The Secret of Santa Claus, MAOI inhibitor mushroom in Taoism

[voidisyinyang]

O.K. I have a little story to share. This summer I discovered amanita muscaria mushroom aka fly agaric mushroom in our forest which was an amazing find for Minnesota. Of course I researched it before ingesting it but I did a nine hour full lotus trip on the mushroom and I blogged on it. OH there was a thread on this mushroom and shamanism here: http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/16827-the-shamanic-origins-of-christmas/page__p__233151__hl__agaric__fromsearch__1entry233151

 

O.K. first of all there is a great documentary about amanita muscaria was the secret story behind not only Santa Claus - yes! -- but also esoteric religion in the West: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnvEHObMMH4

 

The documentary is maybe boring or too speculative for those who have not taken the amanita muscaria mushroom. But since I knew the experience I am not at all surprised that it would be given a crucial role behind religion.

 

so I searched it for Taoism. http://sites.google.com/site/delawareteasociety/a-toad-on-the-moon-or-a-brief-speculation-on-chinese-psychoactive-toad-venoms

A Toad on the Moon: Or a Brief Speculation on Chinese Psychoactive Toad Venoms

 

A Toad on the Moon: Or a Brief Speculation on Chinese Psychoactive Toad Venoms

 

by Frederick R. Dannaway

 

This is fascinating. The Reishi mushroom may have been a code for Amanita Muscaria as it was called the toad-mushroom and then toads have DMT. Amanita does not have DMT but it does increase your DMT levels by working as an MAOI.

 

As Wasson and Needham theorize, the lingzhi mushroom (Ganoderma lucidum), reishi of China, may have been chosen as a code for the Amanita muscaria mushroom to protect its profane use and for exclusive use by an elite. There are many images of the lingzhi mushroom depicted as growing out of the head of a toad linking toads, toadstool mushrooms and the possibly substituted lingzhi. Wasson informs us in China that the Amanita muscaria is known as hama jun (ha ma chun Needham 1974), the "toad-mushroom.”

 

http://ethnopharmacology.com/fungi/

 

The Taoists of ancient China seem to have made use of the fly-agaric mushroom, and often make reference to the 'Divine Mushroom of Immortality', an epithet used by Wasson in his book. The writings of ancient China are replete with many other references to psychoactive fungi and there is even a work called On the Planting and Cultivation of Magic Mushrooms. According to the account of Thao Hung-Ching, writing in AD 515, a respected young Taoist of the time named Chou Tzu-Liang died at the age of only twenty, apparently as the result of ingesting toxic fungi. There are frescoes decorating the Koguryo tombs of Korea (sixth and seventh centuries AD) that depict Taoist Immortals and their female consorts, known as Jade Girls, picking 'magic mushrooms'. Fu-ling, a parasitic fungus that grows on the roots of the pine tree – Polyporus cocos or Poria (Pachyma) cocos is also considered to be an 'immortal medicine' in Chinese tradition. The Chinese Buddhist text called the Tripitaka (Ta Tsang) contains an account of a sage taking refuge in the mountains in order to meditate and consume mushroom elixirs. Yet, it would be simplistic to think that the Chinese attitude to psychoactive mushrooms was universally favourable. Wasson cites a twelfth-century Chinese official who berated the followers of the Manichaean religion (founded by the Iranian Mani, but once of some influence in parts of China largely through the efforts of Iranian and Central Asian travelling merchants) for consuming mushrooms as part of their religious observances. Wasson interprets this as an attack on the use of the fly-agaric as the same official states that the Manichaeans also ritually washed with urine.

 

Just so people know the urine contains a less toxic version of the psychoactive chemical from the amanita muscaria. Yes I did drink my urine when doing amanita muscaria although I watered it down. but that is standard for this mushroom.

 

More here: http://www.scribd.com/doc/15981921/-Thunder-Among-the-Pines-Defining-a-PanAsian-Soma

 

A most interestingsupposition, especially for the theory of a continued Japanese

soma, comes from Dubs(1947;1961) which suggests that the “Indo-Iranian soma-haoma was the trigger for the searchesof the First Emperor of the Han Wu Ti, even it was only a stimulus diffusion (Needham 1974).

”

Anticipating the hopeless task of separating out which geographic group was earliest and mostinfluential, Needham writes “…whatever news it was that came from Persia or India {…} the properties of Amanita muscaria

or related fungi were indeed known to, and used by ancient2 Taoists, perhaps also medieval ones, though it will be no easy task to reveal the details,doubtless among the most secret arcane of the Tao Tsang.

”

The Taoist tradition of China and Japan are fused together in the tales of before Common Era emperors of China who dispatched envoys abroad to find the Isles of the Immortals (Penglai) and to find the source for the

“

Elixir of Immortality

”

, which Needham surmises, is a mushroom. This occurred in the reign of Shih Huang Ti (219 B.C.) whodispatched one Hsu Fu, in Japanese Jofuku, of whom Needham thinks it probable that he andhis people settled in Japan as they never returned to China and there is a tomb of Jofuku inKyoto (Needham 1976). Needham’s exhaustive arguments on the blurring of alchemical symbolism with entheogenic Soma-Haoma

cults is simply too massive to recount here. But here counts later legends of these Taoist

“plant of immortality" missions, in the text “magic mushrooms that nourishes the spirit (yang shen chih

), as clearly partaking of this truly ancient heritage (Needham 1974). His works on the earlier dates of Tantra, such as the commonly citedorigins of 7th century CE (Davidson 2003;Bhattacharyya 1982) and the influence of Taoism on Tantrism are essential to link this “esoteric technology”

with an ancient current that persisted into Tibet and Japan.

