Desire

[ffvii]

Hi, i am starting to use taoist philosophy in my day to day life and i have encountered a problem. for a long time now i have greatly desired to have more friends and a girlfriend. it has been a constant problem that makes me suffer. i wish to release myself from these desires like others, but i just don't know how to. they are and always have been great desires for me. does anyone here have an idea of what i should do?

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[lienshan]

for a long time now i have greatly desired to have more friends and a girlfriend

To know, when enough is enough, is what I read in Dao De Jing.

 

To have 1 girlfriend is enough

[ffvii]

haha no i mean i don't have one at all and i only have a couple friends. i find myself alone a lot. I wish not to desire a girlfriend or any friends.

[Marblehead]

haha no i mean i don't have one at all and i only have a couple friends. i find myself alone a lot. I wish not to desire a girlfriend or any friends.

 

Why don't you wish to have a girlfriend? Are you a girl? Don't wish for too many friends - that will bring on confusion, I assure you.

 

However, if you are a guy there is nothing wrong with desiring a girlfriend. That is a natural instinct you are experiencing.

 

In my understanding the TTC suggests that we lessen our desires, not eliminate them.

 

You got forty bucks? You can buy a girlfriend for thirty minutes with that.

 

Hehehe. Don't push yourself too hard. It takes time to live life.

[Taomeow]

Taoists have nothing against desire. All things normal and human are embraced. Taoism is not anti-life. If you are lonely, it is normal and human to want to have friendships and love in your life. If you were a taoist priest, some sects (not all) would require celibacy, but if you are not, not.

 

One of my teachers, Master Wang Liping, was advised by his teachers to get married after years of strenuous taoist training, because it was decided that he would live in the world and be part of the worldly ways, and living in the world means what the I Ching refers to as "sameness with people." Taoists don't stick out like sore thumbs, shunning all things human, unless their lifestyle is explicitly that of "having left the world." This of course would entail more than one or two adjustments, and a loss of more than one or two desires. But when "coming into the world," they do no such thing.

 

If you want to be scolded for having desires, join a buddhist forum.

[Marblehead]

If you want to be scolded for having desires, join a buddhist forum.

 

Ouch!!!!!!! Hehehe.

[zerostao]

i reckon desiring the right things is alright. all desire is certainly not wrong.

desiring friends is not wrong. to have friends, be a friend.

desiring harmful or injurous or prideful things probably not a good thing.

[Birch]

Desire IME is a fundamental spiritual and natural driver. I think it can get sidetracked and re-routed when it's supressed. I'm still considering it but I had an idea that desire is evolutionary and revolutionary:-) Desire breathes me into life and not the opposite. In fact IME, if I let it, desire shows me all kinds of ways to go. But I attempt to tame it in myself because it's not very well-regarded where I live. Desire is not a frustrated wanting nor the inability to defer gratification. It's a slow-burning furnace, a hurricane on it's way slowly:-)

[Marblehead]

... not very well-regarded where I live.

 

But you are in the 4th dimension Sweetie. No one can see you. Go for it!!!

[Taomeow]

Desire IME is a fundamental spiritual and natural driver. I think it can get sidetracked and re-routed when it's supressed. I'm still considering it but I had an idea that desire is evolutionary and revolutionary:-) Desire breathes me into life and not the opposite. In fact IME, if I let it, desire shows me all kinds of ways to go. But I attempt to tame it in myself because it's not very well-regarded where I live. Desire is not a frustrated wanting nor the inability to defer gratification. It's a slow-burning furnace, a hurricane on it's way slowly:-)

 

Right on.

 

The problem is, people are set up to confuse desires born of true needs with desires born of frustrated needs. Discerning is tricky. Desires born of frustrated needs are the devil. These are the ones that can never be satisfied because they do nothing about the frustrated normal natural need they mask -- it's still there no matter how many masks it wears. Our whole civilization uses this Problem-Reaction-Solution method to sustain its abominable self:

 

1. (create a problem) make sure normal natural developmental needs are never met, and

2. (cause a reaction) once everybody is sufficiently frustrated on the deepest level,

3. (offer a solution that does not solve the original problem but looks like "something is being done about it") offer an infinite number of substitutes, send everybody on a wild goose chase forever.

 

So anyone undertaking a discerning stance toward true needs and desires vs. sleight-of-hand substitutes takes on a whole civilization. Not easy.

 

Still worth it.

[Birch]

Still worth it :-)

[doc benway]

Hi, i am starting to use taoist philosophy in my day to day life and i have encountered a problem. for a long time now i have greatly desired to have more friends and a girlfriend. it has been a constant problem that makes me suffer. i wish to release myself from these desires like others, but i just don't know how to. they are and always have been great desires for me. does anyone here have an idea of what i should do?

