Need serious help please, kundalini problems

[mike 134]

I thought this thread was dead, in case anybody's wondering yeah eventually I did feel my chakras and heat. It was after focusing on the centers in the head, funny it happened the very first time I focused on the crown for 30 secs but before that I tried to feel the root and there was no heat. After a few days the top of my head started burning spontaneously and I feel like there's molten liquid in my lumbar area going up, chest is on fire at night and my heart opened, now its in both the head and body but it's not through the neck yet, but I can feel heat up there. Kind of weird it's skipping around like that. My left body also warms up but not my right, also strange.

[Informer]

Yes, so everything that isn't truly known is written as fiction?

 

What about confirmation bias of the subjective persuasion, or when one experience is used to affirm a belief subjectively? Like fore instance, say someone tells you something will happen, and then tells you what it means. Then that things happens, so is what they told you it means also true?

 

Is anything that has been attached to that specific phenomena or experience actually true? Or is it only the experience is true?

 

Jnana approach:

 

Jnana Yoga: Jnana Yoga is the path of knowledge, wisdom, introspection and contemplation. It involves deep exploration of the nature our being by systematically exploring and setting aside false identities.

http://www.swamij.com/four-paths-of-yoga.htm

Edited June 18, 2012 by Informer

[ShaktiMama]

Yes, so everything that isn't truly known is written as fiction?

 

What about confirmation bias of the subjective persuasion, or when one experience is used to affirm a belief subjectively? Like fore instance, say someone tells you something will happen, and then tells you what it means. Then that things happens, so is what they told you it means also true?

 

Is anything that has been attached to that specific phenomena or experience actually true? Or is it only the experience is true?

 

 

This is only matters to people who don't have the skills to perceive. Science is far behind the validation of the processes of subtle energy and the subtle body. There is no money in it. Why study it?

 

Practice internal energy cultivation and you will know and understand for your self whether it is true/subjective/whatever or not. I am not talking trying for a couple of hours. Get with an authentic program and teacher and practice.

 

Old experiments from the 90s show measureable increase in killer T cell count in the blood after an energy healing treatment. Research therapuetic touch or healing touch if you want cites.

 

When do people stop asking how and just do? The mind is hungry for proof. Not to disparage the intellect but waiting for proof may mean you miss the bus. The FDA does 20+ years of experiments to approve new drugs and treatments thru trials. People suffer and die while waiting. Why wait?

 

I remember in the 90s that glucosamine was labeled a dangerous trend as a drug because there was no trials. Also no incentive to test because it is cheaply available. Now it is given to patients in the hospital in pill form as a supplement. So how long are you gonna wait until you feel confident to step out and practice?

[Informer]

*Reality check*, you don't have super powers. Carl Sagan put it very eloquently when he said: "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence."

 

Science doesn't attempt to prove anything, that was done away with scientism.

 

Filling one with beliefs and superstitions is contrary to jnana.

Edited June 18, 2012 by Informer

[Informer]

 

 

Old experiments from the 90s show measureable increase in killer T cell count in the blood after an energy healing treatment. Research therapuetic touch or healing touch if you want cites.

 

 

Yes, that could also be simpley autonomous control being over-ridden in the thymus gland.

 

The development and maturation of semi-invariant natural killer T cells (iNKT cells) rely on the recognition of self antigens presented by CD1d restriction molecules in thymus. The nature of the stimulatory thymic self lipids remains elusive. We isolated lipids from thymocytes and found that ether-bonded mono-alkyl glycerophosphates and the precursors and degradation products of plasmalogens stimulated iNKT cells. Synthetic analogs showed high potency in activating thymic and peripheral iNKT cells. Mice deficient in the peroxisomal enzyme glyceronephosphate O-acyltransferase (GNPAT), essential for the synthesis of ether lipids, had significant alteration of the thymic maturation of iNKT cells and fewer iNKT cells in both thymus and peripheral organs, which confirmed the role of ether-bonded lipids as iNKT cell antigens. Thus, peroxisome-derived lipids are nonredundant self antigens required for the generation of a full iNKT cell repertoire.

 

http://www.nature.com/ni/journal/v13/n5/full/ni.2245.html

 

The above is "actual" evidence, it doesn't prove it, but lend credence and increases the probability.