 

Needham and Wasson accepted that the Chinese “plant of deathlessness” ( pu ssu chihtshao ) could be the agaric which grew under the “tree of deathlessness” or birch ( pu ssu chihshu ). Mushrooms, shamanism and sexuality are found very early in Chinese literature, such asthe shamanistic invocations Nine Songs of the 3rd century. Here a “Mountain Goddess” is invoked by a shaman whose mission is to capture the “Thrice-herb” in the mountains for, as Strickmann writes, “the goddess, his lover” and records the commentators state the plant is a mushroom. This little study aspect of Goddess worship and entheogenic mushrooms in China may well be the original source for proto-Tantric and Tantric schools that emerged in the “TheGreat China” (Mahacina). Needham (1983) describes this current as “religious sexuality” or cinacara as flowering into Tantra with the important note that much of this philosophy was already present in Chinese mysticism since recorded history. This erotic mysticism which developed into Tantra proper emerged in Buddhism as early as the 3rd Century C.E. and spread through Asia (Payne 2006).Evidence of mushrooms as hallucinogens and aphrodisiacs are also found in a text from the 3rd century C.E. involving a certain Chiao-fu and two nymphs of the Blue River (Strickmann1966)

 

Wasson notes that the ling chi was “a small plant, not woody" that had become scarce much to the dismay of the “necromancers.”

 

Wasson suggests, with some persuasion, that their was a conscious religious furor toreplace the popular designation in art, poetry and iconographyto the “not woody” zhi, the soft (A.Muscaria ) known to the Taoists through the shamanic Nivkhi,with the very “woody” lingchi(Ganoderma lucida)in a brilliant ploy to secure the supply for theelite.

 

Here's what SMILE reports on taking this shroom: http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/6309-k/page__st__32__p__72785__hl__agaric__fromsearch__1entry72785

 

In Russia, we have Amanita muscaria, commonly known as the fly agaric, that grows in any forest from August to October. I even ate 5 of them at once. Officially, I should be dead. Unofficially, talking plants and voices explaining things and what is going on, visions, etc. Lots of vomiting from poison. All alone at night, in a house surrounded by forest- good stuff. Never did it again.

Now, there is no need.

 

Then: http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/4090-the-elixir-in-a-bottle/page__p__42563__hl__agaric__fromsearch__1entry42563

 

View PostOolong Rabbit, on Nov 14 2007, 01:43 AM, said:

That may have some value but that is not the philosopher's stone. The key to the philosopher's stone and a lot of other mysteries is the red and white fly agaric mushroom: amanita muscaria. It is also probably where the watered down ritual of "eating the body of christ" comes from. In fact that key unlocks a lot of doors. I highly recommend Clark Heinrich's book Magic Mushrooms in Religion and Alchemy It will blow you away.

 

Another taobum initiate: http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/2316-shrooms/page__st__16__p__21407__hl__agaric__fromsearch__1entry21407

 

I took amanitas once, your supposed to do 30 grams. They are not toxic if you eat them dried out. If you drink you pee (I didnt) you will trip more, and harder, recycling the active ingrediants for up to like 5 times.

 

WHen I took them, I had a serious experience. I felt like I could see into the future and simply felt a deep mytical emptiness. Everything seemed to be pulsing like in waves, as if my heart had merged with my environment.

 

Some of these effectss, Im sure, were due to anticipation that it would be like this.

 

One of theings I did on them was to figure out if I went throug earth, what lat and long atude would i come out at? someowhere in afghanistan...

 

Wow so in that thread Sean Denty says Mantak Chia does not "see the light" in his on dark cave meditation room. That's too bad. I mean I was wondering what abilities Mantak Chia had. I know Chunyi Lin said when he did his seven week full lotus cave meditation that at first he was scared but then this third eye opened up and the cave filled with light and then he traveled into heaven and it was the best time of his life.

 

Yeah so much for shrooms as the real secret to religion but still it's fun to read about all their speculative theories and sure some did pursue psychedelic shrooms in China as elixirs of immortality. It was probably like in the Bushmen culture and elsewhere -- a tool for those who needed extra help. haha.

Edited December 24, 2011 by fulllotus

[LaughingNumbSkull]

Santa one moment, the next thing you know you're switching the words around.

 

That=..............Satan?

 

THAT'S the strangest secret about santa you'll ever find.

 

Santa=Satan

[taooneusa]

one of the chemicals in fly agaric is a lesioning agent. It breaks down tissues in the brain (grey matter)

It is impossible to know the amount of chemical in any single mushroom. Overdose is very possible if

you follow the 30 grams idea. Traditionally a shaman would drink the urine of a reindeer that had ingested

amanita and then other humans would drink the urine of the shaman -this refined and guaranteed the amount

of chemical to a safe standard.

 

Interesting that Amanita sounds like Amritta. Also Ra is called Ra SaTan. Ra, Sa and Ta are in-tones.

 

Also, Aman Ra like the Christian Amen -a man of Ra, a man of god

 

aside note: Ra Ptal -the son of the god man sounds like Hindi "Raj Patel"

 

like eastern Raja (king) Amun Ra -the self created man-god is the unite Jakal (anubis)

and Ra the son of god. One the avatar (manifestation) and the other an incarnation of the

same presence. Amanita-A Man-Amen-Amun-Mu-Moon-land of Mu-Santa-Saint-Satan-keeper the underworld-Anubis-Ra-Man-Raja-Ptal-Patel-Age of Water-Amrita-An Avatar

 

Ra Ptl Ah Mun Ra

 

 

 

"" Claus came from the Dutch Klaas, from Middle Dutch Niklaas, which derives from the Greek name Nikolas (or Nicholas) from Nikolaos. Nikolaos is a combination of two words, namely, Nike (victory) and Laos (people). So Nikolaos literally means victory of the people.

