Bliss VS Awareness

[Understanding]

The question is, is the main purpose of your meditation(spiritual cultivation practice) for attainment of bliss or awareness?

 

I think Id say Awareness to me is more important, i like to feel in control, and i feel that through awareness i could attain bliss, but im sure it can work the other way around.

[C T]

In your view, how does the raising of awareness lead to bliss?

 

The path i am on tells me that meditation is for removing subtle mind obscurations and layers of conditioned responses which together act as blockages to remaining in a mode of neither grasping nor averting sense formations which arise due to habitual tendencies. As these obscurations are gradually peeled away, the natural result, in perfect relation to how stable one remains undistracted, will be the enhanced awareness of one's true nature.

 

In addition, the practice of yoga works as a pivotal support so that meditative absorptions can remain stable and the body can remain poised for extended periods, culminating in perfect balance and harmony between body and mind.

 

When perfect balance is maintained, the natural result from this is Bliss.

 

One does not set about to achieve any state as such, because this too, is falling into the condition of 'grasping'; for example, when one gets the result one seeks, the tendency to cling to these pleasant states becomes very apparent. This means that by desiring bliss or awareness, one is creating the potential for clinging to arise.

 

Clinging is neither good nor bad ~ what it does is it subtly or grossly creates a web of other causes which binds one to other potentialities/causes of suffering. (suffering here refers to one's mental state at the point of death, where during one's life, so much have been invested to attain as much as one can desire for, ranging from the material to the spiritual, so, as one's body become frail and the mind brittle, the possibility of becoming filled with bewilderment, regret, anger and frustration is almost certain, because no one likes to lose what has been painstakingly grafted throughout one's life. Imagine the stress at having attained all the wonderful bliss states, and then realizing that none of it can prolong life for even an extra minute as death looms closer and closer).

[Marblehead]

The question is, is the main purpose of your meditation(spiritual cultivation practice) for attainment of bliss or awareness?

 

I think Id say Awareness to me is more important, i like to feel in control, and i feel that through awareness i could attain bliss, but im sure it can work the other way around.

 

The main purpose of my entire freakin' life is awareness. All those emotions come and go whenever they like.

[thelerner]

I voted Awareness. Bliss is nice; a great energizing cleansing sensation, but Awareness is life.

[xabir2005]

I voted for Others because wisdom to me is a unity of bliss, luminosity and emptiness.

[doc benway]

Bliss vs Awareness:

Are the two really so different?

I also voted 'other' becuase I'm not sure there is a "purpose" anymore.

[Marblehead]

I voted for Others because wisdom to me is a unity of bliss, luminosity and emptiness.

 

Hehehe. You just couldn't resist adding your "emptiness" to the equation, could you?

[Marblehead]

Bliss vs Awareness:

Are the two really so different?

I also voted 'other' becuase I'm not sure there is a "purpose" anymore.

 

I think they are about as different as are pigs and Christmas trees.

[Marblehead]

 

I also voted 'other' becuase I'm not sure there is a "purpose" anymore.

 

Hehehe. Well, at least with that inclusion you get one point for approaching awareness.

[doc benway]

I think they are about as different as are pigs and Christmas trees.

 

[xabir2005]

Hehehe. You just couldn't resist adding your "emptiness" to the equation, could you?

Actually not my main point - I'm saying, bliss and awareness cannot be separated. Oh yes and of course emptiness too.

 

p.s. the bliss of nondual awareness is actually unimaginable until you experience it.

Edited September 15, 2011 by xabir2005

[doc benway]

I'm saying, bliss and awareness cannot be separated.

Or distinguished...

 

I think one sticky point is how we define those terms in English and how the terms are used and defined in Sanskrit. And as you point out, the other issue is taking the time to actually experience unpolluted awareness.

[Green Tiger]

I would say, for me, unification is the better word. Unification of my senses with the available stimuli could also be called awareness. Unification of my body with the pull of the earth gives me a sense of pleasant feeling of falling or melting that could also be called bliss. But I think the common denominator is a breaking down of barriers, of tensions, of resistances and merging with my environment.