 

Here is more evidence:

 

 

They are called T cells because they mature in the thymus. There are several subsets of T cells, each with a distinct function.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T_cell

 

As evidence from independent sources compiles in increases the probability that the proposition is true.

 

There is a lot more evidence, and it's no wonder thymus is associated with rejuvenation.

[ShaktiMama]

*Reality check*, you don't have super powers. Carl Sagan put it very eloquently when he said: "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence."

 

Science doesn't attempt to prove anything, that was done away with scientism.

 

Filling one with beliefs and superstitions is contrary to jnana.

 

Nope, I dont have super powers that is for sure. I am just an average human being who practices internal energy cultivation. Extraordinary claims are so subjective for sure. Breaking the 3 minute mile was one. Science does not have the tools yet to measure subtle energies or subtle bodies. Acupuncture and qigong are based on 5 thousand years of empirical investigation and practice. And yet, we in our belief in the superiority of modern science, poo poo it.

 

I am not a jnanist. I am an empiricist.

 

All beliefs even the statement: "Filling one with beliefs and superstitions is contrary to jnana," is a belief, a construct of the ego. This statement on that quote is a construct of the ego.

 

Live without beliefs. Disengage the iron grip of the mind.

 

S

[Informer]

Nope, I dont have super powers that is for sure. I am just an average human being who practices internal energy cultivation. Extraordinary claims are so subjective for sure. Breaking the 3 minute mile was one. Science does not have the tools yet to measure subtle energies or subtle bodies. Acupuncture and qigong are based on 5 thousand years of empirical investigation and practice. And yet, we in our belief in the superiority of modern science, poo poo it.

 

I am not a jnanist. I am an empiricist.

 

All beliefs even the statement: "Filling one with beliefs and superstitions is contrary to jnana," is a belief, a construct of the ego. This statement on that quote is a construct of the ego.

 

Live without beliefs. Disengage the iron grip of the mind.

 

S

 

I like you

 

What I think happens is that there is imbalance between logic and creativity to affirm or deny either or.

 

The equilibrium is in combination.

 

As some may say there is only objectivity and others claim only subjectivity.

Edited June 18, 2012 by Informer

[ShaktiMama]

I correct myself. These experiments were done in the 80s. And how does autonomous control become over-ridden in the thymus gland by an immune compromised HIV very sick patient with very low Killer t cell count who is too weak to think?

 

Simple experiment: blood follows chi flow. Hands get very hot in temperature when energy healing is being done.

 

I had thought to my PhD work on nitric oxide release as a vasodilator in the role of raising heat when chi was applied. Unfortunately, the protocols required to do in vitro/human experiments were too restrictive and time consuming.

 

I am OK with your having problems with this, your disbelief. Give up your need to have proof and practice with a good teacher. Then you will have an empirical answer. It will be your own answer, not someone else's

 

Good luck,

 

S

 

 

Yes, that could also be simpley autonomous control being over-ridden in the thymus gland.

 

 

 

The above is "actual" evidence, it doesn't prove it, but lend credence and increases the probability.

 

Here is more evidence:

 

 

 

As evidence from independent sources compiles in increases the probability that the proposition is true.

 

There is a lot more evidence, and it's no wonder thymus is associated with rejuvenation.

[Informer]

Einstein provided evidence for both a subjective and an objective realm existing intertwined with the Theory of General Relativity:

 

 

Some predictions of general relativity differ significantly from those of classical physics, especially concerning the passage of time, the geometry of space, the motion of bodies in free fall, and the propagation of light. Examples of such differences include gravitational time dilation, gravitational lensing, the gravitational redshift of light, and the gravitational time delay. The predictions of general relativity have been confirmed in all observations and experiments to date. Although general relativity is not the only relativistic theory of gravity, it is the simplest theory that is consistent with experimental data. However, unanswered questions remain, the most fundamental being how general relativity can be reconciled with the laws of quantum physics to produce a complete and self-consistent theory of quantum gravity.

 

 

Yes, the premise is that it can be described objectively as well as subjectively if it is true. This is to advance knowing through both internal seeking as well as external seeking.

