skydog Posted October 5, 2012 Im hearing this idea mostly as a brainwashing thing on TV. Oh got to do what you got to do. I need money, and who cares what I have to do for it, Its unfortunate but I got no other way. Really? Would you kill someone for money? Hurt someone for money? Anything for money? Anything for those 70 pound trainers? Or do you just desire the money? Yes conceptual post but you get the point. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted October 5, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zanshin Posted October 5, 2012 Money is really a silly thing people made up. It is kind of nice that if you give people money, they will do helpful practical things for you like fix your car, trim your trees and bring you food. No one needs money though, money in and of itself is intrinsically useless. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrtiger Posted October 6, 2012 Im hearing this idea mostly as a brainwashing thing on TV. Oh got to do what you got to do. I need money, and who cares what I have to do for it, Its unfortunate but I got no other way. Really? Would you kill someone for money? Hurt someone for money? Anything for money? Anything for those 70 pound trainers? Or do you just desire the money? Yes conceptual post but you get the point. Can you view the question from the perspective of someone with different responsibilities to your own? What if you had a wife and children to feed, rent and taxes to pay? Have a think about the wider picture. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydog Posted October 6, 2012 (edited) Yes, I can .....Please refer to "conceptual post but you get the point".... Can you view the question from the perspective of those who do bad things but justify it with the socially conditioned belief that they needed the money and had no other alternative which in many cases is not true. Have a think about the wider picture. I can understand how this kind of post can annoy someone or cause a reaction in someone but perhaps that is neccessary, I am no saint, and probably have blind spots and biases but yeh I thought this was a useful perspective. Good day Edited October 6, 2012 by sinansencer Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrtiger Posted October 6, 2012 Yes, I can .....Please refer to "conceptual post but you get the point".... Can you view the question from the perspective of those who do bad things but justify it with the socially conditioned belief that they needed the money and had no other alternative which in many cases is not true. Have a think about the wider picture. I can understand how this kind of post can annoy someone or cause a reaction in someone but perhaps that is neccessary, I am no saint, and probably have blind spots and biases but yeh I thought this was a useful perspective. Good day There is a wider discussion here. I appreciate that you don't want to go down that road. So I'll leave it there. Potentially and interesting topic though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zanshin Posted October 6, 2012 Can you view the question from the perspective of someone with different responsibilities to your own? What if you had a wife and children to feed, rent and taxes to pay? Have a think about the wider picture. Flake out and the wife will do it? Since that's what sisters do, we don't need caretakers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GrandmasterP Posted October 6, 2012 Money is only tokens. No use at all apart from what you can exchange it for. You can't take it with you when you leave your body and those who get by on inherited wealth as opposed to what they have personally worked for are usually a royal pain in the erse. An Englisman's home is his castle . Hence one nice thing money can buy is independence from BS such as landlords. You own your house freehold in England then everybody but the tax man can feck off. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted October 6, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zanshin Posted October 6, 2012 Taxes are mandatory administrative expense for schools, roads, police, fire and other services. I think it's a pretty good deal. Real estate taxes are sort of outdated though from when land was more closely tied to wealth. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted October 6, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GrandmasterP Posted October 6, 2012 Not round here thank goodness. If you don't pay taxes they can come after your assets but apart from that you're left alone. If someone is buying a property via a mortgage then it belongs to the mortgage holder til that is paid off but if you own it outright and debt free and the land too then you have freehold. You can't take it with you but whilst you're here on this side of life you tend to be left alone. Cats Protection League are having ours house and land when we've both left the body. Provided they look after any remaining pets in great luxury til those pass they can do as they choose with it then. We won't care. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted October 6, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zanshin Posted October 7, 2012 Real estate taxes came from the idea that those with more wealth who lived in a community should have more responsibility to help take care of the community. I said it's sort of outdated because now it doesn't seem equitable that a farmer should pay more money for schools and such than a professional person with a higher income. But if the requirement to pay taxes is thuggery, what alternative do you suggest? I'm in favor a more minimalist government, but it seems like we need some sort of community pot to at least take care of the infrastructure and provide some services and I do think the wealthy should kick in for education for all otherwise class structure can only become more and more entrenched. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted October 7, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thelerner Posted October 7, 2012 (edited) When everyone cultivates the better ways it pushes everyone to the best overall possible scenario... If everyone cultivated abundantly there will be abundance, Most people here 'cultivate' in some way. Are we happier and living more abundantly then most? It can be a crude awakening when people find out that spiritual organizations, monasteries included have there fair share of problems and egoic battles. on the third hand, while I don't believe money should be used to justify doing things that are immoral . When leaving the fantasy land that was college and having to face the world and make a living my working ethic was- I'll do it for the money; in that case selling computers. Working 8 to 10 hours a day is not easy. Two decades later as the boss it still wasn't easy. Edited October 9, 2012 by thelerner Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydog Posted October 8, 2012 et thoughts please stop this garbage of trying to convert everyone into a christian. The lerner I agree with your thoughts, I have no intention to induce guilt in anyone, but lets look at things from a perspective of Kants Philosophy, how would the world be if everyone behaved like this. Well most people do behave in this way, if everyone believes the social conditioning that the only way to survive is to work in a (potentially evil) job- kill people join the army, market bullshit, etc what kind of freedom do people have, what kind of morality will that create, this idea creates a slave based civilisation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted October 8, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydog Posted October 8, 2012 Man I hate to be rude, or cause sadness in you, but maybe you should realise how some people really dislike christianity. When I was growing up my nan would try to convert me and my brother into christianity, when we would ask (oh if god was so merciful why are so many people starving and suffering she would say shut up and eat your meal) so from that point on I dislike it. I feel it is very repressive and while it does encourage some values I find it disempowering, and has actually been a method to culturally destroy many places in order to make those places future servers of slavemasters. I find preaching offensive and almost like an attack especially when most christian preachers are hypocritical. I find christianity fear and guilt based and often members are very ignorant. I do not wish to hurt you with words, but at the same time this is a taoist forum and some members get annoyed at attempts at conversion. Good day Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GrandmasterP Posted October 8, 2012 "... if everyone believes the social conditioning that the only way to survive is to work in a (potentially evil) job- kill people join the army, market bullshit, etc what kind of freedom do people have, what kind of morality will that create, this idea creates a slave based civilisation". Sounds like my life does that Sinan. Left school at 15, Army (medic)... then nursing, then teaching... Now 60 so been paying feckin' taxes for 45-years. And still can't afford to retire. I should have listened to my old granny back in 1967 and saved up more. Thing is with armies mate, and this is NOT a pop at you in any way... a lot more folk would be slaves today had we not had our army plus the Americans fighting for us when they were needed. Necessary evil and all that. .......................................................................................................... PS I thought you were an atheist Marblehead. (That being your karma this time around and all). 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted October 8, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydog Posted October 8, 2012 (edited) Yep angry random healing crises I apologise for the lashing out but Ive bitten my tongue a few times..I have expressed my view and perhaps there can be greater mutual harmony in future Edited October 8, 2012 by sinansencer 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted October 8, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydog Posted October 9, 2012 rejecting the truth. to say that god exists and this is truth and everything else is lie and everyone else is delusional is slightly insulting to the say the least you say this in half of your posts. I have said what Ive said, I shouldnt have to apologise because I get angry at being preached at, but still I somewhat like you and do not wish to see you sad Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
