Ego versus Humility

[manitou]

I've been seeing things from a very dark perspective lately, since going off 25 years of Prozac. While taking the drug, it seemed easy to stay in a place of gratitude, a place of periodic humility, emphasis on periodic. But the deep down anger I've been living with now is turning my world upside down.

 

When I let the anger get ahead of me, I take things out on the "supporting cast" of my life - the peripheral folks engaged usually in a service industry of some sort - whether at the grocery store, gas station, wherever. Some days I have no fuse at all - the anger is brimming over the edge.

 

The ego seems to ride out on the anger. At the bottom of the anger is ego. Why did that SOB cut me off on the road? Doesn't he know who I am?? Don't these people standing in line ahead of me realize that my time is valuable (as though theirs isn't??) And it goes on ad infinitum. The anger is a very convenient vehicle for ego.

 

Yet, humility is the opposite. I have in front of me a Stephen Mitchell translation of the TTC - I look at his Chapter 7:

 

the Master stays behind;

that is why she is ahead.

She is detached from all things;

that is why she is one with them.

Because she has let go of herself,

she is perfectly fulfilled.

 

This seems to diffuse it a bit; to realize that my anger, my impatience, my desire to be first, to achieve, are opposite to the Humility that this chapter seems to suggest. And what is Humility, really? I see it as giving credit where credit is due. To know that it is not Me that is achieving anything, it is that Thing within that is the thing that creates my art and has given me a good brain. It is my good brain. It is my thoughts. And it is also my Ego, my Anger. The Tao is both, and I think we must be gentle on ourselves when we find ourselves acting out like this, as I am prone to do right now. I suspect we all share this periodically.

 

Chapter 39:

 

The Master views the parts with compassion,

because he understands the whole.

His constant Practice is humility.

He doesn't glitter like a jewel

But lets himself be shaped by the Tao,

as rugged and common as a stone.

 

This says to me that we must view our darker side with compassion as well - we are part of the whole, and the Tao created both the light and the dark; outside us and inside us. It is all One, and our dark side is part of it. Mitchell's Chapter 22 addresses this:

 

If you want to become whole,

Let yourself be partial.

If you want to become straight,

Let yourself be crooked.

If you want to become full,

Let yourself be empty.

If you want to be reborn,

Let yourself die.

If you want to be given everything,

Give everything up.

 

I find much comfort in Mitchell's Chapter 70:

 

My teachings are easy to understand

and easy to put into practice.

Yet your intellect will never grasp them,

And if you try to practice them, you'll fail.

 

My teachings are older than the world.

How can you grasp their meaning?

 

If you want to know me,

Look inside your heart.

 

I would love to know if anyone else struggles with their own behavior....

[Marblehead]

I would love to know if anyone else struggles with their own behavior....

Some people think I have an ego problem but I always disagree with them.

 

Anyhow, humility. You know, just recently I modified the Three Treasures, for my own use, to be: Compassion, Conservativism, and Humility.

 

Yes, I believe if we learn (yes, learn, for we who have allowed our ego to dominate) humility ego will still be there but it will be a much more mellow fellow and won't push itself forward so often.

 

I commend you for wanting to be yourself without the help of the drug. Be gentle with yourself because your body and especially your mind have a lot of adjusting to do.

 

I haven't really offered any help here, I know, but I just wanted to let you know that I am listening.

[de_paradise]

Idle thoughts and little daily encounters are what I'm concerned about lately too, not high falutin' secret neigong. There places where one can put one's mind, relatively free from ego, and that is as we all know, in the now, the moment. But also subduing self-referential thoughts, and idle criticisms is important. Idle compliments (that person has a nice ironed shirt) are relatively free from ego because it notices, it approves, it allows. In Chinese the word good also means yes.

[Birch]

Sorry to hear the ride through is rough Manitou. I wish I knew enough about ego to reply properly about it. From what I understand so far, emotions that are misplaced or misinterpreted or disproportional to the situation are all in the realm of this ego stuff.

 

I recall my small experience with Paxil put a mushy veil between whatever I felt and myself. I recall still feeling like crap but it was distanced from me to some extent. I didn't trust that situation for some reason. I wanted my feelings back.

 

I don't know about Prozac, does it do stuff to liver chi? TCM people?

[mjjbecker]

I would love to know if anyone else struggles with their own behavior....

