Mopai Training with jim mcmillan

[Practitioner]

It's things like that, the 7 paragraphs all in caps, and the whimsical "i dont care because you're not SO AND SO" nature of his posts that make me think that "Sifu ReL" is indeed not an adult sifu behind this account, but a child pretending to be one.

Edited July 13, 2012 by Practitioner

[JohnC]

It's things like that, the 7 paragraphs all in caps, and the whimsical "i dont care because you're not SO AND SO" nature of his posts that make me think that "Sifu ReL" is indeed not an adult sifu behind this account, but a child pretending to be one.

Agreed.

 

Rel, let alone a 'sifu'.

[Sifu ReL]

the fact that i said at the begining of my post up there that i was just GUESSING. should of been enough....on top of that im 19...and to the comments of me being a Sifu or not is irrelevent to say the least its a name on a forum site....and on top of that since i made the post i have came in contact with many people with Mo pai Info.

 

and to all you make believers of yall inner chi. yall are not master neither you all have yet to even be able to demostrate a technique. and since neither can i , seems as though were all full of shiit, regardless though.

 

ILL TYPE IN CAPS IF I FEEL THE NEED, IF YOU FEEL AS THOUGH IM YELLING AT YOU...LOL MATTER JUST KEEP THINKING IM YELLING....

 

P.S. YOU SHOULD SPEND LESS TIME READING MY POST AND COMMENTS AND PM'S AND MORE TIME MEDITATING.

BUT YEAH.

 

THANKYOU YOU TO THOSE OF YOU ON THIS FORUM WHO ACTUALLY DO YOUR BEST TO HELP OTHERS.

THANKYOU YOU TO THOSE OF YOU WHO USE THIS FORUM TO SAY NONESENSE ABOUT YOUR INTERNAL PRACTICE.

 

MAY PEACE AND BLESSING OF THE CREATOR BE WITH YOU ALL

 

LOVE,

SIFU REL <---LMFAO

[Sifu ReL]

In the light of your recent mumblings (using caps amounts to shouting and the content is not much better), it should be understandable that I prefer to not reply to your PMs anymore. Aside of the problem of who one teaches, I made a promise to use any knowledge on Mo Pai that I received from a certain person only for my personal use.

Also: Mo Pai is since some longer time closed for "Westerners" and people who claim to still be able to teach officially are...*cough*

You are immature and imbalanced and Mo Pai is a dead end - simple as that.

 

YOU SHOULD SAY YOUR MO PAI KNOWLEDGE FOR EVERYONE

 

LMAO MO PAI WILL NEVER BE DEAD!

 

AND THE WEST DOES KNOW MO PAI.

 

 

(OMG HE USED ALL CAPS AGAIN)^^^^^^

[Dreamingawake]

I suspect the big draw of this system is that 'you don't get to know.' It's the forbidden fruit. If the details of the system were public knowledge then the same people who chase it the hardest and talk about how it's the 'best' even though they know nothing of it would probably be the ones to criticize it the most. The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence

[mjjbecker]

mjjbecker,

 

Can I ask your personal opinion on something?

 

Do you believe the lower dan tein can be filled without sitting meditation in a deep trance state. (as is taught in spring forest qigong, and longmen pai)

 

As in filled completely?

 

 

This is something I am genuinely curious about.

 

Certainly.

 

As far as I know every authentic method has sitting meditation as part of the training. 'Stilling' the mind is the key though. It is mentioned in 'The Magus of Java' where Pak John states that it is when the mind is stilled (I don't recall the exact words) that the qi fills the dantien.

 

Will only sitting meditation put qi into the dantien? No. In 2002, when Pak John visited Athens, he tested a woman who had 75% filled her dantien. Her main practice was taijiquan and to my knowledge she did not practice sitting meditation.

 

Achieving this stilling of the mind is a fundamental part of Hu Yao Zhen's neigong that he passed down. I understand sitting meditation was part of his training, but in regards to neigong, standing practice is a fundamental part. Joseph Chen gives an interesting anecdote from when he trained one time in the park with the late Grandmaster Feng Zhiqiang, the most well known inheritor of Hu's teachings. They all did standing practice and most of them stopped after half an hour. Then they had lunch. After two hours, only Feng was still practicing and the students decided to stop him so they could leave. On doing so, Feng expressed his surprise that two hours had passed*. And there is a fundamental point: Getting to that state where you don't notice time passing.

 

Grandmaster Feng was a man of remarkable ability, and when I met him clearly a man who was at peace with himself and the world. If a person can achieve that level of peace within themselves, then I think they have achieved something truly great from their practice. Feng had remarkable power, but power with misery is pointless.

 

You have the moving methods that are taught in various schools that are trained alongside sitting meditation. Can they still the mind and can a person gather qi through them? Yes. We know that from the woman who practiced taijiquan. I myself have achieved a stilling of the mind and 'connected oneness' (words can't come close to the explaining the experience) by practing part of the taijiquan form I mentioned above, but also, significantly, from practicing the 18 step taiji qigong method years ago. Not a so-called neigong method, but for me one of the most profound training experiences of my life was gained while doing this. And it can be learned for free off the internet.

