THE EIGHTH CHAKRA

[Sifu ReL]

just wanted to get all the info on the 8th chakra...im starting to study 8-15, i hope to get to the 11th chakra flowing and open soon.

 

i looked around on the Net and didnt find anything very useful well atleast not with ppls reviews and opionions... i like to know what everyone thinks since i never take one person to be right above everyone else...but yeah if you have any real info on chakra's 8-15 please do tell share your insight...

 

thankyou

[Protector]

OK, here's one, it doesn't exist

[Sifu ReL]

OK, here's one, it doesn't exist

 

wow... nice reply. but ill take my chances.

[Sifu ReL]

OK, here's one, it doesn't exist

 

also the 8th enables people to Atral travel via OBE....so just dont comment no more, your fired.

[Jeff]

The 8th chakra is above the crown and has a direct connect to the "second chamber of the heart". It usually opens after the crown is fully open.

 

[Birch]

You'd be referring to a principal point (of potential consciouness, as in 'that which one is conscious of) which happens to be outside of one's physical body. I've read that the 'eighth' chakra is above one's head. I wonder. I also read that there are loads of 'chakras' all over the body. Except I've seen them described as 'nadis' if they are 'lesser' points and they kind of remind me of acupuncture points and the chakras remind me of 'dantiens'. And so it goes with each systematic mapping of the terrain. The only time I've felt and seen my chakras was under guided meditation, not any other kind. In 'emptiness' meditations I've had a sense of the chakras flowing into me and really being the 'stuff' driving me despite myself. But hey, I personally prefer the idea of the yi-chi-blood relationship.

[konchog uma]

Jeff,

 

in my experience, the chakras don't need to "open" or "awaken" or whatever you want to call it in any particular order. My girlfriend for example has awesome crown experiences, and the top of her head tingles in meditation and she can access that divine consciousness pretty easily, but her third chakra (manipura at the navel) is something she still has yet to release all the blocks from. Its really a struggle for her. People can be all over the place with their awakening, and the stages that it happens in don't need to be linear. Just something to consider.

 

ReL,

 

there are a lot of different chakra systems, which doesn't mean that some are right and some are wrong, i think they all work, but maybe you could clarify which is the 8th youre talking about?

 

the system i use places the chakra above sahasrara about 2 feet above the head and associates it with white light. It is the center of cosmic consciousness, where the sahasrara is ones own personal god(dess) consciousness, the 8th is impersonal, more cosmic than individual. It is said to be a shared chakra, where human consciousness can tap into and embrace the wisdom of the universe.

 

I think its like an elaboration or development of sahasrara personally. They are so closely related that its like as you get deeper into sahasrara, you just get deeper into the universe, til you get get to the om point of pure vibration in the void, and then the void itself. There isn't really dimensionality when you approach that level of consciousness, so 2 ft, 3 ft, its all silly. Its also silly to think of those levels of god consciousness as being somehow "deeper" or more centrally located in the core of sahasrara. They are up there, and it works to visualize them as being 2 ft, 3 ft, the center of emptiness and void at 4 ft, but those centers are actually beyond mind, they just appear there because they have to interact with the individual mind somehow. Its hard to explain. Once you get past 7, there can't be a really clear map, there are only concepts that are helpful, in the same way that all the different cultures who worked with chakras had their own models, and different as they might be, they all worked to give those people results. And it might have nothing to do with what you are talking about with your 8-15 model. But good luck either way. The important thing is to get out of individual consciousness and relate to the universe.

 

Shivoham

[Sifu ReL]

Jeff,

 

in my experience, the chakras don't need to "open" or "awaken" or whatever you want to call it in any particular order. My girlfriend for example has awesome crown experiences, and the top of her head tingles in meditation and she can access that divine consciousness pretty easily, but her third chakra (manipura at the navel) is something she still has yet to release all the blocks from. Its really a struggle for her. People can be all over the place with their awakening, and the stages that it happens in don't need to be linear. Just something to consider.

 

ReL,

 

there are a lot of different chakra systems, which doesn't mean that some are right and some are wrong, i think they all work, but maybe you could clarify which is the 8th youre talking about?

 

the system i use places the chakra above sahasrara about 2 feet above the head and associates it with white light. It is the center of cosmic consciousness, where the sahasrara is ones own personal god(dess) consciousness, the 8th is impersonal, more cosmic than individual. It is said to be a shared chakra, where human consciousness can tap into and embrace the wisdom of the universe.

