The urge to put people in their place

[skydog]

As I cultivate or grow spiritually I am noticing I am increasing my morality and behaviour so therefore I see more and people behaving less morally and well.

 

Whereas before I would just reason everyone needs to act like me, morally but now I see so many people acting immorally, sometimes I get the urge to really put people in their place.

 

But then I contemplate...is it just a belief that everyone should be kind/moral, is it just a belief that everyone should be fair and aware or conscious or as much as I am.

 

I should treat everyone like they are me or think of them as my brother or best friend before any thoughts come.

 

But then again, sometimes I get angry at family and dont think this is bad just being honest, sometimes being myself is best.

 

Like maybe I should let the Tao do its thing instead of trying to be the police and not intefere

[GrandmasterP]

Taoists are strangers in a strange land.

Not everybody is a Taoist and that is fine and, without doubt; just as it should be.

Just leave them be and cultivate yourself..

Non interaction is the best action when it comes to those not on the path.

[GrandmasterP]

That said, if they are paying the bills, feeding you and doing your laundry then be exceptionally gracious and polite to them at all times.

Good manners cost nothing.

[Marblehead]

And stop trying to control others. (That was said to me and not pointed at anyone else.)

[寒月 Hanyue]

As I cultivate or grow spiritually I am noticing I am increasing my morality and behaviour so therefore I see more and people behaving less morally and well.

 

Whereas before I would just reason everyone needs to act like me, morally but now I see so many people acting immorally, sometimes I get the urge to really put people in their place.

 

But then I contemplate...is it just a belief that everyone should be kind/moral, is it just a belief that everyone should be fair and aware or conscious or as much as I am.

 

I should treat everyone like they are me or think of them as my brother or best friend before any thoughts come.

 

But then again, sometimes I get angry at family and dont think this is bad just being honest, sometimes being myself is best.

 

Like maybe I should let the Tao do its thing instead of trying to be the police and not intefere

 

It can be hard.

 

I was taught by a teacher to approach it as though you are an anthropologist and simply observing the behaviours of a culture or people you are not from. This can help.

 

Letting go of judgements is another part of it. Realising what these judgements are.

 

Why do these judgements arise? In part we have energetic filters that we perceive everything through. The gates behind the eyes in particular hold many patterns and images, some positive and others negative. If something or someone fits a similar pattern then it can trigger a reaction based not on the reality in front of you but based on those energetic patterns that you view it from. Work on releasing the energy of the eyes, around the eyes, and behind the eyes, and the head in general. Sink it and let it go. This can help too.

 

I don't think this means you aim to go all 'zen' monk and serene with no judgements on peoples bad behaviours. It means you've learned to drop your filters from the equation, so you percieve more clearly, so you KNOW when judgements arise because of their behaviour and not from your own filtered perception and interpretation of it.

 

Hope that helps,

[mrtiger]

As I cultivate or grow spiritually I am noticing I am increasing my morality and behaviour so therefore I see more and people behaving less morally and well.

 

Whereas before I would just reason everyone needs to act like me, morally but now I see so many people acting immorally, sometimes I get the urge to really put people in their place.

 

But then I contemplate...is it just a belief that everyone should be kind/moral, is it just a belief that everyone should be fair and aware or conscious or as much as I am.

 

I should treat everyone like they are me or think of them as my brother or best friend before any thoughts come.

 

But then again, sometimes I get angry at family and dont think this is bad just being honest, sometimes being myself is best.

 

Like maybe I should let the Tao do its thing instead of trying to be the police and not intefere

 

As far as I understand, moral judgements are not in accordance with the Dao.

 

Because the yardstick of what is right and wrong is constantly changing it is very difficult to define immoral behaviour.

 

Things that are acceptable in our lifetime, for example sex before marriage or pregnancy out of wedlock, would have been frowned upon even 100 years ago. Or take homosexuality, it was acceptable in the Hellenistic period, then it became a taboo as Abrahamic religion swept the region up until today where it's increasingly an acceptable part of our society. However... it i is still punishable by death in many countries today.

 

Similarly things that are deemed as wrong now were part of everyday life back in the day, such as public hangings, bearbating and slavery.

 

But back to 2012 and our notion of what is wrong and right.

 

Vegetarianism is an interesting one. I believe it's right for me but if I judge others for eating meat I'm actually judging myself.

 

Why?

 

Well, what about the microbes in my food? The insects (and sometimes other creatures) who die when I drive down the motorway or the snails I unwittingly kill when I prune the laurel. To live is to kill and destroy.

 

I heard a great saying the other day. I think it's a Yorkshire saying which is a country in Northern England known partly for it's simple and down to earth people:

 

"Those who matter don't mind and the who mind don't matter"

[Guest RBSA]

Maybe the effect on you is different than the effect on others . I practiced some qigong since one day and i already noticed i am tolerant to others more than usual . Also consider what mrtiger said but in another way . I try to say that eating less meat induce you a plant like position , plants that are harmless . Unless you eat carnivore plants . In any other case you should become more tolerant .

[skydog]

Good posts...

Edited September 21, 2012 by sinansencer

[Guest RBSA]

I didn ' t get fully your last post . I had to re read your first post . And i still don ' t get what upsets you .

 

But you sound special or a bit different let ' s not call it freak . You think of being morally higher . There was a Lao Tzu saying something about those who think of them high are low and thus they lack virtue . Something like this .

 

Try not to think in duality . For example if you think high there is also low . One goes high only if he came from low and this is less virtuous . And is also dual .

 

I hope i am not breaking anything . Love and light .

[skydog]

I guess looking at things without the filter/lens as snowmonki suggested is right..

