My Last Post

[Aaron]

Well to be completely honest, from what I've heard, Sifu Hata hasn't actually determined any of his students to be sifus. The fact that no student in the last 50 years has earned the rank of Sifu causes me to seriously doubt the validity of the school.

 

Other than that, I'm staying out of this one. I say do what your heart tells you to do. If it's right, then do what's right, but don't let yourself be fooled into believing something is right, simply because you want it to.

 

Make amends when you have done something wrong, but don't expect amends simply because you believe someone has done something wrong. No one is required to believe you or accept you, nor are you required to prove yourself to anyone but yourself, but in the same way, if you present yourself to be something, then you should be able to prove without a doubt that you are what you claim to be.

 

As for me, I'm simply nothing, so it's very easy to live up to my standards.

 

Aaron

Edited October 18, 2011 by Twinner

[mYTHmAKER]

As for me, I'm simply nothing, so it's very easy to live up my standards.

Aaron

 

No yours are the most difficult standards to live up to

[Shen555]

It's sad to see you go Sifu Mike, really loved the Celestial Qigong DVD's of yours. All the best to you in all your future endeavors good sir. This forum has truly lost one of it's greats!

 

Warmest Regards,

 

Shen

Edited October 18, 2011 by Shen555

[fiveelementtao]

Thanks for the nice PMs and responses on this thread. You guys are right. I admit it. My ego and feelings are hurt. It is a sign of how limited and human I am. And while all that is true, it has me thinking about how does this online environment help me personally and how does it help me serve others? Am I really helping people by being on this forum or are there other ways to be more helpful. Sometimes it is good to power through the pain and other times, pain is an indicator to change course.

 

In terms of the forum etiquette, it IS possible to control that... IF we choose to. We as a community are not victims. We have a collective choice about the kind of atmosphere we choose create and tolerate. TTB's is not a force of Nature that we are forced to survive. Any member's repeated insultive behavior is indicative to me of a growing trend that is just not acceptable to me any longer. If they were held accountable for their choices of words, they would be forced to monitor themselves. If not, there is no shame in banning someone who has repeatedly proven themself to be destructive and uncooperative... It IS possible to have free dialogue, debate etc... without tolerating childish destructiveness. I have decided I won't tolerate it anymore in my life where possible. If my choice is to either come on this forum and accept the inevitable possibility that I will be personally attacked, or not. I choose not.... I see that as a sign of strength not weakness. However, I am only one person. Everyone is different. If the majority of the Forum decides that these kind of vindictive personal attacks are acceptable in their collective environment, then I support that for them. It does not mean I have to tolerate it if I don't wish to. So, I am trying to do something to change that. I'm OK if the answer is "no." At least I know I tried to do something before I left.

 

This incident is really just the tip of the iceberg for me in regards to online interaction. The real question is... "Does the time and energy I spend here on TTBs really contribute to spiritual growth for myself and others? My students don't talk to me like that. In fact, No one has ever insulted me in person the way people do over the internet. So, why not focus on teaching those who appreciate it? Am I really helping others by coming on here and spouting my opinions to a mixed audience? I'm not sure.

 

In terms of just sticking it out... Teachers are human. Many will notice that most of the teachers that used to frequent this forum have left or are rarely heard from any more. A couple of them have told me that they have left for the same reasons as I. They just couldn't take the personal abuse any longer or the lack of respect. Call me unspiritual or thin skinned or egotistical, but the attacks are taking a cumulative toll on me and I just don't want to experience them anymore.

 

It's one thing for us to come online and trash someone who is not an active member of the community. It's another thing to do so when they are standing right there.This would not happen in organic, face to face human contact. The only way to change this online dynamic is through deliberate choice.

edit

Let me add that IMO Scotty did not mean to be rude to you. He was stating his opinion,

@thelearner,

Scotty was not simply miscommunicating as he would like to portray himself.

It was in another thread where the slander occurred. Here is a couple quotes...

 

He has posted fraudulent history here regarding ancient symbols and this tradition.

"incorrect" would be an opinion or critcism. "fraudulent" implies deliberate deceit on my part and is outright slander.

 

The HUUL breath mantra is just red phoenix level 2 stolen and modified a bit.