 

By attempting to bring subjective experiences into the objective realm, there is motivation and intent within scientific process to find the truth objectively, releasing the subjective hold. This is in the same manner as General Relativity, which subject and object are explained objectively. The same is true vice versa.

 

Utilizing proper rationale instead of blind faith. Relying on Faith and beliefs puts on in an interesting situation of confirmation bias:

 

 

Confirmation bias (also called confirmatory bias or myside bias) is a tendency of people to favor information that confirms their beliefs or hypotheses.[Note 1][1] People display this bias when they gather or remember information selectively, or when they interpret it in a biased way. The effect is stronger for emotionally charged issues and for deeply entrenched beliefs. For example, in reading about gun control, people usually prefer sources that affirm their existing attitudes. They also tend to interpret ambiguous evidence as supporting their existing position. Biased search, interpretation and memory have been invoked to explain attitude polarization (when a disagreement becomes more extreme even though the different parties are exposed to the same evidence), belief perseverance (when beliefs persist after the evidence for them is shown to be false), the irrational primacy effect (a greater reliance on information encountered early in a series) and illusory correlation (when people falsely perceive an association between two events or situations).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

Edited June 18, 2012 by Informer

[ShaktiMama]

mike md, on 17 June 2012 - 04:45 PM, said:

I thought this thread was dead, in case anybody's wondering yeah eventually I did feel my chakras and heat. It was after focusing on the centers in the head, funny it happened the very first time I focused on the crown for 30 secs but before that I tried to feel the root and there was no heat. After a few days the top of my head started burning spontaneously and I feel like there's molten liquid in my lumbar area going up, chest is on fire at night and my heart opened, now its in both the head and body but it's not through the neck yet, but I can feel heat up there. Kind of weird it's skipping around like that. My left body also warms up but not my right, also strange.

 

Please see my response to your PM to me.

 

Yes, these are active kundalini signs.

 

S

[RiverSnake]

My energy is more of the healing/yin/the mother quality so it doesn't have that yang impact.

 

 

You may enjoy one of Ya Mu's seminars, he specializes in Medical Qigong and Taoist Medicine. Glad to see you back on the forum, your insights and experiences are a joy to read. I read Shadow Strategies recently, the part where your testing and the guy yells really loud was hysterical.

 

Thanks for your contributions.

 

-My 2 cents, Peace

 

 

-

Edited June 18, 2012 by OldGreen

[gatito]

 

 

Live without beliefs. Disengage the iron grip of the mind.

 

 

 

That's the statment of a Jnani.

 

(It's usually the result of a thorough investigation of present experience - unless it's another belief system. )

[Informer]

So how long are you gonna wait until you feel confident to step out and practice?

 

Very seldom am I not practicing.

 

My practice could very well be beyond most or even anything that you could teach me aside from beliefs. How long are you going to wait to find out what is true and start eliminating all those constructs you've been allowing to build up for all of these years? As long as you have been practicing I would think you may know the value of truth over belief by now.

 

Why do you assume to put yourself in a higher place then others?

 

I had thought to my PhD work on nitric oxide release as a vasodilator in the role of raising heat when chi was applied. Unfortunately, the protocols required to do in vitro/human experiments were too restrictive and time consuming.

 

I doubt you have a PhD from any accredited university, or would be providing evidence for these extraordinary claims you so dearly believe to be true. I'm hardly impressed if that is the purpose. I don't think there is much that could not be written of as a placebo effect. People heal themselves all the time, my wounds heal of their own accord.

 

Why wouldn't you have proposed to run the experiment on mice anyways? If there were replicateable results, I'm sure you would have found a basis for funding.

 

Here is an example:

Abstract Highlight Terms Highlight biological terms.

