any helpful advice for me to understand of 'feeling Qi'

[noelle]

My father often said that he had sensitive sense in his palms which was like 'magnet'...recently I got to understand it a bit....but vague...

 

any advices, knowledge and opinions welcome! also any practices you know helpful for 'vitality', '養氣'

 

Thanks,

Noelle.

[voidisyinyang]

My father often said that he had sensitive sense in his palms which was like 'magnet'...I did not pay attention on his words but recently I got to understand it a bit....but vague...

 

any advices, knowledge and opinions welcome! also any practices you know helpful for 'vitality', '養氣'

 

Thanks,

Noelle.

 

focus on your heart in meditation and you'll feel increased electromagnetic chi energy.

[gendao]

The problem most people have is that they're using their kinesthetic sense - what they normally use to feel their muscles.

 

However, to feel qi, you need to use a different & subtler sense. Your muscles should be totally relaxed, as this sense does not exert muscular control. If you can feel & tense your muscles with it, then you’re using the wrong sense! This energetic sense operates independent of your muscular sense and is a level subtler..

 

It took me over 2 years of personal practice to realize this basic misconception. Enjoy.

 

 

For a fun experiment, muscularly relax your hand and then "smile" with it. Feel anything?

If not, you might still have to cultivate for a while before you can feel it. Increased practice increases both your qi reserves and sensitivity.

 

 

BTW, if you're not feeling your qi, then you're not really doing qigong. You might be moving a bit, and everyone has to start somewhere...but you're not really cooking it. Another huge fantastical misconception by n00bs who stand or wave their arms around blindly...

Edited December 23, 2011 by vortex

[Desert Eagle]

[noelle]

BTW, if you're not feeling your qi, then you're not really doing qigong. You might be moving a bit, and everyone has to start somewhere...but you're not really cooking it. Another huge fantastical misconception by n00bs who stand or wave their arms around blindly...

Ahhh, I see...thanks Votex : )

would you tell me more abt your experiences?

 

@Desert Eagle, ^.^ I understand what the person in clip doing but I do not know Chinese, would you explain what it says?

 

focus on your heart in meditation and you'll feel increased electromagnetic chi energy.

 

@fulllotus, then you also can feel 'qi' or kind of sense of magnet?

[Ish]

The more relaxed you are the stronger chi can flow.

The clearer your mind, the clearer your perception, which helps to feel chi.

Learn some basic qigong patterns and practice them fully relaxed fully in the moment, no effort, no force to perceive anything.

Im sure you will experience chi in no time.

[Mokona]

[Harmonious Emptiness]

I think a proper warm up to release stagnant blocks while calming the mind are essential. bouncing up and down (just bending the knees, also kick your feet, shake your ankles) and shaking all the joints is a good start, then twist at the torso side to side and let your hands slap your sides.

 

Also, doing more than one movement, and returning to hold the dan tien between movements, you might feel the dan tien more after the first or second movements. Keep in mind that energy will radiate from the palms so it's good to have them facing where you are intending the energy and try to feel it as you do so. "Do it with a feeling" like they say in the blues, but don't tense up very much at all, if at all, so the channels stay open. Follow the feeling in your body, that is the best guide to how fast or slow to move your hands, imo. As you develop this awareness, the chi will follow where the energy of awareness is, imo & experience...

Edited December 22, 2011 by Harmonious Emptiness

[Encephalon]

Like many others, I first began to feel chi in my fingers. I remember how deliriously happy I was when the first sensations of tingling started up. Within a couple weeks I was able to cause the thumbs and specific digits to awaken and throb at will. This is easily explained by the fact that the hands are richly enervated.

 

To me, the movement of chi feels like the pleasant sensation of pressure right before a sneeze. A point of energy expands and makes itself palpable and can be manipulated by the mind (yi chi) with some months of practice.

 

Unfortunately, like many earnest beginners, I practiced the Water method, Chu Nei kung, and even a few weeks of Gary Clyman's tidal wave chi kung. I was careful not to 'blend' these teachings into one practice but kept them separate, but the problem is I can't account for which practice was the most efficacious (although i have abandoned Clyman's routine due to its excessive Fire energy).

 

I think Ish has made the critical point - relax, relax, relax. you hear this all the time. I was lucky when I started because I had been working at a gym as a trainer, working out a lot and making sure that my flexibility matched or exceeded my strength gains (I was the old man on the team but the most flexible). I attribute the capacity to deeply relax as the reason why my first year of energy training was so productive and enjoyable.

Edited December 22, 2011 by Encephalon

[gendao]

Dunno bro, I mean - I always feel more energy after my qi sets, even though i'm not powerfully sensitive yet, to the point I can feel the qi during the movements. Wouldn't you say it's more of a progression to feeling qi during the movements later in the practice, but the energy is still being moved and built up? i'm for sure a n00b so just blast me with your thoughts on this.. - Or are we saying the same thing - just "real" Qigong doesn't start until sensitivity during the movements arises?