 

I think its like an elaboration or development of sahasrara personally. They are so closely related that its like as you get deeper into sahasrara, you just get deeper into the universe, til you get get to the om point of pure vibration in the void, and then the void itself. There isn't really dimensionality when you approach that level of consciousness, so 2 ft, 3 ft, its all silly. Its also silly to think of those levels of god consciousness as being somehow "deeper" or more centrally located in the core of sahasrara. They are up there, and it works to visualize them as being 2 ft, 3 ft, the center of emptiness and void at 4 ft, but those centers are actually beyond mind, they just appear there because they have to interact with the individual mind somehow. Its hard to explain. Once you get past 7, there can't be a really clear map, there are only concepts that are helpful, in the same way that all the different cultures who worked with chakras had their own models, and different as they might be, they all worked to give those people results. And it might have nothing to do with what you are talking about with your 8-15 model. But good luck either way. The important thing is to get out of individual consciousness and relate to the universe.

 

Shivoham

 

 

well i just wanted to hear other opionion, as to where they are above my head or in my body make no difference...after my 7th chakra open it turnt more into a level system of knowledge and spiritual awakening then the worldly/physical attachments of energy flowing through the body.

i read something over the internet that said Jesus opened 12 chakras. allowed his abilitys...so im sure Muhammad opened 12 chakras too. moses prolly 10-12 chakras... bruce lee prolly 9-10chakras .......it also said that that to open the 8th your energy has to be spining in the chakra at 10,000 spokes, and the 7th chakra spines at 960 spokes....so you can see imagine the level it takes to get from 7-8...but after you open 8th the rest are said to open fast or you gain faster.....also its said at 10th chakra you damn near perfect, at like being at the right place at the right time and merging your masculine and feminine energys within.

[Jeff]

Jeff,

 

in my experience, the chakras don't need to "open" or "awaken" or whatever you want to call it in any particular order. My girlfriend for example has awesome crown experiences, and the top of her head tingles in meditation and she can access that divine consciousness pretty easily, but her third chakra (manipura at the navel) is something she still has yet to release all the blocks from. Its really a struggle for her. People can be all over the place with their awakening, and the stages that it happens in don't need to be linear. Just something to consider.

 

....

 

Shivoham

 

I agree that the chakras can open in any order. But, in the context Sifu Rel is describing, it is really more of an integration point or completion of the body chakras. The seven main body chakras "merge" back into the heart (often called the second chamber) and then the eighth opens. It is really "different than astral travel" and the beginning of "oneness" at a human level.

 

[konchog uma]

I agree that the chakras can open in any order. But, in the context Sifu Rel is describing, it is really more of an integration point or completion of the body chakras. The seven main body chakras "merge" back into the heart (often called the second chamber) and then the eighth opens. It is really "different than astral travel" and the beginning of "oneness" at a human level.

 

 

can you say a little more about the 7 centers merging into the heart? Is that yogic, or from a different culture?

 

thanks

 

[Jeff]

can you say a little more about the 7 centers merging into the heart? Is that yogic, or from a different culture?

 

thanks

 

 

Yes, it is yogic in terminology, but each path has the same "thing". In Christianity, it is described as the "Holy Spirit" bringing you to the soul. Tibetan Buddhism describes it as after the "tummo" completes it job, it goes back and settles in the heart. Milropa describes it as the beginning of the "completion stage".

 

Also, to Sifu Rel's original question, no one who has actually opened the 8th chakra would describe what they are doing as astral travel. But, to the person being "connected to" by the master, it would feel like they were "visited" or the presence appeared.

 

Was there something specific that you wanted to know about it?

 

[Cueball]

I'd definitely like to hear more about it - either from personal experience or from other sources.

 

I've also been working along similarish lines, and, anamatva - what you said definitely makes sense according to what I understand. But I've never got much in the way of ancillary information, so would love to hear more, specific or non-specific, it's all good.

 

Thanks!

[Disabled Not Broken]

I've read that the 'eighth' chakra is above one's head. I wonder. I also read that there are loads of 'chakras' all over the body. Except I've seen them described as 'nadis' if they are 'lesser' points and they kind of remind me of acupuncture points and the chakras remind me of 'dantiens'. And so it goes with each systematic mapping of the terrain.

100% agree

[Tibetan_Ice]

just wanted to get all the info on the 8th chakra...im starting to study 8-15, i hope to get to the 11th chakra flowing and open soon.

 

i looked around on the Net and didnt find anything very useful well atleast not with ppls reviews and opionions... i like to know what everyone thinks since i never take one person to be right above everyone else...but yeah if you have any real info on chakra's 8-15 please do tell share your insight...

