Heart As Qi Circulation Focus

[Simon V.]

Hello all

 

Back in the late nineties, or around 2000, on the old Healing Tao Forum, around the time Sean started this site as I recall, there was a thread dealing with what I remember as stemming from a particular understanding of how Qi development progresses. I have been thinking of this off and on for a while now, because for years a significant element of my practice has been developing handstands as a species of qigong practice--standing practice but on the hands, simply.

 

In yoga they often say that handstands develop the solar plexus centre, will, potency of intent. Maybe this comes just from the fact that one is forced to be very severely attentive to stay balanced. But I have associated it with the heart more: as developing circulation between hands and heart and also throat, though I also often use the dantian or all of the above. I find it also to be a good 'longevity practice'.

 

In this old thread that I recall, someone had piped up to say that the heart was ultimately the centre one ends up using--at a certain level of qigong development--to circulate the qi, i.e., not the dantian. It was clearly how this person had been taught in his or her tradition. Does anyone recall that, or know of a formal understanding of practice that says this? I know that Spring Forrest qigong uses the heart from the beginning as the central focus, but that is not the same as seeing it as a sort of technical, energetic physiology question, namely that given good energy flow and body development, the heart is found to be the site that naturally lends itself to 'qi circulation'; as in, first you need to build up some 'gong', some craft, in the dantian, clear the channels, then the heart becomes the sluice gate. I am finding this personally to be more or less the case, and yet I am very influenced by reading and teachers that emphasise the dantian/hara as the site from which one directs qi to different locales.

 

I'd love to hear anyone's feedback on this. For example does this ring any bells in terms of specific traditions anyone knows of?

 

Simon

[gendao]

But I have associated it with the heart more: as developing circulation between hands and heart and also throat, though I also often use the dantian or all of the above. I find it also to be a good 'longevity practice'.

 

In this old thread that I recall, someone had piped up to say that the heart was ultimately the centre one ends up using--at a certain level of qigong development--to circulate the qi, i.e., not the dantian. It was clearly how this person had been taught in his or her tradition.

Interesting, I noticed something similar recently, myself.. It's not something I was ever taught, but the phenomena just arose in me.

 

Although I don't necessarily think it's mutually-exclusive - as you could breath from your heart...and even deeper down to your dantian together.

[joeblast]

especially once you make everything smooth and coherent enough that the noise floor drops

[de_paradise]

Interesting, I noticed something similar recently, myself.. It's not something I was ever taught, but the phenomena just arose in me.

 

Although I don't necessarily think it's mutually-exclusive - as you could breath from your heart...and even deeper down to your dantian together.

 

Yeah, I dont do focused circulation practises and rarely use the chakras, but I cant help but notice that the heart is how you can power the qi to go to to other places. Just focusing on the dantien creates a big cloud of qi that just hangs there like a growing fog, but heart energy sends it all over the place. It is said that heart energy is needed to open the wisdom eye. I thought this was kind of incorperated into practises which use terms like cauldrons and burners, going from dantien, and the steam rises basically to the heart and then zaps around the body. I could be mistaken, I really dont do these type of practises to have much to note.

[joeblast]

moving energy, bend and accelerate, focus, bend, accelerate

[Simon V.]

Interesting, I noticed something similar recently, myself.. It's not something I was ever taught, but the phenomena just arose in me.

 

Although I don't necessarily think it's mutually-exclusive - as you could breath from your heart...and even deeper down to your dantian together.

 

 

Thanks for the feedback. That sounds in the same ballpark as my experience, that sense of naturally progressing, hitting upon it. Agree about them not being mutually exclusive. I feel it is a natural experience of what originally inspired the practices of 'kan and li'--the heart energy simply is more fiery, and also, perhaps, more 'emotionally cognitive', desiring, moving. It just feels right at a certain point to interact from the top down, heart to dantian (which I tend to call 'the well', to give it an English moniker), making 'fiery water'.

 

Simon

[Simon V.]

especially once you make everything smooth and coherent enough that the noise floor drops

 

 

Makes sense; without basic quieting focus things will remain relatively murky wherever the locale is. Yes, that's my line of inquiry, which seems to match my experience--that given a coherent clear development (entailing facility in quieting down) the heart may more naturally be the energy-flow directing/encouraging centre, with its brighter emotional charge which 'inclines desiringly toward things, situations'.