Old Saint (sat-i-n) Nick

The rob is made from a dye derived from beetles that consumed the sap of trees called Dragons Blood.

The same beetle also feed on a certain sacred cactus common to the southwestern states. Another

source of the red dye is Cinnabar that is the source of Alchemical Mercury. Mercury and Gold are used

together by yogis though its not the gold or the mercury they're after. There is even a red liqueur consumed

and made by priest in Europe made from the same beetles. The Heart of the Soviet Union 'Red Square'

is a Huge hint at the root tradition of Soviet shamanism and Christianity. The color of robes and especially

hats tends to show the element they were using to derive "gold"

 

Saint Peters robe:

 

Dragons Blood tree

these trees grow only in one place where a third of its plant life is found nowhere else on the planet. It has been described as the most alien-looking place on Earth. Reishi does contain the stone, amanita does not

 

This authors description of the the Rig Vedas suggests that Soma or Amrit are a psycho active plant, but this is not the case. The "blue throat" of Siva describes a chemical cascade between the mid brain and thyroid or throat. Amrit or Manna that came from heaven describes a manifestation of the "blue element" in the air that is inhaled completing a ctcle of the wind channels and holding open the upper sushumna. That color in the throat also shows the Ojas have been refined through one complete cycle of the cosmos. Here's a kicker: that Oja started out on Saturn billions of years ago..

 

The description of stirring the mountain is also a global level event that released a lot of

manna from the earth all at once into the waters

 

My link

""Readers familiar with Hindu mythology will know the popular legend of "the churning of the ocean". This tale explains how soma came into being and versions of it are to be found in the Vishnu Purana, the Mahabharata and the Ramayana. The three sources differ in their details but, briefly, the story is as follows: The gods had been defeated by the asuras and appealed to Vishnu for advice. He counselled them that they should unite with their enemies and together they should churn the ocean which, at that time, was composed of milk. First they scattered various herbs in the ocean, then, taking Mt. Mandara as a churning-stick they wound the naga-king Vasuki around it as a churning-rope. The gods and asuras took opposite ends of the great serpent and heaved back and forth. Many wonderful treasures then came forth from the ocean, the first of which being amrita (in Hindu texts this is often used as a synonym for soma). All versions of the story also feature a virulent poison (variously called kalakuta, khalakuta or visha), in some it is said that it is another product of churning the ocean, others say that the strain on Vasuki caused him to vomit it up. However, Shiva saves the day by drinking the poison and retaining it in his throat, which turns blue as a result. Thus Shiva acquires the epithet Nilakanta ("blue-throat")

 

Cosmic dust gathered in the wake of the procession of the planets filtrates through the north poles of planets attracted through the lay lines to gather at specific gravity wells typically the site of pyramids. These refined by the sun and earth are the Earths Ojas that beget Man. They are literally the Man-na from heaven. An, Ah Mun Rah is a Man who's capable of manifesting the gold within him self from the Manna. They are also the source of thunder and the unusual colors is exhibits. They are the Ogdoad derived from the seven that manifest from the six sounds.. Om..

 

The earth is constantly increasing in size.

Edited December 24, 2011 by taooneusa

[voidisyinyang]

Santa one moment, the next thing you know you're switching the words around.

 

That=..............Satan?

 

THAT'S the strangest secret about santa you'll ever find.

 

Santa=Satan

 

Yeah you gotta watch the doc in full here

 

Very wild stuff. The mushroom is awesome -- it shuts down your amgydala so you have no fear. The Berserkers used this mushroom before going into battle and painting their faces blue.

[voidisyinyang]

one of the chemicals in fly agaric is a lesioning agent. It breaks down tissues in the brain (grey matter)

It is impossible to know the amount of chemical in any single mushroom. Overdose is very possible if

you follow the 30 grams idea. Traditionally a shaman would drink the urine of a reindeer that had ingested

amanita and then other humans would drink the urine of the shaman -this refined and guaranteed the amount

of chemical to a safe standard.

 

Interesting that Amanita sounds like Amritta. Also Ra is called Ra SaTan. Ra, Sa and Ta are in-tones.

 

Also, Aman Ra like the Christian Amen -a man of Ra, a man of god

 

aside note: Ra Ptal -the son of the god man sounds like Hindi "Raj Patel"

 

like eastern Raja (king) Amun Ra -the self created man-god is the unite Jakal (anubis)

and Ra the son of god. One the avatar (manifestation) and the other an incarnation of the

same presence. Amanita-A Man-Amen-Amun-Mu-Moon-land of Mu-Santa-Saint-Satan-keeper the underworld-Anubis-Ra-Man-Raja-Ptal-Patel-Age of Water-Amrita-An Avatar

 

Ra Ptl Ah Mun Ra

 

 

 

"" Claus came from the Dutch Klaas, from Middle Dutch Niklaas, which derives from the Greek name Nikolas (or Nicholas) from Nikolaos. Nikolaos is a combination of two words, namely, Nike (victory) and Laos (people). So Nikolaos literally means victory of the people.

Old Saint (sat-i-n) Nick

The rob is made from a dye derived from beetles that consumed the sap of trees called Dragons Blood.