 

:-D I hope I didn't totally confuse this.

 

BTW - it took you over two years to feel qi between your hands? That sucks!

Well, there's a few key factors here:

1) Using the right sense to feel qi

2) The degree of sensitivity of that energetic sense

3) Having enough unblocked qi to feel

 

My point is that the effectiveness and power of your qigong is a function of your development of these factors. It's not all or nothing, but more a sliding scale based upon the sum of these parts..

 

If you are lacking in all 3 - then you're basically just doing physical calisthenics.

Whereas if you are advanced in all 3 - then you could probably make anything "qigong"...and will be performing it "full-bore" while you're at it.

 

And it didn't take me 2 years to simply feel my qi at all - it took me 2 years to realize that you actually have to use a different, subtler sense than the one used to physically feel your muscles. Because this is something that's never explained anywhere - everyone is simply told to just "feel." Well, if you're tuning in at the wrong bandwidth, then you're not going to really zero in on it.

 

 

Just my $.02 at least...

Edited December 22, 2011 by vortex

[Aetherous]

Relax your hands, and shake them vigorously in front of you for a few minutes. When they're warm, stop abruptly. You will feel qi easily.

 

But feeling qi isn't important, in my opinion. If you focus on that, it becomes an attachment and IMO is harmful. Lots of "qigong masters" die young...

[JustARandomPanda]

I think there may be something to the bit about Qi feeling different than awareness of nerves, hot, cold, etc.

 

One day I decided to play around with the energy in my right foot (or rather what I thought was energy). I started by focusing on my my big toe, then started "pushing" the energy/awareness in spirals throughout my foot. I did this for about 2 hours a day for 3 days of so.

 

Then suddenly on the third day a Dam broke. After about 15 minutes of pushing and playing with this energy it was suddenly as if my right foot was made of nothing but air. Like an airy cloud. I freaked out. I could not believe how weird and different the sensation was. It was as if my right food was ethereal, having no weight or substance of any kind.

 

That experience finally convinced me there must be something to this "Qi Gong" business.

 

I've never had that experience again although I admit I've never bothered to do that same experiment over again.

 

I just ordered Robert Bruce's 2011 revised and updated book

 

Energy Work: The Secrets of Healing and Energy Work

 

He uses a kinetic based method to develop your ability to feel real chi and not just nerves, blood, muscle tension, etc. It's step-by-step and I've decided to give it a shot as my new year's resolution.

[voidisyinyang]

Ahhh, I see...thanks Votex : )

would you tell me more abt your experiences?

 

@Desert Eagle, ^.^ I understand what the person in clip doing but I do not know Chinese, would you explain what it says?

 

 

 

@fulllotus, then you also can feel 'qi' or kind of sense of magnet?

 

Yeah the secret of "Taoist Yoga: alchemy and immortality" is that the water energy has to be lifted up above the fire energy. Most practices focus on mind yoga to bring the fire energy of the heart down below the water. But the thing is females have this easier -- as the recent thread by Ed on the video-book preview "Valley of the Spirit" by a female Taoist practitioner -- females are yang within. This means that females naturally sublimate their energy. So Master Nan, Huai-chin says that females should focus on the heart instead of the lower tan tien. The heart is actually what converts the jing energy into chi energy or electromagnetic energy.

 

the other way is to have a qigong master give you a shen laser transmission -- if you get a phone healing from Chunyi Lin http://springforestqigong.com then after you get the laser transmission just meditate and you should feel the electromagnetic qi energy. The easiest way to test it is to make a "chi ball" by holding the palms of the hands facing each other. There should be a force separating them. I actually don't have this hardly anymore -- for me the electromagnetic force is focused in the center of my brain but it arises out of the heart. Then from the center of my brain it will spread to the rest of my body or externally as needed. but with more practice we can keep building up the qi energy. Check out qigong master Leslie Vincent who just healed someone of severe epilepsy right in my town - she's a brand new qigong master. haha.

[Small Fur]

Hi Noelle,

 

I would seek first to distinguish the many different types of qi.

 

Generally speaking and for instance, the qi which resides in the palms could be described as softer and warmer; this is in contrast to the qi that emanates from the finger tips that may be described as more focused and cooler.

 

The qi that is in the palms tends towards a sensation of a magnetic field when in proximity to an opposite polarity. Most simply, this could be the polarity of sensing qi between one palm of your hand facing the opposing palm. In contrast, the type of qi that emanates from the finger tips has more of an electrical charge, and can be seen as radiating lasers. The qi of the finger tips are penetrative in a different way than the qi of the palms. It has less of a 'fuzzy' magnetic field and more of an pointed electrical charge.

