Body of U.S. teen found at Peru ayahuasca retreat

[idquest]

Apparently, shamans can't guarantee safety in using the herb:

 

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/49009779/ns/world_news-americas/

[konchog uma]

it doesn't mix with dairy or a host of psychotropic medications (maoi inhibitors)

 

can cause hemorrhages and such

 

but burying the body of an 18 year old tourist?? holy crap... "you might be doing too many hallucinogens if ______ seems like a good idea"

 

interesting idquest, thanks

[et-thoughts]

Apparently, shamans can't guarantee safety in using the herb:

 

http://www.msnbc.msn..._news-americas/

 

Well apparently they where there to help initiates "open their minds to deeper realities"... that takes on a whole different meaning now... The participants probably where required to sign a Waiver and Consent Form. Careful with what enters your body, mind and spirit...

[Aetherous]

Does anyone know a total number people who have died from taking ayahuasca? This is the first I've heard of it happening.

[eye_of_the_storm]

I am going to call disinfo on this one too

 

haha

 

My general approach to MSM related things is... nothing is what it seems.

[Seth Ananda]

Was he on any medication?

 

Thats the only thing i have ever heard of causing complications...

[eye_of_the_storm]

Aren't they standard questions beforehand?

 

Unless he told them he wasn't on anything when he was...

[Aetherous]

Dang, I looked up the shaman and recognized him from

.

[fizix]

I can't seem to find where it is stated documented fact that ayahuasca was directly responsible for his death, just that he died during the ceremony. Anyone?

 

Yes... I can't imagine how else he would've died either, besides ayahuasca overdose... but I've never heard of such an instance occurring... if it were just an overdose of ayahuasca/toxicity poisoining, an enormous amount would be required to be fatal, which is baffling as the experienced shaman overseeing the ceremony should've properly administered a dose far from lethal...

Edited September 14, 2012 by fizix

[Diamond Spectrum]

Real Spirit Travel. An Unfortunate accident that puts negative contemporary attention upon ancient practices of soul journey through ethnobotatnic pathways.

[eye_of_the_storm]

I think next week we may get

 

Teen dies from practicing Qigong...

 

Or Herbal tea causes schizophrenia

 

In line with Cannabis will kill you

 

and Organic food is poisonous

 

LOCO

 

and humourous

 

+ again highlight the massive silencing in the MSM... which says more than anything else really

 

Why do we never hear of

 

Alcohol kills X ppl every year

 

Pharma drugs kill X ppl every year

 

Medical mishaps kill X ppl every year

 

Your own Gov kills XXX people every year

 

The SILENCE is DEAFENING

Edited September 14, 2012 by White Wolf Running On Air

[Jetsun]

The Shaman involved Mancoluto aside from claiming to be descended from Martians by way of Atlantis, Lemuria, and Chavin de Huantar,also claimed to be a "First Level Shaman". He said there were only 5 such skilled people on earth,and that it signified they were: a) possessing of 7 senses including ESP, Telepathy, and Intuition,and b ) pure blooded Martians.

 

 

Some people are saying it is more likely there is an overdose of another toxic ingredient called Toe in it as the Shaman didn't brew his own brew.

Edited September 14, 2012 by Jetsun

[Mokona]

The Shaman involved Mancoluto, aside from claiming to be descended from Martians by way of Atlantis, Lemuria, and Chavin de Huantar,also claimed to be a "First Level Shaman". He said there were only 5 such skilled people on earth,and that it signified they were: a) possessing of 7 senses including ESP, Telepathy, and Intuition,and pure blooded Martians.

 

 

Some people are saying it is more likely there is an overdose of another toxic ingredient called Toe in it as the Shaman didn't brew his own brew.

 

It's very important to know about the people you put your trust in, and choose from common sense, besides, can't these experiences be had through energy work and meditation. *I've never made it all the way out, but i've come close to OBE just laying in bed. Just saying, you don't have to travel and drink herbs from Martians in order to experience cool stuff. But......

 

I want to go to Australia and learn from Seth!

Edited September 14, 2012 by Mokona

[konchog uma]

Does anyone know a total number people who have died from taking ayahuasca? This is the first I've heard of it happening.

 

its happened, but usually from mixing ayahuasca with milk or cheese, or with MAOI inhibitors

 

i dont have a number but i have been to retreats and not been allowed to take ayahuasca because of what i ate earlier that day. It can result in brain hemorrage and death, and i assume that they know this because it has actually happened.

[Taomeow]

its happened, but usually from mixing ayahuasca with milk or cheese, or with MAOI inhibitors

 

i dont have a number but i have been to retreats and not been allowed to take ayahuasca because of what i ate earlier that day. It can result in brain hemorrage and death, and i assume that they know this because it has actually happened.

 

The number of confirmed cases is known: 0.

