The Importance of Practice in one's life

[Aaron]

I realize I've been posting a lot of wild stuff lately, so I thought it would be nice to post something practical again, something others might be able to learn a bit from or share a bit of their own experiences about. With that in mind one of the aspects of my own life that I've been putting a lot of thought into is the idea of practice vs. philosophy.

 

In my own experience I have found that in the past when I am interested in a philosophy or idea, more often than not, I tend to approach it intellectually, in other words I study the philosophy involved in the idea, rather than the practice of the idea. What I have found repeatedly is that trying to learn about a philosophy solely through intellectual study leaves one with only a partial understanding of the practice. In fact it's easy to point out those who practice a specific philosophy from those who have an intellectual understanding.

 

A good example would be Christians. I can identify a person who actively practices Christianity almost immediately from someone who only has an intellectual understanding of Christianity, the same goes for Buddhism, Hinduism, and almost every other religion or philosophy out there. When I have a question about a philosophy, I tend to look for those people that actually practice the philosophy, simply because they tend to have a deeper insight into the actual philosophy, because they experience it on a personal level.

 

In that light it seems to me that one area of our own lives that we can endeavor to improve in, is turning our intellectual curiosity into an actual practice. Now keep in mind this doesn't mean that one should convert to a religion or become a "true believer" but rather that in order to fully understand the practices we're talking about, oftentimes it requires practicing that philosophy. For instance if one is interested in understanding Christianity, then merely understanding the philosophical aspects of the religion will only get you so far, but applying the practices of the religion to one's life will help one to understand the reasoning behind the philosophy much more clearly, so one might be inclined to begin to pray and practice the lifestyle associated with Christianity in order to come to a clearer understanding of why people choose to be Christians and the inherent benefits or harm the practice my hold.

 

I know this is simple simple stuff, but I think it's one of the things we tend to forget when we're beginning our studies or criticizing other people's beliefs. Also I'm not advocating or encouraging the practice of any specific religion, but rather using them as examples.

 

Now the area of practice that I think is most important is understanding one's own ideas and practice. This is perhaps a bit more perplexing in that it involves a great deal of introspection and thought, in particular investigating one's own beliefs, the root of those beliefs and then putting into practice those beliefs. Simply defining one's beliefs can only provide a certain degree of benefit to one's life, but applying one's beliefs to their daily life can create a dynamic change in the way one understands who they are. Now the benefit of examining one's beliefs is that we can also come to a realization about those beliefs, for instance we may believe that helping others is the right thing to do, but we may not actually practice this in our lives. Investigating this belief will help us to understand the nature of that belief, why it is actually the right thing to do (for us), and whether or not this is something we should start to practice in our lives. If after investigating the nature of this belief, we choose to begin to practice it, then through that practice we can actually expand our understanding of that belief by experiencing it in action.

 

Anyways, this is a very limited examination, and it stems from my own experiences in regards to learning to practice what I believe, rather than have them float around as abstract concepts. I'm interested in hearing other people's experiences in this regard, so if you have any please share.

 

Aaron

[Nilo]

Practice grounds the realisations and acutalises them in your direct experience.

[Jetsun]

I don't think I have ever met a Christian who has managed to turn their church preaching into actual practice, well they don't seem any more at peace or compassionate than your average atheist anyway, which shows to me that all the intellectual understanding and teachings do nothing without a transformational practice like meditation, which is the problem with mainstream versions of the main religions is that the practical techniques have been lost, or purposefully removed. It may even be that all the preaching and rules and intellectual side without the practical method may even make people more unbalanced and more sick because these people are told they should be compassionate and "good Christians" etc but they aren't given the practical methods to transform their negative emotions and their egos, which leaves people in a mountain of shame and guilt about the difference between the way they actually are and the way their religion tells them they should be, which can turn people into outright hypocrites.

[Aaron]

I don't think I have ever met a Christian who has managed to turn their church preaching into actual practice, well they don't seem any more at peace or compassionate than your average atheist anyway, which shows to me that all the intellectual understanding and teachings do nothing without a transformational practice like meditation, which is the problem with mainstream versions of the main religions is that the practical techniques have been lost, or purposefully removed. It may even be that all the preaching and rules and intellectual side without the practical method may even make people more unbalanced and more sick because these people are told they should be compassionate and "good Christians" etc but they aren't given the practical methods to transform their negative emotions and their egos, which leaves people in a mountain of shame and guilt about the difference between the way they actually are and the way their religion tells them they should be, which can turn people into outright hypocrites.

