Released: Seeking the Master of Mo Pai: Adventures with John Chang by Jim McMillan

[Thunder_Gooch]

Don't know why you keep stating this as fact. Be honest you have no idea.

 

 

 

 

“I have wanted to do so; you are preaching to the choir, Kosta,” he said softly. “I have gone to China twice looking for people like myself, hoping to find a brother. I was unsuccessful both times.” “But you know of their existence now?” I asked. “Yes,” he said. “I know that there are for sure two and I can sense eight more. I think that there are at least ten.”

 

Danaos, Kosta The Magus of Java (p. 93)

[YMWong]

No it shouldn't, there are 10 beings at or above his level alive on earth. That's it.

 

You know a lot then

 

So you don't personally know JC, please correct me if I am wrong, so you don't really know "his level" (to use your words) and yet you are convinced that "there are only 10 ecc ecc"

 

Nice

 

YM

[Thunder_Gooch]

You know a lot then So you don't personally know JC, please correct me if I am wrong, so you don't really know "his level" (to use your words) and yet you are convinced that "there are only 10 ecc ecc" Nice YM

 

Thanks.

[Ish]

Still not fact. Besides even if John Chang said that, using the sensing ability of a level 20~ or whatever he supposedly is would not be an absolute measure would it?

[Thunder_Gooch]

Educated guess, more than acceptable for my purposes.

 

The most advanced being known to the public can locate 10 others like himself when he taps into 100% of his total power.

 

What chance do you think you or I have of finding some of the ones equipped stealth neigong radar shielding technology?

 

 

 

Still not fact. Besides even if John Chang said that, using the sensing ability of a level 20~ or whatever he supposedly is would not be an absolute measure would it?

Edited May 3, 2013 by More_Pie_Guy

[林愛偉]

On the contrary, in Chinese culture, a Shifu (sifu) is a father and a teacher. The actual characters don't signify "master" at all.

师傅 ： someone skilled at something, and makes a living by it. 师父 师-teacher, 父- father.

There is a saying which goes, One day a teacher, a lifetime a father.

 

On the other hand, western ideas of teacher go very much into the emotional dependency/ I pay you, so teach me - mindset.

 

I had a student for Wing Chun once who complained our mirrors were dirty. I smiled, got out the windex and paper towels, and told him to start wiping. He refused very bluntly and with arrogance, stating how he pays me tuition, and so his job is to simply practice what I teach, get what I know, and move on, not to clean. I replied very sternly and laughing, well, if that's how you assume, then you are definitely in the wrong place. I continued, look at your fellow brothers and sisters. Do you actually think they are here because they want what I know, or they are trying to show their diligence in practicing what I choose to give them? On the other hand, I personally don't need this school, the stress and the threats on my life because of this place. No its not truthfully a martial art school, but a cultivation school. Since you don't wish to cultivate being clean, leave. By the way, you pay me tuition so I can pay the rent and make your life comfortable. If I were actually making loads of money off my students, would I truthfully bother renting such a small place? Either clean the mirrors, or leave without a refund.

 

Everyone urged him to clean, and he did. Then, he realized that a student's place isn't to get as much as possible from the teacher. It is to apply themselves as much as possible to what the teacher does give.

 

Hence, why i don't charge for cultivation, and nowadays I don't even charge for my teaching Martial Arts..I think I have to update my English website on that one. hahaha I can't guarantee anyone's progression, because people are totally different in capacities, but I can guarantee they will understand how to figure it out on their own at some point. Money isn't buying powers, or realizations, or peace of mind. It would support my family but it most def will not guarantee my student's realization of enlightenment.

 

 

I agree there are some cultural differences here, although not necessarily all the ones you believe.

In traditional Taoism, teachers choose their students. Or, one might even say, they allow the Tao to choose their students for them. Now since the relationship is an extremely one-sided "paternalistic" mentorship, the students are essentially honored, lucky and "indebted" to receive whatever they are offered - since they have little to offer back (maybe only to "pay it forward?").

And, if a teacher doesn't seek a student out, accepts no payment and makes no promises...then he is under even less "obligation."

In the West, life is more compartmentalized as the saying goes - "don't mix business with pleasure." A student might happen to develop a genuine friendship with a mentor, but more often than not, it is basically just a friendly financial transaction that ends whenever the payments do. There are a lot less complicated strings this way and less vetting needed, but these relationships also may not run as deep or intimate (which would risk becoming "unprofessional" liaisons).