 

The number of cases with innuendo and zero proof (as in, e.g., the referenced article, which does not actually mention the cause of death): as many as they like to concoct.

 

I spent some time in the ayahuasca capital of Peru, Iquitos, before and after venturing into the rain forest. The number of people in Iquitos who take ayahuasca on any given day is estimated at about 10,000. That's 3,650,000 ingestions per year in that city alone. The number of deaths is still zero.

 

The number of deaths in the same area from corporate activities beginning in the last century: 99% of the population.

 

The number of corporations working from every angle imaginable to permanently rid the planet of the rain forest and, consequently, of human, animal, and plant life (the rain forest is the lungs of the planet, removing them is absolute and definite death for everybody, and they are working very hard at removing them) -- um, you tell me, folks. Have you been paying attention?..

 

MAOI drugs account for about 3 million deaths every year from mixing them with things like bike riding, aerobic exercise, alcohol, a host of foods, cross-reactions with other prescription and street drugs, or no other cause than the MAOI drug alone. If someone who has this frankendrug in the system happens to mix it with ayahuasca, guess which substance will be blamed. If he or she commits suicide or murder (there was no single case of a shooting spree in this country where these prescription drugs were not involved), guess how many billion dollars their manufacturers will lose from removing the violently dangerous substance from the market. You've guessed correctly. Zero.

[eye_of_the_storm]

^ agree totally

[Seth Ananda]

+1 Taomeow

[mrtiger]

The number of confirmed cases is known: 0.

 

The number of cases with innuendo and zero proof (as in, e.g., the referenced article, which does not actually mention the cause of death): as many as they like to concoct.

 

I spent some time in the ayahuasca capital of Peru, Iquitos, before and after venturing into the rain forest. The number of people in Iquitos who take ayahuasca on any given day is estimated at about 10,000. That's 3,650,000 ingestions per year in that city alone. The number of deaths is still zero.

 

The number of deaths in the same area from corporate activities beginning in the last century: 99% of the population.

 

The number of corporations working from every angle imaginable to permanently rid the planet of the rain forest and, consequently, of human, animal, and plant life (the rain forest is the lungs of the planet, removing them is absolute and definite death for everybody, and they are working very hard at removing them) -- um, you tell me, folks. Have you been paying attention?..

 

MAOI drugs account for about 3 million deaths every year from mixing them with things like bike riding, aerobic exercise, alcohol, a host of foods, cross-reactions with other prescription and street drugs, or no other cause than the MAOI drug alone. If someone who has this frankendrug in the system happens to mix it with ayahuasca, guess which substance will be blamed. If he or she commits suicide or murder (there was no single case of a shooting spree in this country where these prescription drugs were not involved), guess how many billion dollars their manufacturers will lose from removing the violently dangerous substance from the market. You've guessed correctly. Zero.

 

I wonder what the boy's mother thinks of your claims that this is disinformation.

 

It looks like a robust story to me.

 

 

There are lots of recorded deaths from psychedelics.

 

And here's another two ayahucasca deaths

 

http://colombiareports.com/colombia-news/news/18348-2-die-in-north-colombia-ayahuasca-ceremony.html

 

But I guess you're going to tell me that they are crazy stories made up by the government to control us in some way.

 

Why do you guys find it so hard to believe a psychedelic drug could kill or harm you? Surely it's possible. And if it is possible it's probably happened a few times.

[mrtiger]

I wonder what the boy's mother thinks of your claims that this is disinformation.

 

It looks like a robust story to me.

 

There are lots of recorded deaths from the use of psychedelics.

 

And here's another two ayahucasca deaths

 

http://colombiarepor...a-ceremony.html

 

But I guess you're going to tell me that they are crazy stories made up by the government to control us in some way.

 

Why do you guys find it so hard to believe a psychedelic drug could kill or harm you? Surely it's possible? And if it is possible it's probably happened a few times.

 

Let me ask you a question. If someone died after taking Ayahucasa - what would it take for you to actually believe it?

 

I get the impression for many of the users who come to TaoBums, White-wolf-running-on-air for example, any information that doesn't fit in to one's world view is just written off as a conspiracy.

 

Do you think that this is a rational and honest way to view the world?

 

[Seth Ananda]

I wonder what the boy's mother thinks of your claims that this is disinformation.

 

It looks like a robust story to me.

 

 

There are lots of recorded deaths from psychedelics.

 

And here's another two ayahucasca deaths

 

http://colombiarepor...a-ceremony.html

 

But I guess you're going to tell me that they are crazy stories made up by the government to control us in some way.

 

Why do you guys find it so hard to believe a psychedelic drug could kill or harm you? Surely it's possible. And if it is possible it's probably happened a few times.