The same beetle also feed on a certain sacred cactus common to the southwestern states. Another

source of the red dye is Cinnabar that is the source of Alchemical Mercury. Mercury and Gold are used

together by yogis though its not the gold or the mercury they're after. There is even a red liqueur consumed

and made by priest in Europe made from the same beetles. The Heart of the Soviet Union 'Red Square'

is a Huge hint at the root tradition of Soviet shamanism and Christianity. The color of robes and especially

hats tends to show the element they were using to derive "gold"

 

Saint Peters robe:

 

Dragons Blood tree

these trees grow only in one place where a third of its plant life is found nowhere else on the planet. It has been described as the most alien-looking place on Earth. Reishi does contain the stone, amanita does not

 

This authors description of the the Rig Vedas suggests that Soma or Amrit are a psycho active plant, but this is not the case. The "blue throat" of Siva describes a chemical cascade between the mid brain and thyroid or throat. Amrit or Manna that came from heaven describes a manifestation of the "blue element" in the air that is inhaled completing a ctcle of the wind channels and holding open the upper sushumna. That color in the throat also shows the Ojas have been refined through one complete cycle of the cosmos. Here's a kicker: that Oja started out on Saturn billions of years ago..

 

The description of stirring the mountain is also a global level event that released a lot of

manna from the earth all at once into the waters

 

My link

""Readers familiar with Hindu mythology will know the popular legend of "the churning of the ocean". This tale explains how soma came into being and versions of it are to be found in the Vishnu Purana, the Mahabharata and the Ramayana. The three sources differ in their details but, briefly, the story is as follows: The gods had been defeated by the asuras and appealed to Vishnu for advice. He counselled them that they should unite with their enemies and together they should churn the ocean which, at that time, was composed of milk. First they scattered various herbs in the ocean, then, taking Mt. Mandara as a churning-stick they wound the naga-king Vasuki around it as a churning-rope. The gods and asuras took opposite ends of the great serpent and heaved back and forth. Many wonderful treasures then came forth from the ocean, the first of which being amrita (in Hindu texts this is often used as a synonym for soma). All versions of the story also feature a virulent poison (variously called kalakuta, khalakuta or visha), in some it is said that it is another product of churning the ocean, others say that the strain on Vasuki caused him to vomit it up. However, Shiva saves the day by drinking the poison and retaining it in his throat, which turns blue as a result. Thus Shiva acquires the epithet Nilakanta ("blue-throat")

 

Cosmic dust gathered in the wake of the procession of the planets filtrates through the north poles of planets attracted through the lay lines to gather at specific gravity wells typically the site of pyramids. These refined by the sun and earth are the Earths Ojas that beget Man. They are literally the Man-na from heaven. An, Ah Mun Rah is a Man who's capable of manifesting the gold within him self from the Manna. They are also the source of thunder and the unusual colors is exhibits. They are the Ogdoad derived from the seven that manifest from the six sounds.. Om..

 

The earth is constantly increasing in size.

 

You got more Dragon Blood info - never heard of that tree. Yeah I know that serotonin has the spectrogram light as blue -- so it seems that when the serotonin of the lower body is ionized past the blood brain barrier then this causes seeing the blue-violet light in the brain while meditating....

[voidisyinyang]

Well I brewed up a big batch of Artist Conk mushroom - it's the U.S. version of Reishi mushroom. Anti-cancer, anti-inflammation. Is it also the mushroom of immortality like the Reishi? haha. They're closely related -- same genus. My niece always claims I'm cooking wood. The Artist Conk has to be made into tea -- it's almost impossible to cut up though. haha.

 

Birch Polyphore is similar to the Artist Conk but has a fuzzy underside and grows on birches, duh. Both are "shelf" shrooms.

 

The Reishi is also a "shelf" shroom.

[taooneusa]

It's metals in the chemicals tested in a spectrometer that give off colors.

Metals that power linking up of complex protein chains. The metals are the

ojas that give chakras their particular spectral range.

 

Amanitta is something that for most people should only be done with

guidance from a shaman. The Berzerkers were enabled to make shore invasions,

rape, pillage and plunder while under it's effect. There's some interesting

research out of china, japan and US about Ganoderic Acids.

Edited December 25, 2011 by taooneusa

[taooneusa]

[taooneusa]

..

Edited December 25, 2011 by taooneusa

[Thunder_Gooch]

[taooneusa]

[voidisyinyang]

[voidisyinyang]

http://www.cannabisculture.com/articles/3136.html

 

Santa as the Siberian Shaman amanita mushroom

[taooneusa]

The lesioning chemical in amanita breaks down tissues in the brain in the order

it comes in contact with them. Blood flow determines this, so the areas in first contact

break down more. Because of this the mushroom cannot be consumed constantly.

Most people have some calcification or hardened tissues that present a danger with

a chemial that dissolves grey matter. If you have ever hit your head there is a possibility

of internal bleeding if you use amanita. The spiritual 'opening' achieved with this mushroom

is not from psychotropic effects. The 'opening' comes from plugs or calcification in the sinuses

of the skull being dissolved that enables dark light to get in. It is not safe to use alone

and without a shaman. Shamans first consumed it from reindeer who bodies can handle it

before 'sharing' it with their initiates. It is impossible to tell the amount of chemical in a single

mushroom, there for one cannot count on 'ounces' as a consistent measure.

Edited December 25, 2011 by taooneusa

[voidisyinyang]

[voidisyinyang]

The lesioning chemical in amanita breaks down tissues in the brain in the order

it comes in contact with them. Blood flow determines this, so the areas in first contact

break down more. Because of this the mushroom cannot be consumed constantly.

