How do I prepare for the utlimate transformation (death)

[spiraltao]

This post is about dying. I been thinking about it alot since 09, it is quite hard to keep from it. My huge qigong victory over my liver disease was awesome, but I still wonder about dying. I am NOT talking about giving up on living, no not at all, its just that sometmes (espcially since I got ran over four weeks ago and refused to die under a Ford Ranger), it is counterproductive to me reaching a place of calmness inside.

 

 

 

Why do I worry about it? We are all going to die, bet that. I have now stared death down twice and I don't care to admit, it still scares me!

T

 

 

 

 

I want to get over this fear of the unevitable.

 

Forgive me for asking such an ignorant question, but what is the Taoist view on dying? I do think my soul (shen, qi) will continute to exist after my shell has ceased to function.

 

 

If this is too abstract I will delete it. All input is welcome, my skin is pretty thick too, so I am ready for no one to hold back.

[eye_of_the_storm]

Well I haven't a clue

 

though i have heard

 

if one is able to maintain consciousness during the dream state you should be able to navigate the 'after life' / bardo state easily and achieve 'enlightenment' in that moment

 

perhaps dream yoga?

 

they say death is like falling asleep

 

moving from one dream to the next

 

few can remember the day just gone by, even less remember their dreams? how does one suppose to remember lifetimes?

 

once one remembers then one learns to control the dream...

 

I am dreaming... infinite playground

 

we have to maintain consciousness // never fall asleep

 

the body asleep the mind (consciousness, interfaces with body) awake

 

Edited June 2, 2012 by White Wolf Running On Air

[Protector]

You know what's interesting

If you throw a rock REALLY REALLY HIGH and then die

The rock will keep flying anyway, until it hits the ground

 

And so, you should do more horse stance or write a will, not the boring kind where you leave your stuff to people but the words that could last longer

While you're doing that you should write a manifesto

 

 

And Taoist view on dieing: It happens, there's even evidence of it so look it up

[Harmonious Emptiness]

This may, or may not, speak to you:

 

To quote Ancestor Lu [Dongbin]:

 

"People usually fear death, but when they become seriously ill they long for a quick death to relieve them of their misery, and when they are utterly exhausted in a perilous situation they want to die quickly to escape their suffering. When you look at life and death in reverse this way, you break right through the mental block."

 

(Cleary translation)

[eye_of_the_storm]

I have had vivid dreams of dying - a number of different people and lives

 

I don't know what there place is

 

but the vividness leads me to believe they are past memories

 

for example one was so vivid I was praying to God as I was bleeding out on the ground (shot a few times) ... felt everything

 

and 'drifted off' or 'faded out' of that reality and into this one haha... had uni that morning... shot to death - get up - go to uni

 

unless somebody else has an explanation as to this ^?

[mjjbecker]

What Michael Lomax teaches.

 

Stillness Movement is a 'living' tradition, rather than a collection of obscure texts and terms that, frankly, most Chinese people don't grasp or understand.

 

I also found the book 'The Magus of Strovolos' to be an interesting read.

 

The spirit is multifaceted and more than just the present ego.

[eye_of_the_storm]

death is just the beginning

 

death is the road to awe

 

only he who isn't afraid to die truly lives

[joeblast]

Jay, a must read on this subject is Sogyal Rinpoche's Tibetan Book Of Living and Dying. Recognize the light of your spirit as a mother welcoming her long lost son and take a step beyond

[spiraltao]

Well I haven't a clue

 

though i have heard

 

if one is able to maintain consciousness during the dream state you should be able to navigate the 'after life' / bardo state easily and achieve 'enlightenment' in that moment

 

perhaps dream yoga?

 

they say death is like falling asleep

 

moving from one dream to the next

 

few can remember the day just gone by, even less remember their dreams? how does one suppose to remember lifetimes?

 

once one remembers then one learns to control the dream...

 

I am dreaming... infinite playground

 

we have to maintain consciousness // never fall asleep

 

the body asleep the mind (consciousness, interfaces with body) awake

 

 

HOLY COW! I do Lucid Dreaming A LOT. I have died way more than just once in my dreams. Drowning was a theme as a child. At any rate this makes alot of sense to me, Wolf Running on Air! I keep a dream journal. The manifesto! Lao Xie had already told me "You know Bruce Lee wrote a book while he was healing" Perfect time for will and I am inspired enough to throw a manifesto in there. Leaving something behind that will live forever, now that is an idea.

 

 

Joe Blast, thanks bro! Thanks to all!

[eye_of_the_storm]

HOLY COW! I do Lucid Dreaming A LOT. I have died way more than just once in my dreams. Drowning was a theme as a child. At any rate this makes alot of sense to me, Wolf Running on Air! I keep a dream journal. The manifesto! Lao Xie had already told me "You know Bruce Lee wrote a book while he was healing" Perfect time for will and I am inspired enough to throw a manifesto in there. Leaving something behind that will live forever, now that is an idea.

 

 

Joe Blast, thanks bro! Thanks to all!

 

[Apech]

Great subject.

 

Meditation on death can be very powerful. Someone said most people live their lives as if they are immortal ... i.e. never thinking they are going to die ... whereas we all know the opposite is true. There is meditation on the 'fact' of death ... its inevitability and so on ... and also on the process of death. Both very helpful I think.

[doc benway]

I do think my soul (shen, qi) will continute to exist after my shell has ceased to function.

 

So, if the "soul (shen, qi) continues to exist after your "shell" has ceased to function, then who or what is it that continues?

And what does it mean to continue?

 

And if it continues after your "shell" ceases, then was it absent before your shell came into existence?

