How many Taoists are out there in the TTB....?

[Marblehead]

I haven't listened to Leon for quite a while even though I mentiond his name recently and I have a couple of his albums.

 

But anyway:

 

[mrtiger]

1 .What are the qualities of a Taoist....???

2. What is the first quality to be expected in a Taoist...???

3. If you want to be a Taoist, what do you need to do to become one...???

4. If you think that you are a Taoist now, what makes you think that you are one...???

5. Since you have thought that you are a Taoist, did you follow all the principles or have you ever violated any of these principles....???

 

You may respond by answering anyone of the question.

 

I think that this may have been said by others but I'll say it again.

 

As soon as we start to think of ourselves as a Taoist or a Buddhist or any others ists or isms then we're separating ourselves from others.

 

The whole point of the Tao, to me a least, is to reject these notions of separatism from the rest of the world.

 

So if you think of your self as a Taoist, then surely that's paradoxical.

[ChiDragon]

I think that this may have been said by others but I'll say it again.

 

As soon as we start to think of ourselves as a Taoist or a Buddhist or any others ists or isms then we're separating ourselves from others.

 

The whole point of the Tao, to me a least, is to reject these notions of separatism from the rest of the world.

 

So if you think of your self as a Taoist, then surely that's paradoxical.

 

Yes, you are right about that for the thinking of most people. However, a Taoist always thought that oneself is integrated with Nature and sharing the energy with all. A Taoist is no different from a boy, girl, man, woman, young or elder. A Taoist is just an individual who is following with the principles of Yin-Yang to stay in balance.

Edited August 2, 2012 by ChiDragon

[Isimsiz Biri]

1 .What are the qualities of a Taoist....???

2. What is the first quality to be expected in a Taoist...???

3. If you want to be a Taoist, what do you need to do to become one...???

4. If you think that you are a Taoist now, what makes you think that you are one...???

5. Since you have thought that you are a Taoist, did you follow all the principles or have you ever violated any of these principles....???

You may respond by answering anyone of the question.

 

Very nice questions. If you find satisfactory replies, could you please just PM me?

 

There is a concept of philosophical Taoism and religious Taoism. In my opinion, this philosophical Taoism has nothing to do with Taoist masters in the history. In fact, I am also curious what is meant by philosophical taoism.

 

Religious taoism is very well defined, but it is something very much Chinese. You have to live in China or in a city where there is a real Chinese community.

[Stosh]

Very nice questions. If you find satisfactory replies, could you please just PM me?

 

There is a concept of philosophical Taoism and religious Taoism. In my opinion, this philosophical Taoism has nothing to do with Taoist masters in the history. In fact, I am also curious what is meant by philosophical taoism.

 

Religious taoism is very well defined, but it is something very much Chinese. You have to live in China or in a city where there is a real Chinese community.

Wouldnt it make more sense to ask a philosophical Taoist than Cd ?

[Isimsiz Biri]

Wouldnt it make more sense to ask a philosophical Taoist than Cd ?

 

The problem is the definiton of philosophical Taoism. There is not a definition of it that everybody agrees upon. At least, I am not aware of such a definition. Even if there is a definition of it, if you post it here, there will be so many contradictory opinions agianst it. .

[ChiDragon]

The philosophy in Taoism was based the idea of "Wu Wei" which is follow the course of Nature and let Nature take its course. Thus the whole Taoist philosophy was evolved around the idea of "Wu Wei'. If you can grasp the meaning of "Wu Wei", then there you have it.

[Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan]

1 .What are the qualities of a Taoist....???

2. What is the first quality to be expected in a Taoist...???

3. If you want to be a Taoist, what do you need to do to become one...???

4. If you think that you are a Taoist now, what makes you think that you are one...???

5. Since you have thought that you are a Taoist, did you follow all the principles or have you ever violated any of these principles....???

 

You may respond by answering anyone of the question.

 

1. the qualities of a "taoist" are irrelevant. Too diverse to be listed, too many to be quantified. To suggest any one quality is to suggest there is an opposite non-qualifying one, which, as a taoist, does not exist.

 

2. Exist. The sun and moon are taoist, the frogs and mosquitos, the fog and the sky, the stars and the void. Taoists. In a simplified sense.

 

3. asked and answered. If you do want to, you probably are already on the right path. If not, then the question is redundant. Seekers will seek.

 

4. I am just a Human Being, simply being Human. I am not what any path I walk allows me to call myself; i am not a sage, a taoist, a stoner, a member, a bum, or an american, but I AM A Human Being entitled to walk all paths.

Therefore the question becomes "do you percieve me as a taoist, what makes you see me as such?".