I think in both cultures though, many students DO often subconsciously seek a father figure in spiritual gurus. Even if that guru does not want or proclaim that role himself. (I "saw" this quite a bit in Kunlun, for instance - even though Max himself was reluctant to be anything much more than an instructor.)

ANYHOW...this could get into a much longer discussion on cultural viewpoints and political history... *yawn*


But, I think what might be more relevant in this particular case may be more specific to the MoPai lineage itself. In The Magus Of Java, Chapter 5 recounts deadly clannish rivalries and genocidal massacres between the Liao & Pu villages involving Sifu Liao Zu Tong, his teacher Pai Lok Nen and Warlord Lim. In this context, loyalist defenders swallowed their anger for years while training for vengeance. John compared this situation to Jews vs Nazis or Kosta's own native Balkans...

Today, John himself appears somewhat torn between loyalties to his native ancestral neigong.and Western Christian dogma that attempts to both demonize, yet pirate it. And of course, on a larger scale, "Asian vs Western" students have simply replaced the old "Liao's vs Pu's." In fact, who knows...maybe some of these various students could even be reincarnated souls from either family! Here to try to resolve their conflicts again!

 

Because history repeats itself until you solve it! Therefore, the themes of tribal warfare and mistrust seem to resonate in this soul group like an echo chamber.

 

I feel like...there is actually the potential for a LOT of mass healing of entire generations of people here through all this drama, though...if handled in the right skillful, insightful manner...

 

Anyhow, just another drive-by psychoanalysis here... Marinate overnight & tenderize, folks!

[YMWong]

The most advanced being known to the public [...]

 

[...] according to a book written by a guy you don't know, about another guy you have never met

 

But of course, if that is "acceptable for your purposes" ... good luck!

 

 

YM

[thunderindo]

.

Edited September 20, 2013 by thunderindo

[Ish]

Educated guess, more than acceptable for my purposes.

 

The most advanced being known to the public can locate 10 others like himself when he taps into 100% of his total power.

 

What chance do you think you or I have of finding some of the ones equipped stealth neigong radar shielding technology?

 

The masters who were at such a level to be able to dissolve their physical body into light are IMO at a much much higher level than Chang.

That is a higher level of immortality than the Yang shen in taoism (afaik).

 

There have been numerous accounts of this even in recent times.

[Thunder_Gooch]

Thanks you too.

 

[...] according to a book written by a guy you don't know, about another guy you have never met

But of course, if that is "acceptable for your purposes" ... good luck!



YM

[Thunder_Gooch]

Reference?

 

 

The masters who were at such a level to be able to dissolve their physical body into light are IMO at a much much higher level than Chang.

That is a higher level of immortality than the Yang shen in taoism (afaik).

 

There have been numerous accounts of this even in recent times.

[Ish]

Reference?

 

I will add more when i have time but briefly:

http://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f=78&t=2186

 

From "Heart Drops of Dharmakaya" , it has other accounts of rainbow body including that one.

 

 

You can research more on Illusory Body and Rainbow Body. Both are attainments giving "immortality" in Buddhism.

There are various grades of rainbow body also.

[Thunder_Gooch]

Not my cup of tea, but thanks anyway.

[Kasuku]

Where do you get this information from? Is it from others via internet forums, or have you actually spoken directly to Wang Liping and he claims to personally be able to make incredibly dense 500ft wide chi fields?

No you read his manual, his bio, and testimonials from his own students and listen to what he says to them, and compare with mopai levels. At level 10 ur chi field is around 3 ft (DENSE ONE) - idk how the chi field correlates to levels of power, like the ratio, ud have to ask someone whos attained that level...

Has a Mo Pai student/teacher said anything about voltages corresponding to certain levels?

For normal people chang uses less .5 % of his power at level 20 otherwise it would kill them. maximum natural human electrical voltage is around 0.01 volts. Each level u double ur power - so max 2a is .2 - 4 is 0.04 - Do the math - at 20 its around 1000 (its prob not exactly 'double') but this is all estimated - you see why at level 60 and above ud turn into a ball of light!

I'm just wondering if this stuff is 'commonly known' from some texts/teaching somewhere... or is everyone on this forum just making things up as they go along?

yes its commonly known.. but its all coded and hard to decipher without experiencing it yourself - therefore one needs to train and not just guess

[Friend]

Edited August 17, 2013 by Friend

[h.uriahr]

The 3ft qi field is interesting.

