...I love honesty. If you can ever bring to my attention something that may even appear dishonest about a post of mine, I would be most appreciative.

 

I also welcome any honest conversation on love. Love waits only on welcome.

 

V

[Aetherous]

The irony is that I'm unaware of anyone with Religious Studies credentials who would, or could, disagree with anything mentioned in those posts.

 

I bolded the important part. I could easily find many people with "religious studies credentials" (whatever that means exactly) who would and could disagree with a lot of what you wrote.

 

Anyway, props on collecting the posts where I disagreed with you...that is quite impressive!

[Vmarco]

 

Anyway, props on collecting the posts where I disagreed with you...that is quite impressive!

 

Not impressive at all,...TTB has a quick search engine,...simply recall a word, in this case, Hadrian,...and there are posts I submitted on Christianity. They wouldn't meet with David Barton's approval either,...but then I'm only interested in facts, not fiction,...which doesn't suggest that facts are truth,...just not disproven.

 

V

 

 

"we need to draw our attention to what is false in us, for unless we learn to recognize the false as the false, there can be no lasting transformation, and you will always be drawn back into illusion, for that is how the false perpetuates itself" Eckhart Tolle

[Marblehead]

i agree.

 

HEY youre right!

 

Hehehe. That's called a thread stopper.

[Marblehead]

Love is neither right nor wrong, good nor bad, but rather the binding force that exists within us all, the light of the soul perhaps?

Aaron

 

I just wanted to repeat this. So there you are.

[Marblehead]

 

Honesty is the only way to enlightenment.

 

V

 

Okay. I will repeat this too.

[ralis]

Having received an e-mail a few days ago asking if I would return to TTB,...I responded:

"I had a most excellent time on TTB,...both the inquisitiveness and the combativeness has been very helpful for my writing. Sure, there's a possibility of returning,....was especially interested in the 'What is Light' thread."

 

Obviously, there are many, including moderators, who allowed themselves to get quite "charged" over my posts. And equally as obvious, there is a double standard,...for example I was called:

 

Sissy, troll, frenzied, pompous, great God complex, attacker, monotonous, hateful, sissified boy, jingles, dramatic reactionary, whacked out!, one eyed girl who should pluck out her remaining eye, and even "a repetitive placard of outdated and/or irrelevant postulations", etc.,etc., and not so much as a warning to those who stalked, trolled, and attacked my posts. But no big deal, that's the nature of today's society.

 

In response to Sunya's statement, "Why don't you rely on your own experience instead of vague scientific theories which are purely conjecture. You rely too much on abstractions..." and a broader dialogues,...I responded, "Ah,...you're a conservative.

http://www.thirdworl...econstruct.html

A link based on "88 different psychological studies conducted between 1958 and 2002 that involved 22,818 people from 12 different countries"

 

And for that I was suspended. Anyone who followed my posts from the beginning of any thread I engaged in, can easily see that my responses were follow-ups, and not launched attacks. Sunya was personally asked to cease stalking and attacking my posts on 12 Aug #239 in the oxymoron thread,....the above comment about Conservatives (obviously to the disdain of Conservatives) was two days later on 14 Aug.

 

I feel I kept the rule. Of course, if I shone some light on Christianity (a subject which I'm internationally known to be proficent on), or attempt to explain the Freethought Buddhist practice of the Short Path, I'm ganged on, disrespected and stomped upon as an attacker of someones beliefs. Well, believe it or not,...people are not their beliefs,...although they think that they are. Conservatism is not a belief,...it's an inability to think in an abstract, open-minded, unrigid way, according to many in the Mental Health field. Conservatism has been shown to be detectable in children that are 3 - 4 years old.

 

I don't attack people,...I critique their beliefs. I did not attack Sunya because of his conservatism. In empathy, I did however mentioned that he shouldn't be ashamed of it.

 

The rule I was given was "Treat other members with respect. No personal attacks"

 

There was even a post that I was in receipt of the TTB rules:

http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/19943-disinformation-campaign/ Post #12

"Tao bums is a moderated, privately owned, web site; all who agree with our guiding principals are welcome to join our discussions: Treat other members with respect. No personal attacks."

 

Yet, even before that post, I requested that XxxXxx and Sunya cease stalking and attacking my posts,...for example:

http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/19563-oxymorons-that-hinder-awakening/page__hl__oxymoron__st__240

 

Personally, I've gained much insight being an active member here. I've posted to the unremitting trolls stalking me that I would gladly limit the threads I engage in,...and have no intention of threatening their expert positions on the forum. They instead grouped up, and continued.