 

Simon

[Simon V.]

Yeah, I dont do focused circulation practises and rarely use the chakras, but I cant help but notice that the heart is how you can power the qi to go to to other places. Just focusing on the dantien creates a big cloud of qi that just hangs there like a growing fog, but heart energy sends it all over the place. It is said that heart energy is needed to open the wisdom eye. I thought this was kind of incorperated into practises which use terms like cauldrons and burners, going from dantien, and the steam rises basically to the heart and then zaps around the body. I could be mistaken, I really dont do these type of practises to have much to note.

 

 

Exactly this kind of observation in myself is behind my interest in this. Part of my fascination is to observe what 'kan and li' may be phenomenologically, to look at what experiences are in practice (quality of energy in different locales, spontaneous developments), apart from firmly overlaying theory right from the start--to see what may have originally inspired the theory.

 

Simon

[thelerner]

Nothing to do with circulation but, I've been listening to some Mark Griffin podcasts. In one he said the heart is connected to the crown chakra. A concept I've never heard before. Maybe I'm highly suggestible but lately I've really been feeling it. Not necessarily pleasant, just a more awareness of the top of my head echoing in my upper heart region.

[Simon V.]

Nothing to do with circulation but, I've been listening to some Mark Griffin podcasts. In one he said the heart is connected to the crown chakra. A concept I've never heard before. Maybe I'm highly suggestible but lately I've really been feeling it. Not necessarily pleasant, just a more awareness of the top of my head echoing in my upper heart region.

 

 

I find this to be true. That connection is also affirmed in Tibetan Buddhism.

I think it functions as a go between--between upper and lower--just as would be suggested by its middle location.

 

Simon

[Harmonious Emptiness]

May be of use to consider that the heart is viewed as the "emperor" of the other organs, in a Tao Te Ching sort of emperor's way, in that if the emperor is at one with Tao, all will be in harmony.

 

So during meditation, so long as the heart is one with Tao, things sort of take care of themselves, imo. The Neiye talks about this as well.

 

There is also an alchemical writing, "Compass Center Directions", which talks about the main focus being on the mysterious middle area between the heart and the lower dantien.

Edited May 14, 2012 by Harmonious Emptiness

[Simon V.]

May be of use to consider that the heart is viewed as the "emperor" of the other organs, in a Tao Te Ching sort of emperor's way, in that if the emperor is at one with Tao, all will be in harmony.

 

So during meditation, so long as the heart is one with Tao, things sort of take care of themselves, imo. The Neiye talks about this as well.

 

There is also an alchemical writing, "Compass Center Directions", which talks about the main focus being on the mysterious middle area between the heart and the lower dantien.

 

I think there is a key insight there about finding a quiet centre, and then there being a natural advent of 'things taking care of themselves', of getting in sync thereby with an innate intelligence; this is like the Indian lore of 'Kundalini' having in it the whole of the path when communed with rightly. Still there is a specificity in terms of 'energetic physiology' that I'm interested in, re how I and others experience/have experienced particular aspects in practice (like with regard to the heart centre), where that experience, closely examined, may shed light on commonly accepted theory (Kan and Li etc). Thanks for the interesting input.

Simon

[hagar]

Hello all

 

Back in the late nineties, or around 2000, on the old Healing Tao Forum, around the time Sean started this site as I recall, there was a thread dealing with what I remember as stemming from a particular understanding of how Qi development progresses. I have been thinking of this off and on for a while now, because for years a significant element of my practice has been developing handstands as a species of qigong practice--standing practice but on the hands, simply.

 

In yoga they often say that handstands develop the solar plexus centre, will, potency of intent. Maybe this comes just from the fact that one is forced to be very severely attentive to stay balanced. But I have associated it with the heart more: as developing circulation between hands and heart and also throat, though I also often use the dantian or all of the above. I find it also to be a good 'longevity practice'.