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Why is it that the desire for friends and a lover makes you suffer?

Is it because you don't feel comfortable being in relationships with others?

Have you been hurt?

Are you intent on isolating yourself for a reason?

 

I don't think the desire to have relationships should necessarily be a source of suffering.

Look into why that is the case - it's a place to start.

[Stigweard]

[deci belle]

Just open your heart completely, sfvii. Accept yourself unconditionally right now. If you're lucky, nothing will happen.

[ChiDragon]

A Taoist Thought:

If you desire to have more friends and a girlfriend. You start looking for now. If you find some friends and a her, then it's OK. If not, it's OK too. Put trust in your fate. Let Nature take its course known as Wu Wei.

[Harmonious Emptiness]

Hmm. Yeah, speaking of Wu Wei in regards to this, if your trying to make new friends or find a girlfriend, Wu Wei is important to keep in mind. Part of Wu Wei has an illusive moralistic side, meaning that you don't "take" things. A lot of people see what they want and they try really hard to get it. When this thing happens to be someone's affection or company, that is especially not right.

 

There is a Chinese saying somewhere referring to hunting with 3 dogs. If you hunt with 4 dogs, they can surround and corner the prey which is unfair, so sport hunters (since they exist anyways regardless of what we feel about the so called "sport") should only hunt with 3 dogs so that prey that really really really wants to escape has an opening.

[ffvii]

Why don't you wish to have a girlfriend? Are you a girl? Don't wish for too many friends - that will bring on confusion, I assure you.

 

However, if you are a guy there is nothing wrong with desiring a girlfriend. That is a natural instinct you are experiencing.

 

In my understanding the TTC suggests that we lessen our desires, not eliminate them.

 

You got forty bucks? You can buy a girlfriend for thirty minutes with that.

 

Hehehe. Don't push yourself too hard. It takes time to live life.

Haha thanks and i meant i desire one but i heard that desiring causes suffering and i wish not to desire one but thank you i will try to lessen my desires. haha and nice one

[ffvii]

Why is it that the desire for friends and a lover makes you suffer?

Yes I have been hurt. I used to have a girlfriend and, in the end, she hurt me alot. However the times we were together made me very happy. that is why i wish another one.

Also I have become a lot more introverted and have lost a lot of friends and wish more but am not getting more.

I noticed that the desire for these things made me sad and angry and stuff and i feel like i'll not be able to achieve these things that is why i wish not to desire these things anymore.

[deci belle]

Hmm. Yeah, speaking of Wu Wei in regards to this, if your trying to make new friends or find a girlfriend, Wu Wei is important to keep in mind. Part of Wu Wei has an illusive moralistic side, meaning that you don't "take" things. A lot of people see what they want and they try really hard to get it. When this thing happens to be someone's affection or company, that is especially not right.

 

There is a Chinese saying somewhere referring to hunting with 3 dogs. If you hunt with 4 dogs, they can surround and corner the prey which is unfair, so sport hunters (since they exist anyways regardless of what we feel about the so called "sport") should only hunt with 3 dogs so that prey that really really really wants to escape has an opening.

 

It is exactly the point of Union, the 8th hexagram's ruling 5th line: "The king employs three chasers and loses those running out the front."

[dawei]

Yes I have been hurt. I used to have a girlfriend and, in the end, she hurt me alot. However the times we were together made me very happy. that is why i wish another one.

Also I have become a lot more introverted and have lost a lot of friends and wish more but am not getting more.

I noticed that the desire for these things made me sad and angry and stuff and i feel like i'll not be able to achieve these things that is why i wish not to desire these things anymore.

I have waiting to reply to you so I could truly get a sense of what you are feeling. I am glad you are so open and honest in sharing what is going on. You actually would like friends and a relationship; you just don't want it to be such a desirous issue?

 

Desire seats itself in the second chakra, a gate to the lower dan tian (just below the stomach but called the sexual chamber). But chinese medicine puts it in the middle dan tian; it is the diaphragm which keeps the lower dan tian energy from raising upwards. It gets stuck in what is called the "Yellow Court" (the place of unprocessed emotions), and not allowed to get into the heart area where it process all order and peace. When the energy is not free to flow between these areas there may be even pain felt.

 

Now, I only ask this to see if the issue has progressed to pain; if you put your mind between your heart and stomach area and think about this issue, do you feel pain?

 

I will only add that I think you have some expectations (maybe subconscious) which are more like social imprints as to how life is supposed to unfold and it's not happening. These patterns, once taking psycho-emotional form inside us, then tend to create issues for us.

[Marblehead]

Great post Dawei. Directly to the point, I think.

[Birch]

Super post Dawei!