Sameness

[Jeff]

[deci belle]

This is getting rhetorical, Jeff.

[Harmonious Emptiness]

The meaning of terms like heart and mind depend on the culture and tradition. Sometimes they mean the same, more often they do not. Most often one quiets (or ignores ) the thoughts of the mind to "feel" with the heart. If one is engaged (giving energy to) a thought, can one experience "suchness"?

 

 

I don't know man, I try not to think about it too much

[Jeff]

This is getting rhetorical, Jeff.

 

Sorry, I did not mean to cause any irritation. I will stop.

 

Just trying to figure out how "suchness" (or oneness) could have a separate place to put things.

 

Thanks again and have a great week.

 

[Jeff]

I don't know man, I try not to think about it too much

 

[konchog uma]

thanks decibelle and HE for your elucidations

 

suchness is hard to talk about, and for people who like things pinned down in a left brained way, it doesn't lend itself to that easily. I could not approach mahamudra until i was using both hemispheres in tandem, and even then i could not approach mahamudra BY using both hemispheres in tandem, if that means thinking.

 

So as a comment to Jeff, suchness is the self-evident isness or the unfabricated nature of something. When you try to pin it down and define it, you fabricate it. Suchness can be experienced, but its really hard to adequately define. IME it only appears when you stop trying to rationalize it, and think logically about but where is the suchness of so-and-so or thoughts like that... the suchness of it is right in front of your face! lol forest for the trees yknow? Like decibelle said its not that "suchness is _______"... suchness is suchness, it just is.

[Jeff]

thanks decibelle and HE for your elucidations

 

suchness is hard to talk about, and for people who like things pinned down in a left brained way, it doesn't lend itself to that easily. I could not approach mahamudra until i was using both hemispheres in tandem, and even then i could not approach mahamudra BY using both hemispheres in tandem, if that means thinking.

 

So as a comment to Jeff, suchness is the self-evident isness or the unfabricated nature of something. When you try to pin it down and define it, you fabricate it. Suchness can be experienced, but its really hard to adequately define. IME it only appears when you stop trying to rationalize it, and think logically about but where is the suchness of so-and-so or thoughts like that... the suchness of it is right in front of your face! lol forest for the trees yknow? Like decibelle said its not that "suchness is _______"... suchness is suchness, it just is.

 

Some very good points. As you said, Suchness/awareness/oneness just "is".

 

But, it is not a product of the mind or experienced from the mind. One may experiences it though the "heart", but the heart does not "desire". Only the mind/ego desires. It is also not a separate thing were bits can be stored.

 

[deci belle]

Don't be sorry, mon ami❤

 

The mystery is boundless.

 

Not separate; nothing stored.

 

Now can you accept that it is necessary to "dance around it" because what is key here is uncreated.

 

Awareness is not a thing. It does not exist. What is alive and aware has actually never existed ever. Never has, never will. Miraculous awareness. I just want to weep! How do you work with what is the same?

 

When you're feeling lucky, seal it away and forget about it.

 

Nothing will happen~ over and over and over.

 

That is an example of what it feels like and what to do with it.

 

After a long time, it becomes you as you respond to conditions.

 

Only when one ceases the illusion of separateness can one work with essence.

 

This is entry into the inconceivable; there is nothing to understand.

[Jeff]

Now can you accept that it is necessary to "dance around it" because what is key here is uncreated.

 

Or not "yet" manifest.

 

Awareness is not a thing. It does not exist. What is alive and aware has actually never existed ever. Never has, never will. Miraculous awareness. I just want to weep! How do you work with what is the same?

 

Only when one ceases the illusion of separateness can one work with essence.

 

 

What exists (or is the same) is also suchness/awareness/oneness. It arises and it returns. Always interesting, with infinite possibilities.

 

Edited July 23, 2012 by Jeff

[deci belle]

[Jeff]

[deci belle]

The point is that only a complete ignoramus can stumble upon complete reality, Jeff.

 

May I suggest you review the first ten pages of Crazy Wisdom by Chogyam Trungpa, Shambhala 1991.