 

Again I ask,...if you cannot be respectful in responding to my posts, please don't respond. I'm aware you dispise me, and feel threatened by my membership. I understand that your seniority obviously has weight with the moderators, but just because you're privileged to get away with attacking others is no reason to do it.

 

I would like to engage in discussions on a limited number of threads,...IMO it would be unfair, disrespectful, and rude to post on those threads just to bash a poster. Not once, in 375 posts have I posted solely to bash a poster,....whereas nearly a third of all responses to my posts were ad hominem.

 

V

 

 

The first link is broken, could you repost it? I would like to add that I agree with you in that conservatism is an increasing threat to freedom loving people. Politics and religious belief systems BS, and those that adhere to such narrow minded ideology are included without exception. There are a number of members here that fall into the category of authoritarians.

 

John Dean cites one major study conducted over several decades beginning after WWII, as to the insidious nature of authoritarianism. I will post a link to that study later.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Conservatives-Without-Conscience-John-Dean/dp/B0013LTF2Y/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1314366766&sr=8-1

 

 

http://members.shaw.ca/jeanaltemeyer/drbob/TheAuthoritarians.pdf

[Marblehead]

The first link is broken, could you repost it? I would like to add that I agree with you in that conservatism is an increasing threat to freedom loving people. Politics and religious belief systems BS, and those that adhere to such narrow minded ideology are included without exception. There are a number of members here that fall into the category of authoritarians.

 

I would like to point out that "conservatism" is a label that is used for various purposes. Just the label "conservative" can be very misleading.

 

I often use the word when speaking to "non-interference" as well as "to be sparing" and "being economical".

[dawei]

Not impressive at all,...TTB has a quick search engine,...simply recall a word, in this case, Hadrian,...and there are posts I submitted on Christianity. They wouldn't meet with David Barton's approval either,...but then I'm only interested in facts, not fiction,...which doesn't suggest that facts are truth,...just not disproven.

 

V

 

 

"we need to draw our attention to what is false in us, for unless we learn to recognize the false as the false, there can be no lasting transformation, and you will always be drawn back into illusion, for that is how the false perpetuates itself" Eckhart Tolle

I have absolutely stayed out of this thread but from the beginning but I felt it has merit since if a member feels it then let them speak. This was a generic feeling which is true of any forum but then focused on some (or one). I don't know you nor most of your posts that many have a history of commenting on. What little I have looked at I think you provide a stream of info and it is most often quite good consideration. You are direct, exact, and true to your belief system. You said in another post that you would not be respectful to belief systems... for various reasons. But that is what I see commendable with you; is the true alliance to your belief's.

 

This all being said, I found your comment above very insightful. I would think based on your fairly extensive knowledge and sharing online your comments that you would understand another persons post. You responded with exact rationality to a sarcastic post. Which means either you were mocking in return or you don't truly understand how to interpret online posts.

 

If you do not see this sarcasm then I think we can explain it. If you saw the sarcasm and choose to respond in equal terms, then your rational [veiled] response is worth a grin or two.

 

What I suspect is that the right brain is in full flow but the left brain is on pause. I hope I did not just generate a 1000 word manifesto. I would actually like to hear a terse reponse to the ideas presented... ok, maybe I am asking too much from my first interaction with you? actually, I like you.

[fiveelementtao]

What I suspect is that the right brain is in full flow but the left brain is on pause.

 

insightful, intelligent post dawei... My observation as well... (in terms of the communication at least) But I think you may have your brain hemispheres mixed up. Right brain is intuitive, expansive and emotional. Left brain is literal, intellectual and dualistic. Left brain controls the right side of the body and right brain controls the left side of the body. So, instinctual understanding of the body is reversed when we are talking about the brain hemispheres. My experience of forum interaction is that it is VERY left brain oriented. ( Which is why we see so much arguing and fighting on almost every thread.) It is also interesting to me that my osteopath volunteered to me that the body position necessary for typing on a keyboard stimulates the sympathetic nervous system. (which is the stress response or "Fight or Flight") Which is left brain dominant. NO surprise to me then that modern western folk are overly stressed... and even on a spiritual forum like this one, since one must sit behind a desk and type that everybody's natural tendency seems to be to pick fights...