Most people have some calcification or hardened tissues that present a danger with

a chemial that dissolves grey matter. If you have ever hit your head there is a possibility

of internal bleeding if you use amanita. The spiritual 'opening' achieved with this mushroom

is not from psychotropic effects. The 'opening' comes from plugs or calcification in the sinuses

of the skull being dissolved that enables dark light to get in. It is not safe to use alone

and without a shaman. Shamans first consumed it from reindeer who bodies can handle it

before 'sharing' it with their initiates. It is impossible to tell the amount of chemical in a single

mushroom, there for one cannot count on 'ounces' as a consistent measure.

 

Oh o.k. now I know what you're referring to:

 

Ibotenic acid, however, has been shown to be a potent neurotoxin when injected directly in the brains of mice and rats and is used as a potent brain-lesioning agent.

 

Yeah the liver converts the Ibotenic acid.

 

Yeah it says in this report http://www.scribd.com/doc/23118427/Amanita-Muscaria-Chemistry-Biology-Toxicology-And-Ethnomycology on Amanita Muscaria poisoning that any dehydration converts the Ibotenic acid via decarboxilation into muscimol, "would only contain the latter substance and be the agent responsible for the main symptoms." So that conversion of ibotenic acid to muscimol is by digestion or cooking or dehydration.

 

This report also confirms increased serotonin in the brain from musicmol which is also the effect of DMT.

 

Admittedly the report states that reported use of Amanita Muscaria MIGHT cause brain lesions and brain lesions "could be anticipated."

Edited December 25, 2011 by fulllotus

[taooneusa]

Hey Drew, I am not writing in response to your experience. You have a ton of internal experience and ability, so things like this don't matter.

I was writing out of concern for readers on a website that promotes spiritual progress where quick fixes can entice.

 

 

"so then there is no more inhibition of adrenaline in the body. So this causes extreme energy and euphoria."

 

For persons with week life force the above can be very dangerous as the adrenals get depleted and the life gate can shut.

The symptom then is sudden and severe decrease in body temperature. The body really needs to be in excellent condition for this kind of thing. I'll quote wiki here "

Ibotenic acid is a chemical compound that is naturally occurring in the mushrooms Amanita muscaria and Amanita pantherina, among others. Ibotenic acid is a powerful neurotoxin and deliriant that is used as a "brain-lesioning agent"^[1][2] and has shown to be highly neurotoxic when injected directly into the brains of mice and rats.^[3]

 

and

 

When ibotenic acid is ingested, a small portion is decarboxylated into muscimol.

 

 

 

 

I understand the liver does adjust, but for many people this is a dangerous thing to do.

 

 

 

[voidisyinyang]

Hey Drew, I am not writing in response to your experience. You have a ton of internal experience and ability, so things like this don't matter.

I was writing out of concern for readers on a website that promotes spiritual progress where quick fixes can entice.

 

 

"so then there is no more inhibition of adrenaline in the body. So this causes extreme energy and euphoria."

 

For persons with week life force the above can be very dangerous as the adrenals get depleted and the life gate can shut.

The symptom then is sudden and severe decrease in body temperature. The body really needs to be in excellent condition for this kind of thing. I'll quote wiki here "

Ibotenic acid is a chemical compound that is naturally occurring in the mushrooms Amanita muscaria and Amanita pantherina, among others. Ibotenic acid is a powerful neurotoxin and deliriant that is used as a "brain-lesioning agent"^[1][2] and has shown to be highly neurotoxic when injected directly into the brains of mice and rats.^[3]

 

and

 

When ibotenic acid is ingested, a small portion is decarboxylated into muscimol.

 

 

 

 

I understand the liver does adjust, but for many people this is a dangerous thing to do.

 

Yeah but I think we should be clear about the effects -- I appreciate your concern. I had to take small amounts at a time or else the nausea was too strong and I would have thrown up. I'm just trying to point out that it's not the ibotenic acid that causes the psychotropic effect in the brain. So the above Wiki statement is misleading when it quotes brain lesions -- because the low PH of the stomach hydrolyses the ibotenic acid into muscimol according to the report I just read. Ibotenic acid is about ten times weaker than muscimol so the psychotropic effects of the mushroom are actually from the muscimol not the ibotenic acid.

 

http://www.erowid.org/plants/amanitas/amanitas_info_ott.shtml

 

Ibotenic acid evokes entheogenic effects in human beings at doses ranging from 50 - 100 mg (Chilton 1975; Theobald et al. 1968). An equivalent effect is produced by 10-15 mg of muscimol (Theobald et al. 1968; Waser 1967). After oral ingestion, the onset of the inebriation is rather slow, and generally 2-3 hours elapse before the full effects are felt (Chilton 1975). This delayed response has also been reported following ingestion of Amanita pantherina (Ott 1976a). The effects last for 6-8 hours, depending on dose. Effects are characterized by visual distortions, loss of equilibrium, mild muscle twitching (not convulsions, as has erroneously been reported), and altered auditory and visual perception (Chilton 1975; Ott 1976a).

 

It would appear that muscimol is the psychoactive constituent, and that following ingestion of ibotenic acid, a fraction of the material decarboxylates to muscimol, which then produces the inebriation. After oral ingestion of ibotenic acid, a substantial percentage of the drug is excreted unaltered in the urine, but small amounts of muscimol are also excreted (Chilton, unpublished). This mechanism would potentially explain the Siberian urinary drug recycling practice. After ingestion of the mushroom, the celebrant would excrete substantial amounts of ibotenic acid in his urine. A second user ingesting the urine of the first, would cause some of the ibotenic acid to be decarboxylated to muscimol during digestion, producing inebriation when the muscimol was absorbed; and the bulk of the ibotenic acid would be re-excreted in his urine in turn. Thus a 100 mg dose of ibotenic acid might potentially represent four or five 10-15 mg doses of muscimol, and Steller's 1774 report that one dose of mushrooms could be recycled through four or five persons is certainly feasible. Muscimol itself probably does not play a significant role in urinary drug recycling, since it was found that only a small percentage of injected muscimol was excreted in the urine of mice (Ott et al. 1975a). This hypothesis has yet to be verified quantitatively in human beings, though it has been demonstrated qualitatively in preliminary experiments (Chilton 1979).