 

Circulating the qi while gathering it is essential. It helps to prevent problems developing. Just sitting is a really bad idea, that can lead to stagnation and the problems that go with that. The body is not just a single energy center and attention must be given to the whole.

 

So, what we have on a fundamental level are the stilling of the mind and the gathering, and storing, of the qi into the body. One can do the sitting level one meditation of the Mo Pai and allow the qi to enter the body. One can also practice qi gathering exercises and combine them with stilling the mind. The latter approach, in my experience, is far more effective.

 

Do you have to be sitting on the ground to gather yin qi as well as yang qi? No. The Hunyuan neigong has very specific standing practices for gathering in yin qi through the Huiyin. I think you know the significance of that.

 

Why do I recommend what Michael Lomax does? Because I have not felt the magnitude of qi being gathered to such a level by any other practice I have experienced. I've been in a room where John Chang put out a qi field and I've been in a room where Michael Lomax has done so. Both times the feeling was tangible. Not vague at all. When someone is that good, and is teaching what they know, and their students are making clear, fast progress, you take the opportunity to learn from them. Gift of the Tao neigong gathers, shifts and pulls in qi like nothing else I have experienced.

 

In summation, I think stilling the mind is fundamental when it comes to gathering and storing qi. Sitting meditation is a part of the whole practice, and gathering qi is also a part of the whole practice. Circulating that qi, and understanding the process effects the whole, and not just a single point, is fundamental. Only sitting and only focusing on one point will very likely lead to stagnation, which is going to cause a person possibly serious problems.

 

My thoughts, FWIW.

 

*One time Feng was challenged by a qigong practitioner to see who could do seated meditation the longest. The qigong practitioner conceded after two or three days (I can't remember which) and had to be carried away by his students as he couldn't walk afterwards. Feng went off and practiced with his iron staff, as if nothing had happened.

[Moonbar]

Great post Mr Becker - thankyou

[bakeneko]

YOU SHOULD SAY YOUR MO PAI KNOWLEDGE FOR EVERYONE

 

LMAO MO PAI WILL NEVER BE DEAD!

 

AND THE WEST DOES KNOW MO PAI.

 

 

(OMG HE USED ALL CAPS AGAIN)^^^^^^

 

Why don't you just pay 300 bucks and learn it from one of the *cough* "official" *cough* teachers?

 

Otherweise your mumblings don't make much sense and I have the feeling you had problems to grasp the meaning of what you quoted. I.e. Mo pai *is* a dead END. Not "the lineage is dead". Even if you would make it to level 2 or find someone to teach you level 3. You would need to do this in time when you finish the level before. As far as I am aware of there are NO fixed signs by which you can determine yourself when you finished a level. Only a person with much more cultivation than yourself can "see" into yout body and tell where you stand. Aside of that I am not aware of any person in the lineage of John Chang who would be anywhere near his level. Something to think about.

I prefer to follow other more or less healthier lineages these days (also because I got actually INITIATED into them). From what is commonly called "energetic work" (another WRONG labeling), KUJI-IN - and the practices where this actually CAME FROM- are very good too. But one will be TESTED and the bad apples will meet a bad end. And subsequencely stop the practice.

 

End of my RANT for now.

Edited July 14, 2012 by bakeneko

[Chen]

The thread has as title "learning mo pai with Jim mc Millan"

The problem is to define what is mo pai?

It is only the nei Kung practice or includes seeds of the way of life behind it?

Does it mean Ive learned mo pai if I am level 2 or 3 or I have to wait for the funny think to begin after level 4?

From the three "available" to teach in west ,

Costa is out of the loop,

Lin is a Chinese that no one in Indonesia know him as Lin,that means that he is training with differend name there and starts a business with different name in U.S.

Jim can take you up to level 2 and if he found already a way to continue with a similar system,it is a is similar and not a mo pai way.

Is Jim a genuine instructor as it concerns his abilities ?

Yes no one doubt that he maybe has finished level 2.

Is Jim a mo pai instructor?

Not any more for the moment that he closed the door behind it.

Can I learn mo pai from the Chinese new leader?

Try,the last information is that he accepts only Chinese as students .

Is this a dead end?

It depends on what you want.

Level one is nothing, you will never become an immortal practicing it but a lot of funny thinks happening during it's achievement that proves to me at least that this system has some power.

Level two is something more funny thinks happening there and some not so funny thinks either.

So instead of asking about Training with Jim mc millan in a forum why you don't contact him and start training.....

[Chen]

This thread in no way gives evidence that is actually a fraud,all that was said in the thread is that the book shouldn't be naned Beginning Mo Pai Neikung as the book doesn't contain any actual training instructions and because 300 $ for the level one method is expensive.