[dawei]

insightful, intelligent post dawei... My observation as well... (in terms of the communication at least) But I think you may have your brain hemispheres mixed up. Right brain is intuitive, expansive and emotional. Left brain is literal, intellectual and dualistic. Left brain controls the right side of the body and right brain controls the left side of the body. So, instinctual understanding of the body is reversed when we are talking about the brain hemispheres. My experience of forum interaction is that it is VERY left brain oriented. ( Which is why we see so much arguing and fighting on almost every thread.) It is also interesting to me that my osteopath volunteered to me that the body position necessary for typing on a keyboard stimulates the sympathetic nervous system. (which is the stress response or "Fight or Flight") Which is left brain dominant. NO surprise to me then that modern western folk are overly stressed... and even on a spiritual forum like this one, since one must sit behind a desk and type that everybody's natural tendency seems to be to pick fights...

5ET... you are right in terms of what side of the brain most favor in typical science... I am in the opposite direction and made some wrong statements which you thoroughly correct. Maybe it is hell to be 'right' brained but to be corrected as not "right" in polarity... you seem to have the answers to us all. thanks.

[Vmarco]

 

If you do not see this sarcasm then I think we can explain it. If you saw the sarcasm and choose to respond in equal terms, then your rational [veiled] response is worth a grin or two.

 

What I suspect is that the right brain is in full flow but the left brain is on pause. I hope I did not just generate a 1000 word manifesto. I would actually like to hear a terse reponse to the ideas presented... ok, maybe I am asking too much from my first interaction with you? actually, I like you.

 

Back in the 90's, the last 6 years of the 90's to be exact, I must have looked at more than 6000 stereo-grams,...so many, that I'm not sure if I could even use one hemisphere over the other any more. I think that even my face has become symmetrical.

 

However, many mistaken my vocabulary as a sign of being brainy,....it's actually not,...I simply use a specific language. Lawyers, doctors, astrologers all use a particular vocabulary, the language of their professions,...in my profession, that of a Heart-mind orienteer, it is even more necessary to have an appropriate vocabulary,...because Heart-mind uses gnowledge instead of knowledge. Which, if you used the "TTB search" for gnowledge or gnow, I could keep this manifesto to around a hundred words.

 

V

[dawei]

Back in the 90's, the last 6 years of the 90's to be exact, I must have looked at more than 6000 stereo-grams,...so many, that I'm not sure if I could even use one hemisphere over the other any more. I think that even my face has become symmetrical.

 

However, many mistaken my vocabulary as a sign of being brainy,....it's actually not,...I simply use a specific language. Lawyers, doctors, astrologers all use a particular vocabulary, the language of their professions,...in my profession, that of a Heart-mind orienteer, it is even more necessary to have an appropriate vocabulary,...because Heart-mind uses gnowledge instead of knowledge. Which, if you used the "TTB search" for gnowledge or gnow, I could keep this manifesto to around a hundred words.

 

V

Honestly, I appreciate this idea since I have felt some sides of it and see many sides of it. You were much more concise and exact in your explanation and I truly follow your point.

 

I don't care if you actually answer my original point which deals with a post you did not 'read' correctly. But there are two sides of the brain. whether they flow as one or two, there is the rational and intuition. The former seems to be easily lead by the external and the latter by the internal. Do you have some brief comment on this idea?

[Marblehead]

Left brain. Right brain. I don't know. When I was young I think most of my thinking was done by my penis. All the blood went there and there was no blood or oxygen available for the brain.

[Vmarco]

 

I don't care if you actually answer my original point which deals with a post you did not 'read' correctly. But there are two sides of the brain. whether they flow as one or two, there is the rational and intuition. The former seems to be easily lead by the external and the latter by the internal. Do you have some brief comment on this idea?

 

My apology for not reading a post correctly. As for the question about the preponderance of one hemisphere being more or less external than the other,...from my observations both hemispheres are equally debilitating.

There is a saying,....relate with what will never leave you, and from which you can never leave.

 

The brain is impermanent,...the senses are impermanent,...the body is impermanent,...and yet these are the things we relate with. Heart-Mind is not uncovered through the brain hemispheres, the senses, the body, the intuition, or rationality,....Heart-Mind is uncovered beyond those barriers.

 

This is why it is said, don't seek Heart-Mind, but seek and find all the barriers you have built against it,...the barriers built against Unborn Awareness from being gnown to the impermanent.

 

"There is little place today as ever for the spiritual individualist, the man who cannot betray himself and deny truth for the sake of peaceably settling down in one of society's organized groups or established institutions. The climate is hostile to him. He must remain a lone thinker, self-exiled, paying a price but getting his money's worth". (315)

http://wisdomsgoldenrod.org/notebooks/1/3

[dawei]

I like the points you make concerning the heart-mind and tend to agree. thanks.