Lao Tzu Posted December 23, 2011 yup, and it can be summed up in one word: experience - if you have no experiential understanding, which is obtained by many different forms of meditation, then you are going to flounder in wordville until you get up the gumption to sit down on your rear and practice. I have good experience without any meditation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChiDragon Posted December 23, 2011 According to Huston Smith, Author of my World Religions Textbook. http://www.worldwisdom.com/public/viewpdf/default.aspx?article-title=Taoism_by_Huston_Smith.pdf May I suggest that everyone say something briefly, the way one understands it, instead of use somebody else's lengthy words. This is only a suggestion. Please forgive the unsolicited request.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thunder_Gooch Posted December 23, 2011 (edited) May I suggest that everyone say something briefly, the way one understands it, instead of use somebody else's lengthy words. This is only a suggestion. Please forgive the unsolicited request.... I tried to trim it down as much as possible. Huston Smith does a better job than I could. As I understand it there are many different philosophical schools of taoism, thousands of schools of religious taoism, and perhaps even more of taoist schools which focus on internal arts like neigong, and neidan. Saying meditation has nothing to do with Taoism is a supremely ignorant statement. I used quotes from someone I consider an expert on the subject to support my view. Edited December 23, 2011 by More_Pie_Guy 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thunder_Gooch Posted December 23, 2011 I have good experience without any meditation. You follow a philosophy, or a religious sect of Taoism then. That is fine, but it discounts many other valid schools of Taoism which focus on practices like neigong and meditation. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lao Tzu Posted December 23, 2011 You follow a philosophy, or a religious sect of Taoism then. That is fine, but it discounts many other valid schools of Taoism which focus on practices like neigong and meditation. No, the real Dao is only ONE ! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thunder_Gooch Posted December 23, 2011 No, the real Dao is only ONE ! 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thunder_Gooch Posted December 23, 2011 No, the real Dao is only ONE ! Explain the real Dao and how you practice it, in your own words. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lao Tzu Posted December 23, 2011 Explain the real Dao and how you practice it, in your own words. read the books, follow the ideas, and live in Dao Dao is simple. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Protector Posted December 23, 2011 Every time I look away, there's a new post Get in the chatroom already Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChiDragon Posted December 23, 2011 金丹四百字（张紫阳）: 不可执以无为，不可行于有作，不可泥于存想，不可着于持守，不可枯坐灰心，不可盲修瞎炼。 Four hundred words about NeiDan(Zhang Ziyang): Can not run to inaction, is not feasible to have to make, not like mud in the deposit, not forward to hold on, not just sit and lose heart, not silly religious refining. Perhaps another translation: 不可执以无为， It cannot be just carried out without accomplishment, 不可行于有作， It cannot be executed with intent, 不可泥于存想， It cannot just bury the thoughts in the mud, 不可着于持守， It cannot be just conservative, 不可枯坐灰心， It cannot be just sitting and discouraged, 不可盲修瞎炼。 It cannot be blindly practiced and fanatically cultivated. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thunder_Gooch Posted December 23, 2011 read the books, follow the ideas, and live in Dao Dao is simple. By your own definition you follow a philosophy, that's fine dude. There is nothing wrong with philosophical Taoism. It's a fine philosophy. It isn't the only way however, and following a philosophy does nothing to aid spiritual development. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Protector Posted December 23, 2011 It isn't the only way however, and following a philosophy does nothing to aid spiritual development. Where do you think all these meditations came from then Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wells Posted December 23, 2011 Every time I look away, there's a new post Get in the chatroom already Nobody of us forces you to come back to this thread again and again and read every new post.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Protector Posted December 23, 2011 Can't fight my forum browsing instincts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wells Posted December 23, 2011 Can't fight my forum browsing instincts Be grateful to us that we give you the opportunity to develop the virtue of self-control in yourself! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Protector Posted December 23, 2011 I'll get to that when I finish that webcomic thing Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChiDragon Posted December 23, 2011 (edited) I can see that Lao Tzu is newly stepped into the western world. Please give him a little tolerance and bear with him. Let him learn and endure the western public. Thanks.... Edited December 24, 2011 by ChiDragon 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lao Tzu Posted December 24, 2011 (edited) Perhaps another translation: 不可执以无为 It cannot be just carried out without accomplishment, 不可行于有作 It cannot be executed with intent, 不可泥于存想 It cannot just bury the thoughts in the mud, 不可着于持守 It cannot be just conservative, 不可枯坐灰心 It cannot be just sitting and discouraged, 不可盲修瞎炼。 It cannot be blindly practiced and fanatically cultivated. ChiDragon: 此灰心非彼灰心 Translate: This "灰心" is not that "灰心" Edited December 24, 2011 by Lao Tzu Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lao Tzu Posted December 24, 2011 (edited) What is the difference....??? 你翻译的灰心，是失去信心的意思。 原文的灰心，是心如死灰，沉寂如死的意思。 Translate: In your translation, "灰心" means discouraged. In fact, the "灰心" in the original sentence means a empty mind, silent like dead. Edited December 24, 2011 by Lao Tzu Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChiDragon Posted December 24, 2011 (edited) 你翻译的灰心，是失去信心的意思。 原文的灰心，是心如死灰，沉寂如死的意思。 Thank you... 沉寂如死的人是否也失去一切信心....？？？ A person with a dead heart, isn't it like one is without an confidence at all. 有時翻译只能翻意不能翻字. 不知您意下如何..!!! Sometimes, translation only can be done with the conceptual meanings but not the character itself. What do you think....??? PS... I knew it was coming, Aaron... Edited December 24, 2011 by ChiDragon Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lao Tzu Posted December 24, 2011 Thank you... 沉寂如死的人是否也失去一切信心....？？？ 有時翻译只能翻意不能翻字. 不知您意下如何..!!! 心沉寂如死的人当然谈不上有信心，但这毕竟是两个意思。 翻译当然力求翻意，字也是为了表达意嘛！ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lao Tzu Posted December 24, 2011 (edited) 你瞧，连中国人对中文都会有不少误解，更别提外国人了。 所以，误解“道”的人占绝大多数。 Translate: You see, Ancient Chinese sentences can be misunderstood, even though you are a native speaker. So it is more likely to be misunderstood for foreigners. In fact, majority of the "taoists" are misundertanding the Way(Dao). Edited December 24, 2011 by Lao Tzu Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aaron Posted December 24, 2011 (edited) LaoTzu and ChiDragon Could you guys refrain from conversing in Chinese in the English sections? It's distracting for the rest of us, and the only people that can figure out what your saying are the two of you. Just a request. At least translate what you're saying so the rest of us can follow along. Aaron Edited December 24, 2011 by Twinner 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lao Tzu Posted December 24, 2011 (edited) LaoTzu and ChiDragon Could you guys refrain from conversing in Chinese in the English sections? It's distracting for the rest of us, and the only people that can figure out what your saying are the two of you. Just a request. At least translate what you're saying so the rest of us can follow along. Aaron Sorry about that! I have translated some of them. Edited December 24, 2011 by Lao Tzu Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
