Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan Posted February 7, 2012 So i know a few people in this world, close friends, who have a large long list of a wide range of health issues. I've mentioned off handed before that these things are managable, but they got defensive and argumentative. I'm not trying to convince them of anything, but i cant help but cringe when one claims they will be dead before they are 50, as if they are fine and okay with that and their health, yet complaining in the same breath. (no pun intended) It would be nice if i could help them never the less... Some cases of localized effects have been observed around me, when i am deeper in practices. others express more energy and lower illness rates, but for something as huge as i want to attempt, i wouldnt even know where to start, except breathing But at the same time, part of me suggests against it at all, that they have to learn the hard way or not at all... Thoughts? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jeramiah Zeitigeist Posted February 7, 2012 From my perspective as a healer for the last 18 years; Its up to them. Some people choose to heal, some choose to be remain ill. We all have a different path to follow. At the right time, they will seek out healing, if its appropriate to them, or they won't. Neither choice is right or wrong. It just is. I used to feel the same, in my first year or two of healing. I had an incredible gift and wanted to share it. But now, I give everything I have to those who seek me out for healing, and I don't give a thought to those who choose a different path. We all have choices. Some people just aren't ready to heal. And forcing the issue never works. Never ! Its ego to think we know a better way. My responsibility is to those who seek help, not to those whose path is illness. So be there for them if they seek help, support or advice. If not, then treat them with compassion and understanding, as you would anyone else. Don't define them by the illness or pain. Just let them be. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan Posted February 7, 2012 yeah, absolutely. that's how i feel, however there is that part that i want to "leave an anonymous gift" as it were... Not that i can force it on them, nor would i attempt to do so in any case, but it's that desire to be able to help them. I do what i can in auxilliary, taking care of the chores and kids as much as i can (while still trying to find time to work on schoolwork and get sleep) but it's also distracting from my personal practices, and i have very little time to even do as little as breathing exercises when i am so distracted by the stress and calamity of daily life around here/there. In any case, you're right, and all i can do is what they ask me to do. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aetherous Posted February 7, 2012 Well, you could just ask them if it's okay for you to practice healing on them. Buy them a drink as payment for their time. What healing skillz do you have by the way? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan Posted February 7, 2012 Well, you could just ask them if it's okay for you to practice healing on them. Buy them a drink as payment for their time. What healing skillz do you have by the way? speaking of which, what little i can do, is very little, but i havent felt any serious evidence to my methods and results. It's a very passive approach, to others. i maintain a mental focus on sharing my energies, specifically for the healing and well being of others. And, like i said, when i am actively cultivating, it seems like the effects are observable, but not always. as opposed to right now, while i am so busy i am only trying to keep a small amount of cultivation for personal stores and uses. im fighting off a cold right now, which is going around the house. I tend to get over the cold before others, but often get it again before they get over their first bout. Never the less, when directly asked, i have been able to give people warmth, pain reduction (like stiff joints), and reduce if not remove tension and headaches through direct touch or "hovering hands". I am not as confident in myself as the few i have helpped are though... i dont thoroughly understand what i am doing and wouldnt want to make any poor judgments and mistakes. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RiverSnake Posted February 7, 2012 Wanting to help others when they have not made the personal choice to heal is in my view just another attachment forged by the ego...though one cleverly clothed in our best intentions. Jeramiah said it best. Just gotta let it go and give to those whom are ready to receive. -My 2 cents, Peace Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mYTHmAKER Posted February 8, 2012 Heal yourself and by your example perhaps they will ask for help or not. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jeramiah Zeitigeist Posted February 8, 2012 yeah, absolutely. that's how i feel, however there is that part that i want to "leave an anonymous gift" as it were... Not that i can force it on them, nor would i attempt to do so in any case, but it's that desire to be able to help them. I do what i can in auxilliary, taking care of the chores and kids as much as i can (while still trying to find time to work on schoolwork and get sleep) but it's also distracting from my personal practices, and i have very little time to even do as little as breathing exercises when i am so distracted by the stress and calamity of daily life around here/there. In any case, you're right, and all i can do is what they ask me to do. Don't worry about the anonymous gift. You are giving practical help. Thats good. Healing comes down to intention, and if your intention is clear and pure, you'll be helping them in ways you aren't aware of. So relax and don't worry. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jeramiah Zeitigeist Posted February 8, 2012 Wanting to help others when they have not made the personal choice to heal is in my view just another attachment forged by the ego...though one cleverly clothed in our best intentions. Jeramiah said it best. Just gotta let it go and give to those whom are ready to receive. -My 2 cents, Peace Exactly. Took me a few years to work that out. Life became much easier afterwards. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jetsun Posted February 8, 2012 Maybe they like being ill, perhaps it gives them a load of self pity to cling to and something to moan about, so they might fight you if you try to take it away. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