 

For example RBSA I made a thread about something and wasnt expecting a putdown of being intolerant, which reminds me of another situation or past memory about being misunderstood or people always trying to find a negative comment for a supposeably positive thing you are saying which reminds me of a past situation or memory which brings some annoyance adding onto any lack of groundnesses at this current moment.

 

You are right in one way there is no such thing as morality but in another way there is.. For example I notice a guy making fun of people with babies and having a lot of people agree with him, then he starts arguing with a mother and doesnt apologise just acts worse, this causes annoyance in me because it reminds me of a past situation where he said something i would consider offensive and when i called him out on it he didnt apologise just insulted me, also it triggers annoyance at the fact that people are liked when they say popular or accepted things and not liked when they dont say popular or accepted things which triggers memories of saying things which are not considered socially acceptable and not being seen in a good way and not being seen as good despite being virtous.

[Guest RBSA]

also it triggers annoyance at the fact that people are liked when they say popular or accepted things and not liked when they dont say popular or accepted things

 

As i said i am a freak too . I can understand you .

[skydog]

haha

[fizix]

Taoists are strangers in a strange land.

Not everybody is a Taoist and that is fine and, without doubt; just as it should be.

Just leave them be and cultivate yourself..

Non interaction is the best action when it comes to those not on the path.

Non-interaction is the best action when it comes to those not on the path? Why the aversion? I smell the illusory shadow of fear. By following this, one is limiting his spiritual development, and only 'cultivating' social phobia and self-centeredness... we must seek to help others, not ignore them because we might become 'offended' or 'frustrated' with their 'ignorance'... ahhh you have fallen in the trap of the spiritual ego...

 

We feverishly come to deny these human experiences in the name of enlightenment, ascension, humility... true humility is allowing one to feel the emotions, the desires, not let them build up on the bottom of your soul..not savor them and "owe no apologies", but to learn from the "ego", not shut it all down, play dead in the face of any confrontation, ..

 

You must perceive ALL experience as opportunities for spiritual growth, ESPECIALLY interaction with "those not on the path."

 

Can one really believe that the human race is best to all just go live and meditate in a cave all day? That this is the ultimate Destiny? Yet this is so many practitioners' ideal circumstances, environment! To strive for this "God-like" weird and horrible humility of non-experience. Many forget their Love in this spiritual plateau, toss it away like all their other 'silly' human tendencies, attachments... seek Godhood, yet don't know what it means to be a Man!? The time for the Ultimate Silence will come, emptiness, unity... but man is here for a reason now, in this new age of Love, this new era of new souls, the answer is not to run away to the mountains and live in total isolation, narcotically lost in meditation all day, with no one to worry for but yourself... or devoutly devoid oneself of sex and human interaction and natural desires and (or "dreams" if that is less pseudo-dogmatic)striving towards this ideal that YOU are not real, that your feelings don't matter, that you must ignore it all and stuff it all down, that you must become a drifting satellite patiently awaiting your hard-earned divine intervention.

 

You betray yourself living this way, on this one dimension of 'illusory enlightenment'. No. You are the Divine. The ego is not the enemy, it is merely your best friend demon ally trying to teach you to ascend to heaven, to give you direction to the Light from the Darkness, heaven from hell; opposites attract! Subsequently the unity to whole non-duality. Yin and Yang the eternal principles teach us to live in BALANCE, not to be a cold comfortably numb monk all the time but to go out and be VULNERABLE and LIVE and LOVE and sing dance contribute help others on the path, true humility and dissolution of the negative ego means not neglecting yourself from the human experience just to spare yourself the natural emotions of experience. The energy becomes trapped stagnant in you and weighs you down! to live is not to shy away from pain but to see its true nature and welcome it as any other blessing on the Path,

 

To become enlightened many think he must destroy this sense of self, so he never must endure these 'pains' of the ego and the unknown, and Love is always the first and greatest casualty of this misguided war. Having this dead-set goal to destroy this 'ego' thing is the real illusion, the real selfishness. The answer to seeking enlightenment is always ever changing, always within you, but often ends up to be the complete opposite Way you were previously convinced it was, then eternally changing for you until one finds himself perpetually living in the balance, in the Tao. but always within you! Other men can only point you to the moon. When man forgets himself, but doesnt discover the true Way of Love, this is the true Dark Night of the Soul!

 

Rediscover your emotions! Be a human not a mindless pseudo-god and one day you will do something that is often the greatest fear of the ego, a main reason for many people doing this 'ego/personality-death' worship: You will spontaneously, for no apparent outside reason start crying, but you can feel it.. in the perfect balance of joy and sadness in total harmony, this is enlightenment, this is eternity. but only briefly... after, you will dive back into the unknown, continuing to enlighten the darkness of the ever expanding journey of the spirit, you will know there is always light at the end of the tunnel, have courage to face the darkness..not hide in mindless oblivion. Embrace the One Love. Embrace Your Self. Embrace Nothing and you will become Nothing, do you really want that? And so soon? Do you not want to see what you could truly become with all your blood, sweat, and god-forbid... tears?

 

 

Oh and marblehead, I agree but digress! and your second part, I don't believe you! But in a good way! ^_-

Edited September 22, 2012 by fizix

[GrandmasterP]

Fair point could be fear I suppose not thought of it that way as such. Thing is I teach in a largeish university and mix with all sorts each working day even undergrads, when I absolutely have to. Now that's from necessity not choice. If I could afford to retire I'd do so on Monday. But we [Mrs Grandmaster P and I] socialise and teach QiGong etc exclusively amongst our own kind [Taoists and fellow travellers] and that is from happy choice.

'Birds of a feather flock together' maybe. There is a certain indefinable quality about time spent with like minded people that is somehow missing elsewhere.

Could be fear, though we do have quite a strong hermit tradition .

Will give that one some thought. Thank you.