Chapter 18 -- The Cause of the Death of a Sea Bird

[ChiDragon]

Edited March 29, 2012 by ChiDragon

[Marblehead]

Please be sure to translate into English so that I can talk with you.

[ChiDragon]

Yu Hui(颜回) is travelling to the east to visit the State of Qi2 (齐国), Confucius has a worried look on his face. Zi Gong(子贡) stepped away from his seat and asked: "May I ask you, teacher? Yu Hui(颜回) is leaving to the State of Qi2, you look worried, but why?

 

Confucius said: "Good question. In the past, Guan Zi(管子) had a saying; 'I reckon it was very nicely said. He said: "A small bag cannot be hold big items, a short rope cannot suck up the water of a well.' Hence, it was because of this, our lives are fixed individually, the physical shapes are made to fit each individually, they cannot be added nor subtracted. I am afraid that the stories from the past examples that he is going to present to the ruler of Qi may not be very convincing. The ruler will be resented and perplexed. If he cannot understand then he will become perplexed. If one has worry and perplexed will be worried to death.

 

Besides, haven't you heard? In the past, there was a sea bird flew over to the outskirt of the State of Ru. Lord Ru took it the Great Temple, and held a banquet and play music to entertain it. Gave it the best food there is. However, the bird was faint, irritated, and sad. It was afraid to eat a piece of meat or drink a cup of wine. After three days, the sea bird died.

 

That was a human self-raising method to raise a bird, instead of a bird raise method. The method used to raise a bird is suppose to have it live in the frost, loiter in an deserved island, float on a lake or a river catching fishes, follow a flock of birds flying and make stops and live freely as they can be. Birds are disdain to hear human voices. Especially, attending this kind of noisy party. If this kind of human music was played in a vast desert, all the birds will be flying away; and the animals will be running away. Even fishes will sunk to the bottom of the water. There must be some differences among them. Thus, what is best or worse for them are very different.

 

That was the reason why in the past sages handle affairs using different methods in accordance with the ability of each individual. Nomenclatures are only limited to what it is with reality. The reasons are designed to fit the characteristics of different category. Hence, this was said to be the basic reasoning in reaching all the directions and also maintain the virtue of happiness."

Edited March 29, 2012 by ChiDragon

[Marblehead]

Are we not saying here that we all must follow our true nature? Not only man but different species as well? So is there really a true nature of any collective?

[ChiDragon]

ZhuangZi was telling us do not apply our own standard into another system. It may not be suitable and may cause a disaster; such as serving the sea bird with human foods and wine. Anyway, the lessen here was suggesting that not to be blinded yourself with a standard that was best for you; but maybe the worse for others. If a standard was not applied adequately, then the outcome maybe unpredictable.

Edited March 30, 2012 by ChiDragon

[Marblehead]

not to be blinded yourself with a standard that was best for you; but maybe the worse for others.

You done good.

[Protector]

Doesn't teach how to talk to birds tho

hummmmmmmm

[ChiDragon]

Doesn't teach how to talk to birds tho

hummmmmmmm

 

I talk to my bird, Mango, all the time. He konws what I am talking about. You don't need any specail lessen to talk to a bird. If you talk long enough, the bird will understand you....

[Protector]

Don't think a bird will take up time to make you understand it

hum hummmmmmmmm

[ChiDragon]

Don't think a bird will take up time to make you understand it

hum hummmmmmmmm

When I say "good night, Mango" to my bird, then he says "bye bye, Mango" and went into his mating box.....

[Protector]

Your bird sound delicious

[dawei]

Is this a bird in a cage??? without any freedom of choice and movement?

 

Maybe this is social conditioning... and then there is human conditioning... forcing an animal to adhere to our language response to satisfy our own explanation of ownership, within a cage. Let that bird fly freely and go where it will... does it return each day on it's own accord? Does it seek some conversation?

[Marblehead]

Is this a bird in a cage??? without any freedom of choice and movement?

 

Maybe this is social conditioning... and then there is human conditioning... forcing an animal to adhere to our language response to satisfy our own explanation of ownership, within a cage. Let that bird fly freely and go where it will... does it return each day on it's own accord? Does it seek some conversation?

 

What? You want bird poop on the dining room table?

 

(But yes, I know what you are pointing at.)

[ChiDragon]

Is this a bird in a cage??? without any freedom of choice and movement?

 

Maybe this is social conditioning... and then there is human conditioning... forcing an animal to adhere to our language response to satisfy our own explanation of ownership, within a cage. Let that bird fly freely and go where it will... does it return each day on it's own accord? Does it seek some conversation?

This bird has a cage with the door open all the time. His mating box is place on top of the cage. He goes into the box to sleep and goes into the cage for food and water. He is on my shoulder when I take him for walk. I put him on the lemon tree when we were outside. Sometimes, he flies to my shoulder. FYI He is free as a bird. I become the caretaker of the bird because his original owner is ill.

 

Does it seek some conversation?

Believe me, he does.

 

@marblehead...

You are right about the poop, but my bird stay around the cage most of the time. However, he only flew over the my sofa and did it once and returned back to the cage.

Edited March 31, 2012 by ChiDragon

[dawei]

This bird has a cage with the door open all the time. His mating box is place on top of the cage. He goes into the box to sleep and goes into the cage for food and water. He is on my shoulder when I take him for walk. I put him on the lemon tree when we were outside. Sometimes, he flies to my shoulder. FYI He is free as a bird. I become the caretaker of the bird because his original owner is ill.

 

 

@marblehead...

You are right about the poop, but my bird stay around the cage most of the time. However, he only flew over the my sofa and did it once and returned back to the cage.

So the cage is for his sake or yours?

[ChiDragon]

So the cage is for his sake or yours?

Both of us. Mainly is for his safety at night and when I have to leave him alone.

[dawei]

Both of us. Mainly is for his safety at night and when I have to leave him alone.

I know your sincere in speaking about this bird... but I find it ironic to the topic being discussed which is why I went this direction. It seems to me that pet ownership at some point is very unnatural and very much against the daoist idea...

 

but I think you said it already:

ZhuangZi was telling us do not apply our own standard into another system.

[ChiDragon]

I know your sincere in speaking about this bird... but I find it ironic to the topic being discussed which is why I went this direction. It seems to me that pet ownership at some point is very unnatural and very much against the daoist idea...

 

but I think you said it already:

It seems that way for a wild sea bird; but my bird was raised by human from a hatched egg.

[dawei]

It seems that way for a wild sea bird; but my bird was raised by human from a hatched egg.

Ah... The birds system is altered by man to such an extent that it cannot live in it's natural way anymore. Very interesting and this is more to my point than I realized. BTW: What kind of bird is it? I'm curious to google it to see one.

[ChiDragon]

Ah... The birds system is altered by man to such an extent that it cannot live in it's natural way anymore. Very interesting and this is more to my point than I realized. BTW: What kind of bird is it? I'm curious to google it to see one.

 

It's Sun Conure........

 

Edited April 1, 2012 by ChiDragon

[dawei]

Beyond expectation. Thanks!