 

In this old thread that I recall, someone had piped up to say that the heart was ultimately the centre one ends up using--at a certain level of qigong development--to circulate the qi, i.e., not the dantian. It was clearly how this person had been taught in his or her tradition. Does anyone recall that, or know of a formal understanding of practice that says this? I know that Spring Forrest qigong uses the heart from the beginning as the central focus, but that is not the same as seeing it as a sort of technical, energetic physiology question, namely that given good energy flow and body development, the heart is found to be the site that naturally lends itself to 'qi circulation'; as in, first you need to build up some 'gong', some craft, in the dantian, clear the channels, then the heart becomes the sluice gate. I am finding this personally to be more or less the case, and yet I am very influenced by reading and teachers that emphasise the dantian/hara as the site from which one directs qi to different locales.

 

I'd love to hear anyone's feedback on this. For example does this ring any bells in terms of specific traditions anyone knows of?

 

Simon

 

Interesting. I've been researching and experimenting with heart-focused meditations the last months, and have similar reflections. I've reached some tentative conclusions, but keep in mind they draw on my own system and lineage.

 

Basically, Nei Dan practice working on the Dan tian involves fusing or coupling the shen/light with the red/Jing essence of the LDT. It transforms the and liberates the inner fire of the essential water. But, as you say, it will work in amplifying and nourishing the lower Jiao, and amplify the water aspect in the body.

 

Focusing on the heart is more a shen practice. It works more on emotional/mental processes, and I find that it creates space, after the initial emotional debris is worked through. (this is an ongoing process). What I've experienced is that you may nourish the nerves, the mind, and later successfully still the mind through heart focus.

 

It also works wonders in increasing chi sensitivity, and circulation, but not necessarily amplify it. Only actually sense what is allready in place.

 

On a more subtle level, my practice with heart-focus has increased my awareness, my "now" - sense, and also hightlights the illusory nature of the separation btw inner and outer, subject-object, and also naturally "soothes" the ego. It will slowly erode latent tendencies to work from a dualistic perspective. And it cultivates the inherent love that resides there. Accessing this is beyond wonderful, and suddenly makes you aware that the heart is also the accesspoint, metaphorically, to the notion of the "mysterious female". This is my experience anyway.

 

Many paths working with the heart, like Christian meditations, yogic paths and particularly many Sufi orders highlight how the heart is the personal access point to the Godhead, the transcendent, and in emptying the mind.

 

Lewellyn Lee Vaugh has a wonderful meditation on the love of the heart:

http://www.acupuncturedoc.com/sufi.htm

 

h

[thelerner]

May be of use to consider that the heart is viewed as the "emperor" of the other organs, in a Tao Te Ching sort of emperor's way, in that if the emperor is at one with Tao, all will be in harmony.

I hadn't bought a Mantak Chia book in 20 years, so when I saw a used copy of a newer book I thought why not, see what's changed. The book is Living With the Tao, it's okay, but he starts with one idea and I think its gold; We misuse our minds, we should use the mind for awareness/alertness and make decisions from the heart area. If we're often actively thinking, we're doing something wrong.

 

Its a nice practice for living in the now. Shutting down thoughts by keeping the mind focused on the senses and trying to feel our decisions through the heart.

[Simon V.]

Interesting. I've been researching and experimenting with heart-focused meditations the last months, and have similar reflections. I've reached some tentative conclusions, but keep in mind they draw on my own system and lineage.

 

Basically, Nei Dan practice working on the Dan tian involves fusing or coupling the shen/light with the red/Jing essence of the LDT. It transforms the and liberates the inner fire of the essential water. But, as you say, it will work in amplifying and nourishing the lower Jiao, and amplify the water aspect in the body.

 

Focusing on the heart is more a shen practice. It works more on emotional/mental processes, and I find that it creates space, after the initial emotional debris is worked through. (this is an ongoing process). What I've experienced is that you may nourish the nerves, the mind, and later successfully still the mind through heart focus.

 

It also works wonders in increasing chi sensitivity, and circulation, but not necessarily amplify it. Only actually sense what is allready in place.

 

On a more subtle level, my practice with heart-focus has increased my awareness, my "now" - sense, and also hightlights the illusory nature of the separation btw inner and outer, subject-object, and also naturally "soothes" the ego. It will slowly erode latent tendencies to work from a dualistic perspective. And it cultivates the inherent love that resides there. Accessing this is beyond wonderful, and suddenly makes you aware that the heart is also the accesspoint, metaphorically, to the notion of the "mysterious female". This is my experience anyway.

 

Many paths working with the heart, like Christian meditations, yogic paths and particularly many Sufi orders highlight how the heart is the personal access point to the Godhead, the transcendent, and in emptying the mind.