That is not lots of deaths, that is 3 deaths and we have no way of knowing if the deceased were on other medications as yet, or if a dodgy Shaman was mixing his brew with many other Ingredients...

 

I am wondering if this link is the one i had heard about, where two guys died, but if it is, the shaman in question had mixed in datura and a series of other plants. {at least that is what i have heard from people who know the 'Shaman' in question...}

 

Either way, In the next few years, we will see the media trying to demonise Aya through any means available, but especially through faulty logic...

 

I am not sugesting that this 'conspiracy' is organised, its just that the conservative mind set is deeply offended by westerners thinking that a plant is sacred and healing and will do what it can to cut that poppy down...

[Jetsun]

I would expect deaths associated with Ayahuasca are more likely to do with people choking in their sleep after being sick or by triggering a pre exsiting condition in the body like a heart condition or aneurysm due to the stress of the experience, or mixing in too much of another toxic compound into the mixture, I would be very surprised if overdosing on it or the plant itself could kill anybody.

[mrtiger]

 

 

Either way, In the next few years, we will see the media trying to demonise Aya through any means available, but especially through faulty logic...

 

 

 

 

This has been a tiny story in the great scheme of things.

 

And you're all actually focussing on completely the wrong element of the story.

 

An American mother's son went missing and after a campaign in Peru she discovered he was buried in the jungle.

 

Imagine this was you and your son had gone missing. It's harrowing. That's why the story is making headlines.

 

As for the media deliberately setting out to demonise this plant. I don't think the media cares. It's not going to get clicks or shift papers unless there's a human story behind it.

[Taomeow]

Why do you guys find it so hard to believe a psychedelic drug could kill or harm you? Surely it's possible. And if it is possible it's probably happened a few times.

 

That's not just possible, that's very likely with a DRUG, but ayahuasca is not a drug. (Seth is spot on with "faulty logic" used as a weapon of brainwashing -- the population has long been conditioned to blur the difference between drugs and sacred plants. Drugs are for-profit designer molecules not encountered in nature, used by confused brainwashed idiots toward no good cause whatsoever other than fill the emptiness and meaninglessness of their lives with "something different." Sacred plants are natural pathways to being human which we as a species have evolved with and owe our very brain structure and capabilities to. Not the same.)

 

Let me tell you how and what for ayahuasca was used all across Central America before the takeover of the continent by the alien agenda. When a woman of the tribe got pregnant, her husband took ayahuasca and the latter taught him an icaro, a song to sing to the baby in the womb. He would then teach this song to the whole tribe, as the true song of this new human being to come into their midst. When the baby was born, she was given ayahuasca (just like we give injections of dead bugs and mercury into the bloodstream toward our own purposes for this baby, right upon birth). The whole tribe then sang the baby's personal spirit song to her, greeting her and letting her know that she has come somewhere where everybody knows, loves, and accepts her. This procedure is still followed in the tiny vestiges of the remaining indigenous local cultures.

 

Ayahuasca taken in this context by a newborn baby has never killed one. There's no "overdose," it's not a "recreational drug," it can't be taken for fun and abused. What it's taken for is a quest for humanity. How can someone abuse that?..

 

Once you take it, it scans your body first for all possible disorders, blockages and problem spots, then your mind and your heart, and then takes you to task cleaning out what does not belong in a human being. Things that don't belong abound in a modern human being. Could She possibly lose a fight to one of those upon encounter? I don't know. The drugs She might encounter are part of a great power in their own right, an evil one. But, like I said, I'm yet to see even one confirmed case where someone who is not on any drugs goes to a real (not touristy commercial) shaman and dies from trying to reclaim her humanity. So far, it hasn't happen.

 

Oh, and bringing up the grieving mother doesn't constitute proof, you know... It does constitute a manipulation, of the kind I was talking about -- jerk the emotional strings till one can't think clearly, then brainwash at leisure. Which is exactly how these lies are sold. You've been shortchanged. Ask for your money back.

[mrtiger]

 

 

Let me tell you how and what for ayahuasca was used all across Central America before the takeover of the continent by the alien agenda.

 

OK fair enough.

 

It's taken me a while to gauge the mentality of the people who are commenting on this topic.

 

But you've made me realise how futile any kind of reasoned response is.

 

I'm not against the drug or any drug. I just want a sensible and balanced conversation about it.

 

I see now that this is not the correct forum.

[Taomeow]

 

I'm not against the drug or any drug.

 

There you have it. I am. You are not against drugs, I am against drugs. You call a not-a-drug a drug, I don't. Indeed, nothing to talk about, because we don't have our terms straight, let alone our values.

 

Oh, and the word "alien" quoted out of context is supposed to make someone who used it look lacking in "sensible and balanced" conversation abilities?.. I can assure you I used it metaphorically. (I wouldn't use it any other way unless I know who I'm talking to. And especially if I do. )