 

Here he is outright accusing me of stealing Max's techniques. If he had said "I wonder if Mike was influenced by Max"... That would be a valid question. But accusing me of outright theft is very different. And the worst thing is that he admits that he has no verification of his opinions. He goes on to seek to embarass me by bringing up my former teacher. He knows that this is a very sore personal hurt for me but he has no problem bringing this up if it serves his purposes...Then he calls my teaching "Crap". Opinion? perhaps. Insulting? definitely... Scotty was trying to hurt me. Plain and simple. The guy just has no conscience and cannot control himself. I can accept that people like that are here, but the mods won't do anything to stop it. And on a personal level, I just don't want to support that kind of community anymore.

 

So alot of this has to do with my personal code of conduct. I appreciated Stig's idea that this is a community and we need to hold each other accountable for the way we treat each other. I know that many just consider this another internet forum and who gives a crap, let's see how much fun we can have etc... I have been trying to actively help create the kind of atmosphere that I want to participate in. I have vigorously defended those whom I felt were being targeted and I have vigorously challenged those whom I think were being irresponsible. But I have never consciously insulted anyone. But, there are others for whatever reason just cannot restrain themselves when emotionally stimulated. And if one is tolerated, others will follow.

 

So, bottom line is... I just have to accept that this place is changing and devolving. (or perhaps I am changing or both) and there really isn't anything I can do about it.

 

@ Seth, you're right, I have given the forum an ultimatum. I was very conscious about that. It was not a passive plea for attention. I wanted to make sure that I wasn't leaving this forum without at least making an effort to effect a positive change. It looks as though I have my answer. Scotty's (and those like him) unmoderated destructive presence in this forum is unacceptable to me. If moderated, they can be very constructive members most of the time, but if unmoderated and they get in an emotional funk..., they spiral out of control and cannot restrain their venom.

 

So, Seth, you can call it blackmail if you want. I see it as a way to determine if this is someplace I belong. If the forum decides to do nothing about Scotty, then I know what I can expect in the Future and I have a very clear choice and course of action for how I can best serve myself and others...

 

@Shen and those that feel I have something of value to teach. Thanks for the kind comments. I have a big internet presence and can be easily found. It is not necessary for me to come on here to be helpful. For those who really want to learn from me, they can easily find me and my teachings. Much more to come...

 

@OldGreen, Thanks for the kind words.

 

 

To those who feel I should be defending myself against Scotty's insults... I find no point in that. He is only doing so to hurt me. as you can see anyone who steps in to defend me only provokes Scotty to invent more insults to share. He can't even "Reconcile" (as he calls it)... without then turning around in the same breath to heap more personal insults. There is no appeasing a wounded infant without spoiling him further. If anyone had an honest question about my background or process they could simply ask and I would be happy to answer. I have no problem whatsoever with honest scrutiny. Scotty himself knows that he does not mean what he is saying. He has said very kind things about me in the past when he didn't have an axe to grind against me.

 

Besides, defending my integrity will not prove anything to those who have decided they dislike me for whatever reason. Any attempt on my part to address every slander point by point will only provoke further ridicule and attacks. I learned that a long time ago.

 

So, I will give it another day. I assume nothing will be done and I am OK with that. It just means I am making room for other ways to serve...

 

Thanks to all for the show if support,

Mike

Edited October 18, 2011 by fiveelementtao

[Protector]

hey, you know how the saying goes

 

If you are insulted, let them be

It doesn't mean you lack honor

If you are challenged, let them be

It doesn't mean you are weak

If he touches you

the people are honored that you behead him

 

Bushido

[Aetherous]

5et,

 

Here he is outright accusing me of stealing Max's techniques. If he had said "I wonder if Mike was influenced by Max"... That would be a valid question. But accusing me of outright theft is very different. And the worst thing is that he admits that he has no verification of his opinions.

 

My verification is knowing rp2, and seeing your method clearly on youtube. You even use the terminology that Max uses, "cool mist", in your book!

 

I never admitted I have no verification; in fact I stated the opposite. It's all right there for people who search this forum, and who have purchased your products.

 

He goes on to seek to embarass me by bringing up my former teacher. He knows that this is a very sore personal hurt for me but he has no problem bringing this up if it serves his purposes...

 

Oh...lets not talk about the truth regarding your "lineage" then, if it hurts too much for you. With all other teachers, this is fair game...but with you I guess we should make an exception and keep it a secret from those who are seeking real spiritual practices.

