The intention/desire to heal, transform, change, improve is negative, happiness is the way, or acceptance

[et-thoughts]

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Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts

[Birch]

Sure you disagree... Yea some feelings, thoughts, experiences arise and each chooses how to re-act to them. You concede that one can choose how to respond to situations. Thats good. What you are getting at with your posts on these topics centers on the idiot who chose to insult us instead of on what we do about in such a situation. I am not shifting the responsibility away from the idiot, for calling me and idiot, I am choosing not to respond to the idiot as an idiot. Oh and please observe that the reference here is generic and hypothetical. Please don't take it as a personal issue. I have no control of the others insulting actions what I do have control is on how I respond. I agree with you that the person doing the insulting be damaging themselves and others and ought correct their ways. What I am getting at with my posts on these topics centers on a whole different angle where someone with issues takes a complement remark as an insulting remark. I am pretty sure that you know of individuals that will take whatever statement the wrong way. If you tell them something they get upset. If you omit telling them something they get upset. Here the issue is much different where these individuals create the experiences they have independent of the stimulus they get. Succinctly put ... Where there was no offense some find offense and where there was offense some find no offense.

 

Yes at the extreme, the person doing the insulting continues to be insulting with absolutely no consequences to them UNTIL judgement day or karma rewards them abundantly for what they done! There are indeed some pervasive behaviors here and many don't want to look at what be going on. It would be better if individuals ( damaging themselves and others ) correct their ways and stopped telling lies and insulting and cultivating disagreements and embraced telling the truth and complementing and cultivating agreements... When it happens I will be happier in the mean time I suppose i just have to tolerate and not take it personal what others tell me... choose to cultivate agreements understanding and peace...

 

So which invitation will you choose to cultivate yourself?

 

It's an interesting post ET. Thanks for it. I can almost not bear to write again. But my cultivation (so far) has been very little about choice and almost mostly about just looking at what is there. Of course I started off with cultivation with the goal of being better than I was. A very empowered siddhic super-being that wouldn't feel any pain any more, just bliss, because those things were 'promises' of path. At least I understood them as such:-). I would also gain full-on charismatics, the ability to know 'Truth' with the big T. Have people fall at my feet in awe. Time-travel, weather powers. Total mastery of the plant-world. Have tigers chilling at my toes.

And then at some point I realized I was really just trying to fix myself.

[et-thoughts]

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Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts

[GrandmasterP]

Tigers might be a bit much in a small house. Maybe one tiger chilling at one foot. But two.. Just say the tigers didn't like each other. That could be tough on one's slippers if a tiger fight kicked off.

Delusional or not I find cheery inner smile sorta approach to cultivation is cheerier than going into it miserable. I'm a naturally grumpy old man but hopefully you'd not know that cos positively cheery cultivation does seem to more or less dissolve grumpiness.

Probably too insensitive to over analyse that [being a man and all] it just seems to work. Grumpiness is still 'there' somewhere but it doesn't own me. IMHO QiGong cultivators feel better than non cultivators and we get lots of students telling how they feel better and more energised. Has to be good for you.

[Birch]

Tigers might be a bit much in a small house. Maybe one tiger chilling at one foot. But two.. Just say the tigers didn't like each other. That could be tough on one's slippers if a tiger fight kicked off.

Delusional or not I find cheery inner smile sorta approach to cultivation is cheerier than going into it miserable. I'm a naturally grumpy old man but hopefully you'd not know that cos positively cheery cultivation does seem to more or less dissolve grumpiness.

Probably too insensitive to over analyse that [being a man and all] it just seems to work. Grumpiness is still 'there' somewhere but it doesn't own me. IMHO QiGong cultivators feel better than non cultivators and we get lots of students telling how they feel better and more energised. Has to be good for you.

I don't know Mr GrandP. 'Cheery' doesn't seem to be the 'natural' state (after all, I wanted to find out what the natural state (for me) is/was). However yer 'ole grumpy GranP' is very funny. Most appreciated.

[Jetsun]

My understanding of what the Buddha said is that we spend all our lives running around chasing happiness, but if we stop chasing and just see the truth you obtain your long sought after happiness just by ceasing the search for it and seeing what is. So if you do some practice like inner smile or anything with the intention to make you happy you are just continuing on the hamster wheel of chasing what is already within you.

 

Which is also a principle which can also be explained in some forms of modern psychology in that if you do a practice or do anything to try make yourself happy you are sending the message to your subconscious that you are unhappy just in the doing , so stop striving for it and you stop telling your subconscious that anything is wrong and you stop creating your own unhappiness and your default state can emerge.

 

So our minds are searching for a solution but can't see that our searching is what is causing the problem to exist in the first place, so no wonder we never find a solution and never find peace!

 

I haven't mastered is myself though, everytime i have a glimpse of what I'm really doing I see that I have got back on the hamster wheel without even realising it.

