Protector Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) So this is bothering me a little When someone wants to learn qi gong, one buys a book, a video, or learn in person. Knowledge slowly gets spread around that way and that's very nice and all, but we have Internet now. Knowledgeable people get together and exchange information on-line but they can't say everything. They bought a book and because the information didn't come from them originally, they can't just tell everyone about it. It's kinda like pirating movies but with knowledge. So I thought maybe people who know kunlun for example, could have like a closed off place to talk about it and improve together like that. I dropped the idea since the administrator and maybe some moderators will have the access to it while they didn't pay for it. It's very hard to share information on-line in a way fair to whom the information came from. Without permission a lot of things are left unsaid and that kinda hurts the discussions where you can't make a point without backing it up with more information. So either everything stays the same and discussions barely make sense or ignore all the rules and show the copyrighted content on-line, but that will hurt the site itself. The open information would also make a lot of people who are just visiting the site know the secrets and become rogue. Something that kinda fills the gaps in information is that 30 minute 30 day mentorship. Very slowly people would learn things from each other and be on the same ground when they talk about things on the forum, but that takes a long time and not everyone is willing to learn because they think they already know enough. Another thing that could fill the gaps would be a system that belong to tao bums that could be learned on the site for free. It could come out of the 30 day mentorship eventually or a master could donate his system to the site. Everyone knowing the same system would decrease fighting, new members could jump into discussions faster, and there would be more respect around here. Edited March 5, 2012 by Sinfest Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mYTHmAKER Posted March 5, 2012 Interesting, however body work really has to be transmitted directly in person unless one is really knowledgeable videos can do more harm than good to a beginner. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sifusufi Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) Read my Red Phoenix post (you do read my posts right?) I dropped over 1 G US this week to get it from the source NO ONE has ever shared anything about kunlun for free that I am aware of. Sinfest 1. How old are you? 2. Are you Russian mob? 3. Do you live with your mommy 4. Do you have a job $ ? Шучу мой товарищ люблю тебя мой брат Edited March 5, 2012 by sifusufi Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Protector Posted March 5, 2012 huh? what? you post on this forum? :ЛoЛ: Kunlun is just an example, when you guys are talking about it I don't understand anything you say and I just ignore the rest Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aetherous Posted March 5, 2012 NO ONE has ever shared anything about kunlun for free that I am aware of. Well, I did previously with a few people. No more! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sloppy Zhang Posted March 5, 2012 If there's an issue or question you'd like to take up with a seemingly knowledgeable person on this forum, shoot them a private message. If they haven't blocked you, and if you aren't a complete ass, most people are actually pretty helpful and willing to share. If you demonstrate that you are at a point where the knowledge they may impart to you is something that 1) you can understand, and/or 2) you're at a level to actually use, you might just find something very nice. A while ago someone made a thread for "tao bum pai", for consolidating information into one tao bum system. Obviously didn't work out. So many people coming from so many different systems and so many different paradigms. So many different worldviews. So basically, don't count on it. If there is a conversation that is going on that doesn't make sense, RESEARCH IT! It's the internet. There's information everywhere. Kunlun is an interesting example because it has held a major place on TTB's for a LOOOOOOOOONG time. There are many threads on it, most of them dozens of pages. Some people have gone back and deleted some of their old posts, so some valuable knowledge is lost. But a lot of it is still there. Enough to get a background in it, at least. The Flying Phoenix Qigong thread is HUGE, but as far as I can tell, contains tons of information. Michael Lomax (Ya Mu) has posted pretty regularly over the years, so if there's any questions about what he teaches, go to the source! Gonna involve some work. But I'm pretty sure forum searches and reading up on archives is MUCH easier than horse stance Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Protector Posted March 5, 2012 Thing is, I myself know some stuff that is never mentioned here and I want to say something but I can't just go mouthing off about it since I don't have the permission. Say, I just got an idea. How about trading knowledge? There's no way to put an exact price tag on a technique but if the word goes around a little, it will be more valuable. If it's possible to learn kunlun level one around here, then I would like to trade it for my horse stance. Things will slowly go around, we will eventually have something solid around here, and everyone wins by learning something. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ish Posted March 5, 2012 You know who teaches Kunlun, or whatever other practice, go and learn it from them, not from a student online. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chi 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 What is Kunlun anyway? Why is it so secretive? I'll guess I'll just stick with Spring Forest Qigong. Chunyi Lin said that a lot of Qigong teachers in China try to keep Qigong hidden in secrecy for power reasons. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted March 5, 2012 ... and there would be more respect around here. You looking for more respect? They sell it at WalMart. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
