immortal body

[eccentric215]

I've been reading through the book secret of the golden flower and it talks about the immortal body. Can you please share what you know about this. The book doesn't exactly provide a down to earth description of it and I would like to know more. Thanks all in advance.........

[Aetherous]

Really good question. I don't know...maybe it's like the congealed light of awareness combined with the pattern of energetic structure that is you. Maybe it is the physical body realized as pure light or transmuted into that. Maybe it is just your own spirit.

[eccentric215]

Good one Scotty I'll drink to that.

[konchog uma]

I am not claiming to know, and i haven't come that far along in my own progress, but i think the "immortal body" is a body of light that can house the consciousness after death. To develop ones immortal body to stabilization is to insure that one can survive as a spiritual immortal without being subject to the fate of ghosts that just choose not to "go into the light". Those spirits are said to be subject to appetites and unresolved mental and spiritual karmas that a person who has developed their immortal body can be free from. Such a person can travel to the realms of immortals and siddhas and to various dreaming worlds and strange places and isnt "bound" to places and people like ghosts are.

 

As i understand, being a ghost is like dreaming when you don't really know youre dreaming.. you don't have youre "left brain" or conscious mind so to speak.. youre just on autopilot, shuffling through the scenario in a dreaming awareness.

 

That last part comes from maryanne winkowski, "the ghost hunter" who is often a guess of mark noory on coast to coast AM. The first part comes from a mishmash of teachings and readings on the human potential so i can't site a real source, sorry. Take it or leave it

[Thunder_Gooch]

I've been reading through the book secret of the golden flower and it talks about the immortal body. Can you please share what you know about this. The book doesn't exactly provide a down to earth description of it and I would like to know more. Thanks all in advance.........

 

The yin spirit is made of negative energy, or gravitational energy, the yang spirit is made of positive energy like sunlight. At death the yang spirit and qi will return to the environment, and the yin spirit will carry on.

 

Almost all spirits have only yin energy, they cannot think of their own accord, they can only observe.

 

The yin spirit or yin mind is the thing observing, the yang spirit mind is the thing choosing.

 

If you give a yin being some yang energy (in a deep trance state) it can manifest and display a limited amount of intelligence, but it is almost like a dreaming mind. It can only answer honestly or not answer, it cannot lie. It cannot remember what it was like to feel love, or emotion, but it can recall all the events of it's previous life.

 

After some time yin spirits are sent to a place to burn off whatever karma they have accumulated before being reborn again when they are merged with a new yang spirit before birth.

 

Many Taoist schools focus on the fusion of the yin and the yang spirits before the death of the physical body so that the spirit can continue functioning as a normal mind without a body.

[Creation]

I've been reading through the book secret of the golden flower and it talks about the immortal body. Can you please share what you know about this. The book doesn't exactly provide a down to earth description of it and I would like to know more. Thanks all in advance.........

Down to earth description of an immortal body?

 

What would really provide some understanding on the matter would be a sufficiently "out there" understanding of the ordinary body. Because spirits coming down to Earth is anything but down to earth, whether they do so in mortal or immortal bodies.

[tianhui]

I've been reading through the book secret of the golden flower and it talks about the immortal body. Can you please share what you know about this. The book doesn't exactly provide a down to earth description of it and I would like to know more. Thanks all in advance.........

 

 

Hi pi guy,

 

Do you think the relationship between circumference and diameter may be immortal? It is there before you toss the pie and during and after.

 

Perhaps immortal body is a phrase that points to what we were before we were born, what we are essentially now, and what we always are in the future. Not necessarily a "soul" per se, rather a non-material essence that can "experience" materiality.

[eccentric215]

Thanks all. Does it have anything to do with the astral body. And what exactly is that?

[Practitioner]

In my opinion it's the only worthwhile thing worth cultivating. If you are like myself, that you consider yourself a lifelong practitioner of taoist meditation and neidan. All things come and pass, you may be able to develop some very peculiar and interesting things as a result of training, however, if the results of your training do not pass on beyond death and give you power into a new world, then it is just like all other temporary phenomena, and so what you gained in this life is also lost and taken away from you.

 

To have an immortal body is to keep what you have, and to persist into time as a singular conscious entity free from the regular process of decay and reincarnation that happens with a regular human being.

 

Immortality is not necessarily a physical one, although it is very true some Taoists believe in this for it is something passed down in Taoist scriptures. There are many kinds of immmortals. However, true immortality is reflected by the ability to choose and retain your conscious personality beyond the borders of what would be considered the passing of a normal human life. Some are real life people in flesh and blood who live much beyond the lifespan of a normal human life, others are ethereal beings of light who choose to disguise themselves in the illusion of a normal body. The important thing here is that their consciousness continues perpetuated and unfettered by the barriers that you hit with the normal process of life and death.

