tulku Posted October 27, 2011 Nobody wants you to be free, not even your family or your lover Because they can't control you if you are free Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Protector Posted October 27, 2011 Crazy threads trying to make me stuck in a crazy duality loop again Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Astral_Anima Posted October 27, 2011 Nobody wants you to be free, not even your family or your lover Because they can't control you if you are free Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zanshin Posted October 27, 2011 (edited) ... Edited April 19, 2020 by zanshin Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
doc benway Posted October 27, 2011 Nobody wants you to be free, not even your family or your lover Because they can't control you if you are free So true! And it's also very instructive to see that potential (or tendency) to treat others in a similar fashion, intentionally or otherwise. It can be subtle and elusive and takes a lot of attention to see and eliminate. The way to transcend this is to understand that we do NOT need others for our happiness - no one. We've been brainwashed to think that our happiness depends on others but it doesn't, it comes from inside. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted October 27, 2011 Freedom is for the birds, ... And anyone who wishes to fly. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Everything Posted October 27, 2011 Freedom is for slaves. "In a truely free society, no one needs to tell you that you are free." Jacques Fresco "None are more enslaved then those who falsely believe they are free." Forgot Name "Climbing on top of your fellow slaves is not the way to freedom." Definitely not Obama Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Birch Posted October 27, 2011 So true! And it's also very instructive to see that potential (or tendency) to treat others in a similar fashion, intentionally or otherwise. It can be subtle and elusive and takes a lot of attention to see and eliminate. The way to transcend this is to understand that we do NOT need others for our happiness - no one. We've been brainwashed to think that our happiness depends on others but it doesn't, it comes from inside. I concur. Excellent post Steve Although the part about the brainwashing. I think it hooks in to an initially natural situation (if you're 3 years old and your family are mistreating you, you don't just get up, pack a bag and leave, do you? I think i read a story about that once) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thelerner Posted October 27, 2011 In a codependent relationship, you're less free; it comes with responsibilities, but there are payoffs; love, support, companionship.. Our responsibilities limit our freedom, yet are often the things that make us grow and mature. Like everything know what your trading for in advance. You can't choose your family, but you can say adios at adulthood. Lovers and friends are your choice. What one person feels is control is another persons advice to wake up. We all have blind spots and we need true friends to point them out, even when its painful. 2 1/2 bits 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RiverSnake Posted October 27, 2011 (edited) The process of Meditation or Cultivation means that you are slowly erasing the limitations that used to bind your being via negative thoughts, emotional blockages...etc -People in groups often get along because they have common limitations. At school you often see the EMO kids hanging out with each other and the Black or Asian kids all at one table. IMO this is because they common limitations. Culture, Family and the sociological environment we grow up in often define our limitations. However, when we start Cultivation you will find that the people whom you were once close to will begin to feel like strangers to you, you can no longer talk to them about everything because you have grown beyond them. I once read on this forum that someone whom was married ended up getting divorced because after meditating he became to different from his wife and they no longer had anything in common. To make my point, when you walk around with less limitations your Friends, Family, and Lovers will feel insecure because you know that you can be happy with out them (and they can feel this) and you're very energy threatens the attachments they have to you. As a result they will often unconsciously and unsuccessfully try and put their limitations on you due to their own insecurity or they will just stop hanging out with you. IMO Parents and Children often butt heads because the parents want kids to conform like good soldiers and try to put the limitations they are comfortable with on the children. However, kids don't feel like being set in stone just yet and want to go out and play life. -Don't get me wrong: Friends and lovers are important, but you gotta find some with a similar vibe otherwise just like everywhere else in society you gotta put on a mask so you can blend in with sheep-herd. -My 2 cents, Peace Edited October 27, 2011 by OldGreen Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
konchog uma Posted October 27, 2011 I'm with Apech, cheer up tulku. What is this "freedom" that you are seeming to blame others from keeping you from? Can you define freedom? Maybe if you stopped blaming others and took responsibility for your own "freedom" you would find that nobody can stand in the way of one who has set their intent on freedom, not even family or lovers. Also, i think there are people who want you to be free, and while you might not be blessed with family that wants this, some people are, and while you might have a hard time finding a lover who cares about your personal freedom, they exist. More reasons to quit looking outside yourself for the reasons you have a hard time feeling free. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
doc benway Posted October 27, 2011 I concur. Excellent post Steve Although the part about the brainwashing. I think it hooks in to an initially natural situation (if you're 3 years old and your family are mistreating you, you don't just get up, pack a bag and leave, do you? I think i read a story about that once) Thanks -K- Good point about children but I see this not so much as whether we leave the other person or not vs. the fact that we are able to see through the hold they have over us. I do think that, during childhood, there are certain conditions that will lead someone to be more dependent on approval of others for happiness and other conditions that foster independence from approval. In general, I think our parenting tends to strongly reinforce the illusion of being dependent on approval of others for happiness. In fact, our entire social and psychological structure does that. Encephalon turned me onto a book about Taoism and parenting that does a really good job of showing this and how to avoid it. Can't remember the title just now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aaron Posted October 27, 2011 Nobody wants you to be free, not even your family or your lover Because they can't control you if you are free Tulku, I'm beginning to think you didn't get enough attention as a child (in fact I have a stinking suspicion you still are a child), with that in mind, I'm not really aware of your own home life, so I can't speak for your family or lover (which you don't have and at the current rate may never have), but I can speak for the majority of people who tend to want what's best for their families. I think you're taking your own experiences and pasting them over everyone else, making what's happened to you be the norm, when I will be the first to tell you, that is in no way true. Anyways, cheer up dude, isn't it close to thanksgiving? You'll be out of school for the holidays in a couple weeks. Just look forward to that and bide your time. It can't rain all the time. Aaron Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
manitou Posted October 27, 2011 If you are talking only about dependent relationships, then what I've said is only going to cause conflict. I have many years of walking this dependent relationship path. My husband and I are both recovering alkies; but two alcoholic personalities living together is nearly impossible in the long run. We've actually made it work for nearly 30 years but only because of the Alanon concept of learning to Stay In Your Own Lane. By staying in your own lane, you depend more on yourself. What Joe does or doesn't do definitely affects me at first; but then there is a minor adjustment that takes place in the psyche and it's possible to detach from the behavior of your partner. I think a lot of why we get irritated at our partners (dependent relationship or not) is because our Egos are tied up with who we are with. We tend to think that we are judged by the person we're with. Upwardly mobile or downwardly mobile, speaking spiritually or economically. No, by nature most of us don't want the other to be free. We want the other person to bow to our agenda and 'make us happy' all the time. Spiritual advancement results in a lessening of this tendency and an ability to see the Essence of the other person despite the outward appearances or behaviors. And of course, if someone gets to the point of Oneness, then one experiences love for all, regardless of how badly they're behaving. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