 

On the other hand repeated use of alcohol causes brain lesions -- and obviously alcohol is used abundantly and promoted in society -- http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8452204

 

So I would say that the risk is similar but the amanita high is way different than alcohol.

 

On the adrenaline thing -- it depends on the glutamate relation to adrenaline. I'll look to clarify this.

AMANITA MUSCARIA:

Mycopharmacological Outline

and Personal Experiences

by Francesco Festi and Antonio Bianchi

Taken from PM&E Volume Five

 

Ibotenic Acid is far less active than Muscimol (the activity of

 

Muscazone is practically negligible). At the average con-

 

centration found in the mushroom, it would produce barely

 

perceptible effects.

 

Estimating content for an Amanita muscaria specimen of

 

autumnal growth, Muscimol can be found at around 0.05%.

 

This is based on an estimate of a mushroom with a cap 10-15

 

cm. broad and which weighs approximately 60-70 g. There

 

is a good correspondence between an effective dose of the

 

mushroom (1-10 caps of medium size) and the ones of the

 

isolated compound.

 

In summary, therefore, it seems correct to focus attention on

 

the Muscimol.

Edited December 25, 2011 by fulllotus

[taooneusa]

it really depends on body health, internal ability and body type/element predominance.

..and how much ibutane is actually in the mushroom. Over consumption is where people get into

trouble. The affect can be very severe.

 

It sometimes effects the central nervous system with seizures and respiratory failure:

 

"" I remember a couple that was walking asking me if I was alright. Then I remember one of them saying they called the ambulance. Then I remember what appeared to be the police and some paramedics standing over me and asking all sorts of questions which I could not respond too. I thought it was all a dream. Then I remember being in the emergency room with doctors and nurses stripping my close off, sticking all sorts of IVs in me, and a tube up my urethra (I remember this excrutiating pain). I heard a couple nurses or doctors (not sure) scream, 'He is going into seizure again.' I then recall the doctor asking me if I took heroin a few times, and all I muttered was amanita, but he didn't know what I was saying. Then I remember coming to, with my mom by my side, about 6-8 hours later.

 

I didn't know who I was or where I was for a long time. I thought maybe I had been hit by a car, or maybe I had died. I simply didn't know and really didn't care, it is the day after now, and all I have as memories of last night are about 6 IV spots on both my arms, and an extremely painful urethra, which is torture to pee out of. I simply don't know what happened, maybe it was the drugs, the dosage, or something completely different. I got CAT scans and I don't have a tumor. I have never had a seizure in my life prior to this. I also can no longer drive until I follow up with a neurologist.

 

"" Yep, a night in the hospital in the most awful psychic agony I have ever experienced while they poured ipecac (SP) and charcoal down me 'cause the little bastards refused to let me puke. I was pumped. I was then hooked to a heart monitor and had the distinct displeasure of seeing my heart stop a couple of times. After one of them and a couple of firm thumps to my sternum I asked the doctor if I was going to make it. He was rather preocupied with saving my life and sorta muttered, 'we don't know.' They would not treat me with anything until the mushroom was identified which they did by flying it to a poison control center in Denver, I think it was, by Navy jet from Moffet field. They then shot me with something that had me down in 15 minutes after about six hours of mental horror. The next morning every damn med student and intern came by to find out what it was like. I didn't have good things to report. Your mileage may vary. The view I got of the human condition and the burried sadness, pain and agony in everyone around and treating me in the busy emergency facility may have been one very powerful sort of empathogenic halucination effect but it fucked me up for a long time. I have tried nearly every psychoactive even remotely available and nothing, NOTHING, has had such a negative psychic effect.

 

"" Apparently she had asked if I was ok and if she could go to bed, and I said, “OK”. She then asked if she could turn the light off and I said “Ok” again. She awoke 10-15 minutes later to a gurgling sound coming from the other room. She found me convulsing on the floor. I had pissed myself at least once, and my eyes were wide open, but rolled back in my head. She tried to wake me, but I was non-responsive to her repeated attempts. Desperate, she called the hospital and had them send an ambulance, who in turn called the fucking cops like most stupid hospitals do in the event of an O.D. (How this can be justified when this only results in more deaths from OD’s when people avoid medical attention for fear of the police). The ambulance came and the cops shortly thereafter.

 

this guys symptoms of sweating, being very cold and salivation precede central nervous system problems like seizure and respiratory failure that result fro overdose of muscaria.

 

""

First of all this was about he most unpleasant thing I've ever done. My wife and I split 30 grams of dried aminitas. We ground them up in a coffie grinder and then heated them on the stove with water for about 45 minutes. We started to drink them about 5:15 and finished about 5:25. The taste was not apetizing at all. My wife started to feel sick at about 5:45 and we both were getting light headed. I got up to use the restroom and i felt like i was drunk; but only in my head. For about the next 30 minutes we watched TV. andabout 6:20 I had to vomit. We bot had a tottaly 'in the head' feeling. The only thing I felt in my body was like i was being pushed into the couch. When I closed my eyes I felt like I was falling. My wife felt the same way. About 6:30 I went outside because I was cold. Even though it was 80 - 90 degreese outside I was still cold. I found myself sweating profously, and salvating like my favorite dish was on the stove.