 

Everywhere you look, people are taking their gift of consciousness for granted. People think that they will retain their characteristics of choice, free will and personality after death, which for all we know probably they will not. To attain immortality is to preserve the very precious gifts we have which would normally be exhausted upon death. This is important, because once you lose them, they're pretty much gone.

 

If you're a hardcore alchemical practitioner, its probably the only thing worth chasing after because immortality bestows upon the person the ability to continue their cultivation beyond the normal years of a human life, allowing the immortal to achieve ever ascending heights not even closely accessible to normal human beings. Immortality is a stepping stone because it is almost impossible to refine oneself completely to the very highest ends of cultivation with the lifespan of one lifetime. You need more time.

 

This kind of thing really is only for the few, not many people have the grace to know these kind of practices, and even fewer have the dedication to follow them through to the end.

 

If you just want good health and a full long life and do not concern yourself with such ethereal matters, than you really have no need to chase after such arcane practices. You can simply practice more simple things geared to the goals that you have. There are many ways to the Tao, but not everyone has the good destiny or karma to become an immortal.

[Cheshire Cat]

What about buddhist dharmakaya?

Is this an alchemical body?

[thelerner]

An interesting (& free) source of info on the golden flower comes from JJ Semple. He has Podcasts you can download on Itunes that have some depth from the view point of someone more interested in results then philosophy. He also has a book too.

 

Get itunes and search The Golden Flower Podcast or JJ Semple. Listen to them on Itunes, no ipod needed.

[eccentric215]

Thank you the Learner. I've never thought about pod cast and such. I shall check them out.

[ChiDragon]

Link: Source

 

太乙金華宗旨(The secret of the Golden Flower)

 

二、迴光守中

 

「迴光」是一種逆向注想「天心」的方法。 作者把「天心」比喻成房子，把「光」比喻為房子的主人。 有了主人，房子才有生氣，才有「光」。 這個光是金黃色的，好比金花，實際上就是人的真炁。 「炁」雖是「氣」的異體字，但兩者相對使用時，卻有一定的差別。 「炁」是先天之氣，「氣」是後天之氣。 先天之「炁」無形、至清，後天之「氣」有形、至濁。 因此，真炁又稱為「太乙」、「太一」、「天一」或「先天太一」。

 

本書題為「太乙金華」就是指人的先天真炁如同金花之光。 人有了先天太一的真炁，就有了生命，否則就會死亡。 慧真子注：「天一生水，即太乙之真炁。人得一則生，失一則死。然人仗炁而生，人不見炁；魚仗水而活，魚不見水。人無炁則死，魚離水則亡。故仙人教人抱元守一者，即迴光守中。守此真炁則可以延年也。然後用法鍛煉，則造成不死之軀(immortal body)矣。」人得真炁則生，失真炁則死。 然而真炁是看不見的，如同魚依賴水而生存，卻看不見水。 普通的人既看不到真炁，又不能主動支配真炁，而要存養真炁，只有通過丹道修煉。 丹道修煉的根本，就是「抱元守一」、「迴光守中」。 也就是存養真炁，駕馭真炁，這樣才能延年益壽，長生不衰。

 

 

Editor note:

Sorry, it took me a while to find the Chinese source. It's kinda late now. I will translate it soon. Thanks.

[ChiDragon]

太乙金華宗旨(The secret of the Golden Flower)

 

2. Guarding the "reflected light"(迴光守中)

 

"Reflected light" is a kind of reverse thinking called the "heart of heaven(天心)". The author will let 「天心」 analogous to a room, and let to light be the master of the room. With a master, the room will become lively, then there will be "light". This light has a golden brown color, it is similar to a gold flower. In reality, it is the 真炁(real chi). Even though the character 炁(chi without fire) is in a different form from the character 氣(chi with rice). However, in the usage of the two but there is a difference.

 

「炁」, chi without fire, is the prenatal chi; and 「氣」, chi with rice, is the postnatal chi. The prenatal chi,「炁」, has no form but most cleared. The postnatal chi 「氣」, has form but most turbid. Hence, 真炁(real chi) was called the "Ultimate One" or the "Prenatal Ultimate One".

 

This book called 「太乙金華」 is because that the "真炁(real chi)" seems like the "light of a golden flower". Human had the 真炁(real chi) of the "prenatal ultimate One(先天太一)", then human has life, otherwise he will die.