 

thankyou

 

Hi,

Here are some references to the chakras above the sarashara:

There is a diagram at this link too:

 

link: http://www.himalayanacademy.com/resources/books/mws/mws_resource-03.html

 

The most subtle of the chakras lie above and within the crown chakra at the top of the head. Buddhist literature cites thirty-two chakras above. Agamic Hindu tradition delineates seven levels of the rarified dimensions of paranada, the first tattva and the highest stratum of sound. They are: vyapini, vyomanga, ananta, anatha, anashrita, samana and unmana. The higher chakras have been experienced by a rare few as a conglomerate of nadis, spiritual nerve currents, which when stimulated and developed by many samadhi experiences, slowly descend into the mental and astral bodies, effecting a permanent transformation of the entire being.

 

Also, this about the Golden Body:

link: http://www.himalayanacademy.com/resources/books/mws/mws_ch-48.html

Sunday

LESSON 336

Birth of the Golden Body

 

The golden body, svarnasharira, is a body made of golden light. After many experiences of Parasiva, it gradually descends from the seven chakras above the sahasrara into the ajna chakra, which then becomes the soul's muladhara, then down into the vishuddha chakra, which then becomes its muladhara, and then down into the anahata, which then becomes its muladhara.

 

All seven chakras above the sahasrara slowly come down and down and down until the entire astral body is psychically seen, by mystics who have this sight, as a golden body. The astral body slowly, slowly, slowly dissolves into the golden body. That is what I have seen happen. That is what our parampara and our sampradaya know from experience. Experience is the only true knowing -- a knowing that can be verified in books, through others who have the same knowing, but a knowing that no others know who have not had the same experience. To them it is only a concept, a nice one maybe, but just a concept or written off as an opinion.

 

When the golden body fully enters the physical, having taken over the astral, the knowing that is known comes unbidden. It is beyond reason but does not conflict with it. It is a living scripture but does not conflict with those written by seers of the past who have seen and their records have become scripture. So great is the Sanatana Dharma that it defies all who doubt it, all who disdain it, all who disregard it, all who degrade it, with personal realization of its Truth.

 

This golden body, which begins to build into a golden body after the experience of nirvikalpa samadhi, is connected to the sahasrara chakra. In other words, the sahasrara chakra is the home base in the physical body for the golden body. There are twelve basic unfoldments to this chakra as the golden body grows. When the realized sannyasin travels in high states of contemplation, he moves freely in his golden body and can help and serve mankind. Over time, he gains a conscious control of the sahasrara chakra as a force center which propels him into inner space.

 

It is this golden body, as it refines and refines and refines itself within the Sivaloka after moksha, that finally merges with Siva like a cup of water being poured into the ocean. That same water can never be found and put back into the cup. This truly is svarnasharira vishvagrasa, the final, final, final merging with Siva.

 

TI

Edited July 15, 2012 by Tibetan_Ice

[Cueball]

That's an interesting site.

 

There's a lot of variation within the different systems from what I have come across - some seem to collapse all of the ones beyond into sahasrara; others have different 'placements'. Not that it matters a whole lot I guess. I've not come across the golden body before.

 

Thanks for the info tibetan ice.

 

Edited July 24, 2012 by Cueball

[kevincann]

The 'chakra system' functions in two different modes:

 

1) Normal mode. The so-called chakras (there is a lot of back story here) operate in

an erratic fashion, except during spiritual practices.

 

Also, contrary to a lot of misinformation out there, in 'normal mode' the chakras have

only limited access to the larger reality.

 

2) Transcendent mode. Transcendent mode occurs after both the gold AND the silver modes

of Kundalini rework the entire energy system and meet up in the so-called 'silent center

of Kundalini', also known as the One Cavity of the Mysterious Gate. After this happens,

all the chakras become 'open' to the larger world, are in harmony with each other, and

semen retention becomes effortless. And all of this.. that and a dollar fifty get you

a cup of coffee and a few other things. It's just a beginning.

 

This transcendent mode is at the first felt as 'all the chakras' coming together, and is

sometimes referred to as the opening of the 8th chakra.

 

Those other 'non-physical' chakras if you wish to use such terminology, are only accessible

after the process discussed above, and ultimately don't matter. They too work themselves out

in the wash.

 

Really, there is no point in going 'ga ga' over 'chakras', as we all know. The most important

things to know, the most important things to be, have nothing to do with 'chakras'.

 

And as a matter of fact, I'd say that lots of people experience all that 'under the hood stuff'

without even bothering to notice or document any of it. Noting will trap one in the mud faster,

than fretting about this kind of stuff. It all works itself out automatically as necessary.

 

Love,

 

Kev

[Mokona]

The 'chakra system' functions in two different modes:

 

1) Normal mode. The so-called chakras (there is a lot of back story here) operate in

an erratic fashion, except during spiritual practices.

 

Also, contrary to a lot of misinformation out there, in 'normal mode' the chakras have

only limited access to the larger reality.