 

 

Hello Jetsun,

 

Very well said. I Think you make some very good points in regards to practice and that your example could be used to represent people from many religions. Again, well said. As devil's advocate, I will say that I've met a lot of Christians that actually seemed to practice their religion, but most were older men and women.

 

Aaron

[zanshin]

I agree about the older people, but it also seems older people more likely to do practices. Kneeling to pray, saying prayers at a certain time or rote prayers, counting on rosary. I met an older Latina lady who told me she says a prayer every day in the shower and lets the water wash all the bad stuff away- sounds like a nice practice.

[doc benway]

Good topic Aaron.

I think it boils down to the difference between thought and experience.

Thought creates images that we equate with experience but it is always missing something.

It's missing the life, the uncertainty, the new.

Thought can never approach something new because once it is known it is not new.

To practice is to open to the new, to wait and accept, rather than express and associate.

I learned the lesson of practice in my Taijiquan and meditation training.

There are things you can never get through thought and analysis.

Practice opens another world.

[RiverSnake]

Philosophy by definition is a way of "Doing Things". If you don't practice then you might as well throw away the philosophy too. IME Mental Masturbation rarely ever helps us live a happier and more blissful life.

 

 

-My 2 cents, Peace

[Aaron]

Philosophy by definition is a way of "Doing Things". If you don't practice then you might as well throw away the philosophy too. IME Mental Masturbation rarely ever helps us live a happier and more blissful life.

 

 

-My 2 cents, Peace

 

I think mental masturbation is fine, but it's like real masturbation, don't mistake your skill in masturbating to indicate your actual prowess in the "real thing".

 

Aaron

[Aaron]

There are things you can never get through thought and analysis.

Practice opens another world.

 

Yes... this is the point I was trying to make. It's also why it's so important to seek out people with practice when you're trying to learn more about a philosophy or practice. A person told me that you don't (necessarily) learn Qigong or Tai Chi to learn about Taoism for instance, that if you ask your instructor about Taoism more times then not they'll just stare out you with a blank face, but oftentimes the good instructors are adepts at Taoist philosophy without ever having read the Tao Teh Ching. Of course there are a great many Qigong and Tai Chi instructors that are well versed in Taoism as well, just something I thought was interesting to learn.

 

Aaron

[Birch]

"There are things you can never get through thought and analysis."

 

Would be good IMO if you said what things Steve, or maybe gave examples?

 

I mean of course, it's the very nature of (some kinds of) thought and (some kinds of) analysis to be unable to give 'insight' or 'perspective' into areas that are not defined by them, given their self-limiting nature. And i find it pretty unfortunate (for myself) that I even understand this. I don't, however, imagine that knowing such a thing suddenly means the (my) doors are flung open to capacities beyond the realms of thought and analysis. At least, not so far much.

 

Edited for typo.

Edited November 3, 2011 by -K-

[doc benway]

Yes... this is the point I was trying to make. It's also why it's so important to seek out people with practice when you're trying to learn more about a philosophy or practice. A person told me that you don't (necessarily) learn Qigong or Tai Chi to learn about Taoism for instance, that if you ask your instructor about Taoism more times then not they'll just stare out you with a blank face, but oftentimes the good instructors are adepts at Taoist philosophy without ever having read the Tao Teh Ching. Of course there are a great many Qigong and Tai Chi instructors that are well versed in Taoism as well, just something I thought was interesting to learn.

 

Aaron

After studying Taijiquan for a few years, I asked my Shifu (a practicing Daoist) to begin teaching me the Daoist meditation. After a few months of practice, I asked him if he could recommend a good English translation of the Dao De Jing. His answer was simply, "no." I asked if that was because he never read it in English, and he replied, "No, it's because I've never read it! Now go and practice. Don't waste your time on books!" I've since come to understand that he was simply making a point - there is theory and there is practice and they occupy very different worlds.

 

 

 

"There are things you can never get through thought and analysis."

 

Would be good IMO if you said what things Steve, or maybe gave examples?

