transcranial magnetic field induction is your friend

[gj551]

michael A. persinger (born June 26, 1945) is a cognitive neuroscience researcher and university professor with over 200 peer-reviewed publications. he has worked at laurentian university, located in sudbury, ontario, since 1971. he developed a device called the 'koren helmet'. as you may know brain activity can be measured by EEG ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electroencephalography ). using this tool man is said to be able to intentionally manipulatete it.

 

http://www.mind-shop.de/magnetfeldstimulation-39/shiva-neuro-stimulationssystem-173.html

(this is an english one: http://www.shaktitechnology.com/shiva/index.htm )

 

now i only found this shop in germany selling it but, man, i wish we had one of those

 

Edited May 13, 2012 by gj551

[三江源]

I may be wrong.. but I think the poster here called Sunshine has one and wrote a bit about it.

[astralc]

Actually, I work with brainwaves everyday and transcraniel magnetic stimulation (TMS) is not the answer, it can be fun, yes, but it is not the best approach for spiritual practice or development.

 

What TMS does is quite simple, you first locate the part of your brain that is responsible for self talk, the active part of the language centres in the left hemisphere. Then you place the powerful electro-magnet, and knock that part of your brain off-line, it goes to sleep, by inducing a powerful magnetic field right at the precise location of speech control.

 

Cool, yes, but only so so, people have nice experiences for a while, but not everybody. It is supposed to increase creativity, but in reality, that particular site on the left hemisphere is also responsible for happiness, and if you go about knocking if off-line too much you will develop a pathological depression requiring medication to control.

 

So, no, not a good idea to play with for too long, but as a novelty, it may be OK, but if you are susceptible to depression, stay well away from it.

 

If you really want to use technology to learn to meditate deeply, then neurofeedback is for you, safe, zero side effects, and can train deep states of meditation quite easily.

 

This is a great topic and I am glad you brought it up, I hope I have not dampened your enthusiasm for fast tracking your meditation training.

[Mark Foote]

 

Actually, I work with brainwaves everyday and transcraniel magnetic stimulation (TMS) is not the answer, it can be fun, yes, but it is not the best approach for spiritual practice or development.

 

What TMS does is quite simple, you first locate the part of your brain that is responsible for self talk, the active part of the language centres in the left hemisphere. Then you place the powerful electro-magnet, and knock that part of your brain off-line, it goes to sleep, by inducing a powerful magnetic field right at the precise location of speech control.

 

Cool, yes, but only so so, people have nice experiences for a while, but not everybody. It is supposed to increase creativity, but in reality, that particular site on the left hemisphere is also responsible for happiness, and if you go about knocking if off-line too much you will develop a pathological depression requiring medication to control.

 

 

Astralc, thanks much for your post- very interesting! Can you cite any sources on this- especially on the connection between the active language centers and happiness.

 

I read the Pali Sutta volumes in the 80's, and I am revisiting the descriptions of the jhanas now. The induction of the second material meditative state involves the cessation of prior mental unhappiness, and the fourth material state involves the "going down of whatever physical ease or dis-ease, and mental happiness or unhappiness, existed before"- something like that. More to the point, perhaps, is the Gautamid's description of his own practice before and after enlightenment- sixteen "recollections" in connection with the in-breath or out-breath, four of which are: 1) experiencing thought; 2) rejoicing in thought; 3) concentrating thought; 4) freeing thought (MN III 84, Pali Text Society volume 3 pg 126). These four he said corresponded to "recollection of mind" in the four recollections (mindfulnesses).

 

I know Todd Murphy has proposed that the chakras involve referred sensation from areas of the brain that have no nerves for pleasure or pain. Sometimes I think the tan-tien is similarly involved with the area of the brain that is the language center; certainly we have Dogen talking about "non-thinking" as the pivot of zazen, yet most Tai-Ch'i masters will say that the start of practice is ch'i sinking to the tan-t'ien. I do find sometimes a connection between my ability to be present at the tan-t'ien and my recognition of a place of thinking as a part of the body as a whole.

[astralc]

Astralc, thanks much for your post- very interesting! Can you cite any sources on this- especially on the connection between the active language centers and happiness.