spiraltao Posted March 5, 2012 I think I comprehend what u are saying Sinfest! (BTW, I enjoy your posts), but A LOT of the Kunlun info is in here and why not MESSAGE some peeps and see what they might share. If I felt qualified to talk Kunlun I would. Here is a hint, Kunlun and Kuntao have the same root! LAO XIE said this! Kun means fist, of course, tao means way. I don't know what lun means. ...from what I knwo of Kuntao it is SILAT and looks alot like bagua. ok, ramble over, but my point is that SURELY there are plenty of bums here that would share info via PM. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trunk Posted March 5, 2012 Another thing that could fill the gaps would be a system that belong to tao bums that could be learned on the site for free. Closest thing we have to that currently is the articles section and alchemicaltaoism.com (not that either of them are a system, rather smorgasborgs). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChiDragon Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) Kunlun(崑崙) is a name of a mountain in the western region of China. There is a Taoist group had organized a home base there for their method of practice. Their method was know as "Kunlun" as most style of practice which was named by the name of the mountain where their home base was at. FYI... Kuan or quan(拳) is fist but not 'Kun(昆)'. I see how misleading information are widespread in the forum due to the people who misunderstood of the pinyin of the Chinese characters. Besides, pinyin sometimes are very confusing because one pinyin can be more than one character. If one pick the wrong character, then the intended meaning of the original character will be lost and out of context. The Tao(道) means 'method'. KunTao is just a method which the Kunlun group practices. It is customary to add the character Tao(道), at the end, to a particular kind of martial arts practice. Like Judo(柔道), Taekwondo(跆拳道), and Jeet Kune Do(截拳道) was developed by Bruce Lee. Edited March 5, 2012 by ChiDragon 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Astral Monk Posted March 5, 2012 Well, you can't get everything online, and you can't get everything from books, and you can't get everything from videos. And, unless you are the favorite son, you won't get everything from most teachers, and even if they give everything to everybody, it's unlikely that you'll get it the same way or to the same degree as Joe beside you. So you really can't get everything anywhere. Best to find the simple and practice it to exhaustion. Horse stance is looking good about now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan Posted March 5, 2012 Copyrights are only inhibiting the sharing of valuable information. While i disagree with the practice and adherence to copyright laws, there's nothing i can do about it/them. I believe that if there is a system of physical practice or art, that it should be shared freely by anyone who knows the art/system. Spread the knowledge, expand the enlightenment, help others help themselves. Why does everythign have to be about the money? IF that's teh case, then the original cultivators should be getting royalties for their descendents for eternity for the art and practice of Taijiquan, Qi Gong, Yoga, and so on and so forth.... sheeeeeeeesh.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChiDragon Posted March 5, 2012 Well, you can't get everything online, and you can't get everything from books, and you can't get everything from videos. And, unless you are the favorite son, you won't get everything from most teachers, and even if they give everything to everybody, it's unlikely that you'll get it the same way or to the same degree as Joe beside you. So you really can't get everything anywhere. Best to find the simple and practice it to exhaustion. Horse stance is looking good about now. Yes, you are so right.... BTW, the Ba Qua that you are using was drawn outside in. It should be drawn inside out. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aetherous Posted March 5, 2012 You can look at the money issue from different points of view... One is that teachers are greedy and secretive. Another is that teachers simply know what's best for the students to succeed, through experience. They don't like to waste their time on what doesn't work. Maybe if the student shows the right stuff, then the money issue won't even be applicable to that student...depending on the teacher. Obviously, accusing teachers of being greedy and secretive is not in line with receiving their teachings for free. A teacher would rather see someone who is so passionate that they 'empty their cup' and ABSORB new knowledge like the most thirsty sponge on earth. Open-minded. Ready to learn and transform by their own effort. There is something to be said about the guru-disciple relationship, even if it doesn't apply to all teachers. It's so important to have respect. Be in awe of what you don't know...not irrationally skeptical. So...try to think outside of the box of "spiritual teachers who charge money are greedy". It's only true 75% of the time. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan Posted March 5, 2012 It's not necessarily that teachers are greedy, but that in a world with a failing global economy, this is not a cash cow, but a recipe for extinction. The fewer the people that can afford to learn it, the fewer the people that are going to inherit it's secrets, thus the fewer the people there will be to keep it going around, or alive. Nothing wrong with paying or making an exchange to learn a tradition, practice, or art, but it cannot always be completely required in many cases. Not only is there a scarcity of teachers, but there is also a scarcity of people who can afford this rare teaching. How many people here would, if they could afford to, learn all the secrets of any given art, or even all arts? I know i would... if i had any money to spend on it/them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aetherous Posted March 5, 2012 The global economy is failing, but many people have raised the extra money to learn various things. At least personally I spent over a few thousand on various teachings during my time as a college student, which is kind of remarkable, lol. You may not be able to be a seminar junkie (unfortunately), but "where there's a will there's a way"! It says a lot about someone's resonance with a teaching, if they are unwilling to try to learn it. Where's the passion? The ones with passion go out and get it, no matter what. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RiverSnake Posted March 5, 2012 This thread should be titled: Sinfest vs Sinfest 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan Posted March 5, 2012 It says a lot about someone's resonance with a teaching, if they are unwilling to try to learn it. Where's the passion? The ones with passion go out and get it, no matter what. Not completely true there.... the most significant source i currently have on most teachings is this forum... I keep an eye out for what i can, but i cannot presently afford to pay for teachings, nor do i have a significant time to defer from college and household chores, which is the only form of "rent" i can currently pay. I cant afford my own place, let alone a non-college class in martial arts, or tai chi, or yoga, or whatever else, otherwise i would gladly be hocking up the cash! I learn what i can while i can, but it isnt satisfying my desire to learn and practice more. Typical american, i guess.... but i feel that everything else is of more pressing need, the chores for my place to sleep, the college, which is semi-obligatory for the same reason... leaves me with so little personal time, usually 4 hours..... TO GET SLEEP...! The only other thing i can do, to meet my personal goal, is to sell everything i have and find a buddhist/xiaolin temple and train hard every day... but my personal debts, i wish to repay first and foremost, which means more college and less personal time. Time management is not a skill i possess Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aetherous Posted March 5, 2012 People become masters because of what they learn on their path, not necessarily because of the methods they've been given. Part of this can include learning the hard way how important it is to set goals, to watch out for things in your life like finances, etc. Not having access to the methods you want is a good teaching. Not being able to help people who are in need is a similarly good teaching. Gaining access to learning something, and realizing that it wasn't necessarily what you truly wanted, is also a great way to learn things about yourself. As a teacher told me, "It's important to know what you want!" As another teacher once said, "Pay attention." 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
suninmyeyes Posted March 5, 2012 I learn what i can while i can, but it isnt satisfying my desire to learn and practice more. Hello Hot Nirvana, I want to say that just practising what you can and developing patience can be pure gold. There is time for everything. Daily spiritual practise is like a mental bath, very important for that aspect of a hygene. Practising a spiritual technique of choice or temporarily necessityliterally day in day out , years in ,years out..is the best investemt in life. Just keep on spinning . Another thing is passion Scotty has mentioned . Passion for spirtual understanding has such a lovley fragnance, it is almost irresistable to any more spiritually mature teacher and it holds potential to unlock even the most difficult doors. It truly is a magic key. I got teachings offered for free becouse of it not once but many times, even from someone who charges loads. So this things do happen and are a real fertile possibilty. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dwai Posted March 5, 2012 Not completely true there.... the most significant source i currently have on most teachings is this forum... I keep an eye out for what i can, but i cannot presently afford to pay for teachings, nor do i have a significant time to defer from college and household chores, which is the only form of "rent" i can currently pay. I cant afford my own place, let alone a non-college class in martial arts, or tai chi, or yoga, or whatever else, otherwise i would gladly be hocking up the cash! I learn what i can while i can, but it isnt satisfying my desire to learn and practice more. Typical american, i guess.... but i feel that everything else is of more pressing need, the chores for my place to sleep, the college, which is semi-obligatory for the same reason... leaves me with so little personal time, usually 4 hours..... TO GET SLEEP...! The only other thing i can do, to meet my personal goal, is to sell everything i have and find a buddhist/xiaolin temple and train hard every day... but my personal debts, i wish to repay first and foremost, which means more college and less personal time. Time management is not a skill i possess What's the rush? why not just enjoy what you can do and see how maybe you can cut out things that are not necessary in your life in the pursuits that you want? If you can manage an hour a day, that's good enough. Even in spiritual practices there is "too much". Do too much and you will fry your system. Do too less and you will not do anything. So, the key is moderation...not too much, not too little. Just pick one system that you like and stick with it. It will give you everything you want. Okay, maybe if you really want it, add another system to it. To quote an old indian saying (I actually read it here on TTB in the BK Frantzis interview) -- "its better to dig one well that is 2000 feet deep rather than digging 1000 2 feet deep wells" And you want to learn from a teacher, you must give him/her something. In the old days, the student would cook for the teacher, clean the house, do the laundry, dishes, what have you. Today you pay the teacher to do that. As long as the fees are reasonable that should be okay...if you cant afford it, talk to the teacher and explain your situation. Most good teachers will be willing to accept a student if they are sincere and have their cup empty... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mokona Posted March 5, 2012 Plenty of people just don't care about the money system. I was distantly attuned to all three levels of Reiki for free in the early 2000's, it was amazing. Just find someone who knows what you want to know and start Skyping. Don't worry about anything else. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