 

Unify!

[Marblehead]

 

You guys are getting way to fast for me. Hehehe.

[Marblehead]

Actually not my main point - I'm saying, bliss and awareness cannot be separated. Oh yes and of course emptiness too.

 

p.s. the bliss of nondual awareness is actually unimaginable until you experience it.

 

Yea! That's two strikes against me. Hehehe.

 

Sometimes I get ecstatic when I see a fine looking woman. Is that something like bliss? I have experienced that!

[Marblehead]

Resonate!

 

Radiate!

[ion]

My experience would be hard to put into words as a direct statement...

 

If your meditation is a tool for subduing the ego, and if the meditation of your heart is for the salvation of mankind...

 

And if you, not holding any thoughts or concepts in meditation, consider the experiencing of bliss as a choice you can make, and you choose not to, but let go like a thought, then you will be miles closer to your goal.

 

If you choose "no" when offered bliss and go deeper your awareness will expand and you will aquire compassion.

 

True enlightenment, like total enlightenment in the sense of becomming a buddha can not be had for selfish purposes or for the self and there is no bliss to be had until the salvation of all man kind. To truly become ultimatly enlightened is to have sacrificed your inner "life concept", your sense of self to it is the death of anything you could call your self.

 

To "refuse" bliss is to ascend higher and to gain compassion. Bliss is a distraction of the ego and a fascination of the ego.

 

To unite with the source is to experience "true love" which has the byproduct of blissfullness. To a heightened awareness during mankinds current condition to experience "true love" has the by product of compassion.

 

If you say no to bliss, let go of it like a thought, you will face the ego and be challenged by its thoughts and distracted by its offerings(bliss), and you will understand the predictement that mankind is truly in, and then you will have compassion.

Edited September 15, 2011 by ion

[doc benway]

Sometimes I get ecstatic when I see a fine looking woman. Is that something like bliss?

Nope, that's called an erection

[Aaron]

Hello Everything,

 

Bliss is transient, it does not last. Awareness is transient, it does not last. Seek that which lasts and you will see that these two things are as worthless as the sand at the beach. When you see them as worthless, then they will never be stolen from you.

 

Aaron

Edited September 16, 2011 by Twinner

[deci belle]

Um, last time I checked, impersonal awareness was bliss.

[Nilo]

I guess it depends on your definitions for what bliss and awareness are.

 

I feel that bliss can cause an opening for alot more awareness but alot of people fall into the traps of bliss (pervert tantra fanatics) if they don't have much awareness. I also see that awareness can cause alot of bliss to arise but alot of people fall into the traps of awareness, I'm talking about rigid zen folk who don't know what to do with their body besides sit like a rock. Imho it's best to keep a balance and allow both bliss and awareness to come from a pure intention of the heart, cultivate both at the same time.

Edited September 16, 2011 by Nilo

[Lucky7Strikes]

As a bunch of people have said already, they are the same thing.

[xabir2005]

Or distinguished...

 

I think one sticky point is how we define those terms in English and how the terms are used and defined in Sanskrit. And as you point out, the other issue is taking the time to actually experience unpolluted awareness.

I can't say it cannot be distinguished. If you say it cannot be distinguished, then people will get confused into thinking that experiencing bliss would be the same as realizing or recognizing awareness, which isn't the case. Many meditative states are blissful but does not bring one closer to the realization of awareness.

 

However when you realize and experience non-dual awareness, it is bliss.

Edited September 16, 2011 by xabir2005

[Marblehead]

Nope, that's called an erection

 

Hehehe.

[Marblehead]

Hello Everything,

 

Bliss is transient, it does not last. Awareness is transient, it does not last.

 

I was considering making a similar comment but I had no way to build on it and felt it would sound too negative if I just said it and did not build on it.

 

Thing is, nothing lasts forever. That is because the universe and all things within are dynamic. The only way we could escape these changes would be to escape the physical and Y'all know I don't talk about such things.