 

Hmm...

 

If you want people to be considerate of you, Michael, be considerate of them first. In fact, more important is to be considerate of your actions (for instance, the action of stealing a method...or the action of duping people who are honestly seeking the real thing).

 

"Consideration" is something great to cultivate.

 

The guy just has no conscience and cannot control himself.

 

"When you point your finger, there are three pointing back at you." Look who's talking, man!

 

By the way, I'm going to report this post of yours too, for being slanderous. Saying someone has no conscience is quite the jab, and is absolutely not true.

 

But I have never consciously insulted anyone.

 

Do you need me to copy and paste your flip out post here?

[gendao]

A gelded stamen

Firepit of gray ashes

Seeking home..

 

 

 

I do enjoy the overall quality and contributions of 5ET, although he does have his sore spots, as noted. I also agree it would be a lost opportunity for personal growth to shy away when these get acupressured. As well as a lost opportunity for the rest of us to enjoy and learn all he does have to offer!

 

And no, people aren't so blunt IRL. However, that's one of the therapeutic "bonuses" of internet dialogue - the NHB aspect. Where people may feel less social etiquette to filter their thoughts and speak as freely and openly..

 

Another point I've noticed is how martial artists tend to get easily baited into ego battles and very combative - both offensive and defensive. But a man who is at war with himself, will never find peace.. And every warrior is, ultimately at war...with himself.

Edited October 18, 2011 by vortex

[ChiDragon]

Chapter 81

1. True words are not beautiful.

3. Beautiful words are not true.

3. One who is kind does not quarrel.

4. One who quarrels is not kind.

[templetao]

The simple point is this 5et is an accomplished teacher, businessman, and author.

 

If i were 5et i would be very upset that an uneducated review of my material by someone who has not trained under me or bought any of my products. Was published on a taoist forum that serves the taoist community with taoist info.

 

The fact is when ever you post something on the internet your actually publishing it and distributing it. The internet is a form of distribution. TTB is a venue for distributing and publishing info on the net.

 

To keep this site from becoming a gossip coloum on taoist topics the mods are suppose to remove unproven statmenets upon request.

 

Slander implies distribution

 

Actually its TTB who is liable as the publisher who serves that info about 5et to the net just like a hosting company is responsible for a webmaster who has copyrighted files on their servers is liable.

 

By 5et requesting those posts be removed he actually submitted a request in writing that was ignored.

 

5et can actually file suit if he wanted to.

 

By removing info until proven by fact upon request of the party involved this site retains its integrity.

[Aetherous]

If i were 5et i would be very upset that an uneducated review of my material by someone who has not trained under me or bought any of my products.

 

My review was educated by having trained in Kunlun, and having bought a couple of Michael Denny's products.

 

the mods are suppose to remove unproven statmenets upon request.

 

My statements regarding him are actually proven, if you were paying attention.

 

ALSO:

 

I don't take kindly to threats of lawsuit. That would incredibly harm me, since I am a student in a lot of debt already. Chill the fuck out, people.

[templetao]

This is why forums have rules and mods to protect the content of their site.

 

Your content is the member generated posts not videos not mp3s or electronics.

 

This is why newspapers have editors and so on. To protect the content that they provide.

[Aetherous]

Yes, and the mods apparently decided that telling the truth about a teacher and their product is not worthy of moderation!

 

For every other teacher here, this is not an issue...even when false things are said regarding them. But just because a teacher frequents this forum, nothing negative can be said of them?

[templetao]

My review was educated by having trained in Kunlun, and having bought a couple of Michael Denny's products.

 

 

 

My statements regarding him are actually proven, if you were paying attention.

 

ALSO:

 

I don't take kindly to threats of lawsuit. That would incredibly harm me, since I am a student in a lot of debt already. Chill the fuck out, people.

Well you have to be very careful about what you say. Did you talk to 5et before you made the comments about his products and services? Sometimes what you do has unwarranted consequences.

 

When you speak bad about someone dont be shocked by what you get in return.

 

You just cant talk shit about someone and expect them to sit there and take it.

Edited October 18, 2011 by templetao

[Aetherous]

I do agree with you about that principle...

 

But threatening me with a lawsuit is not cool. Maybe that's worthy of moderation. Your post is getting reported.

[templetao]

I never said i was going to do anything to anyone. This tells me that you didnt fully grasp what i was saying.