Genes/Proteins(4) Species(2) Chemicals(6)

To elucidate pathophysiological roles of heme oxygenase (HO)-1 in regulation of vascular tone in vivo, we have developed and characterized transgenic (Tg) mice that overexpress HO-1 site specifically in vascular smooth muscle cells (VSMCs). The Tg mice were generated by use of human HO-1 cDNA under the control of SM22-alpha promoter. The HO-1 gene overexpression was demonstrated by Northern blot analysis and coincided with increases in the protein expression in VSMCs and total HO activities. Tg mice exhibited a significant increase in arterial pressure at various ages and displayed impaired nitrovasodilatory responses in isolated aortic segments versus nontransgenic littermates while enhancing their nitric oxide (NO) production. The pressure of Tg mice was unchanged by systemic administration of either N(omega)-nitro-L-arginine or SNP. Furthermore, the isolated aorta in these mice exhibited lesser extents of NO-elicited cGMP elevation via soluble guanylate cyclase (sGC), while exhibiting no notable downregulation of sGC expression. Such impairment of the NO-elicited cGMP increase was restored significantly by tin protoporphyrin IX, an HO inhibitor. On the other hand, 3-(5'-hydroxymethyl-2' furyl)-1-benzyl-indazol (YC-1), an NO-independent activator of sGC, increased cGMP and relaxed aortas from Tg mice to levels comparable with those from nontransgenic mice, which indicates that contents of functionally intact sGC are unlikely to differ between the two systems. These findings suggest that site-specific overexpression of HO-1 in VSMCs suppresses vasodilatory response to NO and thereby leads to an elevation of arterial pressure.

 

http://ukpmc.ac.uk/abstract/MED/11440978/reload=1

 

 

Doctors don't generally just jump in and start testing idea's on humans.

Edited June 18, 2012 by Informer

[Informer]

 

Simple experiment: blood follows chi flow. Hands get very hot in temperature when energy healing is being done.

 

 

Yes, I have increased my temperature to over 100 degrees many times, that doesn't mean that it is in fact mystical and without any physiological basis.

 

If you are thinking along those lines, then I would guess you may have mistaken awareness of the blood flow in your veins for chi. Many do.

 

Here is a possible explanation of how it is done:

 

WHAT DOES THE THYROID DO?

 

The thyroid produces two hormones, triiodothyronine (T3) and thyroxine (T4), which regulate how the body uses and stores energy. Thyroid function is controlled by a gland located just below the brain, known as the pituitary (figure 3). The pituitary produces thyroid stimulating hormone (TSH), which stimulates the thyroid to produce T3 and T4.

http://www.uptodate.com/contents/thyroid-nodules-beyond-the-basics

 

Notice the link between the thyroid and pituitary gland, both of which are used in internal alchemy.

 

The thyroid secretes several hormones, collectively called thyroid hormones. The main hormone is thyroxine, also called T4. Thyroid hormones act throughout the body, influencing metabolism, growth and development, and body temperature.

http://women.webmd.com/picture-of-the-thyroid

 

The functions of thyroxine and triiodothyronine are as follows:

1) Increase the basal metabolic rate of the body, thus setting the rate of the chemical reactions that occur in the body

2) Increase the rate at which the body uses food for energy, thus playing an important role in determining your caloric requirement

3) Increase the rate at which the body both makes and breaks down

Michael Lebowitz DC and Ami Kapadia MD

glucose (gluconeogenesis and glycolysis), thus increasing the

absorption of glucose by the cells in general and by the

gastrointestinal tract

4) Increase insulin secretion by the pancreas

5) Increase the respiration rate and depth of each breath

6) Increase the rate of both protein synthesis and breakdown

7) Increase the growth rate of adolescents while quickening the closing

rate of epiphyses in bones

8) Increase fat deposition into circulation to be burned for energy

9) Increase appetite

10) Increase urinary excretion of calcium and phosphorus

11) Increase secretion of digestive enzymes and peristalsis in the

gastrointestinal tract

12) Dilate blood vessels, thus increasing blood flow

13) Increase heart rate, body temperature, and systolic blood pressure

while decreasing diastolic pressure

 

http://www.bodyrestorationanownersmanual.com/html/BodyRestorationChapter2.pdf

[ShaktiMama]

Hi ShaktiMama. Interesting about the type of pathology that can be revaled in a shaking experience. Would love to hear more.

 

 

News to me!

 

Dr. Jerry Alan Johnson writes about it ih his medical qigong textbooks. They are characterized by behaviors of the elements.

 

What is news?

S

[ShaktiMama]

[ShaktiMama]

Thanks. Good to know.

 

 

I was unaware that Jenny worked with KAP. (But I don't follow KAP, so I might be late to this bit of information.)