 

Yes, frequently. It is difficult not to when living in a city with millions of people. There is a general lack of consideration for others as people struggle with their own daily grind. It can be very frustrating.

 

For me, I don't think so much on humility but on compassion. Neither should be excessive or forced, but rather genuine awareness. It isn't about self-flagellation.

 

Part of finding genuine awareness is, I think, developing consideration for everyone, (including yourself), an understanding that everyone has their own struggles and issues to contend with, and acceptance of what 'is'.

 

This practice might help:

 

http://www.researchersoftruth.org/INTROSPECTION-PRACTICE.htm

 

Daily Introspection Practice

 

Each night just prior to sleep (when your subconscious is more porous)

inhale and exhale in a 4:4 pattern and relax completely. (4 beats of the

heart during the in breath and 4 beats of the heard during the out breath)

Either lying in bed or sitting up (try not to fall asleep!) begin to recall the day

from start to finish. Review each event, each encounter, of the day and

with full impunity and leniency towards yourself and others ask yourself the

following questions:

 

What did I think or feel that I should not have thought or felt?

What did I not think or feel that I should have thought or felt?

 

What did I say that I should not have said?

What did I not say that I should have said?

 

What did I do that I should not have done?

What did I not do that I should have done?

 

The goal is not to scold (nor to praise!) yourself or others, but simply to

observe your activity and work to correct your behavior. With time you

will grow more accomplished at seeing yourself and will find that your

moral, spiritual and mystical life will accelerate in growth.

[mYTHmAKER]

https://www.google.com/search?q=naturalsubstitutes+for+prozac&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

[Protector]

Joy and sorrow are also parts of the ego but I don't hear about people suffering from happiness

What you want always run away

and what you don't, wants to stay

WHOO A RHYME

So that's why master stays behind to stay ahead

 

On behavior thing I always stay extra conscious whenever something happens

When something unexpected happens, time seems to slow down and I think what to do

When something I wanted to do happens, I feel the same way since I usually stay in a state of mind where I feel neither

Both are surprises to me

 

Hey manitou, straggling doesn't always make things better, if you feel angry then just get angrier and then forget about it

Make the anger get tired before it makes you do something you don't want to do

[Harmonious Emptiness]

I still get some frustration from time to time. However when I started to grasp the whole Dependent Origination\Emptiness teachings I felt sort of incapable of helping other people since most people have no interest in cerebral reasons for why they need not be angry since there is not them and there is no anger . Oh well .

 

A regular mellow yet greatly effective qi gong practice can do wonders to safely dissipate negative energies so there's no weight to be imbalanced, ime.

 

I've always liked this one, which seems it was put together with detailed instruction by Michael Winn, narrated by Solala Towler, and demonstrated by Michael Rinaldini and others:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1572962536605659291

[Birch]

I struggle a lot with what I think of my own behaviour.

[C T]

Hi Barbara,

 

Sincerely hope you will slowly reflect on this article for i think it may help some. (Incidentally, Jennifer Lauck was also 'awakened' thru a near-fatal auto accident)

 

http://www.andrewholecek.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/BD-Sp12_08_forum.pdf

 

 

 

Blessings!

Edited July 16, 2012 by C T

[suninmyeyes]

Hello dear manitou,

respect for trying to get off prozac.

You got some really nice responses here so far.

 

manitou said:'I would love to know if anyone else struggles with their own behavior....'

 

I have struggled with anger and managed to reprogram a lot of my behaviour. My route was of trying to be as lucid and clear as possible and work became my main meditation and my spiritual battleground. I deal with a lot of people at work all the time and at one point it just was so ovewhealming . This was a help to become more present and sharpen up.

 

One time I was in a occult bookstore and this guy was talking to a highly abusive costumer on the phone -- but he himself was cool and so gathered.

His collegue asked him:'How do you do it(being so composed)?'

He replied:'You have to learn to bless yourself.'

 

This may sound like nothing to you , but at the time and space that caused revolution in my life. I started to learn to bless myself.

Concept I never would even think of before but in that moment it all made sense - just what needed to be heard, something switched on.

It is about being aware of what I want to create and most importantly being aware from what source I gain my inspiration from. It is about being responsable and disposing the blaming . Blaming is a form of expetacion, and it is better to bin it forever.

Doing best in given situation and having a goal in mind , but not expecting is what works for me.

Just letting life move through me without holding on to it for too long.

Anger tore me apart almost at one point and that boiling point needed to be reached. Nowdays I may play with anger for a bit , but I am not going down that road. It is like a devils domain.