 

When i said that 5et could file suit it wasnt against you and im not 5et.

 

what logic are you using?

Edited October 18, 2011 by templetao

[Aetherous]

Duh.

 

You are suggesting that he (could/should) file a lawsuit against me! I take that as a threat.

[thelerner]

Duh.

 

You are suggesting that he (could/should) file a lawsuit against me! I take that as a threat.

 

Oh, just shut up all of you or I'll sue everyone for taking up electricity, board space and my semi valuable time

[templetao]

sigh*

 

i can clearly see that you misunderstand things to a large extent and then misquote people and i think this is the heart of the problem.

 

What i said in very very simple terms that TTB responsible for the content that they provide and host. So it is the TTB that is liable for the content about 5et being distributed on the net.

 

I never said anything about you or doing anything to you.

 

im not sure if you know how things work.

 

If TTB put a movie that is in movie theaters right now on their site viewable to watch. The dmca would file a complaint against the hosting company for TTB to remove the content from their servers. The webmaster would just recieve a letter in the mail notifying them of what happened. but it is the hosting company that is responsible for removing that content.

its the same here.

 

thats the point i was getting at do you understand?

[Aetherous]

So your point is that teachers can sue this forum for allowing content that is slanderous towards them?

 

HMMMMMM.

 

Anyway, got it. Peace out.

[Apech]

**** Moderator Message *****

 

We have had a number of reports (from both 'sides') relating to the current issue between Scotty and 5ET. TTBs does not support any particular school of practice and is an open forum for discussion of spiritual matters including different systems and lineages. It does not also necessarily support or hold the views of expressed by individuals on here. Normal etiquette between genuine practitioners is to respect other people's system even if not agreeing with it. It is ok of course to point out where one might think weaknesses exist in the other persons approach.

 

However it is not helpful to get into personalized disputes and/or to deliberately attack another poster on here or to troll threads for this purpose. The moderation team is discussing action and such action if and when it is taken will be geared to ensuring that TTBs is what it should be, that is a open forum where people are free to express their views without being attacked or goaded into action (including leaving the forum). In other words to protect the reputation of TTBs as a good place to come for information and debate.

 

Anyone who thinks this place is for perpetuating disputes will probably face a long suspension - which will be strictly enforced.

 

Apech for Mod Team

 

**** Mod Message Ends ****

[templetao]

thats not really what i said.

 

again in very simple terms a website is responsible for the content they have. They are only liable if they refuse to remove the content in question form their site upon request.

[templetao]

Scotty im not sure what school you went to but im actually a ceo of a company that makes iphone apps.

 

But you cant tell me that you understood what i said unless i concur and say "yes thats what i meant".

 

The point i was getting at due to what you were referring to is that member generated content should be properly moderated for the sake of the forum. A lack of that could be detrimental to a internet forum.

 

Even though im directly saying thats what i mean. i know you will not simply listen to me the author of my own posts and will twist it some way to mean something completely different.

Edited October 18, 2011 by templetao

[Informer]

The simple point is this 5et is an accomplished teacher, businessman, and author.

 

If i were 5et i would be very upset that an uneducated review of my material by someone who has not trained under me or bought any of my products. Was published on a taoist forum that serves the taoist community with taoist info.

 

The fact is when ever you post something on the internet your actually publishing it and distributing it. The internet is a form of distribution. TTB is a venue for distributing and publishing info on the net.

 

To keep this site from becoming a gossip coloum on taoist topics the mods are suppose to remove unproven statmenets upon request.

 

Slander implies distribution

 

Actually its TTB who is liable as the publisher who serves that info about 5et to the net just like a hosting company is responsible for a webmaster who has copyrighted files on their servers is liable.

 

By 5et requesting those posts be removed he actually submitted a request in writing that was ignored.

 

5et can actually file suit if he wanted to.

 

By removing info until proven by fact upon request of the party involved this site retains its integrity.

 

It becomes free use when published on a forums. Credit , ownership, mine, yours, grow up kids.

[Sloppy Zhang]

I'm going to relate my opinion through my experience of looking for a teacher. Even though I have never met this person, and only learned from books, I have found B.K. Frantzis to be incredibly helpful.

 

Now prior to purchasing any books on him, I of course did a shit ton of research. Even after purchasing "Opening The Energy Gates of Your Body" and read some of his fantastic sounding life stories, I did even more research.