 

2) Transcendent mode. Transcendent mode occurs after both the gold AND the silver modes

of Kundalini rework the entire energy system and meet up in the so-called 'silent center

of Kundalini', also known as the One Cavity of the Mysterious Gate. After this happens,

all the chakras become 'open' to the larger world, are in harmony with each other, and

semen retention becomes effortless. And all of this.. that and a dollar fifty get you

a cup of coffee and a few other things. It's just a beginning.

 

This transcendent mode is at the first felt as 'all the chakras' coming together, and is

sometimes referred to as the opening of the 8th chakra.

 

Those other 'non-physical' chakras if you wish to use such terminology, are only accessible

after the process discussed above, and ultimately don't matter. They too work themselves out

in the wash.

 

Really, there is no point in going 'ga ga' over 'chakras', as we all know. The most important

things to know, the most important things to be, have nothing to do with 'chakras'.

 

And as a matter of fact, I'd say that lots of people experience all that 'under the hood stuff'

without even bothering to notice or document any of it. Noting will trap one in the mud faster,

than fretting about this kind of stuff. It all works itself out automatically as necessary.

 

Love,

 

Kev

Shouldn't the disclaimer be that the above advice pertains more to a persons method of cultivation and/or goals? Psychological traits arise from the chakra points, and working with those states, and eventually with the energy centers themselves is worth develing into - at least if your goal is to work up from the chakras and learn more about oneself. Have you ever had a chakra balancing? Now that is an amazing sense of peace.

[kundakiss]

Shouldn't the disclaimer be that the above advice pertains more to a persons method of cultivation and/or goals? Psychological traits arise from the chakra points, and working with those states, and eventually with the energy centers themselves is worth develing into - at least if your goal is to work up from the chakras and learn more about oneself. Have you ever had a chakra balancing? Now that is an amazing sense of peace.

 

 

I partially agree with Kev. Focusing and delving into chakras is a search for trivial knowledge. I agree that it may give you some insight into who you are, but you have to be willing to let go of what you learned and pursue the universal truths. It is trivial because it is relative, and is described in so many variations throughout the systems that the search becomes never-ending. And unless personal experience can guide in discernment, all that would result is extra confusion. I advise people to stick to universal truths. Such as understanding of love, humility, law of attraction, cause and effect, etc. All the rest will work itself out if the universal principles are understood and followed. The whole point is to let go of external knowledge and live in wisdom. A too educated mind might find it harder to progress, ironically, due to constant personal projected opinions.

 

Also, as far as chakras go, It's not about having all of them open, but in which one your consciousness resides. You could have all of them open, and still function in a state of insecurity and confusion if your awareness is still in the "red" chakra. Awareness rising is directly proportional to level of insight from contemplation, and detachment. So focus on these, everything else falls into place.

 

People make spiritual progress out to be so complicated, yet it is actually all pretty straight forward and simple. An illiterate farmer can attain enlightenment just as well as anyone else. It's not about the books, but about insight into your own experience.

 

Have I ever had a chakra balancing? Nope. But I can get to that deep sense of peace you refer to. So does it matter if I know about chakras or not? :b The end result is the same.

 

Peace

 

Eugene

 

PS. But... paths differ tremendously sometimes among seekers. I may stand by the fact that universal principles apply to everyone, and they should be understood, however since the path is linear, certain steps have to be undertaken before attaining higher levels. If study of chakras serves this purpose for someone, then by all means =). Who am I to say it's trivial!

Edited July 27, 2012 by oodjee

[Tibetan_Ice]

Hi Kevin,

I find that your concepts are so full of misinformation and support of ignorance that I just have to say something.

You are probably a real nice guy and think you have your heart in the right place, wanting to help people and elucidate your acquisition of marginal knowledge, but I think you have some homework to do.

 

The 'chakra system' functions in two different modes:

 

1) Normal mode. The so-called chakras (there is a lot of back story here) operate in

an erratic fashion, except during spiritual practices.

 

 

The chakra system can function in many modes, depending on the level of understanding, ability and precision of the practioner. Someone whom has 24 hour mindfulness can maintain balanced chakras at will, and can balance chakras of those around them too by contact. People with poor mindfulness or incorrect spiritual practice will not have balanced chakras.

 

Also, contrary to a lot of misinformation out there, in 'normal mode' the chakras have

only limited access to the larger reality.

The chakras are connected to the sushumna, the central channel. Thus, each chakra has access to the larger reality. It does not matter if one is meditating or not, any chakra, if the circumstances are right can bring the person into a greater perception of reality, especially the heart chakra.