Gotta be careful where we get our inspiration from and what kind of creation we contribute to. Becouse our every destructive thought has a butterfly effect . It adds to and feeds all the nastiness already present in the world. The more nastiness it feeds the more it is accesable to people , more people plug into/hook into this ideas - it perpetuets so easily. Just look at the state of the world today.

Becoming more aware and be responsable cocreator,

as well as decluttering the heart so its eyes open up and its ears listen is where I am at.

 

PS To comment on your title - I dont see it as ego vs humility -- its about being flexible ,agile and appropriate to the given situation.

 

Best wishes.

Edited July 16, 2012 by suninmyeyes

[zanshin]

Have you thought about taking up martial arts or at least some sort of self defense class? Somehow by feeling less helpless, I stopped getting mad most of the time. I don't know if I see it as needing to squash the ego. When you have inner confidence and feel blessed, outer annoyances and worrying about what people think fades back. OF course I still struggle too, compassion helps also. I work in health care so maybe easier to feel compassion for people who having obvious health issues; they can get really grumpy and downright mean. Maybe they're just plain mean or it's personal- but maybe it's their reaction to pain, scared and sick, and we usually get along okay after a few minutes if I assume the latter and hear their anger out.

[manitou]

thank you, everyone, for your responses so far. Every single entry had a slightly different bit of wisdom for me -

 

Marbles - your modified usage of the 3 Treasures is beautiful - and just knowing that you're listening means so very much to me.

 

Paradise - that seems to be it exactly. we are what we think, and the high falutin' stuff is of the brain; it seems to be the little daily thoughts that show us where our heart truly is. The only thing that seems to save me right now is remembering that we're all One - that person or situation I have negative thoughts about is Me too.

 

K - thank you for your compassion - I thought I'd gotten through the anger through years of inner work - it's been the only way I've stayed sober for 30 years. I just couldn't imagine that the actual anger was waiting to be released at this senior stage of my life. Again, thank you for your love.

 

mjjbecker - you have put your finger on it - including myself in the realm of consideration - not something I've ever even thought about doing, up to this point. I've been journalling nightly trying to get through this- I think I'll add those questions to my journalings.

 

mythmaker - I jumped onto that site and was delighted to see it was about flower essences - this is something that a friend of mine recently showed me - she had ordered Australian bush essences and was making elixers. I found that the mix she made for me was really helpful - I googled around and found that clover essence (the tiny white flowers that pop up when the grass is unmowed) is also referred to as 'serenity in a bottle'. I made up my own, and I don't know if it's psychological or actual - but this essence does give me some relief. Thank you.

 

Harmonious - I feel that qigong would be a definite route through this, but I'm unable to focus right now on the learned movements of others. What I have done instead (I should kick it up) is to do my own qigong-like movements, whatever my body wants to do, to music. It feels right. Some mornings I'm too irritated to do it, but usually it gets done about once a week.

 

Sinfest - Your words are powerful. Make the anger get tired. I drove down the street the other day just screaming at the top of my lungs. Windows up, so I didn't freak folks out. It was so bad about a week ago I nearly did something I didn't want to do - as they say, a permanent solution to a temporary problem. Thankfully that desire passed - and it's not a thought I've ever thought before or since. This was brand new and it scared me.

 

CT - I see what you mean - fear does ultimately underly the anger - I know exactly where my fear comes from, from a young age. I thought I had gone through this, done the forgiving, thought I had assimilated it. But apparently it was done on an intellectual level - enough to stay sober for 30 years, but finding that there was a final scab underlying everything that had yet to be ripped off. The anger just hadn't raised it's little head until now. I love the line in the movie "Hope Floats" where someone said 'Childhood is the thing we spend the rest of our lives getting over'. This actually comes to me often, this phrase - it gives me some solace and the knowledge that I'm not alone - that everyone goes through the same thing at various times. We're all victims of victims of victims. I could spend the rest of my life placing blame, but who am I blaming? The young boy in my father that was raised exactly the same way by his father? And his father? And ad infinitum....these tendencies just seem to be the Gift that Keeps on Giving, if you ask me.

 

Sunny - my soul sister - thank you for the concept of blessing myself. I am going to physically do this somehow every morning and remind myself during the day to love myself as I try to love others. (Kind of a reversal of the original intent, but I need it now) - after all, we are all the same Creature, just different faces, if we embrace the concept of Oneness at all.