joeblast Posted February 8, 2012 speaking of which, what little i can do, is very little, but i havent felt any serious evidence to my methods and results. It's a very passive approach, to others. i maintain a mental focus on sharing my energies, specifically for the healing and well being of others. And, like i said, when i am actively cultivating, it seems like the effects are observable, but not always. as opposed to right now, while i am so busy i am only trying to keep a small amount of cultivation for personal stores and uses. im fighting off a cold right now, which is going around the house. I tend to get over the cold before others, but often get it again before they get over their first bout. Never the less, when directly asked, i have been able to give people warmth, pain reduction (like stiff joints), and reduce if not remove tension and headaches through direct touch or "hovering hands". I am not as confident in myself as the few i have helpped are though... i dont thoroughly understand what i am doing and wouldnt want to make any poor judgments and mistakes. a few people like that in my life also, they seem to view the things I do with some curiosity but chalk it up to just another strange esoteric thing I'm into. you'll need real gung before you can significantly make an impact for some....you'd damn near need to be JC in order to convince others Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan Posted February 8, 2012 Exactly. Took me a few years to work that out. Life became much easier afterwards. I guess i shouldnt brag, and not that I am, per se, but it didnt take me long. by 12, i was starting to 'get it' but i didnt really get it till 21. And even though i do get it, it is often more a matter of remembering it and applying it. Pure intentions, yeah, but like i said, i wouldnt want to be harmful with my helpful intentions. i say it all the time in all my posts anyways Thanks to jeramiah for the encoragement. i try to maintain that mentality/viewpoint, but there's rarely, if ever, any confirmation of what influences people are benefitting from. And thanks all of you, everyone who posted, for the insightful input. It's really a more simple matter than i make it out to be 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RiverSnake Posted February 8, 2012 I guess i shouldnt brag, and not that I am, per se, but it didnt take me long. by 12, i was starting to 'get it' but i didnt really get it till 21. And even though i do get it, it is often more a matter of remembering it and applying it. IME when you truly internalize a truth then it becomes a part of you...you no longer need to think about "applying it". The truth solidified in oneself naturally unfolds without thought. This is just something that takes time and needs to unfold naturally through deep experiences of such. -My 2 cents, Peace 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan Posted February 8, 2012 mmh i believe that, thoroughly. Thanks for your pennies 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jeramiah Zeitigeist Posted February 8, 2012 I guess i shouldnt brag, and not that I am, per se, but it didnt take me long. by 12, i was starting to 'get it' but i didnt really get it till 21. And even though i do get it, it is often more a matter of remembering it and applying it. Pure intentions, yeah, but like i said, i wouldnt want to be harmful with my helpful intentions. i say it all the time in all my posts anyways Thanks to jeramiah for the encoragement. i try to maintain that mentality/viewpoint, but there's rarely, if ever, any confirmation of what influences people are benefitting from. And thanks all of you, everyone who posted, for the insightful input. It's really a more simple matter than i make it out to be I was a very slow developer ! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Clarity Posted February 9, 2012 It's a funny thing. People like to complain, they also seem attached (like an old worn out security blanket) to their pain. This topic reminds me of a recent incident with a potential client who was referred to me. She wanted discounts, assurances, and special treatment in the form of appointments on the weekends and weekend evenings. Mind you, we had not even met and already she was making demands. So I had to draw a boundary and send her away as she would not accept any of the alternatives I suggested. It seems that for some folks, giving up their pain won't happen until they are really desperate enough. Sometimes people have to hit rock bottom before they'll give up their attachments. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idiot_stimpy Posted February 9, 2012 Sometimes people have to hit rock bottom before they'll give up their attachments. Suffering is sometimes the greatest teacher 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan Posted February 9, 2012 Suffering is sometimes the greatest teacher I find this to be almost absolute. Definitely true, but almost absolute. It is rare to find one so completely without suffering throughout their life, LET ALONE, such a person who has willingly unbound themselves from the oh so many unnecessary attachments in life. Truly, i see more often that those who have suffered the most become wisest. Great wisdom comes not only from great age, but from great suffering. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jeramiah Zeitigeist Posted February 9, 2012 I find this to be almost absolute. Definitely true, but almost absolute. It is rare to find one so completely without suffering throughout their life, LET ALONE, such a person who has willingly unbound themselves from the oh so many unnecessary attachments in life. Truly, i see more often that those who have suffered the most become wisest. Great wisdom comes not only from great age, but from great suffering. Damn true ! After 14 years of dedicating my life to healing, I had four years of the most appalling and unbelievable suffering that came so close to breaking me. Only high level Chi Gong and meditation saved me. Suicide would have been a far easier option. Now, out the other side, I am transformed. Not only more peaceful and happier than ever in my life, but with a profound sense of my true nature, and of healing. I have developed a lifetime of wisdom in a very short time, and an incredible empathy and love for everyone. I do feel I have been very lucky. I wouldn't recommend it, but if it comes to you, then embrace suffering as the greatest learning experience. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan Posted February 9, 2012 Damn true ! I wouldn't recommend it, but if it comes to you, then embrace suffering as the greatest learning experience. Embracing it is always the most difficult task, so daunting suffering is, great suffering all the more so. But always keep in mind that everything, no matter how bad, embarrassing, painful, or difficult, are always for the best and will make us stronger. The universe is out to help us, but tough love is a form of help that we often find hard to embrace. Dont forget that it's in our best intentions! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
z00se Posted February 10, 2012 Embracing it is always the most difficult task, so daunting suffering is, great suffering all the more so. But always keep in mind that everything, no matter how bad, embarrassing, painful, or difficult, are always for the best and will make us stronger. The universe is out to help us, but tough love is a form of help that we often find hard to embrace. Dont forget that it's in our best intentions! Can't agree with this. Embarrassing painful or difficult things are always the best for us? What the hell? Isn't that the goal of going with the tao so you don't have to experience this kind of stuff? None of those emotions are useful are they? how can they benefit you? Infact they cause you sickness and ill health. Why experience them when you don't have to? There are so may different good feelings you could be feeling instead! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jetsun Posted February 10, 2012 Embracing it is always the most difficult task, so daunting suffering is, great suffering all the more so. But always keep in mind that everything, no matter how bad, embarrassing, painful, or difficult, are always for the best and will make us stronger. The universe is out to help us, but tough love is a form of help that we often find hard to embrace. Dont forget that it's in our best intentions! The way I see it a large proportion of the suffering in the world is completely pointless, I don't see how most of the atrocities and traumas which get committed to innocent people are a form of lesson from the universe, no doubt we can learn from our suffering but only if it is not overwhelming. Scientists have documented by monitoring brain changes and stress responses in traumatised and abused people that overwhelming stress actually makes you weaker not stronger. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jeramiah Zeitigeist Posted February 10, 2012 Can't agree with this. Embarrassing painful or difficult things are always the best for us? What the hell? Isn't that the goal of going with the tao so you don't have to experience this kind of stuff? None of those emotions are useful are they? how can they benefit you? Infact they cause you sickness and ill health. Why experience them when you don't have to? There are so may different good feelings you could be feeling instead! Being with the Tao is not a form of escape ! Life is still a learning process. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jeramiah Zeitigeist Posted February 10, 2012 The way I see it a large proportion of the suffering in the world is completely pointless, I don't see how most of the atrocities and traumas which get committed to innocent people are a form of lesson from the universe, no doubt we can learn from our suffering but only if it is not overwhelming. Scientists have documented by monitoring brain changes and stress responses in traumatised and abused people that overwhelming stress actually makes you weaker not stronger. Thats the view from the outside ! None of us would be so mad as to choose that level of suffering. I was happy and peaceful, had a great life and was living with compassion and love. I didn't want it to change. But the universe had different ideas. Now, afterwards, I am even happier, with a greater depth of wisdom and understanding. I want to be here, right now. I love it. Everything in our lives brings us to here, where we are right now. For me, its writing this post. Everything around me is good. So the suffering I had brought me here. Sometimes I still wish it had never happened, but mostly I see it was a gift. I learnt things I could never have learnt without that experience. And also, the learning works both ways. The person who did those things will also have had a valuable experience. Somehow, it was important for her too, although in a very different way. The bigger picture is VERY big. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jetsun Posted February 10, 2012 Being with the Tao is not a form of escape ! Life is still a learning process. That is true, one of the main lessons of Buddhism is that we cause more suffering for ourselves by trying to get away from suffering. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