 

5. CAN I violate any of these principals? Specifically Human Being, being Human.

[Stosh]

The problem is the definiton of philosophical Taoism. There is not a definition of it that everybody agrees upon. At least, I am not aware of such a definition. Even if there is a definition of it, if you post it here, there will be so many contradictory opinions agianst it. .

 

I agree about that variability , everyone has thier own take on belief systems ,, which is precisely why I think you should ask the question of someone who considers themselves to be in the group rather than someone who is not and expecting them to give the perspective a fair shake that is Unless I am to be surprised and Cd is considering himself a philosophical taoist,,

I consider him to be a 'Laoist' but thats just my take on it and I figure he can answer for himself,,,

 

My description of philosophical taoism- is that one approaches some of the same source material, but with emphasis on the considered rational basis for the ideas more so than some mystical un-understandable approach which relies heavily on subjective experience or metaphysical ... stuff. One is not committed nor is it even implied that one has to accept the interps of lineages , the existence of Supernatural beings , the infallibility of Lao tzu or Chuang tzu ,or even the whole kit and caboodle of assertions they made. You can agree generally with the philosophy plato or jesus or neitzche or fred flintstone without trying to embody all of what they had to say. Religious taoists have lineages and special garb etc its like a club. Laoists tend to think Lao was the begin all and end all, and philosophical taoists tend to look to materialism or humanism as much as anything else. There is plenty of overlap underneath the labels. ( I figure each of us thinks the others just dont get IT)

[Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan]

Isnt there a thread for this already? Philosophical versus religious taoism?

[Isimsiz Biri]

The philosophy in Taoism was based the idea of "Wu Wei" which is follow the course of Nature and let Nature take its course. Thus the whole Taoist philosophy was evolved around the idea of "Wu Wei'. If you can grasp the meaning of "Wu Wei", then there you have it.

 

It is in fact Wei Wu Wei. Action no action. Mankind should be respectful to nature but humans are the caliph of God on this world. We are responsible of every living thing on earth. For instance, if lions or whales are getting extinct, that shows we are not fulfilling our responsibility, in fact we are betraying our responsibility killing those species until extinction. So I agree with Wei Wu Wei so it is necessary but not sufficient.

[Stosh]

It is in fact Wei Wu Wei. Action no action. Mankind should be respectful to nature but humans are the caliph of God on this world. We are responsible of every living thing on earth. For instance, if lions or whales are getting extinct, that shows we are not fulfilling our responsibility, in fact we are betraying our responsibility killing those species until extinction. So I agree with Wei Wu Wei so it is necessary but not sufficient.

 

I agree again (in part ), wei wu wei -is a vague useless precis for the TTC. insufficient

[zerostao]

wu wei with ziran and common sense

[Stosh]

Still brief but ,, I can go with that.

[Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan]

Wu Wei is quite central to a Philosophical Taoism. You couldnt have philosophical tao without wu wei, otherwise we'd just be calling wu wei something different. The word is more of a placeholder, but the concept is the meat and potatoes.

 

The concept of Wu Wei encompases the bulk of philosophical taoism; to be as simple as naturally possible, but not any simpler is Wu Wei. It makes more sense if you dont think about it and just let it flow.

 

Just do not concern yourself too much with your supposed self.

[Stosh]

_{An explanation there as useful as teats on a bull.}

_{Like recep said in-sufficient}

_{It draws no line between Neodaoism, Religious daoism, lord of the flies, or greenpeace}

Edited December 7, 2012 by Stosh

[Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan]

the lines are too blurred to concern myself so much...

[Stosh]

Good point , but dont drive anywhere

[ChiDragon]

Wu Wei is quite central to a Philosophical Taoism. You couldnt have philosophical tao without wu wei, otherwise we'd just be calling wu wei something different. The word is more of a placeholder, but the concept is the meat and potatoes.

 

The concept of Wu Wei encompasses the bulk of philosophical Taoism; to be as simple as naturally possible, but not any simpler is Wu Wei. It makes more sense if you don't think about it and just let it flow.

 

Just do not concern yourself too much with your supposed self.

 

I am glad that someone understand the same way as I understood Wu Wei. Let's continue with our Wu Wei......

[ChiDragon]

I agree about that variability , everyone has thier own take on belief systems ,, which is precisely why I think you should ask the question of someone who considers themselves to be in the group rather than someone who is not and expecting them to give the perspective a fair shake that is Unless I am to be surprised and Cd is considering himself a philosophical taoist,,

I consider him to be a 'Laoist' but thats just my take on it and I figure he can answer for himself,,,

 

You are right to say that I am a Philosophical Taoist and a "Laoist". BTW did you know that the ideas of the philosophical Taoist was all from Lao Tze's patented idea of Wu Wei, so to speak......???

[mYTHmAKER]

When Taoists became (become) Taoists they adhere to form.

Before they called themselves (became) Taoists they were formless.