 

I read the Pali Sutta volumes in the 80's, and I am revisiting the descriptions of the jhanas now. The induction of the second material meditative state involves the cessation of prior mental unhappiness, and the fourth material state involves the "going down of whatever physical ease or dis-ease, and mental happiness or unhappiness, existed before"- something like that. More to the point, perhaps, is the Gautamid's description of his own practice before and after enlightenment- sixteen "recollections" in connection with the in-breath or out-breath, four of which are: 1) experiencing thought; 2) rejoicing in thought; 3) concentrating thought; 4) freeing thought (MN III 84, Pali Text Society volume 3 pg 126). These four he said corresponded to "recollection of mind" in the four recollections (mindfulnesses).

 

I know Todd Murphy has proposed that the chakras involve referred sensation from areas of the brain that have no nerves for pleasure or pain. Sometimes I think the tan-tien is similarly involved with the area of the brain that is the language center; certainly we have Dogen talking about "non-thinking" as the pivot of zazen, yet most Tai-Ch'i masters will say that the start of practice is ch'i sinking to the tan-t'ien. I do find sometimes a connection between my ability to be present at the tan-t'ien and my recognition of a place of thinking as a part of the body as a whole.

 

Hi Mark, this will certainly stretch me, its good to get questions that make me think and process, I am a feeling centred person, so thinking is not always easy, "I feel therefore I try not to think"

 

The brain is the command centre of the entire body, every body site has a corresponding nerve site which is its supervisor so to speak. When a person loses a limb the corresponding site on the cortex (outer surface of the brain) becomes vacant land, and is slowly portioned off to other body sites. Thus if you lose your leg, when you touch the side of your nose it might feel like you are touching your little toe, because the side of the nose has now taken residence at the old vacant little toe site on the cortex.

 

The language centres are all located on the left brain, or dominant hemisphere, for a simple reason, expediency, they are close together and can communicate so much faster. Dyslexics use some of the right brain to help process words which is very inefficient and why they struggle so. We have the left occipital lobe to recognise letters and words, it goes to the left temple for auditory sounds of the letters and words, then to the left parietal lobe to process meaning then to the left frontal to process a sound and string of words in correct grammatical form as a verbal or written response.

 

What we know thru research of elite athletes, artists and performers, is that when they enter the "Zone" they shut down almost all of their brain activity except for the areas responsible to perform their action - perfectly. Their brain becomes super efficient with all these extra resources to perform one single action perfectly.

 

Thru EEG sensors attached to their heads we can see an elite pistol shooter aiming, then slowly the left hemisphere shuts down dialogue, no words, no self talk, the limbic system in the mid brain shuts down, so no anxiety or fear of failure, and the whole brain moves into what is called "synchronous alpha", the whole brain is basically on 'calm alert' with just the premortor cortex wired to send the signal to the finger to pull the trigger. Novice shooters cannot do this.

 

Meditators do the same, quietening their mind and going into the zone. But meditators can stay at synchronous alpha, calm alert, or move into synchronous theta, which is deeper and is where we OOB, astral travel, remote view, lucid dream, gain insight, reach the spiritual heavens so to speak, etc.

 

This synchronous theta is very deep, you must basically go to sleep to get there as it is right on the edge of consciousness. Using EEG we can see the exact moment when this occurs, amazing it sure is.

 

Getting to your chakra question, basically the Dan Tien, from my understanding, is a nerve centre, nothing more nothing less. We have many nerve centres or clusters and we can charge them up with chi breathing, you can go to your elbow for instance and charge it up to work like a Dan Tien, basically. So the chakra is connected to the brain, because every body part is, but it is not specifically connected to anything special.

 

Non-thinking is very important in almost all spiritual pursuits, by stopping our internal dialogue we 'stop the world' as Don Juan so nicely says. To do this we have to practice doing it, quietening the mind through dedicated practice, be it kicking a soccer ball against the wall 1000 times a day, hitting a tennis ball a thousand times against a wall each day, or meditating or tai chi or a kung fu kata. I do not recommend mantra meditations, it can put you back into beta (thinking), I go straight to the theta synch, passing thru alpha synch to the unconscious. This is 'deep state meditation' and where taoists can "touch the void".

 

Thanks for getting me to think

 

Astralc

Edited May 17, 2012 by astralc

[Mark Foote]

 

This synchronous theta is very deep, you must basically go to sleep to get there as it is right on the edge of consciousness. Using EEG we can see the exact moment when this occurs, amazing it sure is.