 

Lewellyn Lee Vaugh has a wonderful meditation on the love of the heart:

http://www.acupuncturedoc.com/sufi.htm

 

h

 

Thanks for the link. He's someone I've been meaning to explore. My first teacher--still however primarily a Chinese arts oriented teacher--has a strong Sufi connection and I've been influenced by the whole tone of their approach.

 

I find there is something to centering in the heart, then being able to, or even feeling actively inclined, like it is natural, to work the lower dantien from there, also the upper. And I agree though that the development of the lower is a separate important element of practice, or in any case it works well to do it that way, to build up gong/craft as they say (standing practice, one pointed focus in lower dantien, etc). Ultimately there is a kind of threshold past which things are open enough to draw in energy from above and below, & through the hands and feet, which centering in the heart I find greatly facilitates.

 

I think the lower body opening/development could also just come from jogging or similar heavy lower body workouts (like in martial arts), and/or from having an excellent and intense sexuality; i.e. I think one can end up just starting from the heart naturally (perhaps more common with women), like apparently is done in Spring Forrest qigong, in Brugh Joy's method, or similar approaches, given an already opened up lower region. (I have a theory that many megawatt superstars, like say David Bowie or Madonna, have naturally opened up energy, maybe largely because of an intense and uninhibited sexuality, and also of course due to the blazing intensity of performance.) But there seems definitely to be something to the Taoist jing-chi-shen theory, as in it correctly maps onto how the layered (gross-subtle) mind-body works.

 

Always interesting to me has been the Tibetan Nyingma lore around the heart being the best meditative locale for 'realizing the the nature of mind'; that seems to jibe with the message of that Sufi link, substituting 'nature of mind' for 'God'.

 

 

Simon

[joeblast]

Interesting. I've been researching and experimenting with heart-focused meditations the last months, and have similar reflections. I've reached some tentative conclusions, but keep in mind they draw on my own system and lineage.

 

Basically, Nei Dan practice working on the Dan tian involves fusing or coupling the shen/light with the red/Jing essence of the LDT. It transforms the and liberates the inner fire of the essential water. But, as you say, it will work in amplifying and nourishing the lower Jiao, and amplify the water aspect in the body.

 

Focusing on the heart is more a shen practice. It works more on emotional/mental processes, and I find that it creates space, after the initial emotional debris is worked through. (this is an ongoing process). What I've experienced is that you may nourish the nerves, the mind, and later successfully still the mind through heart focus.

 

It also works wonders in increasing chi sensitivity, and circulation, but not necessarily amplify it. Only actually sense what is allready in place.

 

On a more subtle level, my practice with heart-focus has increased my awareness, my "now" - sense, and also hightlights the illusory nature of the separation btw inner and outer, subject-object, and also naturally "soothes" the ego. It will slowly erode latent tendencies to work from a dualistic perspective. And it cultivates the inherent love that resides there. Accessing this is beyond wonderful, and suddenly makes you aware that the heart is also the accesspoint, metaphorically, to the notion of the "mysterious female". This is my experience anyway.

 

Many paths working with the heart, like Christian meditations, yogic paths and particularly many Sufi orders highlight how the heart is the personal access point to the Godhead, the transcendent, and in emptying the mind.

 

Lewellyn Lee Vaugh has a wonderful meditation on the love of the heart:

http://www.acupuncturedoc.com/sufi.htm

 

h

hey h, hope you're doing well ever get around to learning/doing max's red sun practice? its a very different approach but oddly enough, the descriptors were what made it pop into my head

[Aetherous]

Many paths working with the heart, like Christian meditations, yogic paths and particularly many Sufi orders highlight how the heart is the personal access point to the Godhead, the transcendent, and in emptying the mind.

 

I've read Hawaiian descriptions where they connect the three selves (roughly: aumakua/crown, uhane/brow, unihipili/heart) through the Ha breath. In particular, there is a "gratitude point" which they open up and activate, over the location of the thymus gland. I've noticed in doing this type of breath work, that the vibrations and light from the heart center will start to emanate at the front of the heart level at first, and then as the vibrating bliss/mana rises more it will open up the entire sternum/clavicle/shoulder area. Light from above (aumakua connecting with unihipili I guess) is bouncing back and forth through the entire front part of the chest and center of the head...as is poetically described in the hyperlinked book: "thundering grace".