 

I want to hear from someone who actually paid the 300 tell me it is a scam.

 

Honestely I wanted to pay the money but what kept me from it was the book itself the author writing that it would take many years to build a foundation and most don't even have enough chi to get to lvl 4 all put me off. That is not what a scammer normally does....

 

Josama your last paragraph proves that is a "scam" because except John Chang no one can teach you level 4

It has nothing to do with the how strong is your chi but if you have tha ability to move further.

The new leader of the system was level 3 twelve years ago and he is still level 3.

Do you think that a level 3 Chinese that speeks only Chinese will teach any Lin how to become level 4 (Lin is still level 2),and then this person will teach it to you....?

Edited July 14, 2012 by Chen

[mjjbecker]

Great post Mr Becker - thankyou

My pleasure.

[Veritas]

Certainly.

 

As far as I know every authentic method has sitting meditation as part of the training. 'Stilling' the mind is the key though. It is mentioned in 'The Magus of Java' where Pak John states that it is when the mind is stilled (I don't recall the exact words) that the qi fills the dantien.

 

Will only sitting meditation put qi into the dantien? No. In 2002, when Pak John visited Athens, he tested a woman who had 75% filled her dantien. Her main practice was taijiquan and to my knowledge she did not practice sitting meditation.

 

Achieving this stilling of the mind is a fundamental part of Hu Yao Zhen's neigong that he passed down. I understand sitting meditation was part of his training, but in regards to neigong, standing practice is a fundamental part. Joseph Chen gives an interesting anecdote from when he trained one time in the park with the late Grandmaster Feng Zhiqiang, the most well known inheritor of Hu's teachings. They all did standing practice and most of them stopped after half an hour. Then they had lunch. After two hours, only Feng was still practicing and the students decided to stop him so they could leave. On doing so, Feng expressed his surprise that two hours had passed*. And there is a fundamental point: Getting to that state where you don't notice time passing.

 

Grandmaster Feng was a man of remarkable ability, and when I met him clearly a man who was at peace with himself and the world. If a person can achieve that level of peace within themselves, then I think they have achieved something truly great from their practice. Feng had remarkable power, but power with misery is pointless.

 

You have the moving methods that are taught in various schools that are trained alongside sitting meditation. Can they still the mind and can a person gather qi through them? Yes. We know that from the woman who practiced taijiquan. I myself have achieved a stilling of the mind and 'connected oneness' (words can't come close to the explaining the experience) by practing part of the taijiquan form I mentioned above, but also, significantly, from practicing the 18 step taiji qigong method years ago. Not a so-called neigong method, but for me one of the most profound training experiences of my life was gained while doing this. And it can be learned for free off the internet.

 

Circulating the qi while gathering it is essential. It helps to prevent problems developing. Just sitting is a really bad idea, that can lead to stagnation and the problems that go with that. The body is not just a single energy center and attention must be given to the whole.

 

So, what we have on a fundamental level are the stilling of the mind and the gathering, and storing, of the qi into the body. One can do the sitting level one meditation of the Mo Pai and allow the qi to enter the body. One can also practice qi gathering exercises and combine them with stilling the mind. The latter approach, in my experience, is far more effective.

 

Do you have to be sitting on the ground to gather yin qi as well as yang qi? No. The Hunyuan neigong has very specific standing practices for gathering in yin qi through the Huiyin. I think you know the significance of that.

 

Why do I recommend what Michael Lomax does? Because I have not felt the magnitude of qi being gathered to such a level by any other practice I have experienced. I've been in a room where John Chang put out a qi field and I've been in a room where Michael Lomax has done so. Both times the feeling was tangible. Not vague at all. When someone is that good, and is teaching what they know, and their students are making clear, fast progress, you take the opportunity to learn from them. Gift of the Tao neigong gathers, shifts and pulls in qi like nothing else I have experienced.

 

In summation, I think stilling the mind is fundamental when it comes to gathering and storing qi. Sitting meditation is a part of the whole practice, and gathering qi is also a part of the whole practice. Circulating that qi, and understanding the process effects the whole, and not just a single point, is fundamental. Only sitting and only focusing on one point will very likely lead to stagnation, which is going to cause a person possibly serious problems.

 

My thoughts, FWIW.

 

*One time Feng was challenged by a qigong practitioner to see who could do seated meditation the longest. The qigong practitioner conceded after two or three days (I can't remember which) and had to be carried away by his students as he couldn't walk afterwards. Feng went off and practiced with his iron staff, as if nothing had happened.

 

Great post! I totally agree with you and I definitely think that stilling the mind is very important in gathering and storing qi but the problem for me is that it's sooo hard to accomplish. Do you have any tips to still the mind when I'm meditating and focusing on the dantien?

[r.w.smith]

Why don't you just pay 300 bucks and learn it from one of the *cough* "official" *cough* teachers?