 

After baout 30 minutes I went to lay on the couch. I still felt the same.. in my head. My wife looked like she was asleep so I didn't bother her. I was still sweating really bad...but still cold. So I got a blanket and tried to go to sleep. It didn't work. The blanket made me sweat more, which made me colder' and so on. For about the next three hours I felt this way. Finally about 10:00 I started to feel normal. So I got something to eat and when I diddnt feel anything anymore I was really tired so I was able to go to sleep. Sleep came easy accept I kept waking up with a soaking wet pillow; and I dont ussually drool when I sleep. The next morning i woke up and felt fine. There were no after efects like LSD or anything. As an ending note...neither of us will EVER take Aminitas again.

 

Bad Experiences with Muscaria

Edited December 25, 2011 by taooneusa

[voidisyinyang]

it really depends on body health, internal ability and body type/element predominance.

..and how much ibutane is actually in the mushroom. Over consumption is where people get into

trouble. The affect can be very severe.

 

It sometimes effects the central nervous system with seizures and respiratory failure:

 

"" I remember a couple that was walking asking me if I was alright. Then I remember one of them saying they called the ambulance. Then I remember what appeared to be the police and some paramedics standing over me and asking all sorts of questions which I could not respond too. I thought it was all a dream. Then I remember being in the emergency room with doctors and nurses stripping my close off, sticking all sorts of IVs in me, and a tube up my urethra (I remember this excrutiating pain). I heard a couple nurses or doctors (not sure) scream, 'He is going into seizure again.' I then recall the doctor asking me if I took heroin a few times, and all I muttered was amanita, but he didn't know what I was saying. Then I remember coming to, with my mom by my side, about 6-8 hours later.

 

I didn't know who I was or where I was for a long time. I thought maybe I had been hit by a car, or maybe I had died. I simply didn't know and really didn't care, it is the day after now, and all I have as memories of last night are about 6 IV spots on both my arms, and an extremely painful urethra, which is torture to pee out of. I simply don't know what happened, maybe it was the drugs, the dosage, or something completely different. I got CAT scans and I don't have a tumor. I have never had a seizure in my life prior to this. I also can no longer drive until I follow up with a neurologist.

 

You mean Ibotenic not ibutane. haha. The quote you give is without a link but the link says it's combined cannabis with amanita and a beer beforehand....

 

http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=52928

 

I don't know what kind of synergistic effect it would have....but I agree it depends on how the person ingested it -- did they get stoned and then just eat the whole mushroom at once?

slowly drank the mixture over a half hour period.

Well it took me one hour to eat one mushroom that was maybe 10 grams.

 

O.K. so finally I found the connection between adrenaline and glutamate. It turns out that if you increase your glutamate levels significantly then your body produces increased adrenaline to counteract it.

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20493841

 

So this explains why I experienced increased adrenaline! I wasn't sure if it was from something else -- I just thought I had increased adrenaline. Turned out I was correct. Another Amanita Muscaria report stated that the increased strength deal is REAL -- it's not an illusion. So this now makes sense -- also that the Berserker Vikings would use it for battle.

 

Wow check this out!! This may explain the above bad trip from Amanita -- he drank a beer beforehand!! http://www.mushroomgeeks.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-3282.html

 

It is the fresh mushrooms that are overtly toxic with their high levels

of ibotenic acid. When the mushrooms are dried the ibotenic acid looses

1 carbon and 2 oxygen atoms and becomes muscimol. Muscimol is what you

are looking for as your main psychoactive agent and is not toxic like

the ibotenic acid.

 

DO NOT CONSUME ANY carbonated beverages while using Amanita muscaria.

Many a wonderful experience has been cut short and become a black hole

of darkness after the person tripping on amanita drank a beer. It seems

the CO2 in the beer may allow the muscimol to convert back into Ibotenic

acid or something as bad for you. this info is from numerous first hand

reports and is not commonly discussed.

 

I learned about it from Mr. Teeters new book Amanita Muscaria; Herb of

Immortality. More info about the book can be found here.

 

Amanita Muscaria; Herb of Immortality

http://www.dockunda.com/amanita-muscaria-book/

 

As far as overdose level. If you eat too much, you will likely pass out

and sleep for quite a while, but suffer no lasting ill effects.

 

Totally fascinating. Wow his whole book is online -- Teeter's Amanita Muscaria: Herb of Immortality:

 

http://www.ambrosiasociety.org/files/herbofimmortality.pdf

Edited December 25, 2011 by fulllotus

[taooneusa]

here's another quote ""I have eaten Amanitas Muscaria(over a whole ounce dried), and if you are considering eating them, I strongly urge you to reconsider.

 

The experience was very unpleasant. Not only did I vomit while trying to keep them down, but once they hit me....

 

Imagine losing all of your memories and your sense of self. Imaging losing complete control of your body, and having seizures, and banging your head repeatedly into things, and being unable to stand or move or otherwise compose yourself in a conscious directed fashion. Imagine being deathly ill for hours.

 

Experientially, I was a shell of a person, not even an animal. I was a being trapped in temporal loops, my identity having been completely annihilated by the sheer intensity of living time discontinuously. Instead of experiencing life as a serious of mostly discrete sensual impressions, moments became bundles of sense data which I would experience over and over and over and over.

 

Eventually, my friends dragged me, pale and probably covered in vomit and filth, to my bedroom so they would not have to watch me die.

 

Should they have called a hospital? I am really glad they did not, for I came to the next day.