 

I mean of course, it's the very nature of (some kinds of) thought and (some kinds of) analysis to be unable to give 'insight' or 'perspective' into areas that are not defined by them, given their self-limiting nature. And i find it pretty unfortunate (for myself) that I even understand this. I don't, however, imagine that knowing such a thing suddenly means the (my) doors are flung open to capacities beyond the realms of thought and analysis. At least, not so far much.

 

Edited for typo.

Great question!

I don't know if I can do it justice but I'll try.

 

Taijiquan - there are those who spend enormous energy on a theoretical analysis and understanding of Taijiquan. They study the physics, the energetics, the nature of Qi, the history, the philosophy, and they 'know' absolutely nothing about Taijiquan. They read every book and website, they talk the talk but cannot walk the walk. They can't do the form properly and can be pushed over by a light breeze. Taijiquan is inherently experiential, all the theory is nearly worthless when it comes to the practice. Much better to come at the practice with an open and empty mind. Sure, it's fine to be an expert on the theory and philosophy associated with the practice, but it will not help you in the practice at all - you only think it helps. In fact, this is the case with all Qi-related practices. You cannot possibly understand Qi but you can feel it and work with it. The body can understand it but the brain cannot (we say we can but it's completely gratuitous). It's like food - no matter how much you understand the associated chemistry, it cannot provide you with the experience of eating. A menu will never fill the belly or cause the experience of taste (only a memory).

 

The distinction between practice and theory was really driven home to me by reading the works of Jiddu Krishnamurti. We tend to listen with our biases, our ideas, our conditioning. We either agree or disagree with the speaker. Krishnamurti helped me to see that I needed to listen in a completely different way - with my entire being. I cannot agree or disagree. I cannot accept another's opinion or explanation. I must look deeply into what is being discussed, with all of my resources and see for myself the veracity of the statement. I need to see it in my own life, my behavior, my relationships, my experience - I have to go beyond simply agreeing or disagreeing based on my thoughts and images. Very hard to put into words because it sort of goes beyond words. So another example is love. We can talk about it and analyze it all we want, about meta and compassion, passion and lust, and all of that. And it means nothing until the moment that we actually feel the connection between ourselves and the other, between ourselves and every living thing, and then we know what love is.

 

Perhaps the best example of all is awareness. What is it? We can talk about it and describe it and theorize about it's source and location and all of that is completely meaningless. It is not worth one millisecond of the actual experience of conscious awareness.

 

Anyway, not sure if that helps at all - it doesn't sound very satisfying or convincing to me either!

And I'm sure there are some that can debate circles around me.

But I know the truth of it inside.

[Aaron]

After studying Taijiquan for a few years, I asked my Shifu (a practicing Daoist) to begin teaching me the Daoist meditation. After a few months of practice, I asked him if he could recommend a good English translation of the Dao De Jing. His answer was simply, "no." I asked if that was because he never read it in English, and he replied, "No, it's because I've never read it! Now go and practice. Don't waste your time on books!" I've since come to understand that he was simply making a point - there is theory and there is practice and they occupy very different worlds.

 

 

 

 

Great question!

I don't know if I can do it justice but I'll try.

 

Taijiquan - there are those who spend enormous energy on a theoretical analysis and understanding of Taijiquan. They study the physics, the energetics, the nature of Qi, the history, the philosophy, and they 'know' absolutely nothing about Taijiquan. They read every book and website, they talk the talk but cannot walk the walk. They can't do the form properly and can be pushed over by a light breeze. Taijiquan is inherently experiential, all the theory is nearly worthless when it comes to the practice. Much better to come at the practice with an open and empty mind. Sure, it's fine to be an expert on the theory and philosophy associated with the practice, but it will not help you in the practice at all - you only think it helps. In fact, this is the case with all Qi-related practices. You cannot possibly understand Qi but you can feel it and work with it. The body can understand it but the brain cannot (we say we can but it's completely gratuitous). It's like food - no matter how much you understand the associated chemistry, it cannot provide you with the experience of eating. A menu will never fill the belly or cause the experience of taste (only a memory).