 

Astralc

 

Astralc, a very fine piece of writing on your part there, in my opinion. I did send you an email, I will just take the liberty of mentioning here that I would like to use your first post up above along with my subsequent response on my personal blog- would that be alright? It's a way for me to keep track of things that are important to me.

 

Concerning "you must basically go to sleep", you might enjoy my essay Waking Up and Falling Asleep. It's very short. About four pages deep into my blog, there are posts concerning a friend in New York (he's a friend to me now) who read "Waking Up and Falling Asleep", and proceeded to discover the movement of his awareness before sleep. He was able to get back to sleep when he needed to in the early morning hours by following the movement of his awareness.

 

I am as you will gather from this concerned with the communication of a practice, in simple terminology, that can enable me and anyone else with the necessity to access a singularity of mind. As a waking practice, such a state is possible through the relinquishment of volitive activity, which requires an understanding of experience that permits such a relinquishment; in falling asleep, the particulars of a person's understanding need not be an issue.

 

Can you cite any references from the literature (Western medical?) about the connection you mentioned between happiness and the language centers of the brain?

 

My experience of the tan-t'ien is that it is a pivot around which the psoas muscles and extensors reciprocate to keep the body erect; at the same time, the balance there reflects the pivots of the sacrum on the pelvis, and the continuity of a balance there depends on "waking up and falling asleep", which to me implicates the cranial-sacral rhythm and some functionality connected with the pineal gland. If you're interested I have a description of translations of motion in the lotus that addresses the path by which activity of posture or carriage can feed back into the cranial-sacral rhythm; I confess that this is just a guess, but it's been very useful to me, and I've come to have faith that some mechanism like what I describe is at work in the human experience, even if my description may turn out to be inaccurate in some respect.

[astralc]

Astralc, a very fine piece of writing on your part there, in my opinion. I did send you an email, I will just take the liberty of mentioning here that I would like to use your first post up above along with my subsequent response on my personal blog- would that be alright? It's a way for me to keep track of things that are important to me.

 

Concerning "you must basically go to sleep", you might enjoy my essay Waking Up and Falling Asleep. It's very short. About four pages deep into my blog, there are posts concerning a friend in New York (he's a friend to me now) who read "Waking Up and Falling Asleep", and proceeded to discover the movement of his awareness before sleep. He was able to get back to sleep when he needed to in the early morning hours by following the movement of his awareness.

 

I am as you will gather from this concerned with the communication of a practice, in simple terminology, that can enable me and anyone else with the necessity to access a singularity of mind. As a waking practice, such a state is possible through the relinquishment of volitive activity, which requires an understanding of experience that permits such a relinquishment; in falling asleep, the particulars of a person's understanding need not be an issue.

 

Can you cite any references from the literature (Western medical?) about the connection you mentioned between happiness and the language centers of the brain?

 

My experience of the tan-t'ien is that it is a pivot around which the psoas muscles and extensors reciprocate to keep the body erect; at the same time, the balance there reflects the pivots of the sacrum on the pelvis, and the continuity of a balance there depends on "waking up and falling asleep", which to me implicates the cranial-sacral rhythm and some functionality connected with the pineal gland. If you're interested I have a description of translations of motion in the lotus that addresses the path by which activity of posture or carriage can feed back into the cranial-sacral rhythm; I confess that this is just a guess, but it's been very useful to me, and I've come to have faith that some mechanism like what I describe is at work in the human experience, even if my description may turn out to be inaccurate in some respect.

 

Hi Mark, thank you, you are welcome to quote me, and I read you piece on location in space, I like that notion of coming back to space when trying to go back to sleep.

 

The Language centres are on the left side or dominant hemisphere of the brain, for practical reasons, and this is for right handed and some left handed people. True left handers will have them on the right hemisphere.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Language_center - is a basic explanation of the left hemisphere language centres, you can search if you want more detailed information. I posted on another thread that I am doing cranial-sacral healing at the moment and love it.

 

Your comment about the psoas muscle and dan tien I believe to be correct, core strength and dan tien are one and the same I think, except dan tien is about chi of course. I am enjoying your posts:)

[astralc]

OOOOPS

 

I discussed earlier that TCMS can induce depression by knocking out the language sites on the left hemisphere.

 

I must state that recent research into TCMS in depression does not target the language centres as it did when I first read about it some years ago. Today they stimulate the Prefrontal lobe with magnetic pulses rather than one massive pulse to the left brain which is what they did then to induce creativity.