 

2) Transcendent mode. Transcendent mode occurs after both the gold AND the silver modes

of Kundalini rework the entire energy system and meet up in the so-called 'silent center

of Kundalini', also known as the One Cavity of the Mysterious Gate. After this happens,

all the chakras become 'open' to the larger world, are in harmony with each other, and

semen retention becomes effortless. And all of this.. that and a dollar fifty get you

a cup of coffee and a few other things. It's just a beginning.

Kundalini is not the end-all, be all. Kundalini is just an energetic phase that one goes through as the layers of consciousness are peeled back and fall away. Kundalini has no silent center for kundalini is a wind. It is energetic movement. Shakti. Shiva is stillness. The One Cavity has nothing to do with kundalini, although you can use kundalini energy to open the gate. But you can use other energy too to open the gate. You have mixed too many words and terms from different teachings to make sense here.

 

This transcendent mode is at the first felt as 'all the chakras' coming together, and is

sometimes referred to as the opening of the 8th chakra.

 

Really? Where did you read this?

Let me tell you a story. About 25 years ago I wanted to realize the eighth chakra real bad. So I sat in my lazy boy chair and said to myself that I would not get out of the chair until I could see the star two feet above my head, like everyone else was talking about. I focused all my attention on that location, two feet above my head and kept focusing on it. Three and one half hours later, I popped out of the top my head and found myself looking into a large black space with many stars in the greater distance. It felt like I was dying. I had immense fear and recoiled from it. I got up out of the chair and walked towards the kitchen to get a drink of water. As I walked to the kitchen, two faeries come out of the wall and proceeded to talk to me. They were very pretty, sparkly and etheric. I asked them what they wanted. They said that they were there to entertain me. I said that I didn't want to be entertained and asked them to leave. They left. But a few days later they came back and I made friends with them. This friendship has lasted many years.

And, after that experience, I have always been able to see the bright white eighth chakra star about 1 1/2 feet above my head. I can pull down light from it and send it to parts of my body if I want. It is very ecstatic, pure and fine.

 

So, yes, there is an eighth chakra and realizing it has nothing to do with all chakras coming together as you have indicated. Just good old one pointed awareness will do the trick.

 

Those other 'non-physical' chakras if you wish to use such terminology, are only accessible

after the process discussed above, and ultimately don't matter. They too work themselves out

in the wash.

 

Really, there is no point in going 'ga ga' over 'chakras', as we all know. The most important

things to know, the most important things to be, have nothing to do with 'chakras'.

 

Chakras don't work themselves out in the wash as you have indicated. Imbalances can come from many places, karmic fruitions, people contact, events, at any time or place.

One of the faster methods of realization is the bliss of the inner fire. Tummo. Ever hear of Buddha or the Mahamudra practice? It's all about chakras, the inner fire and the central channel. In order to do the practice, not only must one skillfully understand the method and intricacies, but one must know about the chakras.

 

And as a matter of fact, I'd say that lots of people experience all that 'under the hood stuff'

without even bothering to notice or document any of it. Noting will trap one in the mud faster,

than fretting about this kind of stuff. It all works itself out automatically as necessary.

 

You know, that statement is just wrong. It is a statement for the acceptance of ignorance. It is counterproductive. It is the kind of statement that you would find at AYP. Have you become a parroting AYP brown noser? Just shut off, bathe in ignorance and do the practices. Right?

 

Any teaching that supports ignorance is just plain wrong.

 

Buddha said:

Do not accept any of my words on faith,

Believing them just because I said them.

Be like an analyst buying gold, who cuts, burns,

And critically examines his product for authenticity.

Only accept what passes the test

By proving useful and beneficial in your life.

 

Why fret about chakras? If you can't understand the concepts and are incapable of learning about the concepts, then drop it. Most people, even ones with a grade five mentality are capable of learning something new. But don't try to convince others, who might be more intelligent and capable of grasping the underlying knowledge, that their interest and love of knowledge is somehow an impediment. The final realization is knowledge. The ultimate understanding. Understanding is intelligence.

Intelligent people are quite capable of understanding correct practice, when to grasp and to when not to grasp. Intelligent people are able to distinguish between meditative and non meditative states, and when to skillfully apply their knowledge. Most people are way more intelligent than they think they are.

 

Buddha said:

The Dhammapada

Chapter Five: The Fool

 

Night is long for one lying awake.

Seven miles is long for one exhausted.

Samsara is long for fools

Ignorant of true Dharma.

 

If, while on your way,

You meet no one your equal or better,

Steadily continue on your way alone.

There is no fellowship with fools.

 

A fool suffers, thinking,

"I have children! I have wealth!"

One's self is not even one's own.

How then are children? How then is wealth?

 

A fool conscious of her foolishness

Is to that extent wise.

But a fool who considers himself wise

Is the one to be called a fool.