 

The distinction between practice and theory was really driven home to me by reading the works of Jiddu Krishnamurti. We tend to listen with our biases, our ideas, our conditioning. We either agree or disagree with the speaker. Krishnamurti helped me to see that I needed to listen in a completely different way - with my entire being. I cannot agree or disagree. I cannot accept another's opinion or explanation. I must look deeply into what is being discussed, with all of my resources and see for myself the veracity of the statement. I need to see it in my own life, my behavior, my relationships, my experience - I have to go beyond simply agreeing or disagreeing based on my thoughts and images. Very hard to put into words because it sort of goes beyond words. So another example is love. We can talk about it and analyze it all we want, about meta and compassion, passion and lust, and all of that. And it means nothing until the moment that we actually feel the connection between ourselves and the other, between ourselves and every living thing, and then we know what love is.

 

Perhaps the best example of all is awareness. What is it? We can talk about it and describe it and theorize about it's source and location and all of that is completely meaningless. It is not worth one millisecond of the actual experience of conscious awareness.

 

Anyway, not sure if that helps at all - it doesn't sound very satisfying or convincing to me either!

And I'm sure there are some that can debate circles around me.

But I know the truth of it inside.

 

 

Very beautiful. Well said Steve. I think if it was convincing, it wouldn't be very honest.

 

Aaron

[Rishi Das]

Great topic, thanks a lot for posting this. Recently in my life I have really realized this concept. Like you mentioned in your first post, the basic idea is pretty straight forward and easy to grasp although it seems that many people have completely forgotten about this portion of the life experience; including myself for a long time. At the moment in my life I realize it is time to start walking the walk instead of just talking the talk because quite frankly my walking is definitely not as efficient as my talking. I am really grateful to be finding TaoBums, and really appreciate the post.

[LBDaoist]

In many ways, most of the Taoist philosophy can only be truly understood when perceived through the lens of personal practice and direct experience.

 

The passage from the Tao Te Ching about warhorses running rough shod over the field, versus being retired to tend those fields is just as relevant to internal training methods, as it is to the politics and philosophies of war and its effect upon society. There are so many passages in that book that on the surface seem to be speaking of human interaction in society, yet once we develop a connection with our internal practices, become a source of guidance to further those practices.

 

In fact, on the few occasions when I have met people who claim to be Taoists yet who swear that they are "only focused on the philosophy", I realize that they are impoverished in their understanding and practice. A person will never "get" it unless they walk the path.

[Aaron]

I don't necessarily believe that in order to understand the Tao or Taoism, one must practice Tai Chi or Qigong, rather one mast apply the lessons one learns from Taoism. It doesn't hurt to practice Tai Chi or Qigong, but it isn't a necessity. In my own Taoist practice (when I still believed one could be such a thing) I basically meditated a bit each day and tried to practice what I learned in the Tao Teh Ching and other manuscripts. I remember early on I was quite spontaneous and the girls (and guys) loved it. I was funny, carefree, and really very at ease with the world, then the young man (twenty-ish) became a man (thirty-ish) and started to be more practical. To be honest the twenty-ish fella probably had it right all along, at least in regards to how one practices Taoism.

 

Aaron

[doc benway]

I don't necessarily believe that in order to understand the Tao or Taoism, one must practice Tai Chi or Qigong, rather one mast apply the lessons one learns from Taoism. It doesn't hurt to practice Tai Chi or Qigong, but it isn't a necessity.

For me, the experience of Daoism has been very different with and without Daoist practices

[Aaron]

For me, the experience of Daoism has been very different with and without Daoist practices

 

I think one could say that the experience of Tai Chi changes if one practices Taoism as well. It's kind of circular logic, not that it's a bad thing. My point was that it really wasn't necessary, even though it might be beneficial to the overall experience.

 

I wanted to practice Tai Chi, but could never find any instructors where I lived in Washington, despite the fact there was a large Asian community (predominately Chinese and Korean) in Olympia at that time. When I moved back to Florida there was a Kung Fu school across the street from me, but they didn't teach Tai Chi at that time. When they finally decided to have an instructor teach at the school, I lost interest in the idea of learning it (mostly because I don't follow Taoism anymore, but rather I practice a more Vendantic/Buddhist approach).

 

I'm almost glad I didn't, because I'm certain if I did, then I would've been less inclined to search other traditions and eventually reach the place I have now. Which leads me to believe that everything happens for a reason.

 

Aaron