 

Otherweise your mumblings don't make much sense and I have the feeling you had problems to grasp the meaning of what you quoted. I.e. Mo pai *is* a dead END. Not "the lineage is dead". Even if you would make it to level 2 or find someone to teach you level 3. You would need to do this in time when you finish the level before. As far as I am aware of there are NO fixed signs by which you can determine yourself when you finished a level. Only a person with much more cultivation than yourself can "see" into yout body and tell where you stand. Aside of that I am not aware of any person in the lineage of John Chang who would be anywhere near his level. Something to think about.

I prefer to follow other more or less healthier lineages these days (also because I got actually INITIATED into them). From what is commonly called "energetic work" (another WRONG labeling), KUJI-IN - and the practices where this actually CAME FROM- are very good too. But one will be TESTED and the bad apples will meet a bad end. And subsequencely stop the practice.

 

End of my RANT for now.

Edited July 15, 2012 by r.w.smith

[mjjbecker]

Great post! I totally agree with you and I definitely think that stilling the mind is very important in gathering and storing qi but the problem for me is that it's sooo hard to accomplish. Do you have any tips to still the mind when I'm meditating and focusing on the dantien?

 

I'm not a meditation 'master', not close, and it is something I continue to work at.

 

Find a good method and work on it. By work I'm talking thousands of hours of practice over a period of years. With all the information available it is too easy to flit between different methods. Effort equals return. It isn't about chasing the 'ultimate' system, but about that feeling, as Michael Lomax says, 'of coming home'. Despite any hardship, you know it is the right place to be. This is an individual discovery and I can't tell you what method is right for you-you have to find that yourself.

 

Nothing is easy I'm afraid. Practice. Put in the hours, particularly in single sessions if you can. As I already mentioned, 'stillness' can be achieved with moving practice, so work on that as well. Doing both will help each other. That was the advice Michael Lomax gave me when I asked him.

 

Some music might help. I've resisted using the various sound recordings for meditation that can be found, that claim to be engineered to create certain brainwave patterns. I might be wrong but I feel the 'state' has to be reached in a 'natural' manner.

 

Let go of any and all expectations of what may, might or should happen. This is where the prolonged practice sessions are particularly helpful.

 

Just some thoughts.

[JohnC]

Certainly.

 

As far as I know every authentic method has sitting meditation as part of the training. 'Stilling' the mind is the key though. It is mentioned in 'The Magus of Java' where Pak John states that it is when the mind is stilled (I don't recall the exact words) that the qi fills the dantien.

 

Will only sitting meditation put qi into the dantien? No. In 2002, when Pak John visited Athens, he tested a woman who had 75% filled her dantien. Her main practice was taijiquan and to my knowledge she did not practice sitting meditation.

 

Achieving this stilling of the mind is a fundamental part of Hu Yao Zhen's neigong that he passed down. I understand sitting meditation was part of his training, but in regards to neigong, standing practice is a fundamental part. Joseph Chen gives an interesting anecdote from when he trained one time in the park with the late Grandmaster Feng Zhiqiang, the most well known inheritor of Hu's teachings. They all did standing practice and most of them stopped after half an hour. Then they had lunch. After two hours, only Feng was still practicing and the students decided to stop him so they could leave. On doing so, Feng expressed his surprise that two hours had passed*. And there is a fundamental point: Getting to that state where you don't notice time passing.

 

Grandmaster Feng was a man of remarkable ability, and when I met him clearly a man who was at peace with himself and the world. If a person can achieve that level of peace within themselves, then I think they have achieved something truly great from their practice. Feng had remarkable power, but power with misery is pointless.

 

You have the moving methods that are taught in various schools that are trained alongside sitting meditation. Can they still the mind and can a person gather qi through them? Yes. We know that from the woman who practiced taijiquan. I myself have achieved a stilling of the mind and 'connected oneness' (words can't come close to the explaining the experience) by practing part of the taijiquan form I mentioned above, but also, significantly, from practicing the 18 step taiji qigong method years ago. Not a so-called neigong method, but for me one of the most profound training experiences of my life was gained while doing this. And it can be learned for free off the internet.

 

Circulating the qi while gathering it is essential. It helps to prevent problems developing. Just sitting is a really bad idea, that can lead to stagnation and the problems that go with that. The body is not just a single energy center and attention must be given to the whole.

 

So, what we have on a fundamental level are the stilling of the mind and the gathering, and storing, of the qi into the body. One can do the sitting level one meditation of the Mo Pai and allow the qi to enter the body. One can also practice qi gathering exercises and combine them with stilling the mind. The latter approach, in my experience, is far more effective.

 

Do you have to be sitting on the ground to gather yin qi as well as yang qi? No. The Hunyuan neigong has very specific standing practices for gathering in yin qi through the Huiyin. I think you know the significance of that.

