idiot_stimpy Posted February 7, 2012 I would like to get your views on the difference between Enlightenment and Immortality? Is Immortality, life after physical body death with the personality intact? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Protector Posted February 7, 2012 (edited) There seems to be a bunch of different immortalities around, or excuses as I'd like to call them Some people just go ahead and say that some parts of a person wont ever die and so everyone is immortal Other people say that with the right training that sends yourself to live as a sort of spirit outside your body, that spirit body becomes immortal And another way that I have never heard mention on this forum, a living person gathers enough chi to have the ability to decide when to die The idea for that technique came from people who knew they didn't have enough time on earth to master everything so they instead decided to find a way to give themselves enough time. Having all the time in the world, these immortals could live as long as they wanted and finally reach enlightenment at some point. Immortality and enlightenment are completely unrelated in that way but an immortal has more chances to become enlightened, and since becoming immortal was such a big secret, immortals used to be automatically associated with being enlightened Edited February 7, 2012 by Sinfest 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted February 7, 2012 But then they all might be delusional. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
konchog uma Posted February 7, 2012 But then they all might be delusional. look out you're becoming a buddhist! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan Posted February 7, 2012 (edited) But then they all might be delusional. look out you're becoming a buddhist! The grand delusion and/or buddhism are irelevant; we are all delusional. our perceptions are nothing more than delusion generators. Our true delusional state is defined not by our delusions themselves, but weather or not we can acknowledge them and accept that we are, in fact, delusional. Then the path forward becomes yet clearer and our understanding of immortality with it. Edited February 7, 2012 by Hot Nirvana Judo Trend Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
konchog uma Posted February 7, 2012 The grand delusion and/or buddhism are irelevant; we are all delusional. our perceptions are nothing more than delusion generators. Our true delusional state is defined not by our delusions themselves, but weather or not we can acknowledge them and accept that we are, in fact, delusional. Then the path forward becomes yet clearer and our understanding of immortality with it. well said my friend Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idiot_stimpy Posted February 8, 2012 What is the personality other than a ball of thoughts/beliefs held onto? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Protector Posted February 8, 2012 Thoughts and beliefs are not a part of it in the first place Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
joeblast Posted February 8, 2012 imho, not delusional - its just that our sensory input through the cranial nerves are only perturbative methods of "accessing reality" just like the vagus nerve is a perturbative interaction with the zangfu e.g. "not directly accessing reality" so it is an interpretation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Z3N Posted February 8, 2012 imho, not delusional - its just that our sensory input through the cranial nerves are only perturbative methods of "accessing reality" just like the vagus nerve is a perturbative interaction with the zangfu e.g. "not directly accessing reality" so it is an interpretation. All sensory information perceived becomes the product of the "self". What defines the self is the likes and dislikes that one is galveranized too depending on many factors hence diversity of self. So conscious self is the formation of that, what I feel, taste, touch, see, smell and hear are all reality base on this information in regards to self. This is the illusion because the human brain bases what is "real" by electrical impulses which in turn creating the self, this I am "me". Automatically the cocon is formed without even knowing and the consciousness is limited, slowly becomes inwrapped by this mental circuit (Brain matter.) Meaning consciousness spilts into two becoming a conscious and sub conscious, this limits our awareness. Therefore our evolutionary hurdle is established. Hence this topic. Freeing ones mind form the conditioning of self is enlightenment. Basicly ego assassination. This in turn leads to immortality of the soul. One dose not need a body of cells to be immortal. Our body is just a skin bag, a shell. This shell is the purpose of the evolving soul hence short human life spans and reincarnation. We have all been throught it, death reincarnation No need to worry about immortality when you're lacking spiritual evolution as a human species . What good is immortality when I can chop off you're head and you die another rebirth? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lifeforce Posted February 8, 2012 Our body is just a skin bag, a shell. It is these remarks which infuriate me. The body, mind and spirit are inseparable. One cannot function without the others. The body is a remarkable manifestation of creation, and, if looked after, can lead one gracefully into the later years of life. A healthy body is essential to spiritual development. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan Posted February 8, 2012 It is these remarks which infuriate me. The body, mind and spirit are inseparable. One cannot function without the others. The body is a remarkable manifestation of creation, and, if looked after, can lead one gracefully into the later years of life. A healthy body is essential to spiritual development. The body is a person, a place, made up of things. The mind is a person, a place, made up of things. The spirit is beyond mind-body, but occupys the space between reality of the mind and of the body. They are all able to function without one another. but they cannot stir the spirit without each other. a mind with no body or body without mind cannot stir the spirit, and likewise a mind-body without spirit cannot benefit the spirit. Truly, a healthy body is essential to spiritual development, however the attachment to mind and/or to body is not healthy and thusly cannot stir the spirit in healthy ways. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Protector Posted February 9, 2012 The reality is that the body in terms of spiritual evolution is only 10% of the task. The other 90% is all in the mind. I think the body is 1/7 and the mind is another 1/7 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Z3N Posted February 9, 2012 I think the body is 1/7 and the mind is another 1/7 Hahahaha! well this is all just a conversation in the weeds. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Phosphor Posted February 9, 2012 Back to the original question on the nature of enlightenment and immortality, and whether they are different or the same- we need to understand firstly what enlightenment really is. The terms I use are Greek. Enlightenment, in its proper usage, refers to the state achieved when the epinoia, or psycho-sexual energy residing at the base of the spine, rises to the spiritual center (spheroi) residing in the head. This state was named hypostasis when experienced in sitting meditation, and Gnosis when it became a waking state and could be experienced at all times by the magician. They both refer to a connection which is established between the mind and consciousness. This means the magician, mystic, yogi, saint, is now in a constant rapport with God- or the "Good" as Plato named Him, and is the origin of "God". So the normal usage of enlightenment refers to this connection, or union which is achieved. Yoga means union. Nothing is gained in this state so much as it is discovered to be true, since all of our consciousness is already perfect and in union with the Good. The mind only needs to be purified so that the ignorance does not cover this knowledge. Hence "Gnosis". Now, there are many levels of this union however. On the first level, only the consciousness is discovered to be unified with the Good and liberated, free. This is what most people refer to when talking about enlightenment. This does not make the physical body immortal, nor the astral body, nor the mental body. There is a higher achievement which requires different practices, and many more lives of practice, and trial and error, which is the achievement of the body of light. This is the full union of man with God. He is unified not only in consciousness, but mentally, astrally and sometimes physically as well. Meaning the mental body of this universe is the magician's mental body, and the astral body or archeus of the universe is the astral body of the magician, and the physical body is unified with the Light of the physical world. This is full liberation, and this is the achievement of the greatest sages, saints and gods, and heroes in our mythologies and history books. Lastly, extreme longevity can also be achieved through different herbal remedies and practices which aim at rejuvenating the body faster than it decays. The Taoists are famous for this and it is not hard to come across a story of a Taoist master who has achieved such and is known to have lived for generations. This should have answered your question to some extent. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idiot_stimpy Posted February 9, 2012 Thank you very much Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