[et-thoughts]

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Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts

[winniepooh_ank]

The respect to everybody's free will is the main rule. You may change somebody by persuading him/her to do good things. If he or she insists on a bad action, he or she will face the consequences, because it is his/her examination in this life. It is important not to interfere or not to be a partner in somebody else's examination in life, otherwise you have to pass that exam too.

Edited October 12, 2012 by winniepooh_ank

[et-thoughts]

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Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts

[winniepooh_ank]

Actually when one persuades the other to change, it is the other who does the changing.

Considering free will... I wonder if the others will face the consequences of their actions when they insist on not facing them?

Perhaps it is important for one to intervene in a specific way and that is part of ones exam...

to be a partner in somebody else's examination in life is part of life...

Just consider how you where created? or came to be in this domain... union of two

 

You can not run away from consequences of your actions.

 

Every individual is responsible in his/her exam.

[et-thoughts]

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Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts

[winniepooh_ank]

What you just said contradicts the main rule you postulated ...

so either the main rule to respect everybody's free will goes

or one can run away from consequences of their actions

 

remember we are exploring the notion "someone will face the consequences of their actions"

 

Oh the real kicker comes in a bit...

does the victim have to tolerate and respect the perpetrators free will to be condemned and punished rather than accept the victims free will to forgive them ?

 

Dear Et-thoughts,

 

As I said before, your words do not make any sense to me, I can not reply. Sorry.

[et-thoughts]

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Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts

[winniepooh_ank]

As I implied before YOU be the one who make sense of the words (or not)

whether you choose to make sense or make no sense is up to you

I think you just do not want to make sense of the words I write for whatever reason

and thats an observation there may be other reasons

You CAN reply even when you do not make sense of what I wrote ... as evidenced by your reply

 

Dear Et-thoughts,

 

Try to write such as:

1-Introduction

2-Development

3- Result

 

This may help

[et-thoughts]

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Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts

[winniepooh_ank]

So you want me to follow the data - claim -warrant structure...

sure

1. You claim that my statements make no sense, make assertions without asking for clarification

2. I see that my statements do make sense, that you don't understand me, that you don't seek to understand me, and to top it all off implicitly blames me or my statements.

3. evidently to me you are just walking around the issue

 

 

 

Dear Sir,

 

Again, English is not my native language. I tried to follow you but I failed.

 

Introduction-Development-Result is not equal to Data-Claim-Warrant. You again misunderstood me. I did not tell you to write as

1.

2.

3.

 

but rather I told you to write an essay as in Literature class with Introduction - Development - Result. Is it clear now?

Edited October 12, 2012 by winniepooh_ank

[et-thoughts]

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Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts

[winniepooh_ank]

English is not my native language either... thought I am glad it serves to communicate between us. I understood you want me to follow a more logical easier to follow way. In a sense a way where I tell what I am going to say, I tell it with a bit more detail, and then I sum it all up by telling what I said... The terms of data-claim-warrant correspond to a more logical approach used in certain debates.

 

I think I did understood you... hope that the above paragraph reflects this... though if you find that I still did not get what you where stating do let me know. I would rather simply state what I consider pertinent and if someone want to explore deeper into a certain comment or what I meant by something they can ask about it. Sometimes I just mention a few key words that are more than enough for some to grasp the idea... the intention to transform change improve towards happiness acceptance and other divine stuff. Sometimes it takes a bit more explanation to share the ideas.

 

I certainly disagree with your appoach "Sometimes I just mention a few key words that are more than enough for some to grasp the idea." Personally, I understood nothing from your long sentences. However, there is a certain progress in your last posts. I hope this progress continues

[et-thoughts]

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Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts

[winniepooh_ank]

Thank you for providing your feedback...

If you want me to elaborate on, explain, clarify the words, sentences, ideas, and intentions I post please do ask...

Maybe you understood nothing, because thats what you want to cultivate and understand.

I am glad that you framed what you said the way you did. It reflects that you take responsibility rather than project and blame. I wish many others would do the same, and take responsibility for their actions. There is a big difference in claiming "the words mean nothing" and "I found no meaning in the words, to me the words mean nothing" I think you understand...

 

I understood your last sentences. Actually, I forgot the topic of discussion. Please feel free to ask your questions, but please, one thing at a time!

[et-thoughts]

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Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts

[winniepooh_ank]

Well you where objecting and disagreeing to my approach of mentioning a few words in order for some to grasp the idea I wanted to share. When we look at it thats basically what we each and all we do in this forum. The core topic of the dialogue in this thread center on "

The intention/desire to heal, transform, change, improve is (something)...

 

 

happiness is the way, or acceptance... or maybe these all stems from love... and each ought to learn how to love once and for all

 

I have no obejection to your desire mentioning a few words. My request is to understand them if you are telling them to me. That is all.

[et-thoughts]

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Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts

[andoymanal]

just be happy always to heal wounds from the past.