 

Why do I recommend what Michael Lomax does? Because I have not felt the magnitude of qi being gathered to such a level by any other practice I have experienced. I've been in a room where John Chang put out a qi field and I've been in a room where Michael Lomax has done so. Both times the feeling was tangible. Not vague at all. When someone is that good, and is teaching what they know, and their students are making clear, fast progress, you take the opportunity to learn from them. Gift of the Tao neigong gathers, shifts and pulls in qi like nothing else I have experienced.

 

In summation, I think stilling the mind is fundamental when it comes to gathering and storing qi. Sitting meditation is a part of the whole practice, and gathering qi is also a part of the whole practice. Circulating that qi, and understanding the process effects the whole, and not just a single point, is fundamental. Only sitting and only focusing on one point will very likely lead to stagnation, which is going to cause a person possibly serious problems.

 

My thoughts, FWIW.

 

*One time Feng was challenged by a qigong practitioner to see who could do seated meditation the longest. The qigong practitioner conceded after two or three days (I can't remember which) and had to be carried away by his students as he couldn't walk afterwards. Feng went off and practiced with his iron staff, as if nothing had happened.

Bump and great post.

[Cat Pillar]

I'm not a meditation 'master', not close, and it is something I continue to work at.

 

Find a good method and work on it. By work I'm talking thousands of hours of practice over a period of years. With all the information available it is too easy to flit between different methods. Effort equals return. It isn't about chasing the 'ultimate' system, but about that feeling, as Michael Lomax says, 'of coming home'. Despite any hardship, you know it is the right place to be. This is an individual discovery and I can't tell you what method is right for you-you have to find that yourself.

 

Nothing is easy I'm afraid. Practice. Put in the hours, particularly in single sessions if you can. As I already mentioned, 'stillness' can be achieved with moving practice, so work on that as well. Doing both will help each other. That was the advice Michael Lomax gave me when I asked him.

 

Some music might help. I've resisted using the various sound recordings for meditation that can be found, that claim to be engineered to create certain brainwave patterns. I might be wrong but I feel the 'state' has to be reached in a 'natural' manner.

 

Let go of any and all expectations of what may, might or should happen. This is where the prolonged practice sessions are particularly helpful.

 

Just some thoughts.

 

So, just a note on brainwave entrainment. I can understand your misgivings about using them, since I had the same, but I think I've gained a lot of benefit from utilizing various brainwave entrainment programs.

 

They don't work very well on me, but well enough to where I learned to recognize what an alpha state feels like. It's how I knew that doing Kunlun puts me into an alpha brainwave state.

 

In my opinion, they're useful if approached like training wheels. They get you used to the various brainwave states, but because of their nature are limited in where they can take you. Using a more traditional meditative practice without entrainment provides the freedom to go wherever you need to go without getting locked in to a certain range or state.

 

I don't use them much anymore except if I'm having problems relaxing or sleeping.

[Green Tiger]

Certainly.

 

As far as I know every authentic method has sitting meditation as part of the training. 'Stilling' the mind is the key though. It is mentioned in 'The Magus of Java' where Pak John states that it is when the mind is stilled (I don't recall the exact words) that the qi fills the dantien.

 

Will only sitting meditation put qi into the dantien? No. In 2002, when Pak John visited Athens, he tested a woman who had 75% filled her dantien. Her main practice was taijiquan and to my knowledge she did not practice sitting meditation.

 

Achieving this stilling of the mind is a fundamental part of Hu Yao Zhen's neigong that he passed down. I understand sitting meditation was part of his training, but in regards to neigong, standing practice is a fundamental part. Joseph Chen gives an interesting anecdote from when he trained one time in the park with the late Grandmaster Feng Zhiqiang, the most well known inheritor of Hu's teachings. They all did standing practice and most of them stopped after half an hour. Then they had lunch. After two hours, only Feng was still practicing and the students decided to stop him so they could leave. On doing so, Feng expressed his surprise that two hours had passed*. And there is a fundamental point: Getting to that state where you don't notice time passing.

 

Grandmaster Feng was a man of remarkable ability, and when I met him clearly a man who was at peace with himself and the world. If a person can achieve that level of peace within themselves, then I think they have achieved something truly great from their practice. Feng had remarkable power, but power with misery is pointless.

 

You have the moving methods that are taught in various schools that are trained alongside sitting meditation. Can they still the mind and can a person gather qi through them? Yes. We know that from the woman who practiced taijiquan. I myself have achieved a stilling of the mind and 'connected oneness' (words can't come close to the explaining the experience) by practing part of the taijiquan form I mentioned above, but also, significantly, from practicing the 18 step taiji qigong method years ago. Not a so-called neigong method, but for me one of the most profound training experiences of my life was gained while doing this. And it can be learned for free off the internet.

 

Circulating the qi while gathering it is essential. It helps to prevent problems developing. Just sitting is a really bad idea, that can lead to stagnation and the problems that go with that. The body is not just a single energy center and attention must be given to the whole.