 

Zanshin - funny, I do crave physical activity right now - it does help diminish the anguish. I have a craving to work out in some way, I bought some of those rubber cords with handles on the end and I've been using them. Feeling physically helpless hasn't been my problem, I'm well trained in self defense. But you're right - there is definitely a place for working this out physically in addition to better diet - I am doing this right now. At the very least, I'll be an angry person with buff arms

 

Thank you everyone - I feel much love for each and every one of you, and for taking the time to respond to my crisis. Just the fact that I'm willing to share this with you is a marked improvement to my closeted snarlings of a few weeks ago.

 

THANK YOU

 

Barb

[gatito]

I don't think that awakening and self-realisation is something which prevents anyone from enjoying the full spectrum of emotions - it's just that the underlying "satchitananda" of Consciousness is seen never to be absent.

 

Not being able to feel some emotions would be a limitation rather than a freedom.

[doc benway]

 

 

I would love to know if anyone else struggles with their own behavior....

Oh my goodness, yes...

I was an angry man for many years.

My wife has suffered deeply for it.

My children have suffered deeply for it as has my relationship with them.

And I, perhaps most of all, have suffered for it after waking up.

I'm slowly working through the guilt and regret and bitterness.

Much of that is behind me.

And I'm certain there is more to come.

 

I think that the focus on the ego is an interesting one.

It's also helpful to me to look at how the other comes into play as well.

I think it's captured beautifully by Zhuang Zi in the parable of the Empty Boat.

Here's an excerpt from Thomas Merton's translation-

 

If a man is crossing a river

And an empty boat collides with his own skiff,

Even though he be a bad-tempered man

He will not become very angry.

 

But if he sees a man in the boat,

He will shout at him to steer clear.

 

If the shout is not heard, he will shout again,

And yet again, and begin cursing.

And all because there is somebody in the boat.

Yet if the boat were empty,

He would not be shouting and not angry.

 

If you can empty your own boat

Crossing the river of the world,

No one will oppose you,

No one will seek to harm you....

 

I'm also impressed with your courage, Barbara.

Good luck and please remember to be kind to yourself.

You deserve this at least as much of that as those around you.

[dwai]

I've been seeing things from a very dark perspective lately, since going off 25 years of Prozac. While taking the drug, it seemed easy to stay in a place of gratitude, a place of periodic humility, emphasis on periodic. But the deep down anger I've been living with now is turning my world upside down.

 

When I let the anger get ahead of me, I take things out on the "supporting cast" of my life - the peripheral folks engaged usually in a service industry of some sort - whether at the grocery store, gas station, wherever. Some days I have no fuse at all - the anger is brimming over the edge.

 

The ego seems to ride out on the anger. At the bottom of the anger is ego. Why did that SOB cut me off on the road? Doesn't he know who I am?? Don't these people standing in line ahead of me realize that my time is valuable (as though theirs isn't??) And it goes on ad infinitum. The anger is a very convenient vehicle for ego.

 

Yet, humility is the opposite. I have in front of me a Stephen Mitchell translation of the TTC - I look at his Chapter 7:

 

the Master stays behind;

that is why she is ahead.

She is detached from all things;

that is why she is one with them.

Because she has let go of herself,

she is perfectly fulfilled.

 

This seems to diffuse it a bit; to realize that my anger, my impatience, my desire to be first, to achieve, are opposite to the Humility that this chapter seems to suggest. And what is Humility, really? I see it as giving credit where credit is due. To know that it is not Me that is achieving anything, it is that Thing within that is the thing that creates my art and has given me a good brain. It is my good brain. It is my thoughts. And it is also my Ego, my Anger. The Tao is both, and I think we must be gentle on ourselves when we find ourselves acting out like this, as I am prone to do right now. I suspect we all share this periodically.

 

Chapter 39:

 

The Master views the parts with compassion,

because he understands the whole.

His constant Practice is humility.

He doesn't glitter like a jewel

But lets himself be shaped by the Tao,

as rugged and common as a stone.

 

This says to me that we must view our darker side with compassion as well - we are part of the whole, and the Tao created both the light and the dark; outside us and inside us. It is all One, and our dark side is part of it. Mitchell's Chapter 22 addresses this:

 

If you want to become whole,

Let yourself be partial.

If you want to become straight,

Let yourself be crooked.

If you want to become full,

Let yourself be empty.