Something like that

[ChiDragon]

Yes, "formless" is only a philosophical concept from a Taoist point of view. What that all come to was the self discipline in cultivation for self poise which is a big challenge skill to endure something that others cannot endure. The best part of the endurance was no harm done at all to the Taoist cultivator....

[Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan]

I am glad that someone understand the same way as I understood Wu Wei. Let's continue with our Wu Wei......

One could accurately posit that i began practicing Wu Wei at age 10 or 11, shortly after my concussion and hearing loss, however it was never an intentional practice until after i encountered relatd and/or relating information on the internet years later.

 

I wouldnt personally tell you that i begin practice until i was 16 to be honest, because everything i did well enough without the educated basis was done, perhaps, for the wrong reasons. Anger, frustration, confusion, and discomfort were the reasons for my earliest successes with Wu Wei and letting go of things icould not control. No matter how desperately i wanted to, i knew in my heart that it wasnt the correct path. But it was not until about 3-6 years after these times that i learned what i had learned from personal experience was stuff of legends and sage lore. So i searched teh internet for all i could, learned the principals of many traditions, and even some times the names of those traditions and/or practices.

 

Fact of the matter is i hadn't attributed a name to the practice of Wu Wei until last year in the library where i read about it in a Taijiquan book! So if thename comes before the practice, i havent practiced wu wei at all until last summer!

 

 

 

Now i sit around online researching the various topics, practices, forms, and traditions, and have been doing so for the most of the past 13 years. Everything is in flucuation, impermanence. We all have good days and bad days, wu wei isnt going to cure that! But letting go of the bad days is a great way to enjoy the good ones!

[Protector]

Y'all act like you never seen a Taoist person before

Jaws all on the floor like ChiDragon to an ox threw it through your window

and started teaching about technical things, some stuff, and some more

you first were ignoring, then throwing the furniture (Ahh!)

It's the return of the... "Ah, wait, no way, you're kidding,

he didn't just say what I think he did, did he?"

And Lao Tsu said... nothing you idiots!

Lao Tsu's dead, he's locked in my basement! (Ha-ha!)

Taoist women love Sinfest

[*vocal turntable: chigga chigga chigga*]

"Sinfest is so awesome, him look at him,

Walkin around quoting his you-know-what

Replying the you-know-who," "Yeah, and he's so cute lol!"

Yeah, I probably got a couple of screws up in my head loose

But no worse, than when you forget to do the horse stance

Sometimes, I wanna get on forum and just let loose, but won't

cuz aftertaste would make me feel like a dead goose

"The Tao is like this, The Tao is like this

And if you're lucky, you might just give it a little squeeze"

And that's the message that we deliver to little kids

And expect them to know what Te in Tao Te Ching is

Of course they gonna know what meditation is

By the time they hit fourth grade

They re-watched the ATLA don't they?

"We ain't nothing but mammals.." Well, some of us cannibals

who cut other people open like cantaloupes

But if we can meditate with better thoughts on pillow folds

then there's no reason that the men and women can't evolve

But if you feel like I feel, I got the antidote

Horse stance I like most, nei gong thing that burns and crawls

 

[Chorus: (repeat 2X)]

 

'Cause I'm the Real Taoist, yes I'm the Real Taoist

All you other Real Taoists are just imitating

So won't the real Tao-ist please stand up,

please stand up, please stand up?

 

*Bleep* doesn't wanna do horse stance and write in the journal;

well I do, so fuck him and fuck you too!

You think I give a damn about credibility of F.Hands?

Half of you people don't even care, or do they?

"But Sin, what if he's not real, wouldn't it be weird?"

Who cares! It's not even a rap anymore,

So you can, go write a thread about fascism

Shit, Mythmaker better switch me chairs

so I can sit next to Immortal and Vmarco

and hear 'em argue over who loves Christianity more

I don't know what to put in this line, well gee

"Yeah, he's cool, but I'm not sure about his lineage, hee-hee!"

I should update my journal or just let it be

and explain why I don't have a lineage and you're like me [AHHH!]

I'm sick of you changing your oppinions, all you do is annoy me

so I have been sent here to destroy you [bzzzt]

And there's a million of us just like me

who horse stance like me; who just wu wei like me

wear blue like me; mud walk, talk and bark like me

and just might be the next best thing but not quite me!

 

[Chorus 4x]

'Cause I'm the Real Taoist, yes I'm the Real Taoist

All you other Real Taoists are just imitating

So won't the real Tao-ist please stand up,

please stand up, please stand up?

 

Ha ha

Guess there's a Weird Al in all of us

Fuck it, let's all do horse stance

 

So that's where I left this thing

[Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan]

it wont let me "super like" D:

 

 

^Edited typo; "i / it"^

Edited December 20, 2012 by Hot Nirvana Judo Trend