 

A Taoist, 慧真子, said: "The Heavenly One engender water(天一生水), actually, it simply means the 真炁(real chi) of is the "prenatal ultimate One(先天太一)". Those who obtained it will be alive; those who lose it will be dead. Thus human depends on the 炁(chi) to live but doesn't see 炁; fish depend on water to live but doesn't see the water. Human without 炁(chi) will die, fish away from the water will die also. Therefore, the immortals taught human to "embrace the 元(yuan, primary) and guard the 'One'(抱元守一)"; it simply means "guarding the reflected lights(迴光守中)". One guarding the 真炁(real chi) which can be extended one's life. One need to find a way to practice to create an immortal body then.

 

Human obtained 真炁(real chi) then lives, lose 真炁(real chi) then dies. Somehow, 真炁(real chi) is invisible. It is analogous to a fish which relies on water to survive, but it doesn't see the water. In deed, an ordinary person cannot see the 真炁(real chi) nor can it be actively predominated. In order to save and keep the 真炁(real chi), it can only be going thought the cultivation of internal alchemy. The fundamental cultivation of internal alchemy is to embrace the 元(yuan, primary) and guard the 'One'(抱元守一) and "guarding the reflected light(迴光守中)" It also means that save safe keeping the 真炁(real chi) and controlling it, only this way that one can be able to attain longevity and beneficial to prolong life and immortalized without aging.

 

Glossary:

迴光(Reflected light): 指太陽剛落山時，由於光線反射而發生的天空中短時發亮的現象。比喻人死前精神突然興奮。也比喻事物滅亡前夕的表面興旺。

 

Editor's note:

Please see explanation at the following post.

Edited April 30, 2012 by ChiDragon

[ChiDragon]

迴光(Reflected light): 指太陽剛落山時，由於光線反射而發生的天空中短時發亮的現象。比喻人死前精神突然興奮。也比喻事物滅亡前夕的表面興旺。

 

迴光(Reflected light): The reflected light was referred to a phenomenon at sunset. It is the sun light which was reflected in the sky, for a short duration, before the complete darkness. It was analogous to a person before death; the person appears to be very healthy and lively, all the sudden, for a short time. Then, the person dies at the release of the last breath. Also, it is analogous to something that was appeared to be at its golden peak before it was vanished.

 

The ancient Chinese Taoists, once thought, by applying the concept of the "safe keeping the Reflected Light" before it was diminished will prevent the death of the human body. Perhaps that was why Chi Kung was invented to continue breathing before the release of the last breath to prolong life.

[Master Logray]

In my opinion it's the only worthwhile thing worth cultivating. If you are like myself, that you consider yourself a lifelong practitioner of taoist meditation and neidan. All things come and pass, you may be able to develop some very peculiar and interesting things as a result of training, however, if the results of your training do not pass on beyond death and give you power into a new world, then it is just like all other temporary phenomena, and so what you gained in this life is also lost and taken away from you.

 

To have an immortal body is to keep what you have, and to persist into time as a singular conscious entity free from the regular process of decay and reincarnation that happens with a regular human being.

 

Immortality is not necessarily a physical one, although it is very true some Taoists believe in this for it is something passed down in Taoist scriptures. There are many kinds of immmortals. However, true immortality is reflected by the ability to choose and retain your conscious personality beyond the borders of what would be considered the passing of a normal human life. Some are real life people in flesh and blood who live much beyond the lifespan of a normal human life, others are ethereal beings of light who choose to disguise themselves in the illusion of a normal body. The important thing here is that their consciousness continues perpetuated and unfettered by the barriers that you hit with the normal process of life and death.

 

Everywhere you look, people are taking their gift of consciousness for granted. People think that they will retain their characteristics of choice, free will and personality after death, which for all we know probably they will not. To attain immortality is to preserve the very precious gifts we have which would normally be exhausted upon death. This is important, because once you lose them, they're pretty much gone.

 

If you're a hardcore alchemical practitioner, its probably the only thing worth chasing after because immortality bestows upon the person the ability to continue their cultivation beyond the normal years of a human life, allowing the immortal to achieve ever ascending heights not even closely accessible to normal human beings. Immortality is a stepping stone because it is almost impossible to refine oneself completely to the very highest ends of cultivation with the lifespan of one lifetime. You need more time.

 

This kind of thing really is only for the few, not many people have the grace to know these kind of practices, and even fewer have the dedication to follow them through to the end.