If you want to be reborn,

Let yourself die.

If you want to be given everything,

Give everything up.

 

I find much comfort in Mitchell's Chapter 70:

 

My teachings are easy to understand

and easy to put into practice.

Yet your intellect will never grasp them,

And if you try to practice them, you'll fail.

 

My teachings are older than the world.

How can you grasp their meaning?

 

If you want to know me,

Look inside your heart.

 

I would love to know if anyone else struggles with their own behavior....

 

Dear Manitou,

 

Ego and humility are two sides of the same coin. True humility is not lack of ego but inspire of ego, imho. Ego is something we cannot live without, unless we have completely transcended human frailties. I haven't met too many people who have, so there's not much of a way around it.

 

The one thing that I have felt the need to watch out for is false humility. In my culture (and most asian cultures) there is a "formal" humility that is part of our social etiquette, which has nothing at all to do with truly being humble. This humility is hypocritical to a large extent.

 

While I know that your post deals with a much more visceral version of it, it is not entirely impractical to inquire whether there might be elements of this "formal" humility in play (inadvertently cultivated into one's behavior).

 

I also realized a while back that it is not practical to live like a sage in this world. At least not while we have to work and participate in this world as functional components. Being too humble and sagacious will only leave us as doormats. There has to be a right mix of humility and toughness...softness and hardness (balance of yin and yang). Not everyone deserves to be met with the same softness. Some need "tough love" while others need "tender lovin'" if you know what I mean...which one needs which we have to decide based on time.

 

I have struggled with temper growing up and got to a point where I thought i had conquered anger. But all I had done in hindsight is internalized part of the anger (and potentially afflicted my liver in the process). So now, I crave some yang martial activities...something to take all the pent up anger/frustration of the day out (I used to on the mat or in full-contact sparring)...something i am not able to do with taiji quan practice. I found running helps somewhat, but not the same as pounding a heavy bag or sparring full-contact with another human being.

[Marblehead]

 

... I thought i had conquered anger. But all I had done in hindsight is internalized part of the anger (and potentially afflicted my liver in the process).

 

I wanted to point this out because I have lived this experience as well. There is a real big difference between holding our anger in submission and just experiencing the anger, then letting it go.

[flowing hands]

I've been seeing things from a very dark perspective lately, since going off 25 years of Prozac. While taking the drug, it seemed easy to stay in a place of gratitude, a place of periodic humility, emphasis on periodic. But the deep down anger I've been living with now is turning my world upside down.

 

When I let the anger get ahead of me, I take things out on the "supporting cast" of my life - the peripheral folks engaged usually in a service industry of some sort - whether at the grocery store, gas station, wherever. Some days I have no fuse at all - the anger is brimming over the edge.

 

The ego seems to ride out on the anger. At the bottom of the anger is ego. Why did that SOB cut me off on the road? Doesn't he know who I am?? Don't these people standing in line ahead of me realize that my time is valuable (as though theirs isn't??) And it goes on ad infinitum. The anger is a very convenient vehicle for ego.

 

Yet, humility is the opposite. I have in front of me a Stephen Mitchell translation of the TTC - I look at his Chapter 7:

 

the Master stays behind;

that is why she is ahead.

She is detached from all things;

that is why she is one with them.

Because she has let go of herself,

she is perfectly fulfilled.

 

This seems to diffuse it a bit; to realize that my anger, my impatience, my desire to be first, to achieve, are opposite to the Humility that this chapter seems to suggest. And what is Humility, really? I see it as giving credit where credit is due. To know that it is not Me that is achieving anything, it is that Thing within that is the thing that creates my art and has given me a good brain. It is my good brain. It is my thoughts. And it is also my Ego, my Anger. The Tao is both, and I think we must be gentle on ourselves when we find ourselves acting out like this, as I am prone to do right now. I suspect we all share this periodically.

 

Chapter 39:

 

The Master views the parts with compassion,

because he understands the whole.

His constant Practice is humility.

He doesn't glitter like a jewel

But lets himself be shaped by the Tao,

as rugged and common as a stone.

 

This says to me that we must view our darker side with compassion as well - we are part of the whole, and the Tao created both the light and the dark; outside us and inside us. It is all One, and our dark side is part of it. Mitchell's Chapter 22 addresses this:

 

If you want to become whole,

Let yourself be partial.

If you want to become straight,

Let yourself be crooked.