Waysun Liao says that you want your TE to radiate out 3ft. That's when the real fun begins

[Kasuku]

sifu rel has 3 ft

[abandonhope]

sifu rel has 3 ft

Prove this.

[Lukman Surjana]

No it shouldn't, there are 10 beings at or above his level alive on earth. That's it.

 

If there are thousands who possess knowledge of systems like his that can do the same thing, but just haven't achieved it yet, that I don't know.

 

There may be thousands of them, I am unsure.

 

What I do know is the vast majority of all other teachers are just Lumber Jacks to me.

 

 

Your seeming to forget the high level master are capable of moving and hiding their chi from those below their own levels ? Every mopai students are taught to do this, in fact john chang does it when he will visits china and abroad. He will tell you he is not capable of detecting teachers of a much higher calibre, but is only at his levels close or similar to his.

 

Do you forget the stories about the golden light challenging master chang and defeating with him ? Were you aware this man lived in the same town and was only reminding to remain humble ?

 

Kostas books are not neikung bibles. You must EMPTY YOUR CUP as bruce lee says.

Edited May 3, 2013 by Lukman Surjana

[Friend]

Edited August 17, 2013 by Friend

[voidisyinyang]

The chi field deal is funny because the shen transmission is non-local. Someone posting on this thread just had their third eye expanded via a phone healing today -- as they reported to me. I won't say who it is. I'm just saying that there are qigong masters who do the shen spirit laser holographic transmissions. Anyone can call 1-952-593-5555 to get the phone energy transmission.

 

For me -- I know I am low level but it is true you can sense the energy of people lower than you -- so if someone has their electromagnetic spirit below their 2nd chakra then I can sense that - and that is also non-dual - so I can sense it online or just by eye contact or long distance. So I have caused people to contact me if I focus on them when I am focusing my third eye energy.

 

So yes also people will take your energy if they can sense it and so I was told until I can get my energy to higher level - then people will not even be able to sense I have energy for them to take.

 

The more you go into the Emptiness then the more power you have so it makes sense that a golden light immortal would show up to John Chang to make sure he stays humble. Qigong master Chunyi Lin says he knows golden immortal masters in the mountains of China but of course he can not share their names. haha.

Edited May 3, 2013 by pythagoreanfulllotus

[r.w.smith]

Please tell the story.

'seandenty', on 13 October 2006 - 11:53 PM, said:

The following story was told to me by Kostas senior student in Greece. Several of Sherfu's students witnessed the whole thing go down. I posted this on Shaolin Wahnam three years ago.

 

"One day at Sifu John Changs clinic in Java, three acupuncture needles mysteriously appeared in the wall. Sifu and his students were at a loss as to how this could have occurred. The following day the same thing happened. This continued for several days; each day Sifu would return from lunch to find three more needles in the wall.

 

At some point he sensed a presence in the room as three needles rose out of their cabinet, turned toward the wall, and shot across the room, imbedding deeply into the wall. John called out to this mysterious presence, show yourself coward. Presently a ball of condensed golden light floated into the room. Recognizing a challenge for what it was, he shot an energy blast from his palm directly at the sphere. The sphere in response deftly evaded the strike and remained floating nonchalantly in the air. What followed was an intense but largely one sided dual. The students who where present said that at one point Sifu Changs body literally became a blur as he moved faster and faster in his attempts to strike the sphere. After a while he gave up and the ball left as mysteriously as it had arrived.

 

A couple days later, while Sifu was away on business, a man came calling at his home. His wife answered the door and man asked her to deliver the following message to Sifu: dont be too proud. Neither Sifu, nor his students knew this man and he never returned."

 

Actually the story was to be continued several years later, as Sherfu's senior student received an offer from the mysterious challenger to come and study with him when Sherfu retired.

 

I don't expect anyone to believe me and quite frankly, who would. This is the will of the masters to remain beyond the veil. Actually, there may be a documentary in the works in the next few years that will involve David's masters. If it happens, I think it's going to change the world as we know it.

 

I'm currently receiving emails and telephone calls from around the world; in some part due to the posting here. Many people who have met Kostas or read the book or seen the documentary, are willing to look past the veil. Personally, I feel it's the beginning of something; just like Kostas book was 6 years ago.

 

I know that some of you out there are just watching and have met John Chang and others perhaps. I would invite you to share... who knows, maybe something good can come of it.