 

 

She doesn't! Please let's not start THAT rumor. I apologize if my communication made you to think differently. What I meant was that both KAP and Sifu Jenny both tell their students to use shaking as part of preventative maintenance practice.

 

S

[ShaktiMama]

Yes, I have increased my temperature to over 100 degrees many times, that doesn't mean that it is in fact mystical and without any physiological basis.

 

If you are thinking along those lines, then I would guess you may have mistaken awareness of the blood flow in your veins for chi. Many do.

 

Here is a possible explanation of how it is done:

 

 

 

Notice the link between the thyroid and pituitary gland, both of which are used in internal alchemy.

 

Never said it was mystical. Your assumptions again. I was going to study at the University of Colorado, in vitro research on the role of a specific gas that vasodilates the capillaries in response to chi transfer. It would involve blood draws before and after treatment. As in, does chi treatment cause a specific chemical to be released in the body that helps speed healing by vasodilating the capillaries to increase vital nutrient to facilitate repair. These are the type of scientific inquiries, experiments that will validate what people think are just metaphysical concepts.

 

A truism in medical qigong school, chi follows blood, blood follows chi. I spent a year training in Dr. Jerry Alan Johnson's program before deciding I didn't want to be a medical qigong doctor. Get his textbooks and read for yourself. Do your research. He has incredible bibliographies on the science behind chi.

 

Why are you insisting on this metaphysical bias of yours? Why are you assuming that what I am talking about is mystical when your data sounds questionable? Ambient skin temp runs about 92-94 degrees. Don't know how you are testing but an infra red laser measuring tool that you can buy on Amazon for 15 bucks is the way to go. That's what I use. Raising your surface skin temp abve 100 degrees means you are probably running an internal temp of 104-105, seizure and coma territory because you are at the point of cooking your brain. Have you checked your measuring instruments for accuracy? Maybe you mean an internal temp of 100 degrees. That is more plausible with what is known in phyiology.

 

What are you trying to prove? On one hand you decry mysticism and the next you talk about internal alchemy?

 

I will not continue in conversation with you if you continue to insult me.

[Informer]

Never said it was mystical. Your assumptions again. I was going to study at the University of Colorado, in vitro research on the role of a specific gas that vasodilates the capillaries in response to chi transfer. It would involve blood draws before and after treatment. As in, does chi treatment cause a specific chemical to be released in the body that helps speed healing by vasodilating the capillaries to increase vital nutrient to facilitate repair. These are the type of scientific inquiries, experiments that will validate what people think are just metaphysical concepts.

 

A truism in medical qigong school, chi follows blood, blood follows chi. I spent a year training in Dr. Jerry Alan Johnson's program before deciding I didn't want to be a medical qigong doctor. Get his textbooks and read for yourself. Do your research. He has incredible bibliographies on the science behind chi.

 

Why are you insisting on this metaphysical bias of yours? Why are you assuming that what I am talking about is mystical when your data sounds questionable? Ambient skin temp runs about 92-94 degrees. Don't know how you are testing but an infra red laser measuring tool that you can buy on Amazon for 15 bucks is the way to go. That's what I use. Raising your surface skin temp abve 100 degrees means you are probably running an internal temp of 104-105, seizure and coma territory because you are at the point of cooking your brain. Have you checked your measuring instruments for accuracy? Maybe you mean an internal temp of 100 degrees. That is more plausible with what is known in phyiology.

 

What are you trying to prove? On one hand you decry mysticism and the next you talk about internal alchemy?

 

I will not continue in conversation with you if you continue to insult me.

 

Did I insult you? Which of my assumptions are incorrect? That you insinuated you had a PhD, by not elaborating?

 

If anything you insulted me by insisting you know anything about me or my practice needs.

Internal Alchemy is hardly mystical IMO, sure there are fairy tales attached to it. There is truth in it as well as fantasy and belief, as most things.

 

Doctors who test things on themselves are desperate and obviously influenced by confirmation biased. Some people want to prove something so bad, they will do whatever it takes. That's why when we formulate a hypothesis it is sometimes better to hypothesize the opposite of what we think will happen. We can disprove a hypothesis, but we don't prove one, we only give evidence for it. Even if one guy got results from testing on himself, it is hardly any evidence at all unless the phenomena is replicatable independently.