 

Since different qi forms are types of energy and people infrequently experience sensing their own energy, they are apt to describe all qi as one singular 'thing' that bears an electro-magnetic quality. This is true, in the sense that qi is an energy of a fundamental source and that energy, by its nature, has such electromagnetic properties. However, as you begin to differentiate not only the sensation, but also its movements, you will discover that various forms of energy bear different properties, and so they are suited to different applications.

 

There are many practices to cultivate vitality. The one best suited to you depends partly on your constitution and where you are at in life, as well as what you are looking to achieve. 'Vitality', like anything can be applied in many different ways- thus, different practices are better suited to certain individuals than others.

 

Be well, Mila

Edited December 27, 2011 by Small Fur

[doc benway]

Hi Noelle,

 

When I had my first experience of knowing that I was understanding Qi, the best way I could describe it is that it felt somewhat like the feeling of sexual stimulation. Not that I was turned on sexually by the experience but that is the closest thing "Qi" feels like for me, comparatively. It started for me in the Hui Yin area which is sort of near the prostate gland. It was very, very subtle at first but when I realized what was happening it became very powerful as my awareness and sensitivity developed. This is the area where men are often most successful at feeling it because it is a very concentrated area for the Jing (reproductive potential and essence, often equated with semen in men but that is an oversimplification in the Western paradigm).

 

As Drew mentioned, women generally are more successful in the beginning by focusing on the heart region. Years ago I spent some time speaking about this with Livia Kohn and she also recommended that women focus more on the heart rather than the lower Dan Tian or other points in the pelvic region. Rather than think of it in cultivation terms, it may be helpful to think of it in more familiar terms - receptiveness, openness, love. So you may try bringing your attention to the area of your heart (not the anatomic heart but between your breasts and inside the center of your sternum and just allow your awareness to rest there. Allow yourself to become tranquil. Allow the thoughts to come and go as they will and just return your attention to this area for a while. Over time, see if there arises a feeling there. It is beyond description. It is beyond words like warm, cool, tingly, electric but different people use different words of that nature. It might feel like love or it might feel like happiness or fulfillment. It can take a lot of different forms. Like Mila says, there are different forms of Qi, and the experience and perception of Qi varies accordingly.

 

One thing that became clear to me with practice is that the way Qi is often described is misleading. I do not look at Qi as being something quantifiable or something separate from myself. When people talk about "having QI" or "storing Qi" or "building Qi", that can be misleading. I experience Qi more as an interaction or a process. It seems to be intimately connected with the interaction of awareness and "substance". For me Qi is always already there and what is happening is that my experience of "building" or "storing" Qi is more a function of becoming more sensitive to the Qi that always already exists in everything. I feel more like an antenna than a receptacle. This is partly due to the "fact" that there is no real boundary between self and other. The skin is certainly no barrier to Qi so how can "I" store Qi? In fact, what is "I" other than the thought that claims responsibility for being the thinker? It's really nothing more than a witness. Certainly, as an organism becomes healthier and more robust, there is the potential for "greater" or "more" Qi. And as I practice methods like Qigong, Taijiquan, and Daoist cultivation, my physical, emotional, psychological, and spiritual health and well being improves so not only am I becoming more sensitive but "my Qi" is becoming healthier and more robust.

 

For me there is Jing, which relates to our corporeality, our physical "existence", our reproductive potential.

And there is Shen, which relates to awareness, spirituality, sensitivity, love, intelligence.

And the interaction between the two is where Qi arises.

But this is just my own developing understanding based solely on my own practice.

I am no authority and I'm not well versed in the Chinese literature like some of our members.

 

Sorry to get all metaphysical on you but I do get carried away sometimes....

 

Good luck in your developing practice. It's a wonderful world to explore!

[dwai]

My father often said that he had sensitive sense in his palms which was like 'magnet'...recently I got to understand it a bit....but vague...

 

any advices, knowledge and opinions welcome! also any practices you know helpful for 'vitality', '養氣'

 

Thanks,

Noelle.

 

What are you currently practicing? I think advice is best given in context of what you are practicing...

 

But, qi can feel like many things...depending on the person. Some feel it like electro-magnetic sensation, some feel it like heat, some cold, some feel an "airy" sensation. The brain translates the signals it's getting into something familiar...so even though Qi isn't by itself heating, cooling, electrifying, etc...it is interpreted in any which way by the brain. With time it will most likely transform into a feeling of pressure (like air or water filling a tube) and flow. Also, it is most easily felt in the hands (since we do most work with our hands) and least easily felt in the legs (below the belt so to speak). But then again, I'm speaking from a man's perspective. Women might feel it differently...

 

One good practice to start feeling it is to stand in the beginning posture of Taiji Chuan (or Qi Gong), with the feet shoulder width apart (with toes pointing straight ahead or slightly turned inwards, parallel to each other). Think of a rectangle or a parallelogram.