 

Best, Sean

 

http://thetaobums.com/topic/12933-john-chang-versus-mike-tyson/

[林愛偉]

I don't know why there is so much wonder about setting your energy field 3ft or higher. That is kind of basic stuff.

 

I learned that when I was in my early teens and refined it while learning Taiji Quan under Sifu Rudy Curry in Queens, NY.

The practice for it is really easy, but just takes a person to diligently practice it...consistently. Then there are practices which one does to strengthen the will and intent as well as strengthen the field of energy being extended.

 

Over the yrs I have refined it and worked on several different ways, which aren't very much different actually. hahaha

 

I always say, when the time comes to actually have your life in danger, then the skill presents itself. That way, one doesn't get caught up in delusions of grandeur.

 

On occasions, when I felt some drunkard was following me, I would extend my energy to the space around me and he would end up walking, confused about it, away from me while he was trying to walk towards me. Then I would contract the field and he would flow right back in my direction, and then when he got closer, I would send him out again. hahahaha I remember that day, the drunk guy's friend was across the street laughing his drunk butt off while this happened for about 3-5 minutes.

 

Then I turned to the guy and said, Have a nice day! I work here (at the time I was working in a school in China, and he followed me with his friend, scheming on the strange looking white guy in Changpao.) Anyway, when I said good bye to him, I stopped playing with the field, and he stopped dead, looked at me and shook his head.. I over heard him telling his friend, what the hell was that...? I couldn't get near him..what the hell.

 

 

Its no super power, and definitely nothing to be all in wonder about. Can I do it now? I don't know, I really haven't tried to do anything "different" in many years..no need to really.

 

If anyone is interested, here you go. The first step, which can be the only step if you adjust the intent. haha

 

Stand feet shoulder width apart, bend knees very slightly, pull down the tail bone to straighten the back, pull up the head by the crown and tuch the chin down slightly. Drop the chest at the sternum, just a bit. Tongue to the roof of mouth, and anal lock with slight, very slight, contraction, and keep it steady.

 

Now the easy stuff:

 

Hands to the sides of your body, palms facing your legs. Rock forward on your feet, slowly, and when you have your weight on the front toes, balls of feet, slowly rock back on to the heels, placing your weight on the heels, and maintaining balance, without falling over. Then, repeat forward and back. Do as long as you like, but no shorter than 10 minutes. HAHA

 

Then, stop slowly, and center the weight in the center of the foot, letting the pressure move throughout the foot completely. Now rock side to side, but this time, do not lift your foot off the ground. When weight is at the left foot, outer side of the foot (lateral side), the pressure and weight on the right should be on the inner part of the right foot (medial side).

 

Then, continue rocking slowly, back and forth. When you want to go back and forward, stop at the center, and settle the pressure, and then proceed.

 

There are 8 directional rocking, and 1 directional extension and 1 directional expansion.

 

If you want commentary on this practice, set up a thread and bring on the questions.

 

BUT, such a practice, free of charge, so easy and simple, without vengeful spirits and what-nots, along with the only requirement of diligent practice, patience, and dropping the ego...I mean...who would actually do this?

 

Oh, One More Thing! ( hahaha quoting the Jackie Chan Cartoon here)... Disclaimer: You may or may not feel something. i can not guarantee that you will indeed get any further on your own unless you maintain correspondence with me, free of charge too. Also, even with correspondence, I can not guarantee that you will indeed, most definitely be able to do things such as push people away who are trying to hurt you, move objects, fly, walk on water, fade into oblivion and then reappear...etc...and all those fun spiritual power thingies people dream about.

 

I can guarantee that you will get the exact practices that I received, with the same intentions and strengthening of will, which in turn may allow you to realize this way of concentration (ability, but I like the way I say it better, lol) Whether or not you succeed at it is not up to me, but you, and the only way to know if you did get progress is to test it out. But it can only be done naturally. You can not fake your own inherent intuition to protect, and be compassionate.

 

 

okay. There you go. I hope someone decides to play around with this and do something with it. I don't even bother with this anymore unless its for stopping negative energies from poisoning my family...like avian flu, or whatever...lol

 

Enjoy!... take my words with a grain of salt...probably the tiniest. This practice will not harm you, that you can trust me in. It will not harm you, cause you to turn evil, transform into crazy munchkin eating smurfs...you get the point.