 

So, what we have on a fundamental level are the stilling of the mind and the gathering, and storing, of the qi into the body. One can do the sitting level one meditation of the Mo Pai and allow the qi to enter the body. One can also practice qi gathering exercises and combine them with stilling the mind. The latter approach, in my experience, is far more effective.

 

Do you have to be sitting on the ground to gather yin qi as well as yang qi? No. The Hunyuan neigong has very specific standing practices for gathering in yin qi through the Huiyin. I think you know the significance of that.

 

Why do I recommend what Michael Lomax does? Because I have not felt the magnitude of qi being gathered to such a level by any other practice I have experienced. I've been in a room where John Chang put out a qi field and I've been in a room where Michael Lomax has done so. Both times the feeling was tangible. Not vague at all. When someone is that good, and is teaching what they know, and their students are making clear, fast progress, you take the opportunity to learn from them. Gift of the Tao neigong gathers, shifts and pulls in qi like nothing else I have experienced.

 

In summation, I think stilling the mind is fundamental when it comes to gathering and storing qi. Sitting meditation is a part of the whole practice, and gathering qi is also a part of the whole practice. Circulating that qi, and understanding the process effects the whole, and not just a single point, is fundamental. Only sitting and only focusing on one point will very likely lead to stagnation, which is going to cause a person possibly serious problems.

 

My thoughts, FWIW.

 

*One time Feng was challenged by a qigong practitioner to see who could do seated meditation the longest. The qigong practitioner conceded after two or three days (I can't remember which) and had to be carried away by his students as he couldn't walk afterwards. Feng went off and practiced with his iron staff, as if nothing had happened.

 

Nog.

 

Very special that someone here can compare Gift of the Tao and Mo Pai. Makes me proud to be a Bum.

 

I would also like to add that Jerry Alan Johnson has said (special feature on his Chi Kung Healing Workout DVD) that his instructor told him moving meditation is 1000 times more powerful than stillness meditation, but most people don't practice moving meditation with correct posture, so don't get the full benefit.

[GeoBall]

"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."

 

I have a problem with how secretive Daoist teachers are, and the ones that try their best to be completely honest; have a difficult time explaining everything, usually because they just cant.

 

I think sharing training, teachings, and tools is a good thing as long as the sharer shares them correctly. Meaning it wouldn't work if they were too humble, or too egotistical.

 

If I had "Daoist immortal" secrets I would share them with everyone. Which btw I do share all the "secrets" I currently have with everyone.

 

To be utterly honest, I think the teachers that have "special powers" should be at the front line. Debating with scientists, improving our race as a whole. Because keeping secrets is only making it harder on everyone else that isn't immortal and has secret teachings. Kinda selfish if you ask me.

 

I am a musician, but everything I've ever come up with has already been created. It was a pattern in a song previous to the song I came up with. And natural sounds and songs were there way before music was even invented. So the music I make is technically not my music. It's just music, and I share it with everyone for free. If only everyone had a similar concept of knowledge and truth.

Edited July 24, 2012 by GeoBall

[Leif]

If I had "Daoist immortal" secrets I would share them with everyone. Which btw I do share all the "secrets" I currently have with everyone.

 

You almost sound like you accept their powers except their wisdom, thinking that your wisdom (including with whom/how to share the knowledge) is higher than theirs.

[templetao]

"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."

 

I have a problem with how secretive Daoist teachers are, and the ones that try their best to be completely honest; have a difficult time explaining everything, usually because they just cant.

 

I think sharing training, teachings, and tools is a good thing as long as the sharer shares them correctly. Meaning it wouldn't work if they were too humble, or too egotistical.

 

If I had "Daoist immortal" secrets I would share them with everyone. Which btw I do share all the "secrets" I currently have with everyone.

 

To be utterly honest, I think the teachers that have "special powers" should be at the front line. Debating with scientists, improving our race as a whole. Because keeping secrets is only making it harder on everyone else that isn't immortal and has secret teachings. Kinda selfish if you ask me.

 

I am a musician, but everything I've ever come up with has already been created. It was a pattern in a song previous to the song I came up with. And natural sounds and songs were there way before music was even invented. So the music I make is technically not my music. It's just music, and I share it with everyone for free. If only everyone had a similar concept of knowledge and truth.

 

 

Being a master or in a position of power isnt that easy every decision you make has many different ramifications.

 

To simply give away all of the secrets to taoist immortality is reckless for this reason. If it someones unbelievable good karma to have all of the secrets of taoist immortaltiy handed to them for free and that person does reckonize that gift for what it is. Then this will waste that manifestation of that good karma and a master can see this and doesnt want to ruin things for you by giving you something that your not ready for when your karma could have manifested in getting your dream job or meeting your future wife.

 

The gift is of taoist immortality is not just the good karma of this life but of many and it may not come back around again for a very long time.

[Sifu ReL]

lmao...i take back everything ive ever said on here....