 

I think if you can go very deeply into exactly "who" it is that has a soul and what that means, you may be able to come more to terms with dying because that is a glimpse into the nature of life/death and immortality.

[gatito]

The picture posted by WWROA also speaks to me.

Edited June 2, 2012 by gatito

[3bob]

death itself dies...

 

although he is a tough old nut to crack.

[RiverSnake]

By cultivating we learn to not only live a more joyous and graceful life, but also how to die peacefully and without fear. Live your life fully and walk down a path of no regrets...that and cultivation is the best preparation.

 

-My 2 cents, Peace

[gatito]

I absolutely agree with 3bob and OldGreen and I'd like to add that what you are was never born and will never die. You are eternal and your true nature is intelligence/love/beauty/peace/happiness.

 

Traditionally, it's described as SatChitAnanada.

[spiraltao]

I absolutely agree with 3bob and OldGreen and I'd like to add that what you are was never born and will never die. You are eternal and your true nature is intelligence/love/beauty/peace/happiness.

 

Traditionally, it's described as SatChitAnanada.

 

 

 

Will/has my spiritual cultivation always be a part of the SatChitAnanada? I am understanding correctly. I look forward to Monday when I can go looking for those books. Might have to scribd them if they are rare in the least due to a very small collection overall at the local library.

 

 

 

Through the baguazhang and internal practices, how would they relate to SatChitAnanada?

 

 

 

...for now, live to cultivate skill and wisdom with goal to heal others.

 

 

 

This death subject gets on my mind quite often. Thank you all for taking the time to respond.

[konchog uma]

Why do I worry about it? We are all going to die, bet that. I have now stared death down twice and I don't care to admit, it still scares me!

I want to get over this fear of the unevitable.

 

awesome!

 

i don't know the daoist view on dying (try not to do it? LOL) but i have stared death in the face a couple times too and i think it is blissful to finally die. I don't think it is scary at all but very peaceful and fulfilling. I just want to offer encouragement to everyone reading this that death is fun and excellent, not some terrible loss (just loss of personality self and so on) but a wonderful gain. i think this is why it is called parinirvana by some.

 

also, reading the tibetan, egyptian, hindu, celtic, etc books of the dead might be helpful. I have never seen the hindu or celtic ones, my teacher has a copy of hindu and he's mentioned celtic... um bardo thodol (tibetan) and egyptian are more widely circulated.

 

i hope this thread takes off

[Vmarco]

This post is about dying.

 

I want to get over this fear of the unevitable.

 

 

The inevitability of death is a lie,...thus it would better to work on your fear of truth. Even if you do not uncover Truth Realization, such would be helpful in understanding the Clear Light experienced shortly after death. Naropa said, "By learning to recognize the transcendent Light during his lifetime, an adept may return to it without difficulty when the shock of death threatens to disorient him."

 

[Gerard]

Why worry about death, you never cease to exist, just a constant transformation of the various projected "selves" of your original mind. The goal is returning to this one using your physical projection, which is the one that experiences a most significant "death." Dream and astral projections also "die", so if you never worried about them don't worry about the physical either.

[astralc]

jay, thats quite a question you are asking, first off what do taoists say about death... I think someone already said it, 'it happens'. I think thats about it too, to dwell or give it too much energy is wasteful, so taoists would just use its ever-present influence to sharpen their practice. With death ever behind us, reminding us the 'end is nigh', we naturally practice just that little bit more diligently.

 

For what its worth, what lies afterwards? Well, I have been fortunate to have met family members, friends, and a few others who had passed on. So, to me, existence, as we know it, doesn't stop. It just changes shape. What I would suggest you do is to stay on good terms with Lady Luck on the roads, obviously she watches over you, and keep doing your chi gung, that obviously works for you too. You are one heck of a lucky person, just keep doing what you are doing and enjoy the day.

[manitou]

I SO second the suggestion about the Tibetan Book of the Living and Dying - as luck would have it, I'm in the middle of it right now. It talks much of our ability to get to the point of mental singularity where there is no difference at all between living and dying - we ride the life stream through all events. The cyclical rhythm of the bardos makes imminent sense, and is comforting knowledge that all things rise and fall according to nature's plan.

[Stosh]

I think,

I find myself agreeing with Vmarco and Gatito.

That the life itself is the illusion

Folks rarely actually worry about what they were

before they were born

when they sleep

consider death in the same way

 

but answering directly the initial question,

 

LIVE well.

 

So when it comes your time to unravel

you fear it heartily

If that is your wont.

But every moment until then -Live!

 

 

 

 

Where does the self go when myself sleeps deep?

Does one not sigh relieved , welcome bed! ,

and oft begrudge the rising sun some few more winks.

Relish I, both that drifting off

and the stolen half-waked time

before the clock jangles me to arise!

Dreams themselves are not so sweet

as these viewless borders are to lidded eyes.

 

Stosh

Edited June 3, 2012 by Stosh

[thelerner]

Meditation on death can be very powerful.

There is a 'warm up' before meditation I do, I think its from the Vispassana tradition.

 

I say to myself some variation of:

 

I am not my body, I am that which inhabits it.

I am not my thoughts, they are temporary, like clouds floating across the sky.

I am not my emotions, I acknowledge them and let them settle like waves in pond.

I am not my past.. they are memories and patterns I can choose not to follow

I am not my future..that is just projections

I am not my possessions

I am breath and awareness

 

then I'll go onto meditation.

 

I think the practice of acknowledging I am not my thoughts and body make the concept of death easier.

Edited June 3, 2012 by thelerner

[mYTHmAKER]

My problem is what to pack