 

I turned up a LOT of shit talk. Like, seriously.

 

"He's fat, he can't be doing real martial arts."

 

"He's an asshole who can get away in push hands because he is fat."

 

"He is a glutton. *Insert personal anecdote of Frantzis' gluttony."

 

"He is a braggart. None of those things happened."

 

"He got kicked out by one of his teachers."

 

"None of the Chinese ever taught any white man with such a huge ego any REAL "inner door" practice, only the fake stuff to get him to pay money while they laugh at him behind his back. I know this because I'm a REAL inner door disciple of *insert your favorite teacher*".

 

Yadda yadda yadda. And, you know, in his writing and in video I have seen things that, you know... could have used a little more tact (though I guess for him in his circumstances WERE using tact, but then again, I've never met the man, so how would I know?)

 

The thing is, I also heard a lot of good things. But for me, good things are really useless. When I shop a product on Amazon, I only read the bad reviews. Why? Of course the 5 star reviewers like the product for (most likely) all the reasons I want to buy the product. I want to find out why I DON'T want this product.

 

And I found a lot of pretty good reasons why someone wouldn't want to train with B.K. Frantzis or be associated with him.

 

But you know what?

 

The material in his books and DVD's is phenomenal. At least, in this humble do-it-yourselfer's opinion. I can't wait for a chance to go to a seminar and learn from him in person. As a skeptic, I always held out the possibility that he was just talking a good game. But goddamn... each time I look at something new, it just gets to such finer and finer and finer detail. Even if it's just on the physical/chi level. Even if he DIDN'T know anything about the emotional/spiritual/mental/etc levels, his physical/chi knowledge would be FAR worth the price of admission. But the more he goes on, the more I start to think that he really DOES have some serious higher knowledge. That, or he's just a top notch bullshitter and knows all the right ways to hint at things.

 

But I digress...

 

 

The point is, I kept practicing Frantzis' material, and keep on looking out for his products, because I saw in them their tremendous quality and help for my life. As we like to say on the internet, "haters gonna hate". Fuck 'em. Do what you do.

 

You don't want students who are going to be put off by a couple of internet rumors. You don't want students who are going to switch loyalties like they switch songs on their iPod. You want students who are committed to learning the material, and who are committed to internalizing it, integrating it in their own lives, mastering it, and then passing it on.

 

Plenty of people don't want to train with a fat, arrogant, self important sonofabitch to learn internal martial arts and meditation. Me? I think he's got the goods. I think he's a person. I'm willing to meet this person because I see extreme value in what this person is teaching, and I wish to learn it, integrate it into my life, master it, and then pass it on. I have no idea what it will be like when I meet him, or how we will get along, or how I react. My plan is to focus on learning as much as I can from this person.

 

And, you know, if someone doesn't want to train with that kind of person, fine.

 

If someone doesn't want to train with a trickster coyote who beefs up the stories surrounding his energetic martial arts prowess, well that's fine with them. If people want to train with someone because they see value in what that person teaches, fine with them.

 

If someone doesn't want to train with someone who repackages what they have learned from China in a cultural framework that is more accessible to the average Westerner, well fine with them. If you want to practice with someone because you see value in what that person teaches, great.

 

Don't expect people to never talk shit about you. Because, well, for one thing, they always will, and for another thing, they always will on the internet. If you've got haters, it means you're out there enough to be recognized. And that is good. It means people are thinking about you. You don't want a bunch of "yes" men. You want people who can think critically. You want that person who can see through the bullshit and be like "you know, I heard X, Y, and Z rumor. But I don't give a flying fuck, because I think you've got the goods."

 

Focus on giving out the goods, and shrug off whatever else comes along.

Edited October 18, 2011 by Sloppy Zhang

[fiveelementtao]

This discussion has surprisingly become very interesting and I think it has value for the forum. For me, I want to be clear... I am not trying to save my professional reputation. This is a personal issue that I think directly relates to the overall health of the forum.