 

Peace and Blessings,

Lin

 

(just Lin, Aiwei, or "That Guy"...not the in-question Shifu Lin)

 

Since that Shifu Lin thread is so popular, I just want to make sure no one mistakes me for that guy. hahahahahahahaha

Edited May 4, 2013 by 林愛偉

[Formless Tao]

I could not have explained the below any better then you, Truth Seeker. You hit the nail on the head. Great job

 

 

 

As in another thread current on TaoBums, there is plainly a huge cultural divide between the Indonesian students and the Americans, and every post just seems to flare up more anger. That’s not going to calm down until both sides understand how their cultural perspectives are coloring their ideas. I’ll take a stab at laying out some fundamentals, please correct any mistakes I may make.

 

In the Asian perspective: the student owes the teacher loyalty and obedience, and the teacher is responsible for making sure the training is correct and the student is training safely. There is no “long term contract” though, and at any time the teacher may end the teaching for any reason if he feels that’s the right thing to do. The teacher points to the mountain and explains some things about it, but the student is responsible to climb it alone, at his own pace, and without much hand-holding.

 

Therefore: John Chang has done nothing wrong. He did a Western thing in following his logical mind rather than his spirit ancestors, and he taught the West, because logically all people are the same, so there should be no problem. When problems did arise, he stopped teaching all Westerners, which was his right. Jim and other Westerners were then responsible for finding their own paths. Shifu Chang actually suffered himself by being removed as head of Mopai, and was in no position in any way to help any Westerner continue in Mopai.

 

In the American perspective: a long-term teacher-student relationship often involves emotional intimacy and becomes something of a father-son relationship. The teacher is invested in the student’s progress, and in turn the student feels an obligation to work hard and advance steadily. They go up the mountain together, sharing the experience on an emotional as well as intellectual level. The teacher only ends the relationship if there is a major problem they cannot resolve, and even then the teacher likely feels an obligation to help the student find another teacher.

 

Therefore: Shifu Chang was right to expand Mopai to the West, he just wasn’t careful enough in choosing students (e.g. Verdessi). However, Jim had been a good student up to that point, therefore it was a breach of trust for Shifu Chang to expel him along with the other Westerners. Furthermore, Shifu Chang did not tell Jim personally and did not take any responsibility for Jim’s continued training, such as pointing him in another direction in which he might pursue a similar or “next best” training. And so Jim was angry at Shifu Chang for failing to uphold his teaching responsibilities as defined in the West.

 

Complicating factors:

1. John Chang does not speak English well, so he could not personally fully explain to Jim why Westerners were being kicked out.

 

2. John Chang, it seems, also has the Asian trait of wanting to avoid personal conflict or criticism. Shifu Chang apparently never told Kosta to his face, “Why the hell did you write the book that way?” And also he did not try to personally explain to Jim (e.g. with an interpreter over the phone) why his training must end, as would be absolutely expected of any Western teacher. In Asia, this trait in Shifu Chang shows a gentle person who values harmony, and other people used to this trait would intuitively understand him. In America, this frustrates people and makes them feel like they’re being avoided and they can’t get a straight answer.

 

3. Westerners usually don’t perceive ancestor spirits in the way Asians do, and clearly Jim and Shifu Chang view the spirit of Ancestor May in totally opposite ways. In Asia, not only are spirit ancestors your elders and superiors, but they also have vision and wisdom that we do not because they’re in the spiritual realm. There is a difference between the spirits of departed people (especially high-level masters) and spirits which are often called demons, elementals, djinn, lower devas, etc. – beings who are not human in origin and who should generally be avoided, as Shifu Chang has advised. In (Christian) America, a non-Christian spirit that is trying to guide you is a demon and should be avoided at all costs.

 

And that, my friends, is 75% of why we’re seeing these arguments. The other 25% is emotion, egos, and personality conflicts. 100% of it is surmountable with patience, understanding, and a deflation of egos. But will that happen? Sadly, I seriously doubt it.

 

The obvious problem here is that you can’t hold someone in another culture to the standards of your culture. When a student studies with a teacher, that student has to play by the teacher’s rules. Jim was in Sifu Chang’s world and had to live by those norms. Unfortunately they never had a conversation about what would happen if Sifu Chang could no longer teach, so when that traumatic day came, it was too late to understand each other and avoid very painful feelings.

[Truth Seeker]

I could not have explained the below any better then you, Truth Seeker. You hit the nail on the head. Great job

Thanks, Formless Tao. Being Western myself, I was a bit hesitant writing about the Asian perspective, but I'm glad I at least landed in the ballpark.