 

 

THANKS TO

 

-THE TAO BUMS

-MANY FORUMS & BLOGS

-THE WORLD WIDE WEB

- and 5 other people who i met through email

 

 

i now have the manual/exercises/technique for levels 2-4 MO PAI .

and to all you who claim that its so secret....its really not, it only took my 5months of research... yall should spend more time meditating and less time telling people to stop looking for info.

but i thank yall the most because if it wasnt for yall telling me i "cant" i prolly wouldnt of tryed so hard.

 

and as to if shifu lin is a scam....he's really not. he does charge $300, which you can pay in incraments of $100 a month. as to if he was trained by john or in indonesia, i have no idea....but he does have the mo pai manual, which again is not hard to find...well actually it is for the average person

 

anyways, to all you downers and negative influeces of mopai neigung. i am laughing at you because i have what you dont have...well some of you dont have, cuz there is a hand full of bums who know mo pai but dont post it....

thanks again for reading.

 

p.s. im also laughing at my self because i use big words but cant spell them

[Sifu ReL]

Why don't you just pay 300 bucks and learn it from one of the *cough* "official" *cough* teachers?

 

Otherweise your mumblings don't make much sense and I have the feeling you had problems to grasp the meaning of what you quoted. I.e. Mo pai *is* a dead END. Not "the lineage is dead". Even if you would make it to level 2 or find someone to teach you level 3. You would need to do this in time when you finish the level before. As far as I am aware of there are NO fixed signs by which you can determine yourself when you finished a level. Only a person with much more cultivation than yourself can "see" into yout body and tell where you stand. Aside of that I am not aware of any person in the lineage of John Chang who would be anywhere near his level. Something to think about.

I prefer to follow other more or less healthier lineages these days (also because I got actually INITIATED into them). From what is commonly called "energetic work" (another WRONG labeling), KUJI-IN - and the practices where this actually CAME FROM- are very good too. But one will be TESTED and the bad apples will meet a bad end. And subsequencely stop the practice.

 

End of my RANT for now.

 

lmao sorry it took me so long to respond...i was meditating.

1st my "mumblings" were design to get a responce from people like you.

2nd for someone who doesnt study mo pai , you sure dont know squat.

3rd being the fact that im not a beginner in Inner cultivation, I CAN SEE IN MY BODY...its like your tryna say others know better what goin on in my body then i can ever tell, thats rubbish...tell that to the guy who first mastered mo pai that ... and there are LOTS OF FIXED signs like the freakin BALL in my dantien i keep moving around.

4th you dont kno john so "DUH" your not aware of anyone in his lineage who is near his level...are you speaking with the new head master daily? NO ! so for all you know he could of REACH level 9 yesterday.. something to think about. stick with the "lineage you were INITIATED INTO". and i study Kuji-in & Kuji-Kiri ,so miss me with the rant. ONLY THE CREATOR CAN TEST< FOR HE JUDGES ALL.

THERES NO EVIDENCE THAT MO PAI IS A DEAD END. TELL THAT TO SOME ONE WITH LESS CULTIVATION HAHA

 

(OMG NOT CAPS AGAIN)

[Thunder_Gooch]

lmao...i take back everything ive ever said on here....

 

 

THANKS TO

 

-THE TAO BUMS

-MANY FORUMS & BLOGS

-THE WORLD WIDE WEB

- and 5 other people who i met through email

 

 

i now have the manual/exercises/technique for levels 2-4 MO PAI .

and to all you who claim that its so secret....its really not, it only took my 5months of research... yall should spend more time meditating and less time telling people to stop looking for info.

but i thank yall the most because if it wasnt for yall telling me i "cant" i prolly wouldnt of tryed so hard.

 

and as to if shifu lin is a scam....he's really not. he does charge $300, which you can pay in incraments of $100 a month. as to if he was trained by john or in indonesia, i have no idea....but he does have the mo pai manual, which again is not hard to find...well actually it is for the average person

 

anyways, to all you downers and negative influeces of mopai neigung. i am laughing at you because i have what you dont have...well some of you dont have, cuz there is a hand full of bums who know mo pai but dont post it....

thanks again for reading.

 

p.s. im also laughing at my self because i use big words but cant spell them

 

So you met a guy who claims to be a student which no one has ever verified as true, this person claims to have the mo pai manual, and sells it at $300 per level. He also sells ebooks on amazon, with all positive reviews from fake accounts.

 

We have a known scammer with the exact SAME MO, doing the exact same thing selling ebooks, and claiming to have the mo pai manual.

 

It would make a lot more sense to me to seek out established students like Jim, Andreas, and Kostas, before giving your money to some unknown individual who sells ebooks on amazon which no one has ever met in real life, and no one can verify if he is actually a student or not.

 

Caveat emptor.

 

Best of luck with your endeavors, I think you'll wind up with the most appropriate teacher your Karma will allow for.