 

I said there is nothing mystical about it, and then you say "These are the type of scientific inquiries, experiments that will validate what people think are just metaphysical concepts." OK . . . That's what I was saying . . . You are hardly a victim of anything as you are portraying.

 

Yes that is the idea of science, to bring what we can know to the objective realm. It doesn't have anything to do with anything metaphysical, for if the thing was truly metaphysical it wouldn't be able to be tested objectively.

 

I'm not buying any books or seminars or retreats either . . . The information that I use is free. I don't think I have a metaphysical bias, if I haven't found any evidence, either objective or subjective, i look at it as a less probably explanation, and continue to look for a better one.

 

I don't see where I insulted you?

[Apech]

*** Moderator Message ***

 

Hello,

 

This has been an interesting thread so far with a lot of information - and based by a genuine heartfelt query.

 

I sense that the thread might fall into bickering if we are not careful. That would be unfortunate. If we don't agree on something that's fine but we simply have to state our own point of view and if necessary move on.

 

Please remember the no insult policy it will be enforced.

 

Thanks.

 

*** Mod Message ends ***

[gendao]

Noticeable differences: Dr. Morris's bias was more Taoist. Master Jin is a devout Buddhist. Prayers, lifestyle, and mantras were very important to him. Glenn was more of the rockstar type. LOL

 

I think KAP cultivates sensitivity to chi and energy flow more quickly. This provides feedback quickly to the skeptical minds. It gives re-assurance to the new practitioner. (A few of my students are high level security clearance space engineers and they love this chi stuff. ) Both Master Jin and Glenn commented on how students wouldn't keep up with their practices/homework. Jin wanted people to practice even if it meant they practiced standing while watching TV. There is more reverence/deference for the teacher as primary guru in Jin's system. He was called "the Master" by all his students. Glenn was Glenn or Doc to his students. Some azz kissers would call Glenn the Grandmaster to his face, and he was, but that was not comfortable for him.

 

Both wanted daily practice and daily meditation. Both had/have fierce martial arts skills. Both knew and used shamanic side of qigong, bon po, etc.

 

I find kundalini~qigong is very complimentary in my experience and in talking with other teachers. Some don't like that at all.

 

Both thought spontaneous shaking was to be cultivated as an essential part of the practices. I still use shaking in all my classes and personally. It is not as dramatic as it was in the beginning but to think one becomes totally free of blockages and will never need to shake or do shaking again is in error. My body still does jerking releases. It happens a lot when Santiago Dobles and I are around each other since we work on clearing the other. There is always a deeper level to go to for working. Death is the only thing that will stop it.

 

There are different types of shaking that go on. Shaking comes when there is pathological chi and experienced qigong practitioners can tell you what kind of pathology is in play by the type of shaking movement exhibited. Shaking/kriyas also result when energy is slamming up against a block in the body. When the block dissolves it is like taking boulders out of a rapids in a river. The flow becomes much smoother. Shaking also is preventative/maintenance that can or should be done on a daily basis as Sifu Jenny instructs and does KAP. It keeps the channels clean and lets the body correct itself with it's own adjustment.

 

Yes, Glenn like Chia's work for the most part. But even all this discussion that Chia writes about happens spontaneously with a kundalini awakening as it did with me for example, without any instruction.

 

Re: the video. That looks like how a session with Jin Fa works. Some contextual considerations. Energy doesn't move through tension. That would be tension held in the body, the spirit, the mind, the emotions, etc. Being with someone you trust puts one at ease so this energy can move easier and have a deeper effect. Taking someone off the street to do these things to may not work because we are working with subtle energies.

Interesting. So, sounds like you had some dogmatic differences, but were the actual energetic practices pretty similar or compatible?

Hi ShaktiMama. Interesting about the type of pathology that can be revaled in a shaking experience. Would love to hear more.

If you skip to 14:25 in this video of Shi DeLon, the narrator explains some of the various shaking symptoms:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JOmqnrGZM9k

We saw a lotttt of this in Kunlun...

 

I personally think that it represents just the initial emotional tsunami when the major floodgates are first opened. Sort of like how when a pressure cooker is first opened - an amount of water will immediately escape in the form of steam under its own pressure alone.