 

A fool associating with a sage,

Even if for a lifetime,

Will no more perceive the Dharma

Than a spoon will perceive the taste of soup.

 

A discerning person who associates with a sage,

Even if for a brief moment,

Will quickly perceive the Dharma,

As the tongue perceives the taste of soup.

 

Fools with no sense,

Go about as their own enemies,

Doing evil deeds that

Bear bitter fruit.

 

No deed is good

That one regrets having done,

That results in weeping

And a tear-streaked face.

 

A deed is good

That one doesn't regret having done,

That results in joy

And delight.

 

As long as evil has not borne fruit,

The fool thinks it is like honey.

But when evil does bear fruit,

Then the fool suffers.

 

The foolish ascetic who month after month

Eats food with the tip of a blade of grass

Is not worth a fraction

Of a person who has fathomed the Dharma.

 

Like fresh milk,

Evil deeds do not immediately curdle;

Rather, like fire covered with ash,

They follow the fool, smoldering.

 

Reasoning is harmful

To fools;

It ruins their good fortune

And splits open their heads.

 

Fools will want unwarranted status,

Deference from fellow monks,

Authority in the monasteries,

And homage from good families.

"Let both householders and renunciants

Believe that I did this.

Let them obey me in every task!"

Such are the thoughts of a fool

Who cultivates desire and pride.

 

The way to material gain is one thing,

The path to Nirvana another.

Knowing this, a monk who is the Buddha's disciple

Should not delight in being venerated,

But cultivate solitude instead.

 

And here is something from the Dalai Lama:

 

Individuals who are best suited for practice of Dharma are those who are not only intellectually gifted, but also have single-minded faith and dedication and are wise.

 

Although individuals may be highly intelligent, they are sometimes dogged by skepticism and doubts. They are clever, but they tend to be hesitant and skeptical and are never really able to settle down. These people are the least receptive.

 

...particularly in Buddhism while we practice we must use the brain as well as the heart. On the ethical side, we must practice the quality of a good and warm heart; also, since Buddhism is very much involved in reasoning and logic--the wisdom side--intelligence is important. Thus, a combination of mind and heart is needed. Without knowledge, without fully utilized intelligence, you cannot reach the depths of the Buddhist doctrine; it is difficult to achieve concrete or fully qualified wisdom. There may be exceptions, but this is the general rule.

It is necessary to have a combination of hearing, thinking, and meditating. The Kadampa teacher Dromton ('brom ston pa, 1004-1064) said, "When I engage in hearing, I also make effort at thinking and meditating. When I engage in thinking, I also search out more hearing and engage in meditation. And when I meditate, I don't give up hearing and don't give up thinking." He said, "I am a balanced Kadampa," meaning that he maintained a balance of hearing, thinking, and meditating.

Kindness, Clarity, and Insight 25th Anniversary Edition

 

I'm so sorry to have posted this post to you, but I find that anyone who supports ignorance should be set straight.

No hard feelings and I wish you all the best.

 

TI

[kevincann]

Hi Kevin,

I find that your concepts are so full of misinformation and support of ignorance that I just have to say something.

You are probably a real nice guy and think you have your heart in the right place, wanting to help people and elucidate your acquisition of marginal knowledge, but I think you have some homework to do.

 

 

 

The chakra system can function in many modes, depending on the level of understanding, ability and precision of the practioner. Someone whom has 24 hour mindfulness can maintain balanced chakras at will, and can balance chakras of those around them too by contact. People with poor mindfulness or incorrect spiritual practice will not have balanced chakras.

 

 

The chakras are connected to the sushumna, the central channel. Thus, each chakra has access to the larger reality. It does not matter if one is meditating or not, any chakra, if the circumstances are right can bring the person into a greater perception of reality, especially the heart chakra.

 

 

Kundalini is not the end-all, be all. Kundalini is just an energetic phase that one goes through as the layers of consciousness are peeled back and fall away. Kundalini has no silent center for kundalini is a wind. It is energetic movement. Shakti. Shiva is stillness. The One Cavity has nothing to do with kundalini, although you can use kundalini energy to open the gate. But you can use other energy too to open the gate. You have mixed too many words and terms from different teachings to make sense here.

 

 

 

Really? Where did you read this?

Let me tell you a story. About 25 years ago I wanted to realize the eighth chakra real bad. So I sat in my lazy boy chair and said to myself that I would not get out of the chair until I could see the star two feet above my head, like everyone else was talking about. I focused all my attention on that location, two feet above my head and kept focusing on it. Three and one half hours later, I popped out of the top my head and found myself looking into a large black space with many stars in the greater distance. It felt like I was dying. I had immense fear and recoiled from it. I got up out of the chair and walked towards the kitchen to get a drink of water. As I walked to the kitchen, two faeries come out of the wall and proceeded to talk to me. They were very pretty, sparkly and etheric. I asked them what they wanted. They said that they were there to entertain me. I said that I didn't want to be entertained and asked them to leave. They left. But a few days later they came back and I made friends with them. This friendship has lasted many years.