 

The knees should be slightly bent but the knees should not extend beyond the toes (when looked at from the top). The shoulders and elbows relaxed. The ankles relaxed.

 

The head should be held lightly and straight. Imagine a thread connected to the top of your skull and like you are suspended from the sky above (like a puppet). All your strength should naturally simply fall into the ground through your feet. There should be no strain on your knees or ankles. This is called "suspending the crown point".

 

http://gbolarts.com/pages/notes_archive/notes_001.html

 

 

The pelvis should be relaxed and pay attention to the inguinal creases (called Kwa in Chinese) and move your pelvis back and forth till you find the spot where the inguinal creases are not tensed. This is the beginning of what is called "sung kwa"... When done correctly, you will feel like you are sitting on a big beach ball or an exercise ball...

 

This is a link to my teacher's notes on how to stand -- http://gbolarts.com/pages/notes_archive/notes_006.html

 

Also, there are some very good articles he's written on general practice here --

 

http://gbolarts.com/pages/notes_archive/tc_archive.html

 

 

In any case, I have found that this standing practice tunes the body to feeling qi and actually moves the qi down from the top of your head to the feet. Bruce Frantzis (http://www.taichimaster.com) teaches this as the beginning of his Water Method (Daoist) meditation. He calls it "standing and releasing", where you start gently scanning your body from the crown point and work your way down to the soles of your feet. Anywhere you feel physical tension or sensation of "strength", you put your mind into that spot and simply relax that area. The energy will fall through down your body to the ground (via the soles of your feet). Don't overdo it, simply scan and release the tension. This is called becoming "sung" (relaxed). Once you are in the preparation form, you will automatically become relaxed. With time, the body will relax a lot. At that point your sensitivity to Qi will increase significantly.

 

HTH,

 

dwai

[Small Fur]

Hmm… to clarify…

 

First of all, qi is energy.

Second there are many forms of energy, thus there are many forms of qi.

 

What people are describing are differences in the result of what qi movement produces in their particular system, NOT the quality of qi itself.

 

Let me give an example to help clarify:

Lets say you have a hairball in your shower drain and your entire tub is full of cold water. The energy you take to suddenly and forcefully remove the hair ball quickly unclogs and your drains flood the pipes with cold water at high pressure. Maybe you are focused on the tub, so then you describe 'qi' as a feeling of emptying, release and depressurization- not warming but certainly you are less cold. Now let's say you didn't notice your tub but you felt the pipes, you might say qi feels like cold, rushing, high pressure water coursing through your system.

 

So the description of variance given by others has to do with:

-Your constitution: what the design of your personal system is (ie. ceramic tub, metal tub, small pipes, large pipes, etc.,. | overweight, slender, phelgmatic, young, elderly, etc.,.)

-Type of Pathogen/Stagnation: what kind of blockage there is (ie. hairball, mudball, gravel, etc.,.| damp, heat, cold, wind, etc.,)

-Method of Treatment: what quality and method energy is use to remove the block (ie. quick, slow, fast, hard, gradual, etc.,., | moxabustion, qi gong movement, yoga pose, acupuncture needle, herbs, etc.,.)

-Level and Focus of Consciousness: development of awareness (ie. the upper section of the pipe, the end of the pipe, the center of the tub, etc.,., | unconscious, imagination, ideation, direct perception, emotional perception, etc.,.)

 

So, if someone says qi is hot or cold, fast or slow, etc.,. these are descriptions of what the qi/ energy produces- not what it IS. So, in the example, qi was used to initiate the movement of water, and water itself is contains a qi movement. But in all cases- this is not feeling the qi itself, per se. This is the sensation of dynamic produced by qi.

 

Qi movement appears subjective because people bear uniquely comprised systems, and yet its commonality is in that different constitutions of individuals are comprised of universally shared properties and laws. When you understand the mechnisms of an individual system in subtle detail, you gain insight into the course and quality of qi for a particular individual.

 

Finally, back to the issue of what actual 'qi' feels like. Still energy is potential. Qi in different forms of 'accumulation', without too much movement AND in the body, feels relatively as I described in my previous post (at least those two forms feel as such relative to each other). This is as close to a description of sensing types of qi at a physical level of body as I can get to without describing qi prior to human form and it is not a description of qi in gross interaction with unique forms. This is a description of qi in relative stillness. However, remember, qi is potential energy, so the only way to actually feel qi, is to actually feel its potentially prior to manifestation- which means, what I described in my original post, is also not entirely true.

 

The question then becomes, are you able to feel un-manifest potential? (and by the way, yes, it is possible… this is even a more subtle phenomena than experiencing qi forms through the body)

 

In any case, to refine this and give even deeper understanding would take hours, so for now I will leave this as is. Hopefully this sheds some light on the matter a little more clearly.

Edited December 27, 2011 by Small Fur