 

So, I think shaking is like that over-pressurized steam venting out of a cooker when it is first opened... The predominant issues just bursting at our seams. Shake, rattle & roll!

 

But, what about all the rest of the non-vaporized water still in it? That can't escape under its own accord? Well, that remainder may still take years of processing and adjunctive therapies afterward to really detox all out (which may also manifest on various levels). And some of it may even have to be sucked out!

Edited June 18, 2012 by vortex

[Informer]

So how long are you gonna wait until you feel confident to step out and practice?

 

^ this was the cause of my irritation, fyi you are forgiven.

 

<3

[ShaktiMama]

Interesting. So, sounds like you had some dogmatic differences, but were the actual energetic practices pretty similar or compatible?If you skip to 14:25 in this video of Shi DeLon, the narrator explains some of the various shaking symptoms:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JOmqnrGZM9k

We saw a lotttt of this in Kunlun...

 

 

I personally think that it represents just the initial emotional tsunami when the major floodgates are first opened. Sort of like how when a pressure cooker is first opened - an amount of water will immediately escape in the form of steam under its own pressure alone.

 

So, I think shaking is like that over-pressurized steam venting out of a cooker when it is first opened... The predominant issues just bursting at our seams. Shake, rattle & roll!

 

But, what about all the rest of the non-vaporized water still in it? That can't escape under its own accord? Well, that remainder may still take years of processing and adjunctive therapies afterward to really detox all out (which may also manifest on various levels). And some of it may even have to be sucked out!

 

I like this video. Coming from my perspective I would say this chi gong practice is shamanic. One has to be a real chi beast to have this kind of effect on people. I think it was Michael Lomax who said in this forum or it was in his book, A Light Worker's Guide to High Level Energy Healing, that it takes at least 8 hours of daily chi kung practice for the healer to build up his/her internal chi to be truly effective as a healer. I wouldn't disagree with him.

 

I think they are more compatible than different. The higher practices start to look very similar among different traditions after awhile. The wrapping or packaging around them can be very different. I have seen a high level worker just talk to the body and the body makes it's own adjustments and changes for it has it's own intelligence. I am experimenting and practicing with this right now on myself.

 

Sifu Dan Ferrera is a real chi beast because he teaches qigong daily and is a healer with an active healing practice. Santiago Dobles is an animal about training and his chi output shows it. Me, not so much into training heavy. I prefer to just touch someone and let the energy flow and do what it wants. It's very soft and gentle.

 

We see similar expressions in kundalini awakening but we more commonly call them kriyas in our little group. The pressure cooker is a good analogy. My similar analogy is like leaving a rubber garden hose out in the sun. It becomes cracked and stiff, maybe filled with deposits over time not unlike how our energy channels become as we grow up from childhood. When we turn on high pressure water through the hose it will whip about wildly. The same happens when energy starts slamming into narrow channels.

 

This is why the caveat of three years of practice came about. It takes about three years to prepare the channels for high velocity, high intensity energy flow per the Chinese and Yogic models. Schools vary on diet, lifestyle requirements etc. We don't want a 1 inch diameter pipe carrying flow that was meant to carry 3 inch diameter flow. Glenn Morris's horrific experience with kundalini awakening and many others who have spontaneous awakenings are due to this phenomenon of flow in the body. This is why we teach the Secret Smile and Microcosmic Orbit and a couple of other practices as foundational for k awakening. Combined this helps to get the "crusties" out of the energy pipes to prepare for high velocity energy flow.

 

I learned in my medical qigong training that this spontaneous shaking can be stilled by intent. It can really tire out the body in some people. I find the kundalini shaking is much more difficult to quiet than the chi shaking.

 

Kundalini flow can be very very very hot. People can actually have physical burns. Like an electrical wire where the current meets resistance, kundalini meets resistance in our energy channels and this causes the heat that is felt. Specific practices can smooth this process out and we teach those things in our classes.

[ShaktiMama]

^ this was the cause of my irritation, fyi you are forgiven.

 

<3

 

To hurt your feelings was not my intent. My apologies if I have done so.

[joeblast]

Reminds me of my brother's story about making snow back a bunch of years ago at the ski area and letting a 5 inch 35 psi air hose slip out of his hands Everyone ran and that sucker was waving around like mad 20, 30 feet in the air!