 

...On another note, I like what's said in "Daoist Nei Gong" regarding work with the heart center.

[Harmonious Emptiness]

Actually, come to think of it, there's a qi gong movement, "open the heart" which basically pulls energy into the middle dantien from the universe for a while and then gives it back. I find this really sort of loosens up a lot of inner resistance to receiving and giving. By the same token, this loosening of resistance seems to carry over in allowing qi flow and accepting it into different areas, then letting it continue on to different areas.

 

So it makes sense to me from that, sort of "intuitively," that an open heart allows all the other organs to function harmoniously by non-interference and nourishing.

 

That said, "know the male, but keep to the female" - Lao Tzu.

[ChiDragon]

"know the male, but keep to the female"

 

Understood the hardness(the attribute of the male); thus keep the softness(the attribute of the female.)

[hagar]

Thanks for the link. He's someone I've been meaning to explore. My first teacher--still however primarily a Chinese arts oriented teacher--has a strong Sufi connection and I've been influenced by the whole tone of their approach.

 

I find there is something to centering in the heart, then being able to, or even feeling actively inclined, like it is natural, to work the lower dantien from there, also the upper. And I agree though that the development of the lower is a separate important element of practice, or in any case it works well to do it that way, to build up gong/craft as they say (standing practice, one pointed focus in lower dantien, etc). Ultimately there is a kind of threshold past which things are open enough to draw in energy from above and below, & through the hands and feet, which centering in the heart I find greatly facilitates.

 

I think the lower body opening/development could also just come from jogging or similar heavy lower body workouts (like in martial arts), and/or from having an excellent and intense sexuality; i.e. I think one can end up just starting from the heart naturally (perhaps more common with women), like apparently is done in Spring Forrest qigong, in Brugh Joy's method, or similar approaches, given an already opened up lower region. (I have a theory that many megawatt superstars, like say David Bowie or Madonna, have naturally opened up energy, maybe largely because of an intense and uninhibited sexuality, and also of course due to the blazing intensity of performance.) But there seems definitely to be something to the Taoist jing-chi-shen theory, as in it correctly maps onto how the layered (gross-subtle) mind-body works.

 

Always interesting to me has been the Tibetan Nyingma lore around the heart being the best meditative locale for 'realizing the the nature of mind'; that seems to jibe with the message of that Sufi link, substituting 'nature of mind' for 'God'.

 

 

Simon

 

I think you're right regarding the lower center, yet it has a deeper layer, also. Or atleast this is what I have felt.

 

You may work for decades with the lower dan tian, or with Jing or chi oriented practices, and this will never cultivate and transform mind and spirit. You will never transforms what keeps the heart closed, and probably also never really transform the dark energies within.

This all changes with the heart. I completely agree that the heart is a gateway, and a transmitter. It is through the heart the master transmits his energy, and the lineage energy. It awakens the fire in others also.

 

I think you basically are right, to my experience, regarding certain "charismatic" personalites. They naturally utilizes their energy, and they have alot of it, i.e their Jing Chi is abundant and opened. Yet there is point in measuring your amount of prenatal Jing. We use very little of the fire within the essential water, and just igniting the heart fire or spirit, naturally "boils" the essential water. This naturally nourishes everything.

 

So my own experinence is that working with the light and fire of the heart transforms everything else. And I feel this is different from what f.ex Mantia Chia talks about regarding the heart-fire. This is a deeper or more essential aspect, the true spark of the essential light. I've written about this before.

 

h

Edited May 17, 2012 by hagar

[hagar]

hey h, hope you're doing well ever get around to learning/doing max's red sun practice? its a very different approach but oddly enough, the descriptors were what made it pop into my head

 

Hei. you too! Haven't gotten to know the red sun practice.

 

I do work with the color red, and also vizualise the red in Nei Dan practice, as a spark and as a deep red orb.

 

h

[hagar]

I've read Hawaiian descriptions where they connect the three selves (roughly: aumakua/crown, uhane/brow, unihipili/heart) through the Ha breath. In particular, there is a "gratitude point" which they open up and activate, over the location of the thymus gland. I've noticed in doing this type of breath work, that the vibrations and light from the heart center will start to emanate at the front of the heart level at first, and then as the vibrating bliss/mana rises more it will open up the entire sternum/clavicle/shoulder area. Light from above (aumakua connecting with unihipili I guess) is bouncing back and forth through the entire front part of the chest and center of the head...as is poetically described in the hyperlinked book: "thundering grace".