Edited July 24, 2012 by More_Pie_Guy

[Sifu ReL]

So you met a guy who claims to be a student which no one has ever verified as true, this person claims to have the mo pai manual, and sells it at $300 per level. He also sells ebooks on amazon.

 

We have a known scammer with the exact SAME MO, doing the exact same thing selling ebooks, and claiming to have the mo pai manual.

 

It would make a lot more sense to me to seek out established students like Jim, Andreas, and Kostas, before giving your money to some unknown individual who sells ebooks on amazon which no one has ever met in real life, and no one can verify if he is actually a student or not.

 

Caveat emptor.

 

Best of luck with your endeavors, I think you'll wind up with the most appropriate teacher your Karma will allow for.

 

he doesnt sell it for $300 a level...just $300 period as a honouraium , (forgot how to spell it)

and it would make more sense to seek out one of them....i only recieve alittle info from him (SHIFU LIN). which does confirm he does have info on MO PAI. i have his Paypal email, that i will pm you shortly,... but i spoke with others who knew MO PAI INFO and he confirm some of it, now as to if he was just agreeing idk but he did have input,

really i dont know how to say this.

its like it is a scam because the info he has isnt worth $300. but its not cuz he does have "SOME INFO" but not ALL, prolly has just as much info as me. and id never charge 300 thats a rip...he calls it a donation. i have also spoke with a couple people who say they paid him and he given them info....but like i said never spoke with SHIFU LIN on phone. just email, so he could be all one in the same.... weird. but i dont need to worry about it cuz i no longer need to pay him cuz i have everything he knows....or everything i think he knows...he's very mysterious. i got bills to pay so i can buy his knowledge, special if he gonna tell me stuff i already kno.

and yeah he does sell hella book on amazon and other sites....ALL SAYING THE SAME SHIT...BUT THE BOOKS HAVE HELLA DIFFERENT NAMES, ALL BY SHIFU LIN.... THE GUY IS WEIRD IN THAT HE SAYS ITS FOR DONATION BUT HE WANTING AND GETTING ALL THAT MONEY. BUT I STILL CANT DOUBBT HIM CUZ HE DOES HAVE INFO.

so scam or not...up to the indivisual opionion but I WOULDNT BUY nothing from em.

[Thunder_Gooch]

I don't care what you call it.

 

You shouldn't give your money to a guy who no one has ever met (except maybe the guy who promotes him).

 

What's to say this Shifu Lin fellow wasn't a student of other students and gained his information from them, only to turn around and sell the practice under some new name?

 

Wouldn't it make more sense to actually talk to verified students like Jim/Andreas/Kosta etc, than to give your money to some unknown individual?

 

Also we have a known scammer who changes identities like underwear, his MO is selling ebooks, he claims to have a copy of the mo pai manual and scams people left and right, and has milked this community and others for thousands of dollars.

 

If you'll look on amazon, you'll see all the good reviews come from accounts with unverified names, and they only review his items.... hmmm.. weird coincidence don't you think?

 

I think a wiser choice would be to speak with verified students first, then go meet this Lin fellow in person when you are more developed and test him out in person.

 

My friend you should be very weary of the spiritual community, almost everything in it is a fraud or a false teaching from people who only want to make a buck.

 

There are so many false teachings, and so many fraudulent teachers, it's amazing anyone can ever find anything legitimate to practice.

 

 

Caveat emptor

 

 

 

he doesnt sell it for $300 a level...just $300 period as a honouraium , (forgot how to spell it)

and it would make more sense to seek out one of them....i only recieve alittle info from him (SHIFU LIN). which does confirm he does have info on MO PAI. i have his Paypal email, that i will pm you shortly,... but i spoke with others who knew MO PAI INFO and he confirm some of it, now as to if he was just agreeing idk but he did have input,

really i dont know how to say this.

its like it is a scam because the info he has isnt worth $300. but its not cuz he does have "SOME INFO" but not ALL, prolly has just as much info as me. and id never charge 300 thats a rip...he calls it a donation. i have also spoke with a couple people who say they paid him and he given them info....but like i said never spoke with SHIFU LIN on phone. just email, so he could be all one in the same.... weird. but i dont need to worry about it cuz i no longer need to pay him cuz i have everything he knows....or everything i think he knows...he's very mysterious. i got bills to pay so i can buy his knowledge, special if he gonna tell me stuff i already kno.

and yeah he does sell hella book on amazon and other sites....ALL SAYING THE SAME SHIT...BUT THE BOOKS HAVE HELLA DIFFERENT NAMES, ALL BY SHIFU LIN.... THE GUY IS WEIRD IN THAT HE SAYS ITS FOR DONATION BUT HE WANTING AND GETTING ALL THAT MONEY. BUT I STILL CANT DOUBBT HIM CUZ HE DOES HAVE INFO.

so scam or not...up to the indivisual opionion but I WOULDNT BUY nothing from em.

Edited July 24, 2012 by More_Pie_Guy