 

So, I am sorry that I may have misled members with my earlier comments, TCMS, in today's research is proving to be quite useful for people with mental illness.

 

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/transcranial-magnetic-stimulation/MY00185

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transcranial_magnetic_stimulation

 

http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=transcranial%20magnetic%20stimulation%20depression&source=web&cd=7&ved=0CKEBEBYwBg&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.depressionet.com.au%2Fresearch%2Ftms_adol.pdf&ei=tHq4T-PgC-iuiQfsiNy0Cw&usg=AFQjCNFlB2Euvw28S8z7oMw_GcdybzwuyQ&cad=rja

 

http://www.opposingviews.com/i/health/addiction/tms-therapy-approved-fda-can-help-people-depression

[billb]

OOOOPS

 

I discussed earlier that TCMS can induce depression by knocking out the language sites on the left hemisphere.

 

I must state that recent research into TCMS in depression does not target the language centres as it did when I first read about it some years ago. Today they stimulate the Prefrontal lobe with magnetic pulses rather than one massive pulse to the left brain which is what they did then to induce creativity.

 

So, I am sorry that I may have misled members with my earlier comments, TCMS, in today's research is proving to be quite useful for people with mental illness.

 

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/transcranial-magnetic-stimulation/MY00185

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transcranial_magnetic_stimulation

Thanks for posting this I cringed when I saw the title and wanted to say no it is not your friend and the depression it can cause can be severe. There people on the mind-l forum which deals with brain tech who bought the Shakti helmet and their results were not very positive this stuff is interesting but definetly not your friend in my opinion.

 

http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=transcranial%20magnetic%20stimulation%20depression&source=web&cd=7&ved=0CKEBEBYwBg&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.depressionet.com.au%2Fresearch%2Ftms_adol.pdf&ei=tHq4T-PgC-iuiQfsiNy0Cw&usg=AFQjCNFlB2Euvw28S8z7oMw_GcdybzwuyQ&cad=rja

 

http://www.opposingviews.com/i/health/addiction/tms-therapy-approved-fda-can-help-people-depression

[astralc]

Hi Billb, I much prefer neurofeedback and a few other biofeedback devices, but I am willing to wait and see how the research goes with the TCMS, if they keep their protocols simple and not try to do too much it might prove quite useful. I do know that previous research that knocked the language centres off line to create a 'space' for increased creativity, had a following, I just wish I could remember the nae of the guy that did it... darn.

 

The left brain is critical for processing language, it runs fast, between 15-20 Hz, but if the slower frequencies, 3-11 Hz (low theta to alpha) begin to dominate the left side, then it is a sign of depression. By knocking this side off line it has the potential to bring on the depression.

 

I my work I train people using EEG neurofeedback, and depression is quite easy to see in the EEG trace. Reducing the slow waves dominance is not a difficult thing, one day medicine and psychology will realise they have the most incredible technology at hand. But until that day we just have to soldier on. Anxiety, autism, panic, and bipolar etc. are all right brain issues, caused by a dominance of fast waves, because the rght brain, having no language centres, runs very slowly, delta and theta. When we become stressed we see a dominance of beta fast waves that make us anxious. By inhibiting these fast waves we reduce the impact of anxiety disorders.

 

Maybe one day TCMS will do a similar job to neurofeedback. On a positive note the Black Dog Institute is studying Direct Current Stimulation of the Prefrontal Lobes for depression, I hope that works.

 

http://www.blackdoginstitute.org.au/public/research/participateinourresearch/directcurrentstimulationdcs.cfm

[Mark Foote]

Hi Mark, thank you, you are welcome to quote me, and I read you piece on location in space, I like that notion of coming back to space when trying to go back to sleep.

 

The Language centres are on the left side or dominant hemisphere of the brain, for practical reasons, and this is for right handed and some left handed people. True left handers will have them on the right hemisphere.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Language_center - is a basic explanation of the left hemisphere language centres, you can search if you want more detailed information. I posted on another thread that I am doing cranial-sacral healing at the moment and love it.

 

Your comment about the psoas muscle and dan tien I believe to be correct, core strength and dan tien are one and the same I think, except dan tien is about chi of course. I am enjoying your posts:)

 

Thanks, astralc, and I appreciate you reading my piece. If you're interested, the exchanges with humbleone about his experience with "location in space" are here.

