TzuJanLi Posted November 30, 2011 Greetings.. If the teacher is authentic, money makes no difference.. if the teacher has the means to teach for free, that's their choice.. if the teacher needs to subsidize what income they may or may not have, that's not an issue, if the teacher is authentic.. The notion that there is some inherent principle that precludes charging for 'services rendered and value received', is just wishful thinking.. freeloaders wanting to take advantage of a tradition where nothing was charged, but honor and respect of the students made certain that their teacher was cared for.. times have changed, and Taoists adapt.. Be well.. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChiDragon Posted November 30, 2011 Place a donation box at the entrance of the class room would be beneficial... The teacher has to pay the rent for the class room and the water for the restroom, too, you know. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
suninmyeyes Posted November 30, 2011 I have met quite a few teachers who dont charge anything and they are doing finacially just fine either by having a regular work life or living as hermits. There is nothing wrong in charging and nothing wrong in not charging IMO depends on a teacher and what s/he teaches. The only thing to watch out for both as a student and a teacher is greed. Greed often wears a clever guise of right action. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
therion Posted November 30, 2011 If a real master* asks you for money he is trying to fool you because you're a fool. If he is honestly wanting money for his services he is not a real master. As real teachers are kind of rare these days it's better to take every experience as a teacher. That way you get the teaching BUT YOU DON'T PAY A DIME. You become enlightened without becoming homeless. *good luck finding one) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mudryah Posted December 1, 2011 Why would I charge a person to show them how to save their life? So $50-$100 a month is how much your life is worth? Can you imagine the police charging you everytime they caught the robber that robbed your house? If you are a lineage holder I understand but other than that it makes no sense. I had a teacher tell me I need to pay $500 a month because he does not work and he has kids. Come on!!!!! I would be paying his rent!!! I teach for free but I do accept donation if people want to give because I help raise money for a youth program I was apart of as a child but that's it. If people give donations or not I am not going to stop teaching someone how to help save their life and others. You people on here are some book priest, kung fu fantasy, thinking I know everything because I read a $14.99 book on Taoism. Come on!!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eternal_Student Posted December 1, 2011 I'm going to respond from the old paradigm, the current paradigm, and then respond from what I hope will be the new paradigm. In the older days, students would pay their way by doing chores, upkeep on the facility, family help in raising the teacher's children(aka Uncle whatever), security for the facility from other competitive schools, perform advertising through talking of the endeavors of the school, etc. No teaching has ever been for free. You don't understand how things were run in China. Spiritual and martial schools were competing businesses and they fiercely competed! I have been practicing for over 19 years now, teaching for the last 11. I am an acupuncturist by trade and have long term apprentices in a program that graduates students towards sitting for the NCCAOM board exams. Am I supposed to just hand over the years of investment in my time and energy because someone has an idea that teaching should be for free? I spent around 100,000 dollars for my medical education, should that have been for free? Should I let my family of two children and a wife go hungry because someone thinks there is better karma in teachings for free? How does a doctor become a doctor? Can you get even an ITT tech education for free? Physical existence is important for you to even access the spiritual realm. Maslow's hierarchy of needs is a relevant system to how things are set up now. How can you think of God when your belly has been empty for weeks? Some can, but primal needs need to be met as well. Now, I think the question should be, why do we even have money? Why don't we have a system that is set up to deliver all of the basic primal needs since we have the best technology level of all recorded history to this point? Why is anyone homeless or hungry in 2011? What would the world look like if there were no politicians handing down orders, but stood a system that was set up to provide food, shelter and medical needs to everyone? Then once all of the needs are met, a person can investigate whatever profession or realm of existence they desired for free? What if money wasn't the issue but is just a symptom of the root problem of the illness? The absurdity is really the current paradigm and true spiritual endeavors should not be tainted by this system. They just have to adapt to how things are currently and hopefully evolve them towards something better. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TzuJanLi Posted December 1, 2011 Greetings.. Now, I think the question should be, why do we even have money? Why don't we have a system that is set up to deliver all of the basic primal needs since we have the best technology level of all recorded history to this point? Why is anyone homeless or hungry in 2011? What would the world look like if there were no politicians handing down orders, but stood a system that was set up to provide food, shelter and medical needs to everyone? Then once all of the needs are met, a person can investigate whatever profession or realm of existence they desired for free? What if money wasn't the issue but is just a symptom of the root problem of the illness? The absurdity is really the current paradigm and true spiritual endeavors should not be tainted by this system. They just have to adapt to how things are currently and hopefully evolve them towards something better. There is a 'way'! Be well.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aetherous Posted December 1, 2011 No teaching has ever been for free. Passion is payment enough! As I was told, this is actually the old way. There is always a karmic exchange, you could say, but it doesn't need to be determined by the teacher...say for instance, doing the teacher's chores or work for him. The chores and work are also part of the teacher's duty, and doing them himself is part of what it means to lead by example. I have been practicing for over 19 years now, teaching for the last 11. I am an acupuncturist by trade and have long term apprentices in a program that graduates students towards sitting for the NCCAOM board exams. Am I supposed to just hand over the years of investment in my time and energy because someone has an idea that teaching should be for free? I spent around 100,000 dollars for my medical education, should that have been for free? Should I let my family of two children and a wife go hungry because someone thinks there is better karma in teachings for free? How does a doctor become a doctor? Can you get even an ITT tech education for free?Physical existence is important for you to even access the spiritual realm. Maslow's hierarchy of needs is a relevant system to how things are set up now. How can you think of God when your belly has been empty for weeks? Some can, but primal needs need to be met as well. You are talking about the healing profession, which everyone pays for (for better or worse, hopefully better). No one is questioning whether to pay their acupuncturist. I think we are talking about spiritual teachers (that includes alchemy). A healer does the work, a spiritual teacher can't do the work for the student! You must walk your own path. So students these days are paying in every way, and teachers are reaping every reward. Which do you think the Tao favors? Why is anyone homeless or hungry in 2011? I agree, it's horrible...especially having been there myself, briefly for a few days. Damn. Seems we are heartless. But there are principles that are really good which have caused this. Like the idea of personal liberty...where people can earn money without (much) government interference. Then once all of the needs are met, a person can investigate whatever profession or realm of existence they desired for free? What if money wasn't the issue but is just a symptom of the root problem of the illness? I like your ideas, although implementing them would be chaos. Your needs are met through your acupuncture profession, right? So then you have the capability to teach spirituality for free! You can be part of your own solution. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
joeblast Posted December 1, 2011 If any of my teachers do not charge me, I make sure to pay them anyway, so that they may be able to continue teaching myself as well as others. Although once at first with one of them I didnt quite "present it properly" and of course I wasnt fast enough to just slip it into his jacket pocket 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mudryah Posted December 1, 2011 (edited) I live differently from most of you if you have never lived in bad neighborhoods where there is people that only make enough to pay rent and food for the week and someitmes no food at all. So I never ask for money from the poor. I have my own money why take someone elses? Buddha never asked for money and Yahushua (Jesus) never asked for money. But if you are like the person above and you studied Acupuncture/TCM that's different but see I know a guy (an acupuncturist) that went to New Orleans and gave free services to the people during their crisis. It depends on the situation now if I lived in Hollywood I would charge because people can offord it but if some folks can't , even if they are from Hollywood, I wont charge. If I live in Compton, CA I wont charge as much because they are suffering. It depends on the situation. There are doctors and teachers that take peoples money and dissapeare so I would trust the guy that does not mind me paying him or not. Edited December 1, 2011 by Mudryah Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