And, after that experience, I have always been able to see the bright white eighth chakra star about 1 1/2 feet above my head. I can pull down light from it and send it to parts of my body if I want. It is very ecstatic, pure and fine.

 

So, yes, there is an eighth chakra and realizing it has nothing to do with all chakras coming together as you have indicated. Just good old one pointed awareness will do the trick.

 

 

 

Chakras don't work themselves out in the wash as you have indicated. Imbalances can come from many places, karmic fruitions, people contact, events, at any time or place.

One of the faster methods of realization is the bliss of the inner fire. Tummo. Ever hear of Buddha or the Mahamudra practice? It's all about chakras, the inner fire and the central channel. In order to do the practice, not only must one skillfully understand the method and intricacies, but one must know about the chakras.

 

 

 

You know, that statement is just wrong. It is a statement for the acceptance of ignorance. It is counterproductive. It is the kind of statement that you would find at AYP. Have you become a parroting AYP brown noser? Just shut off, bathe in ignorance and do the practices. Right?

 

Any teaching that supports ignorance is just plain wrong.

 

Buddha said:

 

 

Why fret about chakras? If you can't understand the concepts and are incapable of learning about the concepts, then drop it. Most people, even ones with a grade five mentality are capable of learning something new. But don't try to convince others, who might be more intelligent and capable of grasping the underlying knowledge, that their interest and love of knowledge is somehow an impediment. The final realization is knowledge. The ultimate understanding. Understanding is intelligence.

Intelligent people are quite capable of understanding correct practice, when to grasp and to when not to grasp. Intelligent people are able to distinguish between meditative and non meditative states, and when to skillfully apply their knowledge. Most people are way more intelligent than they think they are.

 

Buddha said:

 

 

And here is something from the Dalai Lama:

 

 

 

I'm so sorry to have posted this post to you, but I find that anyone who supports ignorance should be set straight.

No hard feelings and I wish you all the best.

 

TI

 

Don't be sorry!

 

Wow, you just sent me more energy than my wife used to, when we still had relations.

 

I'm so happy that you have figured everything out to your satisfaction.

 

I love you man.

 

Kev

[Mokona]

I partially agree with Kev. Focusing and delving into chakras is a search for trivial knowledge. I agree that it may give you some insight into who you are, but you have to be willing to let go of what you learned and pursue the universal truths. It is trivial because it is relative, and is described in so many variations throughout the systems that the search becomes never-ending. And unless personal experience can guide in discernment, all that would result is extra confusion. I advise people to stick to universal truths. Such as understanding of love, humility, law of attraction, cause and effect, etc. All the rest will work itself out if the universal principles are understood and followed. The whole point is to let go of external knowledge and live in wisdom. A too educated mind might find it harder to progress, ironically, due to constant personal projected opinions.

 

Also, as far as chakras go, It's not about having all of them open, but in which one your consciousness resides. You could have all of them open, and still function in a state of insecurity and confusion if your awareness is still in the "red" chakra. Awareness rising is directly proportional to level of insight from contemplation, and detachment. So focus on these, everything else falls into place.

 

People make spiritual progress out to be so complicated, yet it is actually all pretty straight forward and simple. An illiterate farmer can attain enlightenment just as well as anyone else. It's not about the books, but about insight into your own experience.

 

Have I ever had a chakra balancing? Nope. But I can get to that deep sense of peace you refer to. So does it matter if I know about chakras or not? :b The end result is the same.

 

Peace

 

Eugene

 

PS. But... paths differ tremendously sometimes among seekers. I may stand by the fact that universal principles apply to everyone, and they should be understood, however since the path is linear, certain steps have to be undertaken before attaining higher levels. If study of chakras serves this purpose for someone, then by all means =). Who am I to say it's trivial!

We will probably have to agree to disagree, thats okay. My end goal involves kundalini, and self knowlege and healing skill. The chakras have worked at least as visualizations that have morphed into real feeling and alchemy - this approach works for me, and has lead to divine experiences as well as spirit friends. Good luck on your path.

[kevincann]

We will probably have to agree to disagree, thats okay. My end goal involves kundalini, and self knowlege and healing skill. The chakras have worked at least as visualizations that have morphed into real feeling and alchemy - this approach works for me, and has lead to divine experiences as well as spirit friends. Good luck on your path.

 

I've noticed that nearly all traditions warn against letting the instruments of liberation

become the 'golden shackles' which keep your prisoner forever.