 

Interesting that you don't want to move when your cranial-sacral treatment is done. Someday maybe I'll get a treatment myself, I know Upledger recommends a yearly "tune-up".

 

Lately I find myself rehashing the meditative states of the Pali Canon in my thoughts, but I always return to the Gautamid's statement that whatever a person thinks a meditative state is, it is otherwise. A little left-brain right-brain hocus-pocus there. I'm happy to think that his descriptions are of hypnogogic phenomena, and your description of the phenomena of theta-wave states seems to confirm that.

[astralc]

this is a site on Transcranial Direct Current Stimulation - it disscusses it in detail, do not try this at home though.

 

Interestingly, I use a TDCS at work for anxiety and depression, it connects to the ear lobes sending a mild pulsed current with a funny wave shape, across the back of the head. It has quite a lot of research to back up the claims it is of some use.

 

This is NOT Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation though.

 

Some pretty pics of the brain

 

http://brmlab.cz/pro...in_hacking/tdcs

 

 

 

 

[billb]

Hi Billb, I much prefer neurofeedback and a few other biofeedback devices, but I am willing to wait and see how the research goes with the TCMS, if they keep their protocols simple and not try to do too much it might prove quite useful. I do know that previous research that knocked the language centres off line to create a 'space' for increased creativity, had a following, I just wish I could remember the nae of the guy that did it... darn.

 

The left brain is critical for processing language, it runs fast, between 15-20 Hz, but if the slower frequencies, 3-11 Hz (low theta to alpha) begin to dominate the left side, then it is a sign of depression. By knocking this side off line it has the potential to bring on the depression.

 

I my work I train people using EEG neurofeedback, and depression is quite easy to see in the EEG trace. Reducing the slow waves dominance is not a difficult thing, one day medicine and psychology will realise they have the most incredible technology at hand. But until that day we just have to soldier on. Anxiety, autism, panic, and bipolar etc. are all right brain issues, caused by a dominance of fast waves, because the rght brain, having no language centres, runs very slowly, delta and theta. When we become stressed we see a dominance of beta fast waves that make us anxious. By inhibiting these fast waves we reduce the impact of anxiety disorders.

 

Maybe one day TCMS will do a similar job to neurofeedback. On a positive note the Black Dog Institute is studying Direct Current Stimulation of the Prefrontal Lobes for depression, I hope that works.

 

http://www.blackdoginstitute.org.au/public/research/participateinourresearch/directcurrentstimulationdcs.cfm

I agree there may be some practical applications in the future but I just don't like the idea of selling $600 Shakti helmets to the public and treating it like a cool new toy for the brain, like say light and sound machines and other brain tech.

[astralc]

I agree there may be some practical applications in the future but I just don't like the idea of selling $600 Shakti helmets to the public and treating it like a cool new toy for the brain, like say light and sound machines and other brain tech.

 

Hi billb, I am searching for the helmet now...

 

Mmmm, electromagnetic fields over the Temporal Lobes, OK, I think I know what they are doing. It is common medical knowledge that the Temporal Lobes do funny things, the inside of the skull has slightly raised ridges next to the Temporal Lobes, so if there is a solid head knock, or head injury the Temporal Lobes can bang hard against these ridges, there can be a Temporal Lobe injury, usually seen as slight bruising.

 

In these cases this can cause Temporal Lobe seizures, epilepsy, and sometimes, spiritual or extrasensory experiences. The Temporal Lobes are notorious for being easily injured in head injuries - a good reason to wear a helmet.

 

We can also induce mild Temporal Lobe seizure-like experiences, spiritual experiences, etc. by stimulating them. We can do it with biofeedback, electrical stimulation, magnetic stimulation... lots of ways. I have had some patients, being treated for anxiety, on the right Temporal Lobe (T4), have unusual spiritual experiences such as feeling very 'connected' to God and feeling of being very spaced out and feeling like they are in the 'hands of God'.

 

Nothing magical at all about this, but who knows, is it really a 'spiritual' experience?

 

Anyway, I agree with you, putting on this helmet and playing around with it too long could cause an over-arousal of the temporal sites with nasty effects, like panic attacks and severe depression. I recommend for anyone to stay away from them and to do tai chi instead.

 

Thanks for your posts on this important topic.

 

Astralc