 

So, this isn't about my professional reputation....Seriously people, I make almost no money whatsoever on my "products" as Scotty so derisively calls them. If my online reputation as a teacher were completely discredited and no one ever bought another "product" again, it would have little impact on my business. My total income last year was $20,000. Almost all of that was made from local students. If I tried to live on the money I make on my "products," I would be in a cardboard box. If I put the same amount of time, energy and effort into selling cell phones or timeshares or something, I would make a hell of alot more money... I prefer to teach to local students in order to preserve the integrity of the teachings. I charge an average of $12 per student per class because that is what most people here in Boise are willing to afford. I am lucky if I get a private student or someone coming in from out of town for private lessons. The current economy has just about killed that part of my business. I cannot afford health insurance. I only pay enough auto insurance to legally drive on the road. If it weren't for the fact that my wife has a decent job, I would not have time to teach or write or maintain a FREE website with online teaching materials. I would have to be out there doing the 9-5 thing. So, I am lucky to be able to teach AT ALL. I consider it an honor and a privilege. I do so because I love it and because I feel the need to share what I know to whomever is disciplined enough to learn. So, for those of you (mostly younger folks) who think I am riding high on the hog with all the money I make on my "products." I am willing to bet you have more money than I do... (I personally don't see what is wrong with products. Everyone reading this is using a "product" to do so. I just ate some nice lunch made from products purchased at the store.) When the younger folks on here grow up and have to actually work for a living in order to survive, you will understand the value (nay, the necessity) of charging money for one's time, experience and services ( which are all products by the way.) And if I chose to, I could easily exploit my knowledge and get alot more attention and students, but the karmic price is too high. I have lost students who felt I was holding out on them. And they were right. They weren't ready or mature enough to handle the higher level teachings. Don't get me wrong, if I had a large enough student base to be able to travel around the world to large auditoriums full of people and making good money, I would be happy to do so. But that is not why I teach... But I digress...

 

This isn't about my professional reputation. Only my local students who have trained with me in person for at least a few months IMO, are the only ones who have any real experience to judge my professional reputation as a teacher. It would be unrealistic for me to expect anyone who has never trained with me in person to have a knowledgable experience of me. So, I am not trying to salvage that reputation here. This is my online community. You are my online Taoist family. That is my point here.

 

My experience here is simply one person on this forum who wanted to feel safe among friends. I wanted to portray and exemplify what I consider to be a healthy balance of speaking your feelings and observations freely BUT with consciousness and intelligence. I do not think some on this forum know the difference between a healthy expression of anger and an all out personal attack. I understand this is inevitable on a forum, but I believe we as a community could decide to change that. In this particular instance, I wanted to show that on a personal level for someone to accuse me of theft, plagiarism and deceit was just too below the belt for me on a personal level in an environment that I wanted to consider as a community of friends. I have never expected that on an internet forum that there wouldn't be crazy destructive people. But, if this is to be the community that I want it to be, there has to be some agreement on civility. This is the responsibility of the mods.

 

I honestly expected that the mods would see that accusing someone of theft, plagiarism and deceit without proof other than conjecture based on similarity was by definition a personal insult and worthy of action. What I did not understand was that apparently calling someone "stupid" is an insult and is worthy of mod action. But directly implying that someone is a liar, thief and charlatan is just being critical and is OK. IMO, it is a very serious personal insult. I did not realize that it was actionable by law... I have no desire to sue anybody so, Sean don't worry...

 

I have been considering this move away from TTB's for some time because as I stated earlier, my quality of mind has suffered from allowing myself to become influenced by the negative aspect of the online environment. That is only my fault. I am responsible for how I choose to feel. However, I do also need to be humble enough to know when I need to acknowledge my humanity and take appropriate action to protect my own health.

 

When the mods wrote back that they saw Scotty's actions as merely being harsh criticism of a teacher rather than a personal insult toward a member of the community, I resolved that it was time for me to leave. But before I left, I wanted to hopefully spark a good discussion about the importance of community and our collective responsibility to protect that community. I find this forum to be unique in the online world. It has been sad for me to watch it continue to devolve into just another flame war forum. I am sad to see the quality of information also devolve. I understand that is natural as more and more old timers leave and more and more younger internet generation solo practitioners arrive. And even though I am fully prepared to leave for my own personal reasons, I just didn't feel like I could just walk away without trying to do something to leave this place better than when I found it...

 

In any case, I haven't heard back from the mods yet. In their defense, I have put them in a rather untenable position by giving them an ultimatum and I don't expect them to cowtao to me. If nothing changes, I will ask them to close my account tomorrow.

Peace,

Mike