 

I'm one to talk actually.

 

My life's work has been to document spiritual cosmology and it's relationship to both

psychology and physics.

 

After 51 years of this, I'm coming to a point in my own path, to simply enjoy riding

in the car, and not stress about every last engineering diagram.

 

There is no right or wrong path; no right or wrong knowledge; no right or wrong

tradition. There is only the path, and it takes care of itself.

 

Yes, it's all the same 'under the hood'. But we don't need enlightenment police.

 

Sometimes it's the 'very wrongest of things' which has the power to bring us home;

this is the very essence of Kundalini for example; the power of delusion is the gateway

to liberation.

 

Love,

 

Kev

[The Observer]

Hi Kevin,

I find that your concepts are so full of misinformation and support of ignorance that I just have to say something.

You are probably a real nice guy and think you have your heart in the right place, wanting to help people and elucidate your acquisition of marginal knowledge, but I think you have some homework to do.

 

 

 

The chakra system can function in many modes, depending on the level of understanding, ability and precision of the practioner. Someone whom has 24 hour mindfulness can maintain balanced chakras at will, and can balance chakras of those around them too by contact. People with poor mindfulness or incorrect spiritual practice will not have balanced chakras.

 

 

The chakras are connected to the sushumna, the central channel. Thus, each chakra has access to the larger reality. It does not matter if one is meditating or not, any chakra, if the circumstances are right can bring the person into a greater perception of reality, especially the heart chakra.

 

 

Kundalini is not the end-all, be all. Kundalini is just an energetic phase that one goes through as the layers of consciousness are peeled back and fall away. Kundalini has no silent center for kundalini is a wind. It is energetic movement. Shakti. Shiva is stillness. The One Cavity has nothing to do with kundalini, although you can use kundalini energy to open the gate. But you can use other energy too to open the gate. You have mixed too many words and terms from different teachings to make sense here.

 

 

 

Really? Where did you read this?

Let me tell you a story. About 25 years ago I wanted to realize the eighth chakra real bad. So I sat in my lazy boy chair and said to myself that I would not get out of the chair until I could see the star two feet above my head, like everyone else was talking about. I focused all my attention on that location, two feet above my head and kept focusing on it. Three and one half hours later, I popped out of the top my head and found myself looking into a large black space with many stars in the greater distance. It felt like I was dying. I had immense fear and recoiled from it. I got up out of the chair and walked towards the kitchen to get a drink of water. As I walked to the kitchen, two faeries come out of the wall and proceeded to talk to me. They were very pretty, sparkly and etheric. I asked them what they wanted. They said that they were there to entertain me. I said that I didn't want to be entertained and asked them to leave. They left. But a few days later they came back and I made friends with them. This friendship has lasted many years.

And, after that experience, I have always been able to see the bright white eighth chakra star about 1 1/2 feet above my head. I can pull down light from it and send it to parts of my body if I want. It is very ecstatic, pure and fine.

 

So, yes, there is an eighth chakra and realizing it has nothing to do with all chakras coming together as you have indicated. Just good old one pointed awareness will do the trick.

 

 

 

Chakras don't work themselves out in the wash as you have indicated. Imbalances can come from many places, karmic fruitions, people contact, events, at any time or place.

One of the faster methods of realization is the bliss of the inner fire. Tummo. Ever hear of Buddha or the Mahamudra practice? It's all about chakras, the inner fire and the central channel. In order to do the practice, not only must one skillfully understand the method and intricacies, but one must know about the chakras.

 

 

 

You know, that statement is just wrong. It is a statement for the acceptance of ignorance. It is counterproductive. It is the kind of statement that you would find at AYP. Have you become a parroting AYP brown noser? Just shut off, bathe in ignorance and do the practices. Right?

 

Any teaching that supports ignorance is just plain wrong.

 

Buddha said:

 

 

Why fret about chakras? If you can't understand the concepts and are incapable of learning about the concepts, then drop it. Most people, even ones with a grade five mentality are capable of learning something new. But don't try to convince others, who might be more intelligent and capable of grasping the underlying knowledge, that their interest and love of knowledge is somehow an impediment. The final realization is knowledge. The ultimate understanding. Understanding is intelligence.

Intelligent people are quite capable of understanding correct practice, when to grasp and to when not to grasp. Intelligent people are able to distinguish between meditative and non meditative states, and when to skillfully apply their knowledge. Most people are way more intelligent than they think they are.

 

Buddha said:

 

 

And here is something from the Dalai Lama:

 

 

 

I'm so sorry to have posted this post to you, but I find that anyone who supports ignorance should be set straight.

No hard feelings and I wish you all the best.

 

TI

This was a refreshing and enjoyable post to read. Thank you!