 

...On another note, I like what's said in "Daoist Nei Gong" regarding work with the heart center.

 

Very interesting! Have heard many good things about the Huna tradition.

 

It is actually very similar to what I experience myself, in heart-focused practice.

In Nei Dan, there is a heart point, the Middle Dan Tian, and then a deep heart point on the inside of the spine. In a standing practice of opening the heart, we connect the heart to the spine, and feel how the light of the spine is fused to the light of the heart. It will actually heal your upper back and neck issues =).

 

h

[Aetherous]

In Nei Dan, there is a heart point, the Middle Dan Tian, and then a deep heart point on the inside of the spine.

 

Yep, using Indian terminology, there is the front point (kshteram I think it's called) which activates the adjacent chakra...dantiens are usually central between the front (kshteram) and back (chakra) of the body.

 

Of course, it can be made into something way complex...

 

[Simon V.]

I think you're right regarding the lower center, yet it has a deeper layer, also. Or atleast this is what I have felt.

 

You may work for decades with the lower dan tian, or with Jing or chi oriented practices, and this will never cultivate and transform mind and spirit. You will never transforms what keeps the heart closed, and probably also never really transform the dark energies within.

This all changes with the heart. I completely agree that the heart is a gateway, and a transmitter. It is through the heart the master transmits his energy, and the lineage energy. It awakens the fire in others also.

 

I think you basically are right, to my experience, regarding certain "charismatic" personalites. They naturally utilizes their energy, and they have alot of it, i.e their Jing Chi is abundant and opened. Yet there is point in measuring your amount of prenatal Jing. We use very little of the fire within the essential water, and just igniting the heart fire or spirit, naturally "boils" the essential water. This naturally nourishes everything.

 

So my own experinence is that working with the light and fire of the heart transforms everything else. And I feel this is different from what f.ex Mantia Chia talks about regarding the heart-fire. This is a deeper or more essential aspect, the true spark of the essential light. I've written about this before.

 

h

 

I agree that there is a deeper layer--to all the centres. And there's something about letting go of the localized focus at a certain point (I'm thinking of in a given session).

 

Simon

[joeblast]

Very interesting! Have heard many good things about the Huna tradition.

 

It is actually very similar to what I experience myself, in heart-focused practice.

In Nei Dan, there is a heart point, the Middle Dan Tian, and then a deep heart point on the inside of the spine. In a standing practice of opening the heart, we connect the heart to the spine, and feel how the light of the spine is fused to the light of the heart. It will actually heal your upper back and neck issues =).

 

h

Middle dt

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celiac_plexus

 

 

Can see cardiac plexus also here

 

The superficial part of the cardiac plexus gives branches

 

(a) to the deep part of the plexus;

( to the anterior coronary plexus; and

© to the left anterior pulmonary plexus.

 

The deep part of the cardiac plexus is situated in front of the bifurcation of the trachea, above the point of division of the pulmonary artery, and behind the aortic arch.

 

It is formed by the cardiac nerves derived from the cervical ganglia of the sympathetic trunk, and the cardiac branches of the vagus and recurrent laryngeal nerves.

 

The only cardiac nerves which do not enter into the formation of the deep part of the cardiac plexus are the superior cardiac nerve of the left sympathetic trunk, and the lower of the two superior cervical cardiac branches from the left vagus nerve, which pass to the superficial part of the plexus.

 

Right half

 

The branches from the right half of the deep part of the cardiac plexus pass, some in front of, and others behind, the right pulmonary artery; the former, the more numerous, transmit a few filaments to the anterior pulmonary plexus, and are then continued onward to form part of the anterior coronary plexus; those behind the pulmonary artery distribute a few filaments to the right atrium, and are then continued onward to form part of the posterior coronary plexus.

 

Left half

 

The left half of the deep part of the plexus is connected with the superficial part of the cardiac plexus, and gives filaments to the left atrium, and to the anterior pulmonary plexus, and is then continued to form the greater part of the posterior coronary plexus.

 

 

oop, gotta go, final jeopardy's on