If you want to become full,

Let yourself be empty.

If you want to be reborn,

Let yourself die.

If you want to be given everything,

Give everything up.

 

I find much comfort in Mitchell's Chapter 70:

 

My teachings are easy to understand

and easy to put into practice.

Yet your intellect will never grasp them,

And if you try to practice them, you'll fail.

 

My teachings are older than the world.

How can you grasp their meaning?

 

If you want to know me,

Look inside your heart.

 

I would love to know if anyone else struggles with their own behavior....

 

DANCE!

[suninmyeyes]

..and here is a huge toon should you decide to :

[manitou]

Nice video - and truly there isn't enough dancing in my life. The thing that seems to be happening is an ability to sustain a slight out-of=body-ness, a place where I can get to where I'm almost watching myself - when I can stay in this place, none of it matters. No anger, no good, no bad. This is a good thing, for my purposes right now. Almost like hanging out in the assemblage point, as Castaneda would call it - just about a foot away from me. This honestly is working pretty well, but I have to decide to inhabit the place first rather than letting the rage overcome me. Posting again on TTB's is very helpful - but that's sporadic too.

 

It's all coming together, just taking a little time - what an interesting experience this is. Makes me realize what a truly human animal I am.

[suninmyeyes]

It would be nice to have a cup of tea together now if we were living nearby.

 

manitou I was thinking if you maybe have some sort of injury or a lot of acid in your body, or other imbalance.. Becouse many times we get this extreme emotions becouse something is hurting us inside, or some strong imbalance and it is very physical but constant, and therefore maybe not noticable . It is kind of a vicious circle.

This kind of relationship is route worth exploring and working on from many levels.

I am just blabering now, but may cause some inspiration.

[Clarity]

[Jetsun]

Coming off the drug may mean that parts of your psyche which have been kept down are emerging to have their say, some of them may be pissed at being ignored, but every part of your ego and all the voices inside of you have the intent to help you even if it doesn't always feel that way, and if they intend to help you they must be formed out of love, so from that perspective ego or non ego doesn't really matter as its all good. My 2c

[gendao]

Life has humbled me. The more I undergo, the more I realize how "I" (egoic self) am basically at the total mercy of my soul and higher powers.. "I" am basically just a backseat driver to Life.

 

And even Love and sheer Will are powerless to conquer its executive decisions.

 

Only understanding its greater wisdom, and still having Faith in it when I can't - ease my bumpy ride...

The solution is not changing your life, it's understanding it.

Although by understanding it, it will either change...or no longer "need" to.

Either way, problem solved.

[manitou]

I also realized a while back that it is not practical to live like a sage in this world. At least not while we have to work and participate in this world as functional components. Being too humble and sagacious will only leave us as doormats. There has to be a right mix of humility and toughness...softness and hardness (balance of yin and yang). Not everyone deserves to be met with the same softness. Some need "tough love" while others need "tender lovin'" if you know what I mean...which one needs which we have to decide based on time.

 

 

 

I think you're right about not being practical to live like a sage. Not sure what you're talking about here - but I do believe that if 'conventional wisdom' dictates one thing, I'm pretty sure it's the wrong path to take. In that sense, I do try to follow the leanings of the TTC every time it comes to mind - certain words flash into my mind, and I don't think they're a false humility. They come from the Knowing that all 10,000 things are a product of the 3, which are a product of the 2, which is a product of the One. Hence, all One in the end, even this chair I'm sitting on right now. The control issues within me can raise their head, but it's one of the 3 Treasures that I use (Love, Never Be the First, Never too much) that come into mind more often than not. The Not-Doing by keeping our hands off trying to control a situation, and Trusting that the One works by shaking itself out just fine without my help at all. These are all so counter-intuitive to my nature that although I've been trying to keep mindful of these values for many years now, it still amazes me when the wu-wei of being 'hands off' actually works, and in fact works in ways that would have been severaly limited if I had placed my hands on it.

I agree; trying to emulate the Sage by trying to act with a false humility is anathema to one's spiritual growth; it would be a terrible hindrance, subtly reinforcing ego every time it's done. The kind of humility I mean is the kind that knows that we aren't the ones doing things at all; it's spirit within us doing it, forming our thoughts; therefore, we have no credit to take. Conversely, when nasty times come along, we must know that spirit is causing these as well - from within us. It attracts to us what we need; it is the magnet within. It is with this understanding that the Sage would see life - One with all of it.