 

If you just want good health and a full long life and do not concern yourself with such ethereal matters, than you really have no need to chase after such arcane practices. You can simply practice more simple things geared to the goals that you have. There are many ways to the Tao, but not everyone has the good destiny or karma to become an immortal.

 

 

Very good post and very good observation. All Tao practices are just like daily build up of wealth, good body, fame, knowledge.... They are all temporary after all. It is what you can bring to another life that ultimately matters. Otherwise most are merely health exercises - although quite potent.

[idiot_stimpy]

Immortal body, another name for the Astral Body?

[Master Logray]

Different levels. Immortal body can be astral body or physical body.

[Mokona]

I am not claiming to know, and i haven't come that far along in my own progress, but i think the "immortal body" is a body of light that can house the consciousness after death. To develop ones immortal body to stabilization is to insure that one can survive as a spiritual immortal without being subject to the fate of ghosts that just choose not to "go into the light". Those spirits are said to be subject to appetites and unresolved mental and spiritual karmas that a person who has developed their immortal body can be free from. Such a person can travel to the realms of immortals and siddhas and to various dreaming worlds and strange places and isnt "bound" to places and people like ghosts are.

 

As i understand, being a ghost is like dreaming when you don't really know youre dreaming.. you don't have youre "left brain" or conscious mind so to speak.. youre just on autopilot, shuffling through the scenario in a dreaming awareness.

 

That last part comes from maryanne winkowski, "the ghost hunter" who is often a guess of mark noory on coast to coast AM. The first part comes from a mishmash of teachings and readings on the human potential so i can't site a real source, sorry. Take it or leave it

 

I concur, Dr Glenn Morris describes this a bit in his books. But he writes that it is the Kundalini that allows this sort of immortality.

 

On a side note, those with increased emotion and bodily awareness have a much easier time with this, martial artists and body builders, even. Interesting reason to work out, huh?

 

If the Golden Flower text is too much, PM me and I'll get back to you by Friday with some info that may help. (The-down-to-earth-type).

[ChiDragon]

Any body that was eighty years old and above is considered to be immortal.

[Wayfarer]

I've been reading through the book secret of the golden flower and it talks about the immortal body. Can you please share what you know about this. The book doesn't exactly provide a down to earth description of it and I would like to know more. Thanks all in advance.........

 

When Taoists refer to the Immortal Body it means one of two things depending upon the context of how it is being said:

 

1) Your physical body: its natural lifespan is shortened by how we leak energy e.g by being anxious, stressed etc burns up the energy our body uses to keep it well and in health. So settling the mind, practising Qigong etc being mindful of how we take in, lose and use energy is a practice of immortality - or rather extending the life of the body to that which is expected.

 

2) Attaining the Tao: though nothing is attained this is the phrase that seems to be used to describe a person who has awakened (as in a Buddhist sense). In Buddhism, such a person 'steps from the wheel of cause and effect' and ends his or her Karma. How so? An awakened person has noticed the presence of what is holy within and around them. Knowing this thing that cannot be named is all that exists (as it is noticed and felt everywhere; as all things are it) means that essentially nothing changes. If nothing can ever be anything other than what is Sacred and does not change then Immortality is known. For instance, before you were born you were the Suchness we name Tao. During your life you are it and after you die you are it - nothing has changed other than the 'you' you see. Buddha spoke of our suffering occurring due to not having Right View. When you see 'you', you do not have Right View. So an Awakened person is Immortal not because their physical body will always remain as it is but that the Divine Presence that expressed as a deeply settled quality within and around us is noticed...it is this that does not change...and it is this that you truly are.

 

So you can talk about Yin and Yang but they are also IT. The symbol of Yin and Yang is trying to draw our attention to the fact that what is black and what is white are not different - we should look to the whole, the holy to notice where difference ends.

 

Our meditation helps to settle the energy. When this occurs (in Taoism: the Dragon and Tiger coming together) a different feeling is noticed in one's stomach area - the True-Heart Immortal Lu spoke of to Wang ChongYang. Its Stillness begins to flourish the more we notice it and nurture it (through stillness and silence). The same essence is alight in trees and clouds and stones, basically everything. When a person practices Qigong and Dao Yin they appear brighter because their energy is improved and their skin is nourished through this practice. If they are Awake, they will also seem deeply settled and untroubled. But the light that is discussed is a distraction...

 

Whether you glow or look like a pile of crap makes no difference. You cannot be anymore holy or unholy than you already are. There is only one thing - light, dark, beauty, ugly, good, bad, glowing, dull...all is it.

 

Heath