[voidisyinyang]

here's another quote ""I have eaten Amanitas Muscaria(over a whole ounce dried), and if you are considering eating them, I strongly urge you to reconsider.

 

The experience was very unpleasant. Not only did I vomit while trying to keep them down, but once they hit me....

 

Imagine losing all of your memories and your sense of self. Imaging losing complete control of your body, and having seizures, and banging your head repeatedly into things, and being unable to stand or move or otherwise compose yourself in a conscious directed fashion. Imagine being deathly ill for hours.

 

Experientially, I was a shell of a person, not even an animal. I was a being trapped in temporal loops, my identity having been completely annihilated by the sheer intensity of living time discontinuously. Instead of experiencing life as a serious of mostly discrete sensual impressions, moments became bundles of sense data which I would experience over and over and over and over.

 

Eventually, my friends dragged me, pale and probably covered in vomit and filth, to my bedroom so they would not have to watch me die.

 

Should they have called a hospital? I am really glad they did not, for I came to the next day.

 

Well that quote is from a thread started by a person seeking help in identifying amanita shrooms. It is easy to misidentify them -- for example there is a variety of amanita in Minnesota that has no psychotropic effects. I didn't know about this variety before I ate the amanita muscaria that I found -- which obviously was not the kind with no psychtropic effects.

 

The time loop effect mentioned in the above report is actually quite prominent from amanita muscaria - so much that I also blogged on it. http://naturalresonancerevolution.blogspot.com/2011/10/fly-agaric-loop-as-dmt-dream-state-aka.html again making the connection to DMT. Still you get a more toxic effect from the similar looking amanita pantheria and it's possible that the above report was someone who ingested the wrong kind as this quote describes:

 

"Mushroom the Journal" had an educational story in its summer 1991 issue. (112) A busload of high-school students, coming back from a jazz competition mushroomed in woods near their dinner stop. Thinking to get high from Amanita muscaria they picked Amanita pantherina. They shortly began to vomit and hallucinate and even a few became semi-comatose. Three boys ended up in an intensive care unit, two others were kept overnight in hospital and six more were treated and released after ipecac and activated charcoal treatment. Oregon State police rushed the samples to Oregon Health & Science University in Portland. The university in turn got Janet Lindgren, chairman of the Toxicology Committee of the Oregon Mycological Society, out of bed at 2 a.m. The symptoms, the time of year and the fragments clearly identified the offending mushrooms as Amanita pantherina. The school temporarily suspended those, who poisoned themselves; the others hopefully learned by example.

 

The Amanita Pantheria looks like an older Amanita Muscaria which starts out red but then yellows with age. The pantheria is never red. You probably know this but that's why the Pantheria can be confused for Muscaria.

 

So the Pantheria has more muscarine in it than Muscaria -- and then the muscarine can produce seizures: http://www.pharmacorama.com/en/Sections/Acetylcholine_2_2.php#2

 

According to conditions, the stimulation of the post-synaptic muscarinic receptors elicits a depolarization or an hyperpolarisation. In animals, their stimulation induces facilitation of training but also hypothermia, tremors, seizures.

Edited December 25, 2011 by fulllotus

[taooneusa]

the very same result quoted if frequently experienced from A. Muscaria.

The "banging your head into things repeatedly" is another common problem.

He did not mean he was falling down, but being unable to stop him self from

intentionally banging his head on hard objects.

 

Amrit and Soma are not a mushroom. They are contained in all things.

These mushrooms are actually a very poor way to attempt to derive Soma.

There are other sources much easier on the body.

 

It's better to say that some 'part' of soma is hidden in all things, and that

ingestible red-colored sources are most all very toxic.

Edited December 25, 2011 by taooneusa

[voidisyinyang]

here's another quote ""I have eaten Amanitas Muscaria(over a whole ounce dried), and if you are considering eating them, I strongly urge you to reconsider.

 

The experience was very unpleasant. Not only did I vomit while trying to keep them down, but once they hit me....

 

Imagine losing all of your memories and your sense of self. Imaging losing complete control of your body, and having seizures, and banging your head repeatedly into things, and being unable to stand or move or otherwise compose yourself in a conscious directed fashion. Imagine being deathly ill for hours.

 

Experientially, I was a shell of a person, not even an animal. I was a being trapped in temporal loops, my identity having been completely annihilated by the sheer intensity of living time discontinuously. Instead of experiencing life as a serious of mostly discrete sensual impressions, moments became bundles of sense data which I would experience over and over and over and over.

 

Eventually, my friends dragged me, pale and probably covered in vomit and filth, to my bedroom so they would not have to watch me die.

 

Should they have called a hospital? I am really glad they did not, for I came to the next day.

 

 

Yeah it's impossible that the above bad experience was caused by muscimol -- so it was either ibotenic acid -- which means the amanita was not dried properly -- or they ingested it with carbonated drink thereby converting the muscimol back into ibotenic acid -- or they misidentified the muscaria as pantheria.

 

http://www.inchem.org/documents/pims/fungi/pimg026.htm

 

Muscimol lacks cholinergic effect at the

neuromuscular junction. It inhibits tremor induced by

tremorin but does not stop the associated salivation

and lacrimation....These observations further support a

localization of action of muscimol in the brain rather

than in the peripheral nervous system.

 

Ibotenic acid and glutamic acid produce convulsions in

immature rats, in which the blood-brain barrier is not

completely developed (Johnston, 1973).

[voidisyinyang]

Just got my sister to drink Artist Conk tea to heal her cough. Then I googled artist conk cough and sure enough it's used to treat bronchitis, lung, respiratory coughs. haha. She's better already.